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PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better

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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#321 » by mpharris36 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:40 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:There's enough blame to go around where it can be managements fault for putting the team together, players fault for playing poorly, and Thibs fault for not making the right adjustments.

It does seem like all are true


Agreed

The guys with track records need to play better
Thibs needs to adjust to who's playing well faster (if Obi is playing well, which he has, find more minutes for him) don't always just trust "vets".

FO took our identity away to basically try to build a team to beat the Atlanta Hawks.


Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#322 » by Deeeez Knicks » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:40 pm

DaGawd wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
DaGawd wrote:Meanwhile…. Mitchell Robinson folks….




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Is he going at it with Wiseman? :lol:

Nah lol. Some random fans


Damn, he sounds high af :lol:

It would have been funnier if went off on Wiseman though...g_wiseman is probably one of melo's accounts :lol:
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#323 » by Clyde_Style » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:42 pm

Sham needs to make the next GT

We're playing his team tomorrow
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#324 » by Deeeez Knicks » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:48 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Agreed

The guys with track records need to play better
Thibs needs to adjust to who's playing well faster (if Obi is playing well, which he has, find more minutes for him) don't always just trust "vets".

FO took our identity away to basically try to build a team to beat the Atlanta Hawks.


Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.


Randle, RJ and Fournier are all playing pretty bad. Is it just a slump, or fit or coaching? Hard to say which is the biggest factor but it does seem like all is an issue.

Even if they play better, the chemistry/fit looks off and our defense has taken a hit. We have to find the right adjustments. We really need last years Randle back, or at least close to being back. He is not hitting the same shots as last year. If he regresses its a big issue
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#325 » by god shammgod » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:51 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:Sham needs to make the next GT

We're playing his team tomorrow

No. I did the last one. Plus I’m rooting for the Lakers. Wouldn’t be right.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#326 » by mpharris36 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:53 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.


Randle, RJ and Fournier are all playing pretty bad. Is it just a slump, or fit or coaching? Hard to say which is the biggest factor but it does seem like all is an issue.

Even if they play better, the chemistry/fit looks off and our defense has taken a hit. We have to find the right adjustments. We really need last years Randle back, or at least close to being back. He is not hitting the same shots as last year. If he regresses its a big issue



The problem with a lot of our guys if they aren't putting the ball in the basket they really don't have a lot of "secondary" skill sets whether that is distributing or defense to help the team win.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#327 » by DaGawd » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:56 pm

god shammgod wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Sham needs to make the next GT

We're playing his team tomorrow

No. I did the last one. Plus I’m rooting for the Lakers. Wouldn’t be right.

Guess this means Knicks win by 30
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#328 » by Knicksfan1992 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:00 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Agreed

The guys with track records need to play better
Thibs needs to adjust to who's playing well faster (if Obi is playing well, which he has, find more minutes for him) don't always just trust "vets".

FO took our identity away to basically try to build a team to beat the Atlanta Hawks.


Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.


I think there's signs Kemba and Randle are starting to figure each other out more and a lot of it comes down to Randle at least making more of the shots he was making last year and Kemba not taking too much of a backseat when he has it going...I'm upset Kemba didn't get to finish last night (I'm guessing for injury reasons) because I thought that 3rd quarter gave us another glimpse of what the offense can be when he and randle have it going. It's very hard to cover.

I think part of the problem is Fournier hasn't been a willing or good catch and shoot guy and it's clunking up the offense a bit when he's indecisive...If you're going to run an offense through Randle you need to have decisive guys play off of him. Right now Fournier is attempting only 4 catch and shoot 3's a game and he's shooting 33% on them. For example last year... Bullock attempted 5.7 a game and hit 42.5% of them. Bullock being simple minded I think helped the offense gel in the regular season when there's less specific game-planning by the opposition and he had 1 job offensively and that was to let it fly when he has a sliver of space. Fournier needs to accept his role better or get replaced by Burks who will play it better and still has some off the dribble chops also.. Also Barrett's been way worse off the catch as well. A lot of it comes down to dudes missing shots that they shouldn't be missing IMO too.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#329 » by Deeeez Knicks » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:00 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.


