The Official Jalen Suggs Thread

[basketballRob]

Our offense prior to blowing it up. 2017-18 #25, 2018-19 #21, 2019-20 #21.

Magic are #22 the last 10 games on offense. So we're basically just as good the last 10 games as the team we blew up. Plus we have way more cap flexibility now, have some good players on the injured list, and have more draft capital.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/nba-teams-offensive-rating-defensive-rating-last-10-games

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[zaymon]

in last 7 games against orlando, 9 different allstars didn't play . It helps

Most of outcomes against bad teams is depending on how serious and how inganged opponents are. That's why Pistons can suprise one Bucks, Jazz, Cavs, Heat in single season, and basically lose all others.

I dont know what point you are trying to make. All stars were missing when Suggs was injured and all stars are missing when he returned. Bulls and Mavericks are dangerous even without some players, they are still winning against some teams. You also cant say both Chicago and Dallas werent going hard for the win.
Suggs has many flaws right now, but we are playing better defense with him. We are 4th in defensive rating since his return.

Mavs in second night of back to back without Hardaway and Porzingis,Bulls without 3 starters and 2 rotation players...

4th best? Isn't Atlanta the best in last 5, while being 5th worst for season? Sample size ans opponts (and situation with opponents) matter.

Suggs plays solid perimeter defense, but he for damn sure isn't turning season by himself. We are as good as good opponents allow us to be. That goes for all 4 tankers this year. I mean, that is always a case really.
That's why even worst teams every year win 10-15 -18 games.

We are 3rd wost offense in last 7, but 18# in last 3 games. Sample size isn't worth keeping eye on. We'll see at the end of year where we rank.

Well you set your expectations high if you think we should win against full strentgh Bulls and Mavs. Nobody says Suggs is turning around the season by himself, nobody even mentions we are turning around our season at all. I just think Suggs changes the vibe of our team for better. You can disagree i dont mind.

[jezzerinho]

I accept it could totally be coincidence, but does anyone else feel that Orlando is suddenly playing more cohesively with fewer errors, better teamwork and more switched on since Suggs came back? The part we can't see is how a character like Suggs affects the dressing room.

I suspect it's a powerful thing.

Plus fewer minutes for Ross and RJ also helps in that department!!!

Its a cliche but he does look like culture changer. Everybody plays harder when he is out there. He competes, but doesnt get frustrated. When he got foul on his clean block on Powell he very fast got composed and even joke'd with referee.
It doesnt seem like its coincidence we started winning since he returned. You look at boxscore and think there is no way he has highest +/- on the team. You watch the game and you understand. He is the positive attitude Westbrook

in last 7 games against orlando, 9 different allstars didn't play . It helps

Most of outcomes against bad teams is depending on how serious and how inganged opponents are. That's why Pistons can suprise one Bucks, Jazz, Cavs, Heat in single season, and basically lose all others.

Classic Pepe reply!

I'm talking about us, not them. I'm not referring to victories either. I'm talking about how the team has played more cohesively since Suggs reappeared.

His outburst against Chicago was telling. I think he instills a pride in the roster that nobody else does. Wagner Sr brings chippiness, Anthony brings exuberance, Carter brings composure, Franz brings consistent execution... But Suggs brings a real pro mentality that probably would have only minor effect on a vet team. On the Magic, it's huge.

[zaymon]

Its a cliche but he does look like culture changer. Everybody plays harder when he is out there. He competes, but doesnt get frustrated. When he got foul on his clean block on Powell he very fast got composed and even joke'd with referee.
It doesnt seem like its coincidence we started winning since he returned. You look at boxscore and think there is no way he has highest +/- on the team. You watch the game and you understand. He is the positive attitude Westbrook

in last 7 games against orlando, 9 different allstars didn't play . It helps

Most of outcomes against bad teams is depending on how serious and how inganged opponents are. That's why Pistons can suprise one Bucks, Jazz, Cavs, Heat in single season, and basically lose all others.

