It's time to move on from Mosley

[VFX]

What I find funny in the coaching argument is that people point to the lack of shooting talent as the primary reason Mosely isn’t on the hot seat or given any kind of scrutiny whatsoever.

Far be it from me to say Weltman has done his job. He hasn’t and I’m in the camp that believes this roster is more his fault than Mosely’s coaching…

However, are we going to completely overlook a few things that have or haven’t taken place here?

Weltman signed KCP. (by everyone’s standards a shooter that fans praised this past offseason)
Weltman re-signed Gary Harris. (a shooter)
Weltman drafted Jett Howard. (albeit a bust)

Paolo hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2023-24
Franz hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2022-23

So is shooting really the primary issue? Yeah, if you place the blame on all of these guys as either becoming inept from shooting averages or you disregard development standards from dudes making maximum contract money.

It’s just funny that people call Mosely out on not calling for a timeout in certain game situations. What’s he gonna do? Draw up a great play for Gary Harris or KCP? No, he’s not. Mosely should pray they hire an actual development coach and someone that knows anything about an offense.

Should he be fired? Probably not. But he’s far from being exempt from accountability in terms of developing anything on that side of the floor so far.

[eyriq]

What I find funny in the coaching argument is that people point to the lack of shooting talent as the primary reason Mosely isn’t on the hot seat or given any kind of scrutiny whatsoever.

Far be it from me to say Weltman has done his job. He hasn’t and I’m in the camp that believes this roster is more his fault than Mosely’s coaching…

However, are we going to completely overlook a few things that have or haven’t taken place here?

Weltman signed KCP. (by everyone’s standards a shooter that fans praised this past offseason)
Weltman re-signed Gary Harris. (a shooter)
Weltman drafted Jett Howard. (albeit a bust)

Paolo hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2023-24
Franz hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2022-23

So is shooting really the primary issue? Yeah, if you place the blame on all of these guys as either becoming inept from shooting averages or you disregard development standards from dudes making maximum contract money.

It’s just funny that people call Mosely out on not calling for a timeout in certain game situations. What’s he gonna do? Draw up a great play for Gary Harris or KCP? No, he’s not. Mosely should pray they hire an actual development coach and someone that knows anything about an offense.

Should he be fired? Probably not. But he’s far from being exempt from accountability in terms of developing anything on that side of the floor so far.

That’s actually a damning point. A drop-off across the board like that doesn’t happen by accident. It screams of something systemic.

This isn’t something Mosley can just sidestep. It points directly to the structure and philosophy of the offense, and that needs a countermeasure. Whether that’s a coaching staff shake-up, a completely new offensive system, or bringing in someone who actually knows how to develop shooting, something has to give. Standing pat isn't an option anymore.

[GelbeWand09]

The he got no shooters or ballhandlers or offensive players in general argument comes back to Mosely too. He definitely played his part in putting the squad together. As if Weltman only brings in and drafts players he thinks are good. He will of course also ask Mosley what he needs and what players he thinks are suitable. Does anyone think it's a coincidence that Carlisle, for example, has a bunch of shooters on the team in Dallas and Indiana?

I'm not saying we have to fire him, but we definitely need a upgrade in the coaching staff .

[Skybox]

What I find funny in the coaching argument is that people point to the lack of shooting talent as the primary reason Mosely isn’t on the hot seat or given any kind of scrutiny whatsoever.

Far be it from me to say Weltman has done his job. He hasn’t and I’m in the camp that believes this roster is more his fault than Mosely’s coaching…

However, are we going to completely overlook a few things that have or haven’t taken place here?

Weltman signed KCP. (by everyone’s standards a shooter that fans praised this past offseason)
Weltman re-signed Gary Harris. (a shooter)
Weltman drafted Jett Howard. (albeit a bust)

Paolo hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2023-24
Franz hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2022-23

So is shooting really the primary issue? Yeah, if you place the blame on all of these guys as either becoming inept from shooting averages or you disregard development standards from dudes making maximum contract money.

It’s just funny that people call Mosely out on not calling for a timeout in certain game situations. What’s he gonna do? Draw up a great play for Gary Harris or KCP? No, he’s not. Mosely should pray they hire an actual development coach and someone that knows anything about an offense.

Should he be fired? Probably not. But he’s far from being exempt from accountability in terms of developing anything on that side of the floor so far.

