2022-2023 Regular Season Game 74: New York Knicks (42-32) at Orlando Magic (30-43) - 7pm

[Knightro]

I'm not really concerned about winning games until they actually lose the 5th worst spot lol.

[IllMagic04]

Ehh. establishing "winning culture" wins happend in 2015 and 2016, 2017 and 2018 as well.

2014-15 Magic win 3 in a row in last 7 games.
2015-16 Magic win 6 of last 10 games.
2016-17 they tanked little better at the end
2017-18 they win 3 of last 6 games

In theory, if they lost all 6 of games they won in 2016, Magic might could have had Brandon Ingram, because Pelicans went 2# with 5 wins less. Or even if they just won several less, they would have been in range for Jamal Murray.

But worst result of not tanking toward the end was 2018 when they were in range for Trae & Luka and they beat Dallas in meaningless game and got Bum-ba instad.

late edit: they did good job at the end of 2021 & 2022 to secure tank. Hence, that's why they won lottery & got 4th pick in back to back lotteries.

We already won too many games to be "secure" so i guess it doesn't really matter now? Still , going from 5th worst to potentially 8th worst cuts your odds of drafting top 3 from 31,6% to 19%. For comparison sake, Bulls at current seed, have 14,5% chance at top 3.

The situations are completely different. We didn’t have our building blocks like we do now. Paolo and Franz are our guys. Those years we desperately needed to get a high enough pick to get a star. Also the lottery odds were different back then. But even within those odds in 2018 the Kings had the 7th best odds and moved to 2. So had we won more we could've drafted Luka. Speaking of that you do remember Luka and Trae didn’t go 1 and 2 right? Alot of people ( you included) thought Trae Young was gonna be a bust. On lottery night I felt pretty good that Trae was honna be there at 6.

Bottom line its a lottery. You never know how the ping pong balls will fall and you never know what teams in front of you will do. Im personally gonna enjoy watching guys who are actually going to be here in the future play good basketball late in the year.

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But one of reasons why team did not have "core" is because they were constantlly screwing up lottery either by drafting poorly or winning few meaningless games to stay away from top players.

Especially before lottery reform , tanking simply made sense. If you were worst team, you were granted top 4 pick.

Dallas - Magic thing did not include any tie breakers.
Magic won 25 games, Dallas 24. If Dallas won Magic would have had 24 wins, and Dallas 25.
That would put them in tie breaker with Hawks who ended up with 3rd pick. But here is a kicker- in last game of regular season
Magic in game for virtually nothing, played Wizards who secured playoff spot. And Magic just randomlly decided to bring starters . They only played them 12 min but in slugfest of bums Magic bums wanted to "prove "themselfs and won last quater 25-17, enough for Magic to fall from tiebreaker for potential 3rd pick to 6th pick.

If Magic lost both games they would be in play for Luka, Trae and Jaren Jackson. All 3 guys are allstars. Instad, we won 2 cultural establishing games and drafted Mo f**** Bamba.

Btw in 2017 Magic won 29 games and drafted 6th, 76ers won 28 jumped to 3# ( and drafted Tatum but crewed it up with Fultz trade). Lakers won just 3 games less to get 2# spot.

Look, i'm really not big fan of tanking nor i belive it's miracle work, but if you are in position where you are winning 25-30 games , nobody will care about mid April win carried on by Rodney Purvis that eventually costed you chance for Luka Doncic.

I don't disagree that we missed out by not tanking hard enough in the past where the situation was different and odds were different. I remember that Dallas win. It sucked but Dallas sat everyone in that game. Sometimes you have to tilt your hat to the better tank. We tried to lose that Wizards game. We just still won it. Why do we always focus on one direction. If we won a few more games then we coulda had the Kings spot and drafted Luka. Its a lottery. Don't get me wrong. I was all in on the tank. I think tanking is a necessary evil depending on the circumstance. Our circumstance does not call for it currently.

We are 1 win away from being in the same territory as Washington and Portland. Orlando could drop 5%-10% out of picking top 4 should they surpass us. I’d rather have that % than a win nobody will care about in two months.

Again. Its a lottery. You want Brandon Miller. Cool. We need to pick number 2 to get him. Currently we have a 10.5% chance to get him. If we catch the Wizards we will have a 9.2% chance. So this conversation is about 1.3%?

These games are valuable. If Evan Fournier was leading us to victory Id agree with you. Thats not the case. You don't see any value in our young guys playing well in high intensity meaningful games? You dont see in value in Paolo whos struggled with his 3 ball knocking down clutch ones late in games?