Classic Pepe reply!

I'm talking about us, not them. I'm not referring to victories either. I'm talking about how the team has played more cohesively since Suggs reappeared.

His outburst against Chicago was telling. I think he instills a pride in the roster that nobody else does. Wagner Sr brings chippiness, Anthony brings exuberance, Carter brings composure, Franz brings consistent execution... But Suggs brings a real pro mentality that probably would have only minor effect on a vet team. On the Magic, it's huge.

I think Carter brings more accountability than composure. He sure seems to lose it a little every time he misses a shot.

[Horcy]

The best thing I see about Suggs is that he does not care about his stats. He tries to do the best for the team, sometimes a steal in a good moment could mean a win and a stupid shot, a loss.
Many of our players like Cole, Bamba or Ross just want to take shots, they don't even care about the context.
Suggs game by game is getting to understand better what the team needs. He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

[yoyojw17]

The best thing I see about Suggs is that he does not care about his stats. He tries to do the best for the team, sometimes a steal in a good moment could mean a win and a stupid shot, a loss.
Many of our players like Cole, Bamba or Ross just want to take shots, they don't even care about the context.
Suggs game by game is getting to understand better what the team needs. He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

Yup... Suggs still isn't what we "want him to be" right now... But he's getting better... And you're right... He instills the right mentality game in and game out... And that can become infectious. Not picking on mo... But if he's not getting the ball on the offensive end.... He's just coasting through the game on the reg. The last few games... He's been doing the Lil things and have become more willing to play within the flow.

Is that to say that is he suggs effect... Eh.... Probably not... But could be... Because it's what he does.... "I'm not shooting well today.... 100% defensive effort. And even then he might still make mistakes... But he will never just blend into the shadows.

This is a super young team that are trying to find their identity. The talent is there ... They just need to put it all together. And I know people are all about getting that superstar.... But even as built right now.... We can beat teams if we just play the right way. One night you might score 25... Another 10... As someone else picks up due to their advantage. That's a tough mentality for most players to accept. But we've seen what happens when the ball keeps on moving. The talent is there...


.. and fultz and Isaac are still not factored into the picture.

[basketballRob]

The best thing I see about Suggs is that he does not care about his stats. He tries to do the best for the team, sometimes a steal in a good moment could mean a win and a stupid shot, a loss.
Many of our players like Cole, Bamba or Ross just want to take shots, they don't even care about the context.
Suggs game by game is getting to understand better what the team needs. He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

I noticed he doesn't mind as much taking the last-second shots. Some players just dribble the clock out.

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[PrimeThyme]

He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

Yep, && again, it’s why I keep pounding home the Jrue holiday comparisons. He brings identity, winning intangibles, defensive intensity, && edge to a basketball team. I never saw Brandon Roy or Lillard. People wanting that should probably adjust their expectations.

The stats arent always going to be pretty and occasionally you will scratch your head at some of the stuff he tries offensively, but it was/is the same way with Jrue.

At the end of the day, you just want him on your basketball team. Anyone that thinks there is no correlation between Suggs coming back and our recent success is lying to themselves.

Even when he was major slumping at the beginning of the season our most played starting lineup had the highest net rating over a month into the season.

I’m not sure what people are looking for. We’re seeing the ups and downs of a typical rookie guard season. I’ve seen plenty of ups over his last 20 games or so.

[thelead]

He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

Yep, && again, it’s why I keep pounding home the Jrue holiday comparisons. He brings identity, winning intangibles, defensive intensity, && edge to a basketball team. I never saw Brandon Roy or Lillard. People wanting that should probably adjust their expectations.

The stats arent always going to be pretty and occasionally you will scratch your head at some of the stuff he tries offensively, but it was/is the same way with Jrue.

At the end of the day, you just want him on your basketball team. Anyone that thinks there is no correlation between Suggs coming back and our recent success is lying to themselves.

