Game 14: Magic @ Bucks - Trying to get even (going for 7-7)

[Orlwillbeback]

The magic's good defensive rating says more about the team's we've played than us if you ask me.

[BadWolf]

I am not sure if watching the Bucks players getting wide open shots with no defender in site as being solid defensively.

Did the Bucks miss some open shots? Sure.

But you have to figure they shot under 41% WITH 27 fast break points, almost all of those 27 points coming on uncontested dunks and layups off turnovers.

That means in the half court, when the Magic had a set defense, the Bucks basically did nothing.

They are a terrible half court team and try to always run. Not sure it's a sign of great defense.

[Knightro]

They are a terrible half court team and try to always run. Not sure it's a sign of great defense.

Just so I have this right...

This Bucks team that was shooting 44.97% from the floor with a nearly 102 ORTG coming into the game, got held to 40.7% shooting and a 92.8 ORTG and the Magic's defense had nothing to do with it?

I know people are sour that the Magic lost, but the numbers don't lie in this case. The Magic played excellent defense, more than good enough to win. They lost because of an incredibly high number of turnovers and their own offensive failures.

[PennytoShaq]

I am not sure if watching the Bucks players getting wide open shots with no defender in site as being solid defensively.

Can you point out examples? The Magic sagged off certain guys and gave up shots by design. For example, Parker is not a great 3 point shooter, but he decided to be last night.

They were a little slow on some rotations, but for the most part were challenging the perimeter pretty well last night.

No, I think in many rotations, it was not by design. Players just lose their guys, don't fight thru screens or don't switch on hard picks.

They average 111 points at home and we held them to under 100.

[NBAchamps2017]

I feel like Payton is point shaving.

I have a different theory, in fact it maybe DJ who is deliberately doing this. DJ got paid already and it could be the last contract of his career. On the other hand, Payton is not and is looking for a decent contract next season. If DJ decided to play solid EVERY game and Payton struggles, little brother Payton will lose his starting job and a chance of getting paid handsomely. You see, this players brotherhood or something is thicker than the player-organization relationship. Feel me?

[Patrick1978]

Please Vogel, free Mario!! Green and Rudez to the bench!

Yes free mario and give some opportunities to wilcox

[Bergmaniac]

In some of the previous games where we recorded very good defensive numbers I thought it was more to do with the other team's incompetence than our great D (against Indy, the Wizards, Dallas, pelicans, etc). But last night we played excellent defense for most of the game IMO.

[Orlwillbeback]

I feel like Payton is point shaving.

I have a different theory, in fact it maybe DJ who is deliberately doing this. DJ got paid already and it could be the last contract of his career. On the other hand, Payton is not and is looking for a decent contract next season. If DJ decided to play solid EVERY game and Payton struggles, little brother Payton will lose his starting job and a chance of getting paid handsomely. You see, this players brotherhood or something is thicker than the player-organization relationship. Feel me?

Did you actually watch Payton last night tho? He literally gave up on defense one play and let the guy score and then the next or a few plays later he puts up that stupid three pointer. Not to mention so many plays where he just threw the ball to the other team.

I think he hates the organization for trading away all his buddies and now he's trying to get traded. Not only that but I think he doubts the competence of the guys above him. We owe it to Payton to give him another chance imo because he is too talented not to play in this league but we are screwing him up by making him play with Vuc and trading away his backcourt mate Oladipo and Dedmon who were his boys.

[tiderulz]

I feel like Payton is point shaving.

I have a different theory, in fact it maybe DJ who is deliberately doing this. DJ got paid already and it could be the last contract of his career. On the other hand, Payton is not and is looking for a decent contract next season. If DJ decided to play solid EVERY game and Payton struggles, little brother Payton will lose his starting job and a chance of getting paid handsomely. You see, this players brotherhood or something is thicker than the player-organization relationship. Feel me?

Did you actually watch Payton last night tho? He literally gave up on defense one play and let the guy score and then the next or a few plays later he puts up that stupid three pointer. Not to mention so many plays where he just threw the ball to the other team.

I think he hates the organization for trading away all his buddies and now he's trying to get traded. Not only that but I think he doubts the competence of the guys above him. We owe it to Payton to give him another chance imo because he is too talented not to play in this league but we are screwing him up by making him play with Vuc and trading away his backcourt mate Oladipo and Dedmon who were his boys.

he better learn real quick this is a business. Look at Harris, turning down other teams to sign in Orlando, to be traded away months later. NBA is a business, this isnt rec league or college ball anymore. You are paid to play, you play for your check now and your future checks. If he doesnt understand that now, maybe he does need to be traded away

[Rumncoke25]

I'm not very high on many players at the moment, but I would take this type of defensive effort every night. Even with the ...deficiencies with talent level on the team, this can win some games. But the turnovers are so disheartening, they make a offensively challenged team look offensively inept.

Side note has anyone got any info on a potential vucci injury? The one hung I expected he would be able to do is consistently give us 14-18 points on an average efficiency

[Orlwillbeback]

he better learn real quick this is a business. Look at Harris, turning down other teams to sign in Orlando, to be traded away months later. NBA is a business, this isnt rec league or college ball anymore. You are paid to play, you play for your check now and your future checks. If he doesnt understand that now, maybe he does need to be traded away

You are technically not wrong but keep in mind what leverage he has despite being immature.

He is a 6'4" athletic unselfish point guard who makes brilliant plays sometimes. That is rare. There are only so many of those guys that come along and be somewhat competent in the NBA.