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Oh there is definitely value.

I don’t think winning these last few games is massively important if Orlando is still missing the playoffs this season and not at full health.

Yes. 1.3% matters.

Please explain what you would like us to do to achieve this important 1.3%. The art of tanking is putting bad young players on the floor with hope to lose. Sit your best guys as much as possible. Our young guys are our best players. So do you want to sit Paolo and Franz? Do you want to sit Cole and Suggs? Keep in mind we are not mathematically eliminated from the play in.

[VFX]

I'm not really concerned about winning games until they actually lose the 5th worst spot lol.

Be prepared.

[Knightro]

I'm not really concerned about winning games until they actually lose the 5th worst spot lol.

Be prepared.

Orlando has 31 with 8 to go
Washington has 32 with 9 to go
Portland has 32 with 10 to go
Indiana has 33 with 9 to go

How many more wins do you think the Magic have in them? I could see 3 maybe?

Losing to Washington next Friday is really gonna be the big one. That's the one above the others that they clearly need to tank.

[pepe1991]

I'm not really concerned about winning games until they actually lose the 5th worst spot lol.

Be prepared.

Orlando has 31 with 8 to go
Washington has 32 with 9 to go
Portland has 32 with 10 to go
Indiana has 33 with 9 to go

How many more wins do you think the Magic have in them? I could see 3 maybe?

Losing to Washington next Friday is really gonna be the big one. That's the one above the others that they clearly need to tank.

Brooklyn in second night of their back to backs at home , Pistons , look like very, very winnable games. Washington game looks like pivotal to secure top 6 worst record.

Heat & Brooklyn last two games could both be games for nothing for all teams involved, imo.

[Knightro]

Wizards host the Spurs tonight and are 8 point favorites as the Spurs appear set to sit out most of their veterans (Collins, Graham, McDermott).

Blazers host the Bulls tonight and are underdogs, but it sounds like DeRozan may not be able to play for Chicago.

Need both of those results bigly.

[VFX]

Be prepared.

Orlando has 31 with 8 to go
Washington has 32 with 9 to go
Portland has 32 with 10 to go
Indiana has 33 with 9 to go

How many more wins do you think the Magic have in them? I could see 3 maybe?

Losing to Washington next Friday is really gonna be the big one. That's the one above the others that they clearly need to tank.

Brooklyn in second night of their back to backs at home , Pistons , look like very, very winnable games. Washington game looks like pivotal to secure top 6 worst record.

Heat & Brooklyn last two games could both be games for nothing for all teams involved, imo.

Washington will tank that game. Orlando won’t. I’ll make a bet on it.

I’ll say 4 more games while others in the group actively tank.

Washington, Detroit, Cleveland once, and Brooklyn once (and/or) Miami.

[Knightro]

Washington will tank that game. Orlando won’t. I’ll make a bet on it.

I’ll say 4 more games while others in the group actively tank.

Washington, Detroit, Cleveland once, and Brooklyn once (and/or) Miami.

Washington does still have the Spurs and Rockets at home. If those two teams out-tank them, that would put them at 34 right there.

[VFX]

Washington will tank that game. Orlando won’t. I’ll make a bet on it.

I’ll say 4 more games while others in the group actively tank.

Washington, Detroit, Cleveland once, and Brooklyn once (and/or) Miami.

Washington does still have the Spurs and Rockets at home. If those two teams out-tank them, that would put them at 34 right there.

What’s funny is that none of those teams at the top need to actively tank now. They are all pretty solidly going to have a 14% chance at #1 pick.

The real ‘race’ now is for those 1.5% increments at #1 and the 5% +\- at top 4 between 5-7.

[tooler]

Both the winning and the lotto odds are pretty meaningless. I’d still lean toward the lotto. One simple solution is to shut down Franz to give Bol some minutes, maybe goose his trade value. Plus give Paolo more reps to generate excitement over the off season.

[eyriq]

I'm not really concerned about winning games until they actually lose the 5th worst spot lol.

Exactly. I'm enjoying it while my unconscious is very nervously watching our lead in the tankathon haha

I do want to win out though, not going to lie. That would be so good for Paolo and Franz and for our narrative.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Cole had another solid game.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

I’m curiosity to know what brought on Paolo saying “I promised you” to Randle in the 4th quarter. It seems like every PF he goes against always have something against him.

[eyriq]

I’m curiosity to know what brought on Paolo saying “I promised you” to Randle in the 4th quarter. It seems like every PF he goes against always have something against him.

I missed that. Spicy! He really gave Randle problems all night, great to see.