Even when he was major slumping at the beginning of the season our most played starting lineup had the highest net rating over a month into the season.

I’m not sure what people are looking for. We’re seeing the ups and downs of a typical rookie guard season. I’ve seen plenty of ups over his last 20 games or so.

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

[drsd]

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

That typo is a wonderful Freudian slip!


..

[tiderulz]

He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

Yep, && again, it’s why I keep pounding home the Jrue holiday comparisons. He brings identity, winning intangibles, defensive intensity, && edge to a basketball team. I never saw Brandon Roy or Lillard. People wanting that should probably adjust their expectations.

The stats arent always going to be pretty and occasionally you will scratch your head at some of the stuff he tries offensively, but it was/is the same way with Jrue.

At the end of the day, you just want him on your basketball team. Anyone that thinks there is no correlation between Suggs coming back and our recent success is lying to themselves.

Even when he was major slumping at the beginning of the season our most played starting lineup had the highest net rating over a month into the season.

I’m not sure what people are looking for. We’re seeing the ups and downs of a typical rookie guard season. I’ve seen plenty of ups over his last 20 games or so.

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

good thing he is a rookie and has a lot of time available

[yoyojw17]

in last 7 games against orlando, 9 different allstars didn't play . It helps

Most of outcomes against bad teams is depending on how serious and how inganged opponents are. That's why Pistons can suprise one Bucks, Jazz, Cavs, Heat in single season, and basically lose all others.

I dont know what point you are trying to make. All stars were missing when Suggs was injured and all stars are missing when he returned. Bulls and Mavericks are dangerous even without some players, they are still winning against some teams. You also cant say both Chicago and Dallas werent going hard for the win.
Suggs has many flaws right now, but we are playing better defense with him. We are 4th in defensive rating since his return.

Mavs in second night of back to back without Hardaway and Porzingis,Bulls without 3 starters and 2 rotation players...

4th best? Isn't Atlanta the best in last 5, while being 5th worst for season? Sample size ans opponts (and situation with opponents) matter.

Suggs plays solid perimeter defense, but he for damn sure isn't turning season by himself. We are as good as good opponents allow us to be. That goes for all 4 tankers this year. I mean, that is always a case really.
That's why even worst teams every year win 10-15 -18 games.

We are 3rd wost offense in last 7, but 18# in last 3 games. Sample size isn't worth keeping eye on. We'll see at the end of year where we rank.

So..... fielding one of the youngest teams in the league and playing without many key players of our own doesn't make a difference.

Mavericks have the superstar that everyone wishes they had... and Bulls a throwing out a couple of allstar of their own. So... yeah... i will give our young guys praise for pushing either of those teams. CAn still be disappointed in their loss while STILL appreciating what was achieved.

I know some people might not think that Fultz and Isaac move the needle that much due to the amount of time they've been away from the team... and their outlook has been diminishing... but i still think they would totally change the look of this team on both ends of the court as well.

[Knightro]

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

Suggs has plenty to work on, but citing percentage is kind of silly to me. Fultz was drafted five years ago and has only attempted 166 threes total. Suggs has already nearly attempted that many in half of his rookie year.

There's reasons to believe that Suggs will be a better shooter than Fultz will ever be too. Suggs is at 78% from the line and generally speaking his form doesn't look broken, it just doesn't go in right now. Fultz's lone full season he was just 73% from the line and for his career he's sub 70%.

IMO being scared to take threes is much more damaging for a guard than being a threat to let it fly and not making at a high percentage, at least from a long-term perspective.

Suggs still gets closed out on even though he's a bad shooter because he's at least willing to shoot. That opens up the ability to pump fake and attack the closeout.

Fultz at this point doesn't even get closed out on and that's so much worse.

[pepe1991]

Suggs is rookie ,that does not change fact that in last 15 years only 3-4 rookies had as many shots/usage and shot this poorly. And mong those 3,4 only one that turned into good player is Kemba. You don't wanna know who other rookies were.