He is rare and it is likely the Magic will pay him handsomely just to stay right where he is, problems and all.

However, I would not put it past the Magic to screw it up.

[OrlandoNed]

he better learn real quick this is a business. Look at Harris, turning down other teams to sign in Orlando, to be traded away months later. NBA is a business, this isnt rec league or college ball anymore. You are paid to play, you play for your check now and your future checks. If he doesnt understand that now, maybe he does need to be traded away

You are technically not wrong but keep in mind what leverage he has despite being immature.

He is a 6'4" athletic unselfish point guard who makes brilliant plays sometimes. That is rare. There are only so many of those guys that come along and be somewhat competent in the NBA.

He is rare and it is likely the Magic will pay him handsomely just to stay right where he is, problems and all.

However, I would not put it past the Magic to screw it up.

Just because Payton is a rare breed doesn't mean that's a good thing. He is not as special as you think he is. He is still a bottom 10 starting PG in the league and his strengths do not make up for enough of his weaknesses. What he is good at does not outweigh his inconsistency and complete lack of perimeter shooting. We can do better.

[PennytoShaq]

EDIT - wrong thread.

[tiderulz]

he better learn real quick this is a business. Look at Harris, turning down other teams to sign in Orlando, to be traded away months later. NBA is a business, this isnt rec league or college ball anymore. You are paid to play, you play for your check now and your future checks. If he doesnt understand that now, maybe he does need to be traded away

You are technically not wrong but keep in mind what leverage he has despite being immature.

He is a 6'4" athletic unselfish point guard who makes brilliant plays sometimes. That is rare. There are only so many of those guys that come along and be somewhat competent in the NBA.

He is rare and it is likely the Magic will pay him handsomely just to stay right where he is, problems and all.

However, I would not put it past the Magic to screw it up.

he has more liabilities than leverage. he is an athletic PG who doesnt bring intensity every night, pouts lately, cant shoot and has lack of confidence and self doubt. If he just was a bad shooter, that would be okay. That going into the 3rd year, he wont bring passion and intensity every night, that will run him right out of the league when combined with his other flaws.

[Orlwillbeback]

he better learn real quick this is a business. Look at Harris, turning down other teams to sign in Orlando, to be traded away months later. NBA is a business, this isnt rec league or college ball anymore. You are paid to play, you play for your check now and your future checks. If he doesnt understand that now, maybe he does need to be traded away

You are technically not wrong but keep in mind what leverage he has despite being immature.

He is a 6'4" athletic unselfish point guard who makes brilliant plays sometimes. That is rare. There are only so many of those guys that come along and be somewhat competent in the NBA.

He is rare and it is likely the Magic will pay him handsomely just to stay right where he is, problems and all.

However, I would not put it past the Magic to screw it up.

he has more liabilities than leverage. he is an athletic PG who doesnt bring intensity every night, pouts lately, cant shoot and has lack of confidence and self doubt. If he just was a bad shooter, that would be okay. That going into the 3rd year, he wont bring passion and intensity every night, that will run him right out of the league when combined with his other flaws.

You are partially correct.

My question: Find someone better in the next year without giving up too much.

[MagicStarwipe]

I feel like Payton is point shaving.

I have a different theory, in fact it maybe DJ who is deliberately doing this. DJ got paid already and it could be the last contract of his career. On the other hand, Payton is not and is looking for a decent contract next season. If DJ decided to play solid EVERY game and Payton struggles, little brother Payton will lose his starting job and a chance of getting paid handsomely. You see, this players brotherhood or something is thicker than the player-organization relationship. Feel me?

Did you actually watch Payton last night tho? He literally gave up on defense one play and let the guy score and then the next or a few plays later he puts up that stupid three pointer. Not to mention so many plays where he just threw the ball to the other team.

I think he hates the organization for trading away all his buddies and now he's trying to get traded. Not only that but I think he doubts the competence of the guys above him. We owe it to Payton to give him another chance imo because he is too talented not to play in this league but we are screwing him up by making him play with Vuc and trading away his backcourt mate Oladipo and Dedmon who were his boys.

lol what are you even talking about? He was one of our top defenders last night and only had 1 turnover.

[SOUL]

Dellavedova scored 3 points on Payton last night, other two shots he made were on DJ. He left Delly open once which is what I think people are going crazy about.. which is kinda silly. The other time he was open was when Elfrid was covering Fournier's man on the other side of the court and POINTING at either Green or Fournier to go to Delly since they were closer and they didn't budge. Considering we left Jabari open about 7 times for threes when all we needed to do was give him a little pressure, some of the criticism Elfrid gets is pretty laughable.

[Orlwillbeback]

If you can watch the last three minutes you'll see what I mean.

[Tayswagzzz]

Tonight's lining up like this:

D.J. Augustin
Evan Fournier
Aaron Gordon
Serge Ibaka
Bismack Biyombo

DOES VOGEL READ THE FORUMS?! I've been calling for this lineup for awhile now!!!! Dope!!! Magic on Facebook posted that lineup )))))


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[VFX]

Tonight's lining up like this:

D.J. Augustin
Evan Fournier
Aaron Gordon
Serge Ibaka
Bismack Biyombo

DOES VOGEL READ THE FORUMS?! I've been calling for this lineup for awhile now!!!! Dope!!! Magic on Facebook posted that lineup )))))


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Replace Mario with AG and that is the lineup we should have been running.

- I hope to god this lineup outperforms our original.