Game 53: Orlando Magic (20-32) @ Atlanta Hawks (29-21) - 7:00 PM ET

[rusoopE]

Wilkins kept saying he has the best hair in the nba. Then they showed Elfrid shooting a free throw in slow motion (the ball touches his hair when he shoots fts) which produced hardy laughs.

I noticed this before. The ball sometimes touches his hair. I feel like subconsciously he tries not to touch the hair with the ball, could be contributing to his bad shooting.

Sent from my SM-N920V using RealGM mobile app

Some one posted long time ago a YouTube video wich explain how the hair can mess your shooting. I will try to find it and re post it. Its very interesting

I found it, maybe its just bs but it has Some common sense

Watch on YouTube

[pepe1991]

Gordon is good young player who will be starting PF for years to come. However, Magic, and us, Magic fans expected more. But at this point , when he is playing his third year (and being out of position ) it's fair to say that he simply will never be a star. His offense just isn't there. He never improved over 29,8% for 3. We have huge sample size to know that is true. Even when he makes shots, defense refuses to contest them because it's part of their gameplan to leave him wide open. That's why he can't drive at rim, there is no space because defender don't close him down or jump on pump-fakes.

As SF he takes lot of bad shots like fadeaway long 2s and stepback 3s, not being able to knock them down. His TS% dropped for almost 4% from last year, he is even defensive box plus minus negative.

At SF he is one of worst starting SFs in the league, in category with Kidd Gilchrist (but not as great rebounder ), Parsons ( nobody knows what's up with him ) , Deng ( older, washed up , played PF before this season ).

Overall great defender, but great defender with no offense is not much different than great offensive player with no defense. You simply can't play that players longer period of time without hurting yourself. At PF you can limit his offense on garbage -lose ball-offensive rebounds. At SF you are exposing his inbility to shoot

[Blue_and_Whte]

Elfrid hasn't been nearly as good lately and it all started when Fournier returned to the lineup. I blame Fournier and Vogel.

You always blame someone else for Payton's bad games, so how is this any different? I blame Payton for Payton's bad games.

[Mc-o]

Let's not explore the possibility that Elfrid could play better without Fournier or that Vogel's over reliance on him could be hurting the team.

We are equally bad with or without Fournier , stop trying to blame EP having bad games on Fournier . Fournier is far from perfect but doesn't mean he is the reason for EP not being able to shoot .

[npiper17]

Let's not explore the possibility that Elfrid could play better without Fournier or that Vogel's over reliance on him could be hurting the team.

It's become more apparent that Elfrid and Fournier don't fit but it won't be resolved until the offseason. If we have a top 3 pick it's highly likely we'll draft our point guard of the future and then Elfrid's future will be up in the air.

If they decide to keep Elfrid and look at moving Fournier, I know the Pistons had interest in him as part of an expanded Tobias deal last season but considering where they are now and what Fournier has done this season, I doubt that interest still exists.

[MagicStarwipe]

Let's not explore the possibility that Elfrid could play better without Fournier or that Vogel's over reliance on him could be hurting the team.

We are equally bad with or without Fournier , stop trying to blame EP having bad games on Fournier . Fournier is far from perfect but doesn't mean he is the reason for EP not being able to shoot .

Eh... we've made plenty of excuses for other players on the roster, I'm just joining the party. It's true that Elfrid was playing a lot better (and it was an extended period) until Fournier returned and resumed his old roll bestowed upon him by Vogel. It's something worth thinking about whether the person who brought it up has a Payton sig or not.

[Mc-o]

Let's not explore the possibility that Elfrid could play better without Fournier or that Vogel's over reliance on him could be hurting the team.[/qzYytq ]
We are equally bad with or without Fournier , stop trying to blame EP having bad games on Fournier . Fournier is far from perfect but doesn't mean he is the reason for EP not being able to shoot .

Eh... we've made plenty of excuses for other players on the roster, I'm just joining the party. It's true that Elfrid was playing a lot better (and it was an extended period) until Fournier returned and resumed his old roll bestowed upon him by Vogel. It's something worth thinking about whether the person who brought it up has a Payton sig or not.

No one is making excuses for other players, all the players are responsible . Also I Can't even see ur sig on My phone lol u are still making Fournier responsible for Payton's play . So last year it was dipo and Payton are a bad fit , now this year it's Fournier that is a bad fit next to Payton? I'm not saying Fournier is a great player but to blame him for EPs play is laughable .

[MagicStarwipe]

I'm saying Payton played better without Fournier. Since Fournier came back, 1 - his minutes are down, 2 - he's relied on less to make plays.

