Official MMA discussion thread pt 3 UFC 300: Pereira vs Hill, Zhang vs Xionan, BMF Gaethje vs Holloway

[j4remi]

It just looked like Nunes either didn't have a game plan or didn't think she needed a game plan. It was a little bit sad to see someone as good as her underestimate her opponent like that. A simple game plan like really focusing on establishing the leg kick before she started unloading her right hand probably would've won her the fight. Or making a concerted effort to not unload early until she had Pena up against the cage. I think almost any type of plan other than just trying to knock the chick out would've worked for her.

Olivera is something else man.. he's like a swarm of bees.. little nicks here and there, a few knees and kicks and then he's climbing all over you and you can't get him off or keep him at bay. I think he may hold that belt for a minute.

I was surprised she didn't go to the low kick more too. Their first exchange, she made Pena slip and fall off a well-timed low-kick while Pena chased the jab. Pena led EVERYTHING with that quick jab. Everything else was winged out there but the jab was slowing and framing Nunes' head and strikes. Calf-kicks coulda changed that I think.

That said, Pena had to eat some SHOTS to find success at least. It felt like Nunes started to buy into her power too much and didn't worry about the rest. It's not too different from when Rousey got too confident because women were going in there beaten before the fight even started. They had Ronda thinking she could box . Nunes isn't that far off, but she clearly lost confidence when she couldn't back Pena up with a well timed shot.

[HarthorneWingo]

It just looked like Nunes either didn't have a game plan or didn't think she needed a game plan. It was a little bit sad to see someone as good as her underestimate her opponent like that. A simple game plan like really focusing on establishing the leg kick before she started unloading her right hand probably would've won her the fight. Or making a concerted effort to not unload early until she had Pena up against the cage. I think almost any type of plan other than just trying to knock the chick out would've worked for her.

Olivera is something else man.. he's like a swarm of bees.. little nicks here and there, a few knees and kicks and then he's climbing all over you and you can't get him off or keep him at bay. I think he may hold that belt for a minute.

I was surprised she didn't go to the low kick more too. Their first exchange, she made Pena slip and fall off a well-timed low-kick while Pena chased the jab. Pena led EVERYTHING with that quick jab. Everything else was winged out there but the jab was slowing and framing Nunes' head and strikes. Calf-kicks coulda changed that I think.

That said, Pena had to eat some SHOTS to find success at least. It felt like Nunes started to buy into her power too much and didn't worry about the rest. It's not too different from when Rousey got too confident because women were going in there beaten before the fight even started. They had Ronda thinking she could box . Nunes isn't that far off, but she clearly lost confidence when she couldn't back Pena up with a well timed shot.

To me, it looked like Nunes got gassed which suggests that she didn't train hard enough. When believing your own hype too much goes wrong. We'll see if this loss rekindles that fire in the belly of the beast. That's what a makes a champion great. Recovering from adversity like Dominick Cruz did.

Have we discussed how amazing Cruz looked? Who's next for him? How about the Dan Ige look-alike Rob Font?

[HarthorneWingo]

Peeps calling Poirier and Nunes "quitters". I don't know if that's fair. With Nunes, I just think that (1) she didn't take the fight as seriously as she should have; and (2) Juliana Pena is better than people realized.

As for Poirier, I picked Charles to beat him. I thought it would've gone 5 rounds. Like I said earlier, it was Khabib all over again.

If Charles runs through the top 5, you think Khabib might come back to fight him? I think there's something to defining a real champion as being someone who was able to come back from adversity to repeat as opposed to being "undefeated". Life is not about how much you win. It's how you come back from defeat. That said, if you don't have the fire in your belly to dig deep into your soul to train for a World Championship at the high level of MMA, then it's best to stay retired and to continue coaching.

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[HarthorneWingo]

Nate Diaz vs. Poirier booked. What's the point? I could not care less.

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Oh, so we're talking a 5 rounder at 170! This could be interesting. Also, I didn't know that there was a little bit of bad blood between the two. I hope Nate is engaged and ready for battle.

[robillionaire]

RIP Woodley

Also deron Williams beat Frank gore’s ass

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[HarthorneWingo]

Got to love The Count

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[j4remi]

RIP Woodley

Also deron Williams beat Frank gore’s ass

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Pretty sure I mentioned it in the last MMA thread, but I had heard from a buncha heads around the way that Deron Williams was really about it. They'd either seen him or heard from others that had seen him training during his years with the Nets. I wish I coulda found good betting lines because I figure most people woulda guessed the football player wins.

