2023-2024 Regular Season Game 10/In-Season Tournament Game 1: Orlando Magic (5-4) at Brooklyn Nets (5-5) - 7:30pm

[bigdogdylan5]

What is required to critique a coach? Honest question.

Honestly? Not as much as people think.

If there's some sort of CLEAR mismanagement with scheme, where a coach is asking a group of players who physically cannot or mentally cannot defend a certain style to keep defending a certain style and it keeps failing, that's on the coach.

If a coach keeps repeatedly calling set plays for guys who aren't capable of executing the play, or designing offensive schemes to get the wrong guy the ball in the wrong spot. That's on a coach.

But the season is really long. It's not realistic to expect A+ effort and A+ execution every single quarter of every single game. There's not only ebbs and flows within the season, but there's ebbs and flows within games too.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make the Magic turn the basketball over less. That's a personnel issue.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make bad shooters make more shots. That's a personnel issue.

Most problems for NBA teams stem from the Jimmys and Joes, not the X's and O's.

100% this but it’s always the coach that gets blamed. Look at the Bucks… they blamed the coach for last season and oops they hired someone at worst is actually worst and at best is taking time to acclimate to bring a head coach. Mosley should be getting a lot of credit imo for the defense which yea I know is not “sexy”. It all comes back to expectations. Why are we expecting our 3 year experience coach to be an elite defensive and offensive in schemes when this is the first year of not tanking?

[pepe1991]

Black friday is near and it's time to buy nba 2k and play rebuild with Bulls

No ,really, it's time for them to blow it up. That team died with Lonzo's career.

That's not mentioned enough...they were really good with Lonzo running things.

Lonzo might be a good model for Black...Lonzo became a really good shooter but that wasn't his profile. Very similar to Jason Kidd...big, good D, ultra high BBIQ (above all else), elite vision & passing - shooting came later

They played like 6 games together with Vuc, Rozan, Lavine & Lonzo.

Crazy. Kind a like Harden- Durant- Kyrie thing, great on paper, never played together.

[bigdogdylan5]

I think Mosley deserves some criticism for this performance. This was a game you should approach as if it was a playoff game. We were woefully unprepared and got blown out. Bad look for Mosley.

Oh come on it’s Mosley fault Cole and Suggs just forgot how to hold onto the basketball last night? Also why the hell do we need to treat this like a playoff game? The ultimate goal for this team should be playoffs. Go blame the league for scheduling a back to back involving the tournament. Oh guess what we have another back to back next week with Tournament for Toronto and Denver. That’s pretty fair for us…

You all need to be patient with Mosley on offense. It’s not his forte and he lost his lead offensive assistant right before the year and we have this super young guy in that role now. It’s the age old blame the coach because it’s easy.

I just don't know that he got the team in the right mindset to deal with the pressure of an in-season play-in game.

Why does there need to be a special mindset? He clearly treated it like just any regular season game by waiving the white flag and not caring about differential. If you disagree with him fine but the playoffs have to be the goal not some new tournament that may or may not be worth anything.

So let me ask this hypothetical let’s say he treats it as a true playoff game and goes to a 7 or 8 man rotation with Paolo and Franz playing 40+ minutes. Then we got to travel to a different city on a back to back and play them another 35 minutes? It’s dumb and if someone got hurt in that second game we would be calling it the dumbest move in a long time.

[eyriq]

Oh come on it’s Mosley fault Cole and Suggs just forgot how to hold onto the basketball last night? Also why the hell do we need to treat this like a playoff game? The ultimate goal for this team should be playoffs. Go blame the league for scheduling a back to back involving the tournament. Oh guess what we have another back to back next week with Tournament for Toronto and Denver. That’s pretty fair for us…

You all need to be patient with Mosley on offense. It’s not his forte and he lost his lead offensive assistant right before the year and we have this super young guy in that role now. It’s the age old blame the coach because it’s easy.

I just don't know that he got the team in the right mindset to deal with the pressure of an in-season play-in game.

Why does there need to be a special mindset? He clearly treated it like just any regular season game by waiving the white flag and not caring about differential. If you disagree with him fine but the playoffs have to be the goal not some new tournament that may or may not be worth anything.

So let me ask this hypothetical let’s say he treats it as a true playoff game and goes to a 7 or 8 man rotation with Paolo and Franz playing 40+ minutes. Then we got to travel to a different city on a back to back and play them another 35 minutes? It’s dumb and if someone got hurt in that second game we would be calling it the dumbest move in a long time.

I think you nailed it. I think he should have treated it that way, maybe not quite that extreme, but definitely as a game that is more important than a regular season game.

[bigdogdylan5]

I just don't know that he got the team in the right mindset to deal with the pressure of an in-season play-in game.

Why does there need to be a special mindset? He clearly treated it like just any regular season game by waiving the white flag and not caring about differential. If you disagree with him fine but the playoffs have to be the goal not some new tournament that may or may not be worth anything.

So let me ask this hypothetical let’s say he treats it as a true playoff game and goes to a 7 or 8 man rotation with Paolo and Franz playing 40+ minutes. Then we got to travel to a different city on a back to back and play them another 35 minutes? It’s dumb and if someone got hurt in that second game we would be calling it the dumbest move in a long time.

