ESPN Power Rankings

[drsd]

I'd say we are better than the Raptors, but behind Bucks, 76ers, Nets and Celtics and same tier as Pacers, Heat and Pistons.

Doing the Maths: you have the Raps at #9, and the Magic fighting for a #5 - #8 slot. I cannot disagree.


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[NBlue]

I'd say we are better than the Raptors, but behind Bucks, 76ers, Nets and Celtics and same tier as Pacers, Heat and Pistons.

I'm curious as to why you think the Nets are clearly better than us and the Pacers are about the same as us? The Nets and us were basically parallel franchises last year and I see much of the same this year (obviously when KD is healthy its a different story). I see them being marginally better this year in the same way I seem us being marginally better. Can you explain what I'm missing? Also, the Pacers lost 5 of their top 7 minutes players and don't get Dipo back to December at the very earliest. I'm not even sure they make the playoffs - not discounting they finish ahead of us but on paper to start the season I don't see it. If you compare second halfs between the teams I think we are more than 10 games better than them fwiw.

[Knightro]

The only two teams that are no questions asked better than Orlando are Milwaukee and Philadelphia.

Boston and Toronto are *likely* better.

I put the Magic in the same tier as the Nets, Pacers, Heat, Pistons.

If every possible thing goes right for the Magic and a lot of things go wrong for other teams, Orlando could get a 3 or 4 seed.

If everything goes wrong, they'll miss the playoffs.

If I had to make a prediction right this second, I'd peg the Magic for about 44 wins and the 6th seed.

[Xatticus]

I'd say we are better than the Raptors, but behind Bucks, 76ers, Nets and Celtics and same tier as Pacers, Heat and Pistons.

I'm curious as to why you think the Nets are clearly better than us and the Pacers are about the same as us? The Nets and us were basically parallel franchises last year and I see much of the same this year (obviously when KD is healthy its a different story). I see them being marginally better this year in the same way I seem us being marginally better. Can you explain what I'm missing? Also, the Pacers lost 5 of their top 7 minutes players and don't get Dipo back to December at the very earliest. I'm not even sure they make the playoffs - not discounting they finish ahead of us but on paper to start the season I don't see it. If you compare second halfs between the teams I think we are more than 10 games better than them fwiw.

Irving is better than Russell. He just is. The rest of their moves are fairly inconsequential aside from Durant. Jordan should be a solid replacement for Davis. They didn't lose anyone else of significance. LeVert should be healthier this year and Dinwiddie has been trending up. There really isn't any reason to think that they won't be improved this year, even before Durant returns.

Indiana is trickier to predict. Warren replaces Bogdanovic. McConnell replaces Joseph. Oladipo's lost time isn't a reason for pessimism. He was on a balky knee last year and wasn't very good before the injury ended his season. Tyreke was crap. I think their biggest loss is going to be Collison. They brought in Brogdon, but he is a different type of player. Holiday and Leaf will get a bigger roles. I think they will look different offensively, but they certainly have the pieces to be a very good offensive team. Can they replicate what they did defensively?

I really wouldn't be surprised to see Chicago in the mix for a playoff spot either if they can stay healthy. They aren't deep, but should be a fair bit better than last year.

[NBlue]

I'd say we are better than the Raptors, but behind Bucks, 76ers, Nets and Celtics and same tier as Pacers, Heat and Pistons.

I'm curious as to why you think the Nets are clearly better than us and the Pacers are about the same as us? The Nets and us were basically parallel franchises last year and I see much of the same this year (obviously when KD is healthy its a different story). I see them being marginally better this year in the same way I seem us being marginally better. Can you explain what I'm missing? Also, the Pacers lost 5 of their top 7 minutes players and don't get Dipo back to December at the very earliest. I'm not even sure they make the playoffs - not discounting they finish ahead of us but on paper to start the season I don't see it. If you compare second halfs between the teams I think we are more than 10 games better than them fwiw.

Irving is better than Russell. He just is. The rest of their moves are fairly inconsequential aside from Durant. Jordan should be a solid replacement for Davis. They didn't lose anyone else of significance. LeVert should be healthier this year and Dinwiddie has been trending up. There really isn't any reason to think that they won't be improved this year, even before Durant returns.

Indiana is trickier to predict. Warren replaces Bogdanovic. McConnell replaces Joseph. Oladipo's lost time isn't a reason for pessimism. He was on a balky knee last year and wasn't very good before the injury ended his season. Tyreke was crap. I think their biggest loss is going to be Collison. They brought in Brogdon, but he is a different type of player. Holiday and Leaf will get a bigger roles. I think they will look different offensively, but they certainly have the pieces to be a very good offensive team. Can they replicate what they did defensively?