I'm pro-Mosely but you've listed some "good shooters" and then you have Caleb, TdS, WCJ...lots of "shooters" but the shooting overall is terrible. Ive got to believe there's more to it than "let's get Kennard and Klay Thompson in here". If one guy is shooting way below his career avg, that's on him...but it's hard to pile directly on KCP, for example, when the whole team isn't shooting...doesn't excuse them either, I've seen PLENTY of open misses, but it seems that across a whole season (or two) an entire team shouldn't be so inept. So Weltman's the worst but Mose isn't without stains.

[eyriq]

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[SloNick Russia]

What was the realistic goal for this season.
Home court in the playoffs = 3-4 seed in regulation and one PO series win.
Did we get it? No. Did Mosley, FO and players had excuses to come up short? Sure. Health been the first one. We were not supposed to play Boston in the first round, but we did and played it about as well as we could given the roster issues.
What is the reason to fire Mosley? Is there a coach out there to make Paolo and Franz contenders in their 4th and 5th season? I don't think so. Mosley is a fine coach, his defensive approach works both in regulation and playoffs. Let him continue to develop our core. He is like the least of our problems.

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[jonbob17]

I am for keeping him. The offense is just atrocious. He didn't assemble this team. He didn't hurt our guys. He didn't miss a single three point shot this year.

With that said, the whole organization needs to have a come to Jesus moment, and get it through their heads how important shooting is in the NBA in 2025. I was kind of against the Franz extension last summer just because a max is a max whether he signed it last season or this one. And Franz had serious glaring hole in his game, its been more than 2 years, it first showed up in the FIBA 3 summers ago. Franz would have got the max anyways, but it could have been a wake up call for him..I am flawed. If Franz is going to reach his ceiling he has to shoot consistently. That goes for Paolo and Suggs too. I am fine with locking in Suggs, but Kris Dunn $5M a year and even he shot 33%. You ain't getting $30M a year for defense alone.

This has to be about the worst shooting team of the 21st century. We finished 7% behind the leading team in threes. We made 7 less threes a game than the Celtics on the year. 18 vs 11. That is insane.

Effective FG% Cavs 58% Magic 51%. That's 14 points per 100 possessions (per game).

It would be a short leash for everyone from Hammond down...You can't be an all time bad team on offense, or even a slightly healthier or better version of one and contend. We have to at least be average efficiency, and then you can rely on your defense to crush the opponent's efficiency.

[VFX]

I'm pro-Mosely but you've listed some "good shooters" and then you have Caleb, TdS, WCJ...lots of "shooters" but the shooting overall is terrible. Ive got to believe there's more to it than "let's get Kennard and Klay Thompson in here". If one guy is shooting way below his career avg, that's on him...but it's hard to pile directly on KCP, for example, when the whole team isn't shooting...doesn't excuse them either, I've seen PLENTY of open misses, but it seems that across a whole season (or two) an entire team shouldn't be so inept. So Weltman's the worst but Mose isn't without stains.

Anybody that thinks about the issues with the roster for more than 5 seconds knows it isn’t as simple as acquiring a better version of a guy to catch and shoot a basketball.

No amount of coaching will solve that. But it also doesn’t mean every player forgets how to shoot or regresses because you decide leaning on two players is the solution to everything as opposed to trying alternatives.

As someone said previously… it’s not like Mosely isn’t consulted on acquisitions at all. At no point in 4 seasons did he say “I need someone other than Paolo to bring the ball up the court and initiate the offense. We are too stagnant”.

[RichCollab]

Playing hard defense does impact your legs for shooting.

Maybe players get in peak shape through out the season but injuries and rotations get in the way of that.

I do believe the effort expended has some impact on our own shooting. It’s still probably just marginal though.

Drafting philosophy has another impact on our shooting. Believing we can teach everyone to was solid shooters. It helps when you start as a good shooter.

[Max Power]

I’m very much against letting Mosely go. He’s done a masterful job turning the team into something. That’s not to say it’s a finished product, we all know the score, offensively this team is a long way off, and coaching does play a role in that. I’m thinking some coaching personnel changes and roster adjustments can get the team on track. We’ve got more than one star level guy and a couple high end defenders, the Magic cupboard isn’t bare by any means. I think Mose should bring in an offensive guru and a real point guard who’s solid hitting the 3 and we’ll see a huge difference offensively next year.

[JoshuaPotter]

Wrote a long reply, decided to erase it.

The answer is. No not today, but soon. In one hand, you play with the roster you are dealt. A team with only 1 PG, and a developing wing Point Guard who may not be a Point Guard at all.

If I recall correctly. Brian Hill quit when he didn't get the PG he wanted.