Randle, RJ and Fournier are all playing pretty bad. Is it just a slump, or fit or coaching? Hard to say which is the biggest factor but it does seem like all is an issue.

Even if they play better, the chemistry/fit looks off and our defense has taken a hit. We have to find the right adjustments. We really need last years Randle back, or at least close to being back. He is not hitting the same shots as last year. If he regresses its a big issue



The problem with a lot of our guys if they aren't putting the ball in the basket they really don't have a lot of "secondary" skill sets whether that is distributing or defense to help the team win.


Yea, that’s a big problem with our backcourt. Very one dimensional and doesn’t mesh well.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#330 » by robillionaire » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:02 pm

DaGawd wrote:Meanwhile…. Mitchell Robinson folks….




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Pretty embarrassing. He’s like KD insecure but without the talent
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#331 » by Clyde_Style » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:07 pm

god shammgod wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Sham needs to make the next GT

We're playing his team tomorrow

No. I did the last one. Plus I’m rooting for the Lakers. Wouldn’t be right.


but that was Sham as Pseudo-Moo. Now you can be the real Sham

oh never mind
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#332 » by mpharris36 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:22 pm

Knicksfan1992 wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.


I think there's signs Kemba and Randle are starting to figure each other out more and a lot of it comes down to Randle at least making more of the shots he was making last year and Kemba not taking too much of a backseat when he has it going...I'm upset Kemba didn't get to finish last night (I'm guessing for injury reasons) because I thought that 3rd quarter gave us another glimpse of what the offense can be when he and randle have it going. It's very hard to cover.

I think part of the problem is Fournier hasn't been a willing or good catch and shoot guy and it's clunking up the offense a bit when he's indecisive...If you're going to run an offense through Randle you need to have decisive guys play off of him. Right now Fournier is attempting only 4 catch and shoot 3's a game and he's shooting 33% on them. For example last year... Bullock attempted 5.7 a game and hit 42.5% of them. Bullock being simple minded I think helped the offense gel in the regular season when there's less specific game-planning by the opposition and he had 1 job offensively and that was to let it fly when he has a sliver of space. Fournier needs to accept his role better or get replaced by Burks who will play it better and still has some off the dribble chops also.. Also Barrett's been way worse off the catch as well. A lot of it comes down to dudes missing shots that they shouldn't be missing IMO too.


Kemba did deserve those minutes offensively but the concern is the knicks were going to a switch everything system in the 4th pretty much with Randle at the 5. The issue is you can't do that with Kemba since guys like LaVine/DeRozan will just abuse that matchup. Smallish guards that aren't the key cogs on offense are tough to keep on the floor late. Rose can be much more switchable with his size.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#333 » by robillionaire » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:35 pm

maga Mitch currently on IG filling up his big rig and yelling at Biden for the price of gas, this dude is wild glad I decided to roll with nerlens
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#334 » by TheGreenArrow » Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:55 pm

Read on Twitter


We can’t win with this type of player man!!!!!!!!!!!!

WE JUST CANT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#335 » by DaGawd » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:03 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Agreed

The guys with track records need to play better
Thibs needs to adjust to who's playing well faster (if Obi is playing well, which he has, find more minutes for him) don't always just trust "vets".

FO took our identity away to basically try to build a team to beat the Atlanta Hawks.


Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.

I’m content with blaming Leon Rose. We needed to keep up with the rest of the East and make significant upgrades to the roster.. all we did was maybe make it slightly better while completely ignoring the defensive side
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#336 » by mpharris36 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:09 pm

DaGawd wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
Yea, feels like a lot of different things are going wrong when last year a lot of things went our way. Still, we are not far off from last year's pace. Its not a bad as it seems. But things can go downhill fast if we don't adjust.

Have to find more minutes for Obi and IQ when they are playing well, especially when starters are struggling. And something needs to give with the starters. Fournier looks like a classic bad knicks signing so far. I wasn't crazy about him but he can't be this bad, can he??


I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.

I’m content with blaming Leon Rose. We needed to keep up with the rest of the East and make significant upgrades to the roster.. all we did was maybe make it slightly better while completely ignoring the defensive side


its early and he will still be judged on what "big" trade he eventually makes.