Suggs overall FG% is almost identical to last year's three point shooting average in nba. NBA teams haven't shot 24,8% for 3 in last 38 years, and in those years, team took 3 threes a game total.
By effective field goal percentage, last nba players who shot that poorly for season average were playing in 1962. Back in 1962, most nba players had real jobs ,some nba players actually were cutting their careers short to do "real things".
It's borerline impossible to player to shoot this bad for 3 for career. But Suggs has other issues with his game. He is sloppy ballhandler and isn't really looking like full time "PG" as he loves to attemp his own shots way more than actually set anybody else.

He is rookie, and sure, that probably means there will be army of fans to defend everything he does, but even as a rookie, there is legit red flags about his game and he simply has been bad offensive player. Bad by even rookie standards.

[basketballRob]

He just cares about winning. We desperately needed a guy with his mentality. His effectiveness eventually will appear. This team changed since he came back. Period.

Yep, && again, it’s why I keep pounding home the Jrue holiday comparisons. He brings identity, winning intangibles, defensive intensity, && edge to a basketball team. I never saw Brandon Roy or Lillard. People wanting that should probably adjust their expectations.

The stats arent always going to be pretty and occasionally you will scratch your head at some of the stuff he tries offensively, but it was/is the same way with Jrue.

At the end of the day, you just want him on your basketball team. Anyone that thinks there is no correlation between Suggs coming back and our recent success is lying to themselves.

Even when he was major slumping at the beginning of the season our most played starting lineup had the highest net rating over a month into the season.

I’m not sure what people are looking for. We’re seeing the ups and downs of a typical rookie guard season. I’ve seen plenty of ups over his last 20 games or so.

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

Suggs has played 34 games in a position he's still trying to learn.

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[thelead]

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

Suggs has plenty to work on, but citing percentage is kind of silly to me. Fultz was drafted five years ago and has only attempted 166 threes total. Suggs has already nearly attempted that many in half of his rookie year.

There's reasons to believe that Suggs will be a better shooter than Fultz will ever be too. Suggs is at 78% from the line and generally speaking his form doesn't look broken, it just doesn't go in right now. Fultz's lone full season he was just 73% from the line and for his career he's sub 70%.

IMO being scared to take threes is much more damaging for a guard than being a threat to let it fly and not making at a high percentage, at least from a long-term perspective.

Suggs still gets closed out on even though he's a bad shooter because he's at least willing to shoot. That opens up the ability to pump fake and attack the closeout.

Fultz at this point doesn't even get closed out on and that's so much worse.

I'm not saying that he will not improve or that I think that he can't but facts are facts. He is statistically a worse 3pt shooter than Fultz and that's pretty damning IMO. But hey, we picked him 5th so he's going to get all the reps he needs to try to figure it out and I'm not mad at that. It's just beyond disappointing to draft yet another guard that has A LOT of work to do on offense.

[thelead]

Yep, && again, it’s why I keep pounding home the Jrue holiday comparisons. He brings identity, winning intangibles, defensive intensity, && edge to a basketball team. I never saw Brandon Roy or Lillard. People wanting that should probably adjust their expectations.

The stats arent always going to be pretty and occasionally you will scratch your head at some of the stuff he tries offensively, but it was/is the same way with Jrue.

At the end of the day, you just want him on your basketball team. Anyone that thinks there is no correlation between Suggs coming back and our recent success is lying to themselves.

Even when he was major slumping at the beginning of the season our most played starting lineup had the highest net rating over a month into the season.

I’m not sure what people are looking for. We’re seeing the ups and downs of a typical rookie guard season. I’ve seen plenty of ups over his last 20 games or so.

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

Suggs has played 34 games in a position he's still trying to learn.

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Shooting wide open 3's isn't something he should need to learn but it is what it is unfortunately.

[basketballRob]

As a rookie, Jrue Holiday shot 44/39/76. Jrue's worst 3pt shooting percentage throughout his career was 33%. His worst FG% was 43%.

