PG: Team win - Frenchie w/ 41 - RJ first career game winner - Randle vs Fans

[Reign23]

Least talked about part of the game, because of the thumb and the banker, is IQ. He had the best late game stuff.

agree ! IQ and fournier were so great, but 60 pages talk about randles thumbs down and RJ potential.

[Oscirus]

Is this not one of the most polarizing Knicks teams ever?

I mean wow.... Julius gave us a thumbs down and now it's like WW3 in here lol.

I still love this place. Still love the Knicks. I'm rooting for Randle and RJ to succeed big time. I still have some level of faith this can all work out. I like the Knicks' position. A nice batch of young players, plenty of draft capital and some cap flexibility within reach if they were willing to make some trades for the chance at the right free agent. Let's all take a deep breath.

He's sorry....

Strangely thats one of the most non apology apologies he could've done Not mad at it, just shocked the knicks didnt write a better one for him

[Oscirus]

Least talked about part of the game, because of the thumb and the banker, is IQ. He had the best late game stuff.

agree ! IQ and fournier were so great, but 60 pages talk about randles thumbs down and RJ potential.

Also IQ had the best celebration of any knick

[Clyde_Style]

Strangely thats one of the most non apology apologies he could've done Not mad at it, just shocked the knicks didnt write a better one for him

It may not help him that much when many fans will see that as written by someone else. It sure reads like boilerplate text

[Clyde_Style]

RJ has a simple game. So what, y’all want niccas to have generational athleticism and skill. RJ will be very good at everything and a very good nba player for years to come.

He’s a team guy and when he gets that in between game it’s over.

this

Yeah the RJ slander around here is disgraceful. Dude is clearly going to be a solid pro for many years. It’s just internet sh*t talking and agendas.

The last draftee we kept was David “buzzer beater” Lee, so maybe RJ has a chance after all. Although Lee was already 22 y/o as a rookie, which I’m sure MSG would prefer all their draftees to be. I’m rooting for RJ. Would love to see him play 20 years here.

this

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

and this

Are we allowed to this a this?

[Reign23]

RJ has a simple game. So what, y’all want niccas to have generational athleticism and skill. RJ will be very good at everything and a very good nba player for years to come.

He’s a team guy and when he gets that in between game it’s over.

this

Yeah the RJ slander around here is disgraceful. Dude is clearly going to be a solid pro for many years. It’s just internet sh*t talking and agendas.

The last draftee we kept was David “buzzer beater” Lee, so maybe RJ has a chance after all. Although Lee was already 22 y/o as a rookie, which I’m sure MSG would prefer all their draftees to be. I’m rooting for RJ. Would love to see him play 20 years here.

this

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

and this

Are we allowed to this a this?

sure

[whocares1]

A game in which rj got two assists in the final minute as well as the winning shot is embarrassing and pathetic then I'll take it.

The only good thing about all this is eventually he'll be traded for some over the hill player we have no business playing for and when he thrives in whatever environment he's been banished to, Im gonna have fun jimniting up this place

People said the same thing about Frank. That some other teams will use him correctly etc etc etc.

[Deeeez Knicks]

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

What I don't like about him is that he's inefficient.

I couldn't care less about him being flashy or not.

Not yet but he can easily improve that. His game is layups and 3s with FTs….the most efficient shots in basketball

[Deeeez Knicks]

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

Or because he’s just a role player. We are improving tho. We went from arguing Frank to RJ. Hopefully the next player we argue about in the future will be an actual star in the making.

Maybe but every team needs good role players too.

[3toheadmelo]

Fine and since you don’t even watch games don’t respond to me until you actually watch a game you wanna talk to me about

Oooooo, terms of engagement. I watched the highlight reels of the last three games, BFG. But thanks for sharing your imaginary rules

No it’s not a rule it’s just the very real terms of me responding back to you any further at this point which I’m not obligated to do

Imagine if we were all in a book club and you decided you weren’t going to read the books anymore but watched a quick synopsis on YouTube right before you showed up, and then as I was sharing my opinion about the book to someone else you decided to constantly condescend to me and troll with things like “what the hell happened to you” and accuse me of some kind of spite against the author, because I didn’t like the book, when you didn’t even bother to do the assignment. So then I have to try to explain in detail what I didn’t like about it when you have no idea what I’m even talking about. I’m sure you can imagine it would be very frustrating to deal with this kind behavior. So if you’re going to continue to condescend and bait me at least read the frigging book.

Yeah it’s weird for someone to act like they know it all and attack other posters but hasn’t actually watched any recent games.

[Clyde_Style]

Oooooo, terms of engagement. I watched the highlight reels of the last three games, BFG. But thanks for sharing your imaginary rules

No it’s not a rule it’s just the very real terms of me responding back to you any further at this point which I’m not obligated to do

Imagine if we were all in a book club and you decided you weren’t going to read the books anymore but watched a quick synopsis on YouTube right before you showed up, and then as I was sharing my opinion about the book to someone else you decided to constantly condescend to me and troll with things like “what the hell happened to you” and accuse me of some kind of spite against the author, because I didn’t like the book, when you didn’t even bother to do the assignment. So then I have to try to explain in detail what I didn’t like about it when you have no idea what I’m even talking about. I’m sure you can imagine it would be very frustrating to deal with this kind behavior. So if you’re going to continue to condescend and bait me at least read the frigging book.