Woodley got slept like a dude that barely had two weeks to prepare. I'm not even sure what punch he was trying to parry, because Paul didn't do any real set up. Paul hauled back and threw a high looping punch while Woodley looked like he was expecting a straight punch to counter. Just insanity.

[j4remi]

Nate Diaz vs. Poirier booked. What's the point? I could not care less.

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Oh, so we're talking a 5 rounder at 170! This could be interesting. Also, I didn't know that there was a little bit of bad blood between the two. I hope Nate is engaged and ready for battle.

This should be a good one, Poirier doesn't always handle pressure well and Nate's all pressure. That said, I think Poirier is clever enough to utilize leg kicks to avoid too much pressure and his clinch game will be interesting against Nate since he packs a lot of power in short quarters even.

My guy Wonderboy looked about done this weekend. His movement isn't the same post-knee surgery and that means wrestlers can handle him with more reckless pressing forward than before.

Lewis looked like Lewis...nice KO for the highlight reel.

The fight I was excited for was Gamrot vs Ferreira and it was pretty good but ended on a freak injury which is too damned bad. I think Gamrot is legit and this coulda been his coming out party. Instead, he gets a nice win but I don't see that kinda result locking him a recognizable name for the next test...maybe though.

[bringbackhoffa]

Peeps calling Poirier and Nunes "quitters". I don't know if that's fair. With Nunes, I just think that (1) she didn't take the fight as seriously as she should have; and (2) Juliana Pena is better than people realized.

As for Poirier, I picked Charles to beat him. I thought it would've gone 5 rounds. Like I said earlier, it was Khabib all over again.

If Charles runs through the top 5, you think Khabib might come back to fight him? I think there's something to defining a real champion as being someone who was able to come back from adversity to repeat as opposed to being "undefeated". Life is not about how much you win. It's how you come back from defeat. That said, if you don't have the fire in your belly to dig deep into your soul to train for a World Championship at the high level of MMA, then it's best to stay retired and to continue coaching.

Watch on YouTube

If Charles beats Justin then follows that up by beating Islam (Islam has got to get past Beneil first), there will be public pressure to set up a mega fight vs Charles. However, given Khabib looking quite big these days, expanding his Eagle FC operation to North America, and his promise to his mother to never fight again it likely remains highly unlikely. I think there is a better chance Charles would move back down to 145 or move up to 170 to secure a 2nd belt.

In addition, Charles will likely want to cash in on a potential McGregor fight, so he likely has 3 fights set up for him in 2022 with Justin, Islam, and McGregor. Then in 2023 we could be seeing the likes of Paddy the Baddy and Fiziev knocking on the door for a title fight.

[j4remi]

Peeps calling Poirier and Nunes "quitters". I don't know if that's fair. With Nunes, I just think that (1) she didn't take the fight as seriously as she should have; and (2) Juliana Pena is better than people realized.

As for Poirier, I picked Charles to beat him. I thought it would've gone 5 rounds. Like I said earlier, it was Khabib all over again.

If Charles runs through the top 5, you think Khabib might come back to fight him? I think there's something to defining a real champion as being someone who was able to come back from adversity to repeat as opposed to being "undefeated". Life is not about how much you win. It's how you come back from defeat. That said, if you don't have the fire in your belly to dig deep into your soul to train for a World Championship at the high level of MMA, then it's best to stay retired and to continue coaching.

Watch on YouTube

If Charles beats Justin then follows that up by beating Islam (Islam has got to get past Beneil first), there will be public pressure to set up a mega fight vs Charles. However, given Khabib looking quite big these days, expanding his Eagle FC operation to North America, and his promise to his mother to never fight again it likely remains highly unlikely. I think there is a better chance Charles would move back down to 145 or move up to 170 to secure a 2nd belt.

In addition, Charles will likely want to cash in on a potential McGregor fight, so he likely has 3 fights set up for him in 2022 with Justin, Islam, and McGregor. Then in 2023 we could be seeing the likes of Paddy the Baddy and Fiziev knocking on the door for a title fight.

He's big enough to try a shot at 170 for sure. I don't see him going back to 145, he struggled to make weight and wasn't nearly as good there because of weight drain. I have dreams of Holloway vs Oliveira 2 for the LW title though ...the first one got ruined by a throat injury.