I really wouldn't be surprised to see Chicago in the mix for a playoff spot either if they can stay healthy. They aren't deep, but should be a fair bit better than last year.

I think this is a pretty solid and well thought out response. wrt Indiana - my sense is that replacing that many players and basically the heart of the team plus trying to implement Dipo midseason is just too much - they might squeek into the playoffs but if they are challenging for the same seed as the Magic I think its due to the fact we had injuries or they overachieved bigtime.

As to the Nets, its really hard to disagree on Kyrie. Dude shot over 40% from 3 the last 3 years with a 24 PER average and .595 TS average (over the last 3 also). That is damn impressive. Combined with the other 2 guards back there if everything gels and everyone stays healthy they could be extremely formidable. I get that. I just wonder -- is everyone going to gel and is everyone going to stay healthy? Kyrie has chemistry issues and Lavert and Dinwiddie both missed a lot due to injury. I think we are looking at best case scenario for the Nets which I can understand is good -- but you look at out depth compared to theirs and our frontcourt compared to theirs and I think we have some advantages there. Not saying we are clearly the better team or anything like that -- but saying I'm not sure they are a clear tier above us in light of all factors.

[MoMM]

I'm curious as to why you think the Nets are clearly better than us and the Pacers are about the same as us? The Nets and us were basically parallel franchises last year and I see much of the same this year (obviously when KD is healthy its a different story). I see them being marginally better this year in the same way I seem us being marginally better. Can you explain what I'm missing? Also, the Pacers lost 5 of their top 7 minutes players and don't get Dipo back to December at the very earliest. I'm not even sure they make the playoffs - not discounting they finish ahead of us but on paper to start the season I don't see it. If you compare second halfs between the teams I think we are more than 10 games better than them fwiw.

Irving is better than Russell. He just is. The rest of their moves are fairly inconsequential aside from Durant. Jordan should be a solid replacement for Davis. They didn't lose anyone else of significance. LeVert should be healthier this year and Dinwiddie has been trending up. There really isn't any reason to think that they won't be improved this year, even before Durant returns.

Indiana is trickier to predict. Warren replaces Bogdanovic. McConnell replaces Joseph. Oladipo's lost time isn't a reason for pessimism. He was on a balky knee last year and wasn't very good before the injury ended his season. Tyreke was crap. I think their biggest loss is going to be Collison. They brought in Brogdon, but he is a different type of player. Holiday and Leaf will get a bigger roles. I think they will look different offensively, but they certainly have the pieces to be a very good offensive team. Can they replicate what they did defensively?

I really wouldn't be surprised to see Chicago in the mix for a playoff spot either if they can stay healthy. They aren't deep, but should be a fair bit better than last year.

I think this is a pretty solid and well thought out response. wrt Indiana - my sense is that replacing that many players and basically the heart of the team plus trying to implement Dipo midseason is just too much - they might squeek into the playoffs but if they are challenging for the same seed as the Magic I think its due to the fact we had injuries or they overachieved bigtime.

As to the Nets, its really hard to disagree on Kyrie. Dude shot over 40% from 3 the last 3 years with a 24 PER average and .595 TS average (over the last 3 also). That is damn impressive. Combined with the other 2 guards back there if everything gels and everyone stays healthy they could be extremely formidable. I get that. I just wonder -- is everyone going to gel and is everyone going to stay healthy? Kyrie has chemistry issues and Lavert and Dinwiddie both missed a lot due to injury. I think we are looking at best case scenario for the Nets which I can understand is good -- but you look at out depth compared to theirs and our frontcourt compared to theirs and I think we have some advantages there. Not saying we are clearly the better team or anything like that -- but saying I'm not sure they are a clear tier above us in light of all factors.

Answering the questions...

Nets: They have added Irving (better than DLo), Jordan, Prince and Chandler. Jarrett Allen should improve as well, so I think they will be Top 4 even without KD.

Pacers: Lost a lot of players, added a lot of players, probably they will have some chemistry issues, but their depth is solid and even without Dipo they had a great record last season. If Dipo is back by December, he won't miss many games, maybe 20/30?

Raptor: Their starting 5 are Lowry, Powell, OG, Siakam and Gasol. They have VanFleet, Ibaka and Stanley Johnson as their best backup players. That's not a playoff team to me.