But the Knicks had the most cap room in the entire NBA and the team got collectively worse...that isn't good.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#337 » by nedleeds » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:12 pm

TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


We can’t win with this type of player man!!!!!!!!!!!!

WE JUST CANT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Zenzibar wrote:Nevertheless, Payton is not a finished product yet and unless the team moves him in a couple of weeks, I anticipate him trending upward with this coaching staff.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#338 » by moocow007 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:21 pm

TrueWarrior wrote:RJ seriously cannot jump more than 5 inches it seems. He's out there playing like a 45 year old with two blown knees. His shot being off is one thing but he's whiffing wide open layups now too. We can talk about the offensive system, Randle, and such but we can't make excuses for the way he's playing now. It's not a confidence thing as much as he just isn't athletic at all for a 21 year old top 3 pick. He should be yamming it down out there but he just doesn't have the ability unless he gets a full steam ahead. If you're not concerned about him then you're in denial.


You're not wrong. I think a lot comes down to what those expectations are. He's clearly not in the Zion or Ja range as he doesn't possess the elite NBA caliber physical tools and/or shot creation skills of these guys. He can still be a very good player but when you're not a top tier talent you need the right situation.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#339 » by whocares1 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:22 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
I'm struggling to put my finger on one specific issue as well.

Thibs also didn't become a bad coach overnight. But he does have a level of stubbornness to him. I mean he started Elfrid Payton the entire season when he wasn't helping on offense or defense.

The thing that would concern mean about this year vs last year is that we took off when we traded for Derrick Rose. That type of move for how little we ended up giving up for arguably the most important player on the team isn't likely.

We have also played an extremely soft schedule (hardest remaining SOS in the league). Even the best teams we have played seem to always be missing one of there best players.

I’m content with blaming Leon Rose. We needed to keep up with the rest of the East and make significant upgrades to the roster.. all we did was maybe make it slightly better while completely ignoring the defensive side


its early and he will still be judged on what "big" trade he eventually makes.

But the Knicks had the most cap room in the entire NBA and the team got collectively worse...that isn't good.


Worse in what way though if the Knicks in fact overachieved last season? Would the Knicks be better than 9-8 if they had Elfrid and Bullock in this starting lineup? Defensively they are worse but we saw in the playoffs that the defense wasn’t really stopping anyone.

The team isn’t worse bc of the free agent moves. They are worse bc Randle hasn’t played like an All NBA second team player and RJ hasn’t taken the next step into stardom. That could’ve happened with or without Kemba and Fournier.
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Re: PG: The Post-Moo Era Begins. Bulls are Better 

Post#340 » by mpharris36 » Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:33 pm

whocares1 wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
DaGawd wrote:I’m content with blaming Leon Rose. We needed to keep up with the rest of the East and make significant upgrades to the roster.. all we did was maybe make it slightly better while completely ignoring the defensive side


its early and he will still be judged on what "big" trade he eventually makes.

But the Knicks had the most cap room in the entire NBA and the team got collectively worse...that isn't good.


Worse in what way though if the Knicks in fact overachieved last season? Would the Knicks be better than 9-8 if they had Elfrid and Bullock in this starting lineup? Defensively they are worse but we saw in the playoffs that the defense wasn’t really stopping anyone.

The team isn’t worse bc of the free agent moves. They are worse bc Randle hasn’t played like an All NBA second team player and RJ hasn’t taken the next step into stardom. That could’ve happened with or without Kemba and Fournier.


They could have improved from Elfrid and Fournier with guys that actually play on both ends. That is a luxury of having the most cap space. They could have pivoted to a lot of different options.

They overachieved last year but the defense seemed real. They basically threw the defense out the window. Essentially Kemba/Fournier were suppose to help supplement the scoring so Randle didn't have to do everything. That really hasn't worked out so far.
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Robert Williams III/Chris Boucher/Daniel Gafford
Michael Porter Jr/De'Andre Hunter/Udonis Haslem
RJ Barrett/Trey Murphy III/Georges Niang
Tyrese Haliburton/Chris Duarte/James Bouknight
Steph Curry/Jalen Suggs/Anfernee Simons

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