I'm also thinking Khabib stays out. He's def put on a lot of weight and seems focused on the new projects of coaching and Eagle FC. I think if we get him into competition, it'll probably start with grappling stuff. I'd love for him to throw a sambo team into a Quintet type of tournament.

I know I'm getting ahead of myself, but Charles beating Gaethje and Islam would arguably be tougher than Khabib's title run which was Al Iaquinta, Post-Mayweather Conor (1-3, only win over the faded version of Cowboy), Poirier Gaethje. I know I always say this to the point it sounds like hating but it's just truth, Khabib kinda had a cupcake schedule.

[j4remi]

Sidenote: We're getting close to a Poirier vs Nate Diaz booking. They were talking about January but it seems too close to pull off logistically. You know UFC wants to promote that one like mad after all.

https://mmajunkie.usatoday.com/2021/12/ufc-news-dana-white-down-dustin-poirier-nate-diaz-do-it

If the demand is there for a Dustin Poirier vs. Nate Diaz fight, then UFC president Dana White said he’s down to make it happen.

In the aftermath of Poirier’s (28-7 MMA, 20-6 UFC) lightweight title loss to Charles Oliveira at UFC 269 this month, the narrative has quickly shifted into a grudge match with Diaz (20-13 MMA, 15-11 UFC) that was originally supposed to happen in November 2018.

Both fighters have expressed interest in the matchup on social media, and even said they would be willing to do it as soon as Jan. 22 at UFC 270 in Anaheim, Calif.

That might be too soon to strike a deal, especially with Diaz on the final bout of his current UFC contract. However, it appears White is content to give both athletes what they want.

“If that’s a fight that they want and the fans want to see, we’ll do it,” White told MMA Junkie at Saturday’s UFC Fight Night 199 post-fight news conference at the UFC Apex.

Poirier has said repeatedly he’s interested in moving up to welterweight at some point in his career. The matchup with Diaz would likely be the one where he would make his divisional debut, and Poirier said he already agreed for the bout to happen at UFC 271 in February.

“The Diamond” has said he’s ready to scrap soon and he’s genuinely excited by that matchup with the fellow fan favorite, now it’s just a matter of finalizing the details and securing a date and location.

[HarthorneWingo]

Well butter my butt and call me a biscuit but Jake Paul just channeled his inner Badass Bernie Sanders and I, for one, am very impressed. He put Dana on the hot seat and is will to take an ass whooping from Gamebread to boot.

If Jake pulls this off, I'm going to get a tattoo of Jake's face on my forehead.

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Dana's response ... starts with "You [Jake Paul] accused me of doing cocaine and it's not true ..."

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[j4remi]

Well butter my butt and call me a biscuit but Jake Paul just channeled his inner Badass Bernie Sanders and I, for one, am very impressed. He put Dana on the hot seat and is will to take an ass whooping from Gamebread to boot.

If Jake pulls this off, I'm going to get a tattoo of Jake's face on my forehead.

Watch on YouTube

Dana's response ... starts with "You [Jake Paul] accused me of doing cocaine and it's not true ..."

Watch on YouTube

I think they'll use the PPV numbers to demand a lot bigger slice of the pie and not give Jake Paul the fight...not sure how legit that is as a leverage point, but that's what they seem to be positioning to do. I wouldn't hold my breath on Paul getting anyone that's still under contract with the UFC...but it would be entertaining!

My head's gonna explode without some ufc to watch for another couple weeks btw...K1 got some amazing news though. Tenshin vs Takeru is gonna be epic. Tenshin Nasukawa has been a phenom forever, unfortunately best known for getting KO'ed by Floyd Mayweather after a series of last minute rule-changes completely took away any chance he had. But the kid was a phenom and is unbeaten in 40+ fights. Takeru is just over here dominating K1 on the other hand, and to a lot of fans is the better fighter. So it's two generational talents that people have been debating over for years finally getting to fight!

[HarthorneWingo]

Well butter my butt and call me a biscuit but Jake Paul just channeled his inner Badass Bernie Sanders and I, for one, am very impressed. He put Dana on the hot seat and is will to take an ass whooping from Gamebread to boot.

If Jake pulls this off, I'm going to get a tattoo of Jake's face on my forehead.