Yeah it’s weird for someone to act like they know it all and attack other posters but hasn’t actually watched any recent games.

Fatman and Robin tag teaming now?

[nedleeds]

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

What I don't like about him is that he's inefficient.

I couldn't care less about him being flashy or not.

Not yet but he can easily improve that. His game is layups and 3s with FTs….the most efficient shots in basketball

Layups are harder when the other team blocks them because you can't jump or create separation with quickness. He got blocked 4 of his first 7 attempts. Once by Grant Williams who is a tree stump.

[3toheadmelo]

No it’s not a rule it’s just the very real terms of me responding back to you any further at this point which I’m not obligated to do

Imagine if we were all in a book club and you decided you weren’t going to read the books anymore but watched a quick synopsis on YouTube right before you showed up, and then as I was sharing my opinion about the book to someone else you decided to constantly condescend to me and troll with things like “what the hell happened to you” and accuse me of some kind of spite against the author, because I didn’t like the book, when you didn’t even bother to do the assignment. So then I have to try to explain in detail what I didn’t like about it when you have no idea what I’m even talking about. I’m sure you can imagine it would be very frustrating to deal with this kind behavior. So if you’re going to continue to condescend and bait me at least read the frigging book.

Yeah it’s weird for someone to act like they know it all and attack other posters but hasn’t actually watched any recent games.

Fatman and Robin tag teaming now?

All your posts consist of corny jokes and insults to posters now days. Do better fam.

[Oscirus]

A game in which rj got two assists in the final minute as well as the winning shot is embarrassing and pathetic then I'll take it.

The only good thing about all this is eventually he'll be traded for some over the hill player we have no business playing for and when he thrives in whatever environment he's been banished to, Im gonna have fun jimniting up this place

People said the same thing about Frank. That some other teams will use him correctly etc etc etc.

Huge difference between frank and rj.

[whocares1]

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

Or because he’s just a role player. We are improving tho. We went from arguing Frank to RJ. Hopefully the next player we argue about in the future will be an actual star in the making.

Maybe but every team needs good role players too.

Sure but people don’t talk about him so much because they think he’s going to be just a role player. The hope there is that he’ll be a star. Accepting him as being a complimentary piece and striving to find a legitimate piece should be the objective and not hoping one day he’ll start dribbling like Kyrie.

[Chanel Bomber]

It sounds like you are running away from your very own statement though. You made the claim about good teams and who would fit where. Now you are talking about the playoffs, obviously we haven't gotten there yet so where will those teams be at the end of the playoffs is yet to be seen. Miami got wiped off the floor last season in the first round getting swept, Memphis got wiped out 4-1 and so on.

I agree with you, Knicks weren't a good team, but how far do you see some of those other teams advancing this year?

So use your guy Lavine, he basically needed Derozan and Lonzo Ball to join him to get anywhere, clearly not being able to carry a team anywhere on his own. Derozan couldn't even carry the Spurs anywhere the year before that but he's found better success on the Bulls. Lonzo was on a terrible Pelicans team with Zion and Ingram but found better fit with the Bulls. Vucevic was on the awful Magic team. Lavine needed a 32 year old experienced Derozan, a player who was no better than RJ at the same point in their careers, to come in and play at an MVP level to help him carry the Bulls to a good season up to this point. So if your boy Lavine has shown he needs help, clearly, why is it not the case for RJ? Like RJ has to be able to carry the team somewhere without needing talent around him? Of course he does, all players do. The talent needs to fit, chemistry needs to be there, players also develop at different stages of their careers so it has to come together at the right time. RJ is being treated like he's Frank Stinkilikina around here Dude is clearly our best young prospect in a while, if we were smart we would dump Randle and look for legit help to surround him with. If he ends up the next Demar Derozan or the next Dillon Brooks it wont matter he can still become a key contributor for a good team and we can find out eventually. One thing is for sure, Randle isn't getting us anywhere

Bro it's not that deep, I randomly took the 4 teams with the best records per Conference because I wanted to look at starting line-ups just to get a general impression and I didn't think more deeply about how to identify the teams I consider "good". If you consider that lazy, then that's fine, because it was lazy. And I do not know how far these teams will advance. But that doesn't just contradict the bigger point I was making.

Every player needs help.

The difference between Lavine and RJ is that Lavine has been efficient for most of his career, and highly efficient the last couple of seasons (while also carrying a heavier offensive burden). So it's easier to attribute his lack of team success to a lack of help and/or coaching. He always made it easy for pieces to fit around him because he has been efficient for most of his career - he's just one of those players who never had help around him (until this year). And it's not like DeRozan is an ideal fit, but Lavine makes it work because he's malleable and efficient in various playtypes. By comparison, RJ is wildly inefficient, so he's much harder to plug into a team, or to have teammates fit alongside him.