I think you nailed it. I think he should have treated it that way, maybe not quite that extreme, but definitely as a game that is more important than a regular season game.

I just don’t know what you want? Do you think the players played with a lack of effort or didn’t take it serious? Because I totally disagree with that. My thoughts were it was 100% execution. They played really hard dinwidee got hot and made shots through awesome defense. Cole might have been the only one being lackadaisical with the ball everyone else from a turnover perspective we’re trying to do too much but not a lack of effort.

It’s hard to say a middle ground because you either go to a short playoff rotation or normal rotation. If you’re disappointed about the last 4 minutes and playing the deep bench for tie breaker purposes I just don’t get that criticism. Either Mosley decided or maybe more likely conferred with front office and medical team to treat it as a normal game.

I agree with them. The in season tournament is cool for the fans but it’s not what I want the coaching staff to be focused on I want them to do everything they can to set us up for a potential playoff run. That means not playing the starters an extra 5 minutes on the front end of a back to back just to make the score closer for a tournament tie breaker that may or may not be relevant.

[basketballRob]

What is required to critique a coach? Honest question.

Honestly? Not as much as people think.

If there's some sort of CLEAR mismanagement with scheme, where a coach is asking a group of players who physically cannot or mentally cannot defend a certain style to keep defending a certain style and it keeps failing, that's on the coach.

If a coach keeps repeatedly calling set plays for guys who aren't capable of executing the play, or designing offensive schemes to get the wrong guy the ball in the wrong spot. That's on a coach.

But the season is really long. It's not realistic to expect A+ effort and A+ execution every single quarter of every single game. There's not only ebbs and flows within the season, but there's ebbs and flows within games too.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make the Magic turn the basketball over less. That's a personnel issue.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make bad shooters make more shots. That's a personnel issue.

Most problems for NBA teams stem from the Jimmys and Joes, not the X's and O's.

I disagree. I think a practice schedule can influence your shooting negatively.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

[basketballRob]

Ok man I think you have gotten your point across with the practice on Monday. We don’t know how intense it was. You can have a light practice that’s more than a walkthrough. This loss was not because we were tired it’s because we can’t break a zone by shooting and the live ball turnovers were nuts last night (mostly by Cole). Our wins this year have had a disturbing amount of reliance on Cole and/or Mo going nuts. When they had bad games it all fell apart. With our total disregard for shooting it means we have to play perfect from a turnover and defensive perspective that is a lot of pressure for a young team.

Wouldn't have been better to have a full practice on Sunday and then a day off to recuperate? SVG would never have a practiced before or after a b2b. Clifford more than likely had the same policy.

Something is going on with the flat performances in b2bs. They've been historically bad. So yes, I blame the coaches.

They just did the same thing in LA and lost 2 games. They had 2 days after the Portland game and opted to practice the day before the b2b.

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You’re going off a sample size of 1 right now and that was a west coast rode trip. Let’s see if they look tired tonight. You may be right but I don’t mind the practice only if it was light. We just don’t know if it was a SVG practice where it’s arguably harder then a game or it was maybe one step above a walk through. We just don’t know. Last night nobody looked tired but the execution was dog ****. So maybe Mosley is trying to sneak any practice in. Paolo said they had a complete off day on his birthday too.

It doesn't matter. You still have to wake up and go there instead of sleeping in and relaxing.



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[eyriq]

Why does there need to be a special mindset? He clearly treated it like just any regular season game by waiving the white flag and not caring about differential. If you disagree with him fine but the playoffs have to be the goal not some new tournament that may or may not be worth anything.

So let me ask this hypothetical let’s say he treats it as a true playoff game and goes to a 7 or 8 man rotation with Paolo and Franz playing 40+ minutes. Then we got to travel to a different city on a back to back and play them another 35 minutes? It’s dumb and if someone got hurt in that second game we would be calling it the dumbest move in a long time.

I think you nailed it. I think he should have treated it that way, maybe not quite that extreme, but definitely as a game that is more important than a regular season game.

I just don’t know what you want? Do you think the players played with a lack of effort or didn’t take it serious? Because I totally disagree with that. My thoughts were it was 100% execution. They played really hard dinwidee got hot and made shots through awesome defense. Cole might have been the only one being lackadaisical with the ball everyone else from a turnover perspective we’re trying to do too much but not a lack of effort.

It’s hard to say a middle ground because you either go to a short playoff rotation or normal rotation. If you’re disappointed about the last 4 minutes and playing the deep bench for tie breaker purposes I just don’t get that criticism. Either Mosley decided or maybe more likely conferred with front office and medical team to treat it as a normal game.

I agree with them. The in season tournament is cool for the fans but it’s not what I want the coaching staff to be focused on I want them to do everything they can to set us up for a potential playoff run. That means not playing the starters an extra 5 minutes on the front end of a back to back just to make the score closer for a tournament tie breaker that may or may not be relevant.