I think they'll use the PPV numbers to demand a lot bigger slice of the pie and not give Jake Paul the fight...not sure how legit that is as a leverage point, but that's what they seem to be positioning to do. I wouldn't hold my breath on Paul getting anyone that's still under contract with the UFC...but it would be entertaining!

My head's gonna explode without some ufc to watch for another couple weeks btw...K1 got some amazing news though. Tenshin vs Takeru is gonna be epic. Tenshin Nasukawa has been a phenom forever, unfortunately best known for getting KO'ed by Floyd Mayweather after a series of last minute rule-changes completely took away any chance he had. But the kid was a phenom and is unbeaten in 40+ fights. Takeru is just over here dominating K1 on the other hand, and to a lot of fans is the better fighter. So it's two generational talents that people have been debating over for years finally getting to fight!

The Weasel came out with this video of all the possible top UFC prospects for 2022. I know you must be familiar with at least some of them. Any thoughts?

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[j4remi]

The Weasel came out with this video of all the possible top UFC prospects for 2022. I know you must be familiar with at least some of them. Any thoughts?

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He got the bigs ones. Yall know my favorite prospect is Shavkhat (I've hyped him heavy on these boards). I genuinely think he's shown more than Chimaev so far and that's no knock on Chimaev but they're both super prospects. Topuria and Guram are two of my favorite prospects to watch too.

He's also spot on to pick the lower weight Khabib clones. Mokaev has huge hype and really just needs better competition to keep it going. Umar is similar, but feels more like a straight-up clone to me. I'm also not sure that the Dagestani pressure style will hold up in the lower weights where guys have better stamina and are better with scrambles than lightweights and anything higher up the divisions.

The upper weights where he kinda runs out of options are sketchier picks but that's because they have to be. Dalton Rosta hasn't fought anyone to warrant high praise, but he's looked good. Idk Diyar or the other two LHW prospects he mentioned. Romanov the HW is the goods though. His only real issue is that wrestler base guys generally don't get by solely on wrestling for long because eventually you'll get KO'ed before you can get things to the ground. So he may top out top-10 instead.

The female picks I was less impressed by. He focused on power over technique with his picks and that kinda makes sense because in the female ranks the power hitters do seem like safe bets. But they have lids on their ceilings once they run into proper technical talents that have elite talent. You can actually see he made the same mistake with his last set of female picks, falling for power against lesser talent.

Meanwhile, the number one contender who just got robbed of the One title is Denice Zamboanga. She's not even 25 years old with vicious striking and impressive ground work for that promotion's less than peak grapplers. Strawweight at One also has a "too soon to be sure" prospect in the youngest Lee sibling. Angela Lee is One's current strawweight champ, Christian Lee just lost the Lightweight belt, and their 17-year-old little sister Victoria Lee won three pro fights by finish last year for ONEFC (she was still 16 for the first one).

For female 125, Manon looks huge and that will play. It's shallow as hell right now as a talent pool. I'm really interested in Melissa Gatto who just put the beats on Sijara Eubanks though. She's new in the UFC, 25 years old, and she's stopped three straight opponents including Eubanks who is a genuine UFC talent.

I don't have a 135 lbs prospect to really offer. Since I dropped fight pass this year, i don't get to watch Invicta like I used to.

[HarthorneWingo]

The Weasel came out with this video of all the possible top UFC prospects for 2022. I know you must be familiar with at least some of them. Any thoughts?

Watch on YouTube

He got the bigs ones. Yall know my favorite prospect is Shavkhat (I've hyped him heavy on these boards). I genuinely think he's shown more than Chimaev so far and that's no knock on Chimaev but they're both super prospects. Topuria and Guram are two of my favorite prospects to watch too.

He's also spot on to pick the lower weight Khabib clones. Mokaev has huge hype and really just needs better competition to keep it going. Umar is similar, but feels more like a straight-up clone to me. I'm also not sure that the Dagestani pressure style will hold up in the lower weights where guys have better stamina and are better with scrambles than lightweights and anything higher up the divisions.

The upper weights where he kinda runs out of options are sketchier picks but that's because they have to be. Dalton Rosta hasn't fought anyone to warrant high praise, but he's looked good. Idk Diyar or the other two LHW prospects he mentioned. Romanov the HW is the goods though. His only real issue is that wrestler base guys generally don't get by solely on wrestling for long because eventually you'll get KO'ed before you can get things to the ground. So he may top out top-10 instead.