RJ is better than Frank but that's quite a low bar. Frank is barely an NBA player (if at all), so being better than him is not some accomplishment.

I think the Knicks would be wise to move both Randle and RJ. Their games are different but they share a lot of similarities. Neither player is efficient, and neither is easy to build around.

I was trying to dive further into your statement about he can’t start on good teams. Now we aren’t even sure what a good team is but RJ can’t start on it though

Forget Lavine, who has carried the Bulls? Not Lavine but Derozan so has Derozan always been efficient? See how you are ignoring the rest of the NBA and focusing on like 1 or two guys as if these type of players make up the whole league. Lavine and Derozan are two different type of players too but you are so stuck on one and ignoring the other like the other guy hasn’t been their key to success.

You are seriously underrating RJs abilities, acting like he can’t get a shot off against defenders when he’s done so time and time again. Yes he needs to become more consistent but give me a break let’s not pretend like he hasn’t given opponents the business.

And another thing you keep ignoring is the fact that the team lacks cohesiveness, something very crucial to the success of a team. They showed more of it last season than this year and it’s why guys numbers were better. This year there’s been more dysfunction on and off the floor. RJ has still found ways to show serious glimpses of potential despite all that and yes he’s done so in numerous ways

I picked these 8 teams because it's likely that most of them are "good". The entire season hasn't unfolded yet, so a couple of them might regress to the mean or get exposed later - that's why I explicitly said it was an arbitrary selection. Surely you can grasp that. You harping on the fact that it's not 100% accurate is just a red herring at this point.

Let's use last year's teams then, since the smoke has cleared. There were 9 teams last year that I personally consider "good": Bucks, Hawks, Nets, Sixers, Suns, Clippers, Jazz, Nuggets, Mavericks.

If these teams were healthy, how many would've started this year's version of RJ?

Bucks: Middleton, DiVincenzo/Connaughton (possible)
Nets: Harden, Harris (no chance)
Hawks: Hunter, Bogdanovic (unlikely)
Sixers: Green, Harris (possible)

Suns: Booker, Bridges (no chance)
Jazz: Mitchell, Bogdanovic (no chance)
Clippers: George, Leonard, Morris (no chance)
Nuggets: Rivers, Porter (probable, in Jamal Murray's absence)
Mavericks: Hardaway, Finney-Smith (possible but unlikely)

So this year's version of RJ would've started for the Nuggets. And he would've fought for a starting spot on three other teams that had more reliable 3-point shooters at his position (Danny Green, Finney-Smith, Connaughton who are all significantly more efficient scorers than RJ). I guess if DiVincenzo was a starter for Milwaukee, then RJ could be too.

But that's RJ's company right now. Finney-Smith, Green, DiVincenzo, Jordan Poole, Dillon Brooks etc. And these guys are all practically the worst starters (or second-worst) on their teams.

Could RJ improve over time and surpass those guys? Sure.

Also just because DeRozan's arrival has coincided with the Bulls success doesn't mean he's singlehandedly leading the Bulls. They're doing it by committee, with Lavine, DeRozan, and their supporting cast. DeRozan has been efficient, but not overwhelmingly so either. His efficiency numbers are consistent with his last couple of years. It's Lavine who has been insanely efficient this year, same as last. They both have been key to Chicago's success. Where did I deny that? Show me.

I never said talent didn't matter. But when you're as wildly inefficient as RJ has been, you can't just attribute it to roster construction and the roster around him. No. That means his game is inefficient. And it's on him to improve that.

Will he? We'll see. The book isn't closed on him.

[Chanel Bomber]

RJ is just not flashy. That is why a lot of people dont like him

Or because he’s just a role player. We are improving tho. We went from arguing Frank to RJ. Hopefully the next player we argue about in the future will be an actual star in the making.

Maybe but every team needs good role players too.

A role player who shoots 33.3% from 3 with a 50.7% true shooting percentage is not a good role player.

He's bottom of the league in efficiency among volume shooters.

RJ can't afford to be this inefficient. His inefficiency is hurting the team.

[3toheadmelo]

Don’t let this talk about RJ distract y’all from the fact Schroder would’ve been a much better fit at PG than Kemba and y’all thought I was crazy

[Capn'O]

Don’t let this talk about RJ distract y’all from the fact Schroder would’ve been a much better fit at PG than Kemba and y’all thought I was crazy

Low reward. Kemba was boom bust. And I'm here for the chaos.

Fournier was the real **** up.

[3toheadmelo]

Don’t let this talk about RJ distract y’all from the fact Schroder would’ve been a much better fit at PG than Kemba and y’all thought I was crazy

Low reward. Kemba was boom bust. And I'm here for the chaos.

Fournier was the real **** up.

They both were trash deals. Me and sham kept telling y’all about Kembas knees being done but y’all didn’t wanna hear it