That's fine, there's no consensus on how important the in-season tournament is. That said, what I want is for the team to appear prepared for a playoff atmosphere game. If this is the best he can do, it's fair to be critical of him for the poor execution and performance. We were particularly bad, and against a team that isn't necessarily better than us talent wise. We were not ready for this level of intensity.

We don't have many data points to use to evaluate Mosley's ability to coach in the playoffs. One thing I look for in a coach is to establish an identity and system that can withstand shocks and put players in positions where they're comfortable. I think he's getting us there for the regular season, but I consider this the first test of his playoff preparation and we underperformed, he'd get an F from me.

You spell out my case really well and I get it, you don't agree with me but yeah that's the gist of it.

[thelead]

Best thing about last night’s game? We have a game tonight…. And Paolo’s 3 pt shooting of course

[Bensational]

To me it’s pretty simple: if you’re 2 best players only combine for 40 points on 30 shots then you’re gonna struggle, and on the season they average 37 points on 31 attempts combined. We need more juice from the guys who are supposed to carry us when we struggle and hopefully as the season progresses they’ll settle into delivering that.

[eyriq]

What is required to critique a coach? Honest question.

Honestly? Not as much as people think.

If there's some sort of CLEAR mismanagement with scheme, where a coach is asking a group of players who physically cannot or mentally cannot defend a certain style to keep defending a certain style and it keeps failing, that's on the coach.

If a coach keeps repeatedly calling set plays for guys who aren't capable of executing the play, or designing offensive schemes to get the wrong guy the ball in the wrong spot. That's on a coach.

But the season is really long. It's not realistic to expect A+ effort and A+ execution every single quarter of every single game. There's not only ebbs and flows within the season, but there's ebbs and flows within games too.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make the Magic turn the basketball over less. That's a personnel issue.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make bad shooters make more shots. That's a personnel issue.

Most problems for NBA teams stem from the Jimmys and Joes, not the X's and O's.

This works as a start but is an oversimplification if I'm being honest. I'd expand the list of factors to:

1. Tactical accumen
2. Player development
3. Rotation and minutes management
4. In-game decision making
5. Adaptability
6. Team performance and results
7. Player management
8. Communication skills
9. Leadership and culture building
10. Innovation
11. Team morale and motivation
12. Handling of pressure situations

[JoshuaPotter]

What is required to critique a coach? Honest question.

Honestly? Not as much as people think.

If there's some sort of CLEAR mismanagement with scheme, where a coach is asking a group of players who physically cannot or mentally cannot defend a certain style to keep defending a certain style and it keeps failing, that's on the coach.

If a coach keeps repeatedly calling set plays for guys who aren't capable of executing the play, or designing offensive schemes to get the wrong guy the ball in the wrong spot. That's on a coach.

But the season is really long. It's not realistic to expect A+ effort and A+ execution every single quarter of every single game. There's not only ebbs and flows within the season, but there's ebbs and flows within games too.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make the Magic turn the basketball over less. That's a personnel issue.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make bad shooters make more shots. That's a personnel issue.

Most problems for NBA teams stem from the Jimmys and Joes, not the X's and O's.

This works as a start but is an oversimplification if I'm being honest. I'd expand the list of factors to:

1. Tactical accumen
2. Player development
3. Rotation and minutes management
4. In-game decision making
5. Adaptability
6. Team performance and results
7. Player management
8. Communication skills
9. Leadership and culture building
10. Innovation
11. Team morale and motivation
12. Handling of pressure situations

ChatGPT is this you?

[eyriq]

Honestly? Not as much as people think.

If there's some sort of CLEAR mismanagement with scheme, where a coach is asking a group of players who physically cannot or mentally cannot defend a certain style to keep defending a certain style and it keeps failing, that's on the coach.

If a coach keeps repeatedly calling set plays for guys who aren't capable of executing the play, or designing offensive schemes to get the wrong guy the ball in the wrong spot. That's on a coach.

But the season is really long. It's not realistic to expect A+ effort and A+ execution every single quarter of every single game. There's not only ebbs and flows within the season, but there's ebbs and flows within games too.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make the Magic turn the basketball over less. That's a personnel issue.

There's nothing Mosley can preach that will make bad shooters make more shots. That's a personnel issue.

Most problems for NBA teams stem from the Jimmys and Joes, not the X's and O's.

This works as a start but is an oversimplification if I'm being honest. I'd expand the list of factors to:

1. Tactical accumen
2. Player development
3. Rotation and minutes management
4. In-game decision making
5. Adaptability
6. Team performance and results
7. Player management
8. Communication skills
9. Leadership and culture building
10. Innovation
11. Team morale and motivation
12. Handling of pressure situations

ChatGPT is this you?

I turned into a coaching evaluation expert over night

[KillMonger]

Read on Twitter

[Audi]

Read on Twitter

Stupid turnovers and missed FTs being a major factor sounds about right.

[Bergmaniac]

The turnover percentage in the losses is only slightly higher - 16.6% compared to 16.0% in the wins.

[Last Guardian]

Losses always start these crazy debates. Magic do need better shooters (IMO better % not necessarily shoot more often). But they'd be at least a decent offensive team if they actually made their layups, dunks and free throws more often lol. And if they didn't turn it over as much.