HUGE blockbuster just went down.

[magik9113]

On the bright side, the Cavs gain pretty much nothing here, and might even get worse.

seriously?
Joe Smith/Ben Wallace are solid additions IMO.

[drsd]

Cleveland got better this year at the expense of future years. THis is a good trade for the Magic in the long run.

Wallace simply has to many miles in the tank to be effective for more than a year or two. Then, LBJ's team will truly be crap.

[Magicmehdi]

I hoped we could land Joe Smith, he's playing ball this year.

Not a great trade for their future but if we face them in the postseason, Dwight better turn into Supereboundman.

At least we won't have Hughes kicking our a**

[MagicFan3]

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seriously?
Joe Smith/Ben Wallace are solid additions IMO.

Ben Wallace has a negative amount of offensive talent. Smith is good but will offer similar production to Gooden. This is at best a lateral move for them IMO.

[CraZyPraiZ]

Cleveland just skipped right by us. They got a lot more physical with big Ben and Delonte only has to stay out of Lebron's way. Joe Smith has been very solid this year. How does Cleveland not look way better after this trade. As for people saying they got better but sacrificed the future, errr there is no guarantee of tomorrow. At least they are playing to win now. Damn we have a horrible GM with no vision.

[EasternMagic]

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Are you kidding? Wally's numbers this year are all below his career averages. He comes of the bench in Seattle because they want to develop Durant. I don't see how playing with 7 apg Lebron would hurt his numbers. Lebron plays good with shooters around him that's why Gibson's been so good there.

ok your just proving my point.... and there were multiple games where he surpased 20pts with seattle.

[Magicfan94]

Cleveland just skipped right by us. They got a lot more physical with big Ben and Delonte only has to stay out of Lebron's way. Joe Smith has been very solid this year. How does Cleveland not look way better after this trade. As for people saying they got better but sacrificed the future, errr there is no guarantee of tomorrow. At least they are playing to win now. Damn we have a horrible GM with no vision.

How, Ben Wallace has been awful this season. The Bulls have been trying to unload him on every team possible, bt no one bit...until today.

Wallace is only averaging a little over 8 boards and is not the same defensive stopper he was.

Our GM has no vision? I'd argue that he's playing for the future, which is a lot better than playing for today. There was nothing out there that we could have traded for that would guarentee us anything this year.

The win now attitude is a bad one to have because it ends up screwing a team in the future in most cases. Ask Sacramento, ask Dallas, ask New York.

[MagiChamps]

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ok your just proving my point.... and there were multiple games where he surpased 20pts with seattle.

What? Yes he had games where he passed twenty point in seattle. He's done that every year, but overall his numbers are down from what he usually gets. Could you explain to me how I am proving your point?

[Bucs80]

How, Ben Wallace has been awful this season. The Bulls have been trying to unload him on every team possible, bt no one bit...until today.

Wallace is only averaging a little over 8 boards and is not the same defensive stopper he was.

Our GM has no vision? I'd argue that he's playing for the future, which is a lot better than playing for today. There was nothing out there that we could have traded for that would guarentee us anything this year.

The win now attitude is a bad one to have because it ends up screwing a team in the future in most cases. Ask Sacramento, ask Dallas, ask New York.

Otis has no vision. He said we were gonna go young last year. Then he unloaded most everyone who was young, and then got a whole bunch of guys who are middle aged. Then he paid a non-superstar so much money, that would pretty much tie the team salary cap wise for years. We play no defense, we have no real competent big men other than Dwight Howard, and our bench sucks.

The way the team is a win now team, and our serious needs for players. He needed to make moves, and he didn't do it.

[zuppafly]

I think Cleveland gets a more important piece than Wallace on the deal. Delonte fills their huge need of a (at least averge) PG. Gibson might become good but he's still very young, Delonte has a little more experience and he might be the biggest help for Lebron in this trade.

[CraZyPraiZ]

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How, Ben Wallace has been awful this season. The Bulls have been trying to unload him on every team possible, bt no one bit...until today.

Wallace is only averaging a little over 8 boards and is not the same defensive stopper he was.

Our GM has no vision? I'd argue that he's playing for the future, which is a lot better than playing for today. There was nothing out there that we could have traded for that would guarentee us anything this year.

The win now attitude is a bad one to have because it ends up screwing a team in the future in most cases. Ask Sacramento, ask Dallas, ask New York.