The female picks I was less impressed by. He focused on power over technique with his picks and that kinda makes sense because in the female ranks the power hitters do seem like safe bets. But they have lids on their ceilings once they run into proper technical talents that have elite talent. You can actually see he made the same mistake with his last set of female picks, falling for power against lesser talent.

Meanwhile, the number one contender who just got robbed of the One title is Denice Zamboanga. She's not even 25 years old with vicious striking and impressive ground work for that promotion's less than peak grapplers. Strawweight at One also has a "too soon to be sure" prospect in the youngest Lee sibling. Angela Lee is One's current strawweight champ, Christian Lee just lost the Lightweight belt, and their 17-year-old little sister Victoria Lee won three pro fights by finish last year for ONEFC (she was still 16 for the first one).

For female 125, Manon looks huge and that will play. It's shallow as hell right now as a talent pool. I'm really interested in Melissa Gatto who just put the beats on Sijara Eubanks though. She's new in the UFC, 25 years old, and she's stopped three straight opponents including Eubanks who is a genuine UFC talent.

I don't have a 135 lbs prospect to really offer. Since I dropped fight pass this year, i don't get to watch Invicta like I used to.

Great rundown. I’m familiar with the Lee family. I’ve seen Christian fight a couple times and Angela on some YouTube videos.

That guy who trains with Khamzat looks like another beast.

[j4remi]

Great rundown. I’m familiar with the Lee family. I’ve seen Christian fight a couple times and Angela on some YouTube videos.

That guy who trains with Khamzat looks like another beast.

The Lee family is impressive (a bit protected by their company but still really talented). Christian belongs in the UFC and Angela would be a ranked fighter too.

Chimaev's teammate is Guram and yeah, he's damn near guaranteed to make some noise (though it's always risky to hype anyone in LW since it's such a stacked division). He beat Gamrot about a year ago, and Gamrot's fresh off beating Diego Ferreira and Jeremy Stephens...beasts in their own right. Khamzat's team is really good all-around. Alexander Gustaffson is with that crew too. They also have Reza Maddadi over there, who's not a top prospect but is a legitimate UFC talent that's fought some killers.

[HarthorneWingo]

Great rundown. I’m familiar with the Lee family. I’ve seen Christian fight a couple times and Angela on some YouTube videos.

That guy who trains with Khamzat looks like another beast.

The Lee family is impressive (a bit protected by their company but still really talented). Christian belongs in the UFC and Angela would be a ranked fighter too.

Chimaev's teammate is Guram and yeah, he's damn near guaranteed to make some noise (though it's always risky to hype anyone in LW since it's such a stacked division). He beat Gamrot about a year ago, and Gamrot's fresh off beating Diego Ferreira and Jeremy Stephens...beasts in their own right. Khamzat's team is really good all-around. Alexander Gustaffson is with that crew too. They also have Reza Maddadi over there, who's not a top prospect but is a legitimate UFC talent that's fought some killers.

Wait … Alexander Gustafson? I thought he was finished after going up to HW and getting smeshed, Does he have anything left?

[j4remi]

Wait … Alexander Gustafson? I thought he was finished after going up to HW and getting smeshed, Does he have anything left?

I'm not sure how much is left in the tank, but he did plan to fight Paul Craig toward the end of last year but it got canceled because one of them got hurt. He was going back to LHW which seems like the only choice since he's technically great but has a shoddy chin vs power hitters. It's still a huge flaw in a division with guys like Reyes, Smith, Santos and Jiri but at least those guys aren't Rumble Johnson strong I suppose. The long layoff mighta also got his chin back somewhat. His best highlight is over the current champion with the uppercut show he put on when he beat up Glover. So he'd be able to skip the line if he could put together a couple of wins.

[j4remi]

Wait … Alexander Gustafson? I thought he was finished after going up to HW and getting smeshed, Does he have anything left?

I'm not sure how much is left in the tank, but he did plan to fight Paul Craig toward the end of last year but it got canceled because one of them got hurt. He was going back to LHW which seems like the only choice since he's technically great but has a shoddy chin vs power hitters. It's still a huge flaw in a division with guys like Reyes, Smith, Santos and Jiri but at least those guys aren't Rumble Johnson strong I suppose. The long layoff mighta also got his chin back somewhat. His best highlight is over the current champion with the uppercut show he put on when he beat up Glover. So he'd be able to skip the line if he could put together a couple of wins.