pepe1991 wrote: 
Shaun Livingston for career averaged 6,3 ppg , 3 rebounds, 2,4 assists.
Shaun Livingston in his entire nba career made less than $60M.
Despite being on payroll for almost 20 years.
He was never payed more than $7,6M for single season.
Perception of his career changed from " one of worst busts in basketball history" to "okey role player" in his 30s when he joined Warriors and become their 15-17 mpg backup in playoffs .
By that point he was bounced around 9 nba teams.In matter of 3 years ( 2009- 2012) he was waived by 3 different teams ( Memphis, OKlahoma, Rockets) . in same period he was playing on 10 day contracts ( 2008-09 & 2009-10 his nba earning combined are 650 K ).
For sake of debate, it's worth noting guy was 4th overall pick and even before that injury, his career was going very poorly.
Lol, those guys were 6th Man of the Year Candidates/1st guys off the bench, or even started on good-to-contender caliber teams on Warriors/Clippers/Pistons/Thunder over their careers. To say that they were just average-mediocre in their roles throughout their careers is hilarious to me.
You can't even admit these guys are even good quality players is hilarious.
pepe1991 wrote:Reggie jackson plays on 2 years ( 11M a year) contract as Clippers really can't improve roster due their luxury cap situation last 2 seasons. Pistons waived him. it's common sense that his Pistons $17M a year contract was awful. just like Fultz contract is.
The Detroit Pistons released him because they decided to rebuild and he didn't fit their timeline. They also release/waived/bought out Blake Griffin around the same time. Both these guys are vets who are suited on being on contending teams in this stage of their careers (Which the Clippers/Nets hopped on)
You're purposely being disingenuous about the situation once again.
pepe1991 wrote:Isaac played 34 games in 2019- season.
Magic had 15-19 record
WITH HIM and 18-21
WITHOUT HIM.
So that "integral" part wasn't as integral as you think ( again, fact checking yourself would help your cause, but we already established lack of facts & data in your previous posts
)
That's true for the record they had. I'm not downplaying anything. (Unlike your inability to answer my question about your Cap-Flexibility assertion and what "phantom" star player the Magic could've signed/brought in to make the Vucevic era team significantly better)
But, clearly you forgot that when Issac was in the line-up the Magic were one of the best defensive teams in the NBA. Also, he was in the conversation for DPOY during that time and would've certainly made and all-defensive team before he went down.
So lets keep the fact checking 100 percent here.
pepe1991 wrote:Those two players, only played 33 games together, for Orlando Magic, despite fact we are near 4th year anniversary since Fultz joined Orlando, in February
Your attemps to downplay this are abnormal and impossible to take serious.
They "just" never play. Let alone play together. Period.
For me personally, if this team was actually trying to win within the last few seasons. This would actually be a problem for them to trade for better players.
But when the organization decides to blow it up and purposely tank because your previous 3 Core PIeces even realize this wasn't going anywhere, then I don't have a problem waiting and seeing if this those guys are able to get their careers back on track.
So I ask AGAIN Pepe. What is the the actual problem with taking in part in reclamation projects on Fultz/Issac when this team is 2-3 years away from actually competing? I'M BEGGING YOU to answer this question.
You've evaded this question 2-3 times.
pepe1991 wrote:How little they played together? Well it's worth noting that over 3 years span Tracy McGrady and Grant Hill menaged to play more games together than those two guys.
This is more ridiculous because during the Grant Hill/Tracy McGrady era when they both signed, the Expectation was for them to be instant contenders or close to it right out of the gate.
It's a completely different situation to the current Magic squad because the Magic have been purposely tanking and are asset grabbing the last 2 years.
Yes, McGrady and Hill only played a handful of games together. But the main issue was McGrady became a Superstar player during that time and he was ready to compete and he didn't have the help to actually compete.
The cap-flexibility which you mentioned during the Vucevic era which you claimed hurt that iteration of the Magic (though even their own Core players didn't want to be there), was actually more of a real problem during the McGrady-HIll era because they couldn't get another Star player to take the pressure off T-Mac and for them to Magic an actual push for a title.
McGrady forced himself out of the situation and paired himself with an actual 2nd option in Yao Ming (Though that didn't work out either due to their injury history during the mid-to-late 00s)
pepe1991 wrote:Isaac's contract clause can only be exercised if he is waived by team.
Wait, I'm confused... Through your estimation of Issac he barely plays therefore he has no trade value. I would assume since he eats so much of the cap and hasn't played, the Magic should just wash their hands of him right?
The injury clause in his contract would let us out of that obligation without taking much of a cap hit.
Unless, you're suggesting something else.
pepe1991 wrote:Fultz $17M contract becomes fully guaranteed if not waived by June 30, 2023, for 2023-24 season.
If Fultz goes down with injury for a long period of time this season, the front office is definitely going to waive his player option in 2023.
They have way too many guards for them to not going to a different direction for if he doesn't get it together now. Lets, not kid ourselves and say this is unlikely the Magic would let Fultz walk if he has another setback.
pepe1991 wrote:What buffles me is how can somebody defend fact that you have those two guys being in 3rd year of new contracts without even timetable of their return, as in last 3 years they combined for 26 games. One of them played execlly 0:00 min since he signed exstension two years ago, and doesn't even have timetable of return.
Both will be returning this season, guaranteed so we'll see what happens if they can handle the rigors of a long season. The blatant tanking is over and they've had enough time for rehabilitation.
It's a wait and see approach.
Also, the Cap numbers that you are spewing are relative to the time.
Fultz/Issac making around 17 million a piece a year is literally 35% of what the top players make (Stephen Curry) compared to their own individual salaries. Their market-value is correct and not an over pay at all.
They're essentially making role-player/high end role player money.