While you're at it ask LA, Dallas, Phoenix, Cleveland if they are all playing for now or the future. What will you say when our shooters all have off years and we resemble this years Bulls. A classic jumpshooting team that never got anywhere and now is forced to rebuild. You never know what tomorrow brings, so as in life you go for it today not tomorrow. A couple of moves here and there and we can compete for a championship this year. As it stands now we will be lucky yo get out of the first round, especially if we have home court advantage.

[spinedoc]

Honestly, some of you have tunnel vision. You focus on what the player is doing right now without looking at any other variables whatsoever. Cleveland did very well for themselves today. They bolstered their frontline with Ben and Smith. Gooden is a goofball imo, and Hughes has his moments but his cotract is ridiculous. To get Delonte with a new frontcourt and not use AV (I realize they couldn't trade him anyway) is a very nice day. I'm not too cracked up about Wally, but overall its still a good trade for the Cavs.

[Magicfan94]

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While you're at it ask LA, Dallas, Phoenix, Cleveland if they are all playing for now or the future. What will you say when our shooters all have off years and we resemble this years Bulls. A classic jumpshooting team that never got anywhere and now is forced to rebuild. You never know what tomorrow brings, so as in life you go for it today not tomorrow. A couple of moves here and there and we can compete for a championship this year. As it stands now we will be lucky yo get out of the first round, especially if we have home court advantage.

LA wasn't playing for now, in fact that's why Kobe wanted out. After Bynum went down they had to make a trade for a big man, and well the fact that they had cap room allowed the Gasol trade.

Orlando would have had to trade a big piece for a similar deal.

Phoenix and Dallas HAVE to play for now, their superstarsis all aging players and both are in serious cap troubles for the next few years.

Cleveland...I still think that trade does nothing outstanding for them. Ben Wallace is having one of the worst seasons he's ever had.

The whole play to win now is nice and it worked for the Heat, but now they're screwed for 3-4 years while they get rid of some of the veterns and get youth around Wade.

Besides really WHAT trade would have benefited us today?

Remember this board was pushing for Turk to get dealt this time last year so we could keep Darko...

[MagiChamps]

Honestly, some of you have tunnel vision. You focus on what the player is doing right now without looking at any other variables whatsoever. Cleveland did very well for themselves today. They bolstered their frontline with Ben and Smith. Gooden is a goofball imo, and Hughes has his moments but his cotract is ridiculous. To get Delonte with a new frontcourt and not use AV (I realize they couldn't trade him anyway) is a very nice day. I'm not too cracked up about Wally, but overall its still a good trade for the Cavs.

I actually thought Wally was the best part of the deal for the Cavs. James is a lot like Wade where he likes to drive and kick it back out to the three point line when he has nowhere to go. That's where he gets a lot of his assists but until now the only real three point threat he's had in the starting lineup this year is Gibson. Sczerbiak gives the Cavs a career 41% three point shooter that can spread the floor for James and drop twenty on any night. He'll be a more consistent option on offense than anyone James has had yet in Cleveland.

[spinedoc]

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I actually thought Wally was the best part of the deal for the Cavs. James is a lot like Wade where he likes to drive and kick it back out to the three point line when he has nowhere to go. That's where he gets a lot of his assists but until now the only real three point threat he's had in the starting lineup this year is Gibson. Sczerbiak gives the Cavs a career 41% three point shooter that can spread the floor for James and drop twenty on any night. He'll be a more consistent option on offense than anyone James has had yet in Cleveland.

Yeah, I suppose, but he's not the best piece in todays trades. The only thing that I like about Wally vs Hughes is that his contract is one year shorter. They both make an obscene amount of money for what they bring to the table. I do see your point about Wally being more of a pure spot up shooter though.

The best imo was getting Wallace and Smith. With Z in the paint like a redwood, Bens' numbers will go up. And Smith is a much more prolific scorer than Gooden. The perfecta for them would have been to move Snow today too for a cheaper more manageable contract at the point, but they still did pretty well.

[MagiChamps]

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Yeah, I suppose, but he's not the best piece in todays trades. The only thing that I like about Wally vs Hughes is that his contract is one year shorter. They both make an obscene amount of money for what they bring to the table. I do see your point about Wally being more of a pure spot up shooter though.