[craig01]

Warriors - Super Team
Magic - Pooper Team

I would say this is very accurate.

[Furinkazan]

longest Game Thread I have ever seen on this board

[OrlandO]

At this point in his career elf needs the ball to be effective. There's nothing to be gained when he's offball. To a lesser extent the opposite is true for Fournier. He's a lot more efficient when we don't force the ball into his hands. It's obvious Vogel is exposing both players' weaknesses with the roles he's given them. Instead of adjusting to the roster he has he's trying desperately to turn us into the pacers. Problem is elf can't shoot like Hill and Fournier can't make plays like Stephenson. Remember he strangely thought he could already use AG like George?

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[VFX]

AG can go 0-7 and hold a Paul George or Kevin Durant to a horrid night which is a win for us. Fournier can score 18 points on decent efficiency but freeze out half of the team and play bad defense with turnovers. Even a good statistical night from Fournier has a chance to be way less impactful than bad nights from AG if he's doing his defensive assignment.

This being said, when do you think we can get players that play both sides of the court?

[Hadvar]

Josh Smith was above average passer especially for his position... Gordon doesn't have even that.

Josh smith would have been a terrific player with a great carrier,problem he was (in basketball terms)an idiot.

Gordon gonna be an incredible useful player,if they use him in the correct way;that is not making him"next paul george"

he could be a a terrific switching machine and a factor next to the rim with that amazing atletism,but we prefer "going big"in an era when everyone is going in the opposite direction.

would like to put draymond green or tristan thompson playing small forward on this roster and watch how much good they are gonna be,lol.

and by the way is not the first time they completely misjudge how to use young players they draft.

[tiderulz]

Josh Smith was above average passer especially for his position... Gordon doesn't have even that.

Josh smith would have been a terrific player with a great carrier,problem he was (in basketball terms)an idiot.

Gordon gonna be an incredible useful player,if they use him in the correct way;that is not making him"next paul george"

he could be a a terrific switching machine and a factor next to the rim with that amazing atletism,but we prefer "going big"in an era when everyone is going in the opposite direction.

would like to put draymond green or tristan thompson playing small forward on this roster and watch how much good they are gonna be,lol.

and by the way is not the first time they completely misjudge how to use young players they draft.

who cares if you go one way while everyone else goes another, if it works.

in NCAA football, everyone going spread-option, QB run. Bama ran a pro-style offense to 3 national titles recently. you can go against the grain if you make it work, you dont have to copy everyone else

[Nemesis21]

Josh Smith was above average passer especially for his position... Gordon doesn't have even that.

Josh smith would have been a terrific player with a great carrier,problem he was (in basketball terms)an idiot.

Gordon gonna be an incredible useful player,if they use him in the correct way;that is not making him"next paul george"

he could be a a terrific switching machine and a factor next to the rim with that amazing atletism,but we prefer "going big"in an era when everyone is going in the opposite direction.

would like to put draymond green or tristan thompson playing small forward on this roster and watch how much good they are gonna be,lol.

and by the way is not the first time they completely misjudge how to use young players they draft.

who cares if you go one way while everyone else goes another, if it works.

in NCAA football, everyone going spread-option, QB run. Bama ran a pro-style offense to 3 national titles recently. you can go against the grain if you make it work, you dont have to copy everyone else

FSU in 2013, pro-style

[pepe1991]

Josh Smith was above average passer especially for his position... Gordon doesn't have even that.

Josh smith would have been a terrific player with a great carrier,problem he was (in basketball terms)an idiot.

Gordon gonna be an incredible useful player,if they use him in the correct way;that is not making him"next paul george"

he could be a a terrific switching machine and a factor next to the rim with that amazing atletism,but we prefer "going big"in an era when everyone is going in the opposite direction.

would like to put draymond green or tristan thompson playing small forward on this roster and watch how much good they are gonna be,lol.

and by the way is not the first time they completely misjudge how to use young players they draft.

who cares if you go one way while everyone else goes another, if it works.

in NCAA football, everyone going spread-option, QB run. Bama ran a pro-style offense to 3 national titles recently. you can go against the grain if you make it work, you dont have to copy everyone else

But it doesn't work ( not american football but going big in NBA ) .

[OrlandoMagic]

I miss Jason Smith

[CajunBall]

I'm saying Payton played better without Fournier. Since Fournier came back, 1 - his minutes are down, 2 - he's relied on less to make plays.

You're right but it won't stop people from putting all the blame on Payton.