The Jalen Suggs Thread

[thelead]

From eye test, Fultz is doing a good job shooting mid range. He can be a very good playmaker. But again his problem is simple: he can not make 3s. Do we invest in him so hopefully he can bring back his mechanics from College days or we are just OKay with him not being a spacer on the floor.

This ship has sailed.

We're like 5 years removed from his injury/diagnosis/issues/whatever you want to call it at this point.

There's no bringing back his old mechanics. These are his mechanics.

So really it boils down to whether or not the Magic are comfortable pairing their two young and potentially superstar forwards with a non-shooting lead guard.

Watching Dame just drop 3 after 3, nope (had 27 points in the second quarter with a logo 3). Gotta find that if we can.

[Knightro]

Watching Dame just drop 3 after 3, nope (had 27 points in the second quarter with a logo 3). Gotta find that if we can.

Free agent to be Fred VanVleet had 35 points on 6-13 3PT with 8 assists and 1 turnover. This happened *checks notes*... yesterday.

FVV has made more threes in his last 20 games than Markelle Fultz has made in his entire NBA career. I'm not making that up.

But you think he stinks

[thelead]

Watching Dame just drop 3 after 3, nope (had 27 points in the second quarter with a logo 3). Gotta find that if we can.

Free agent to be Fred VanVleet had 35 points on 6-13 3PT with 8 assists and 1 turnover. This happened *checks notes*... yesterday.

FVV has made more threes in his last 20 games than Markelle Fultz has made in his entire NBA career. I'm not making that up.

But you think he stinks

I don't think he stinks. I just didn't want to trade good assets for him. If we can sign him this offseason, great, lets do it. I'm just not a fan of trades for all-star level players. It usually costs too much (in assets) and leaves your team with other issues that you then lack resources to resolve.

[eyriq]

Maybe we just need to embrace our backcourt of the future, Fultz|Suggs

[Knightro]

Maybe we just need to embrace our backcourt of the future, Fultz|Suggs

Magic could sign FVV outright this summer and retain Fultz if they were so inclined.

I think they could play together.

Of course they'd probably have to move Cole at that point, but I think it's possible he's regained some decent trade value this year.

[j_n]

I want Suggs to start at PG.

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If he became a good outside shooter than he's the perfect fit for us at PG, excellent defense, infectious energy, can cut, run the break and doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective, just stay healthy and keep improving.

How execlly he "doesn't need a ball to be effective" if he is one of the worst catch and shoot players nba has seen this year?

OK, you're right, wrong choice of words, I meant that he's not your typical playmaking PG, he can effect the game in transition, cuts, attacking closeouts and making the extra pass, rather than initiating the offence.

[jezzerinho]

.

FVV has made more threes in his last 20 games than Markelle Fultz has made in his entire NBA career. I'm not making that up.

Where's that Mic Drop gif????!!!!!!

[pepe1991]

Watching Dame just drop 3 after 3, nope (had 27 points in the second quarter with a logo 3). Gotta find that if we can.

Free agent to be Fred VanVleet had 35 points on 6-13 3PT with 8 assists and 1 turnover. This happened *checks notes*... yesterday.

FVV has made more threes in his last 20 games than Markelle Fultz has made in his entire NBA career. I'm not making that up.

But you think he stinks

Fultz and Suggs career = 140 threes made.

Donovan Mitchell 178 threes in 49 games this season

[zaymon]

Fultz/Suggs is utopia. Shouldnt happen in the 2023.
Like j_n wrote Suggs is not typical pg. He is more of a wing who can guard opposing lead guard.
He would not work well as a lead ball handler himself ( at least not now), but he could work really well with someone else running the show, ideally someone bigger than a guard.
We happen to have to potential point forwards so playmaking is not critically important from the guard spot.
Yes he needs to shoot from 3, but everybody needs to do it right now.

[MoMM]

Fultz/Suggs is utopia. Shouldnt happen in the 2023.
Like j_n wrote Suggs is not typical pg. He is more of a wing who can guard opposing lead guard.
He would not work well as a lead ball handler himself ( at least not now), but he could work really well with someone else running the show, ideally someone bigger than a guard.
We happen to have to potential point forwards so playmaking is not critically important from the guard spot.
Yes he needs to shoot from 3, but everybody needs to do it right now.

He is a guard who can't run the show and can't be a average shooter. His only skill is defense.

So basically it's trying to make lots of workarounds just to play him somehow, but the fact is that he is a end of bench player.. On the bright side, at least he wants to play and he is not a Bamba 2.0.