Markelle Fultz, statistically, is a better 3pt shooter than Suggs at a career 26% clip. Let that sink in.

I love Suggs but man he has a lot of wort to put in.

Suggs has plenty to work on, but citing percentage is kind of silly to me. Fultz was drafted five years ago and has only attempted 166 threes total. Suggs has already nearly attempted that many in half of his rookie year.

There's reasons to believe that Suggs will be a better shooter than Fultz will ever be too. Suggs is at 78% from the line and generally speaking his form doesn't look broken, it just doesn't go in right now. Fultz's lone full season he was just 73% from the line and for his career he's sub 70%.

IMO being scared to take threes is much more damaging for a guard than being a threat to let it fly and not making at a high percentage, at least from a long-term perspective.

Suggs still gets closed out on even though he's a bad shooter because he's at least willing to shoot. That opens up the ability to pump fake and attack the closeout.

Fultz at this point doesn't even get closed out on and that's so much worse.

I'm not saying that he will not improve or that I think that he can't but facts are facts. He is statistically a worse 3pt shooter than Fultz and that's pretty damning IMO. But hey, we picked him 5th so he's going to get all the reps he needs to try to figure it out and I'm not mad at that. It's just beyond disappointing to draft yet another guard that has A LOT of work to do on offense.

He isn't worse because we haven't completed the year.

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[thelead]

Suggs has plenty to work on, but citing percentage is kind of silly to me. Fultz was drafted five years ago and has only attempted 166 threes total. Suggs has already nearly attempted that many in half of his rookie year.

There's reasons to believe that Suggs will be a better shooter than Fultz will ever be too. Suggs is at 78% from the line and generally speaking his form doesn't look broken, it just doesn't go in right now. Fultz's lone full season he was just 73% from the line and for his career he's sub 70%.

IMO being scared to take threes is much more damaging for a guard than being a threat to let it fly and not making at a high percentage, at least from a long-term perspective.

Suggs still gets closed out on even though he's a bad shooter because he's at least willing to shoot. That opens up the ability to pump fake and attack the closeout.

Fultz at this point doesn't even get closed out on and that's so much worse.

I'm not saying that he will not improve or that I think that he can't but facts are facts. He is statistically a worse 3pt shooter than Fultz and that's pretty damning IMO. But hey, we picked him 5th so he's going to get all the reps he needs to try to figure it out and I'm not mad at that. It's just beyond disappointing to draft yet another guard that has A LOT of work to do on offense.

He isn't worse because we haven't completed the year.

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I don't buy it.

He is shooting 24.8% from deep for the season (34 games). Over his last 10 games, he is shooting 24.3% from deep.

There is no statistical evidence that he is better than what he has shown us.

Just like last year when I questioned if Cole could really shoot based on his terrible start. Yeah, he caught fire at the end and everyone started celebrating but now Cole is proving to be a bad shooter again.

These guys aren't even close to shooting an average percentage...

[basketballRob]

I'm not saying that he will not improve or that I think that he can't but facts are facts. He is statistically a worse 3pt shooter than Fultz and that's pretty damning IMO. But hey, we picked him 5th so he's going to get all the reps he needs to try to figure it out and I'm not mad at that. It's just beyond disappointing to draft yet another guard that has A LOT of work to do on offense.

He isn't worse because we haven't completed the year.

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I don't buy it.

He is shooting 24.8% from deep for the season (34 games). Over his last 10 games, he is shooting 24.3% from deep.

There is no statistical evidence that he is better than what he has shown us.

Just like last year when I questioned if Cole could really shoot based on his terrible start. Yeah, he caught fire at the end and everyone started celebrating but now Cole is proving to be a bad shooter again.

These guys aren't even close to shooting an average percentage...

I think Cole and Suggs would shoot better in a structured offense. Still, we need a bigger sample size on Suggs. Jamal Murray probably shot near the same percentage his first 34 games.

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