The best imo was getting Wallace and Smith. With Z in the paint like a redwood, Bens' numbers will go up. And Smith is a much more prolific scorer than Gooden. The perfecta for them would have been to move Snow today too for a cheaper more manageable contract at the point, but they still did pretty well.

I agree the whole deal was great for the Cavs. I'm still not sure how they're gonna rotate all their big men though. Smith is better than Gooden but I wouldn't say he's a huge improvement. If you start him and Ilgauskas together then Big Ben is just a really good overpaid bench player. Probably the best idea would be to start Ben and Z together which is great for defense and rebounding but Ben has never been able to score and he will only clog the lane. The only way this lineup works now that Gooden and Hughes scoring are gone is with Sczerbiak on the floor. Ben was good in Detroit because every other player on his team could score the ball and all he had to do was play defense. It will be the same in Cleveland and IMO Sczerbiak is a big reason why.

[spinedoc]

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I agree the whole deal was great for the Cavs. I'm still not sure how they're gonna rotate all their big men though. Smith is better than Gooden but I wouldn't say he's a huge improvement. If you start him and Ilgauskas together then Big Ben is just a really good overpaid bench player. Probably the best idea would be to start Ben and Z together which is great for defense and rebounding but Ben has never been able to score and he will only clog the lane. The only way this lineup works now that Gooden and Hughes scoring are gone is with Sczerbiak on the floor. Ben was good in Detroit because every other player on his team could score the ball and all he had to do was play defense. It will be the same in Cleveland and IMO Sczerbiak is a big reason why.

It will be interesting to see how they work it, but I'd go with a starting lineup of Delonte, Lebron, J.Smith, Wallace, and Z, then have Gibson, Wally and AV come off the bench. They did as well as they could with what they had, not sure if it will be enough to keep Lebron, but they have more time to continue to improve.

[devwat12]

Why are people saying this hurts the Cavs future?

They have been trying to move Gooden for 2 years. He was involved in every trade discussion brought up. He plays no D, is stupid, and his motivation is questionable. He barely ever played in 4th quarters when everybody was healthy. They don't lose anything by moving him. Joe Smith is better than Gooden right now.

Wallace has an ugly contract and that seems to be what everybody is hung up on. When you look and see that Larry Hughes' contract is equally as bad and equally long, it is basically a wash.

They also pick up Delonte West and a 2nd round pick. Good and good.

Wally will help space the floor for Lebron and has a huge expiring deal next season. Have you been watching what expiring contracts can get you these days?

This deal involved the Cavs giving up 4 scrubs and 2 poor fits. They got better THIS season and didn't hurt their future flexibility at all.

[spinedoc]

Why are people saying this hurts the Cavs future?

They have been trying to move Gooden for 2 years. He was involved in every trade discussion brought up. He plays no D, is stupid, and his motivation is questionable. He barely ever played in 4th quarters when everybody was healthy. They don't lose anything by moving him. Joe Smith is better than Gooden right now.

Wallace has an ugly contract and that seems to be what everybody is hung up on. When you look and see that Larry Hughes' contract is equally as bad and equally long, it is basically a wash.

They also pick up Delonte West and a 2nd round pick. Good and good.

Wally will help space the floor for Lebron and has a huge expiring deal next season. Have you been watching what expiring contracts can get you these days?

This deal involved the Cavs giving up 4 scrubs and 2 poor fits. They got better THIS season and didn't hurt their future flexibility at all.

That seems to be the topic dejour, check out the other threads. We don't know what we've been watching apparently.

[CraZyPraiZ]

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How, Ben Wallace has been awful this season. The Bulls have been trying to unload him on every team possible, bt no one bit...until today.

Wallace is only averaging a little over 8 boards and is not the same defensive stopper he was.

Our GM has no vision? I'd argue that he's playing for the future, which is a lot better than playing for today. There was nothing out there that we could have traded for that would guarentee us anything this year.

The win now attitude is a bad one to have because it ends up screwing a team in the future in most cases. Ask Sacramento, ask Dallas, ask New York.

Ben Wallace has not been motivated, and the reason no one wanted him is that fat contract. We'll see if he plays better or not. Nothing guarantees that we will play better next year. What happens when the jumpshot stops falling as this is the only area we excel in? Look at this years Bulls and you'll see what I mean. We were so close and instead we have a gm that just mailed it in for the rest of this year. GJ Blowtis.