Paolo asked for a PG officially after exiting season number 2, and now it is also his Max extension time....1 year later.

Tik Tok Weltman. .

[fateis007]

Playing hard defense does impact your legs for shooting.

Maybe players get in peak shape through out the season but injuries and rotations get in the way of that.

I do believe the effort expended has some impact on our own shooting. It’s still probably just marginal though.

Drafting philosophy has another impact on our shooting. Believing we can teach everyone to was solid shooters. It helps when you start as a good shooter.

It's funny I always wondered that myself. If maybe how hard we play on defense, combined with a pretty bad offense, is compounding our shooting woes.

[Cammo101]

I don't think he will be fired. I wouldn't be mad if he was fired, but I also don't think he's been given much of a chance. Talent wins and he has first round exit talent.

[Kent]

We won more games than we should have this season BECAUSE of Mosley.

You want more wins?

Consider changing out players before you think about getting a new coach.

[BadMofoPimp]

I wonder if Mobley would have a better offense with a better roster with shooters. But, I also feel that Defense wins championships. Especially, for a small market team. Need some 3 and D players for better wings around Franz/Paolo then get those guys to pass the ball more. I think Paolo really wants the Max so he sort of hijacked the offense. Maybe, if he gets his max, he will start playing more team ball.

[zaymon]

I wonder if Mobley would have a better offense with a better roster with shooters. But, I also feel that Defense wins championships. Especially, for a small market team. Need some 3 and D players for better wings around Franz/Paolo then get those guys to pass the ball more. I think Paolo really wants the Max so he sort of hijacked the offense. Maybe, if he gets his max, he will start playing more team ball.

I agree with you but that maybe is a very scary one. Most think the reward is worth the risk but i think its not as obvious at it seems.

[drsd]

That’s actually a damning point. A drop-off across the board like that doesn’t happen by accident. It screams of something systemic

Playing hard defense does impact your legs for shooting.

Summing these up, maybe Rich has isolated "why" the Magic regressed to-a-man on distance shooting.

If true, "ball handling" or "add shooters" wouldn't fix this. Playing defense with less intensity would. That ain't gonna happen with Coach leading this team.

[AdamTheGreek]

What I find funny in the coaching argument is that people point to the lack of shooting talent as the primary reason Mosely isn’t on the hot seat or given any kind of scrutiny whatsoever.

Far be it from me to say Weltman has done his job. He hasn’t and I’m in the camp that believes this roster is more his fault than Mosely’s coaching…

However, are we going to completely overlook a few things that have or haven’t taken place here?

Weltman signed KCP. (by everyone’s standards a shooter that fans praised this past offseason)
Weltman re-signed Gary Harris. (a shooter)
Weltman drafted Jett Howard. (albeit a bust)

Paolo hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2023-24
Franz hasn’t progressed as a shooter from outside
Best 3pt shooting season so far was 2022-23

So is shooting really the primary issue? Yeah, if you place the blame on all of these guys as either becoming inept from shooting averages or you disregard development standards from dudes making maximum contract money.

It’s just funny that people call Mosely out on not calling for a timeout in certain game situations. What’s he gonna do? Draw up a great play for Gary Harris or KCP? No, he’s not. Mosely should pray they hire an actual development coach and someone that knows anything about an offense.

Should he be fired? Probably not. But he’s far from being exempt from accountability in terms of developing anything on that side of the floor so far.

Paolo shot 44% from 3 in the Celtics series.
I’m willing to trust that number more than the 32% regular season number where he spent over a month trying to get back into form from the oblique.

Franz has some 3-point yips that go in and out. We don’t know who is to blame for that: Franz or our coaching staff. Because the form definitely changed a few times this season. Franz is a perfectionist, he’ll figure it out.

We’re the worst 3-point shooting team in the league, but we’re middle of the pack in open 3-point looks. That means we’re getting the roster open looks, they’re just not hitting them. That’s on the personnel to convert.

[p0peye]

If they can’t get some better assistants on offense? Yeah, probably.

Orlando's offenive coordinator needs to be replaced; not coach Mosley.

Given the current roster, 30 per cent of the plays should be fast breaks, 30 per cent of the plays pick and rolls, and the other 40% everything else - including spot Heroball plays to mix it up.

There have been some beautiful Banchero to F-Wagner PnRs in the playoffs. They are a thing of wonder and I cannot understand why that is not go-to for this team.

Fast breaks are outcome of defense and outlet passing.

[basketballRob]

Weltman admitted yesterday that it was a roster flaw and not Mosely.

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