[basketballRob]

Fultz/Suggs is utopia. Shouldnt happen in the 2023.
Like j_n wrote Suggs is not typical pg. He is more of a wing who can guard opposing lead guard.
He would not work well as a lead ball handler himself ( at least not now), but he could work really well with someone else running the show, ideally someone bigger than a guard.
We happen to have to potential point forwards so playmaking is not critically important from the guard spot.
Yes he needs to shoot from 3, but everybody needs to do it right now.

He is a guard who can't run the show and can't be a average shooter. His only skill is defense.

So basically it's trying to make lots of workarounds just to play him somehow, but the fact is that he is a end of bench player.. On the bright side, at least he wants to play and he is not a Bamba 2.0.

Lavine had 26/9/5 last night, and Suggs looked as good as him without scoring.

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[MasterGMer]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

[Skin]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

[thelead]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

Is Marcus Smart a starter on a championship caliber team?

[Skin]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

Is Marcus Smart a starter on a championship caliber team?

I don't know. Does that mean something?

[MasterGMer]

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

Is Marcus Smart a starter on a championship caliber team?

I don't know. Does that mean something?

With the timing when Cole is out, I think this stretch is key to Suggs to get extra PT.

I am just wishing for one thing: I just hope tonight's game is not abnormality

[eyriq]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

When I think of a core player I think of a star you build around. What is Suggs doing in a world where he's a star and a core Magic? Is averaging over 15 ppg and making the defensive All NBA first team enough? I mean, for sure. So that's what I'm looking for from him developmentally. I don't expect him to be our leading scorer or even second option but instead to make his catch and shoot threes, and playmake for himself and others occasionally and set the tone defensively night end and night out.

[Bakomagic]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

When I think of a core player I think of a star you build around. What is Suggs doing in a world where he's a star and a core Magic? Is averaging over 15 ppg and making the defensive All NBA first team enough? I mean, for sure. So that's what I'm looking for from him developmentally. I don't expect him to be our leading scorer or even second option but instead to make his catch and shoot threes, and playmake for himself and others occasionally and set the tone defensively night end and night out.

Sounds like Jrue Holiday to me.

[pepe1991]

Despite today's game result, I feel extremely happy for Suggs! I hope a game like this can motivate him to stay that kind consistent.

If he can do that, we have our young core in Paolo, Franz, and Suggs.

Can't wait to see the rest of the season and I am hoping for a play in spot! That is what we are chasing! Go Magic!

Core? Naaashhh.... if he had games like this he can be a 6th man. He's not starter material. Herro, Clarkson, Poole type maybe.

Is Marcus Smart a starter on a championship caliber team?

Was he really? or he is defensive specialist who had incredible luxury to spend his whole career playing along allstar level guards with him?
From IT as MVP candidate, Irving, Hayward, Walker to now Brown ( and along with another MVP candidate Tatum).

And who they went to get via trade? Ofc, another great guard, who was allstar -level player two years ago, who's strenghts are scoring and passing.

I mean, Mario Chalmers was nba starting PG on two championship teams. That doesn't mean it's profile you want .


Magic will never go anywhere with poor shooters around Franz and especially Banchero.
There isn't anything in Suggs game today that sets him apart from Fultz on offense. He is actually even worst playmaker. He isn't even playmaker, nor he ever was at college. He is shooting gaurd who can't shoot so he plays PG but 100% can't create.

47th percentile as pick&roll ballhandler is awful. Once you remove centers & PFs from that, he is one of worst pick&roll handlers in nba, at guards positions.


And in contrast of Celtics, who's Marcus Smat, is 85th percentile ballhandler ( and Brown, and his 83th percentile), and spotups where Boston's Brown, Tatum, Horford, Brogdon are elite shooters (and Smart still sucks ), Magic percentiles in spotups look like this:
Bol 20th percentile
Banchero 20th percentile
Cole Anthony 39th
Fultz 15th

Suggs still menages to be most usless one with 10th .

So yea, Magic are nothing like Celtics. Their dynamic is very different, they are very Tatum-centric, mostly because Tatum gives them 30 ppg and Brown fills the rest. Others are there to fill needs and Brogdon is there to give them spike off bench.

Magic, on other hand, when they win, they win on hot hands from bench and by having very good depth ( from Mortiz, Cole, Bol, Suggs, there is always somebody who catches fire ).

[Knightro]

And in contrast of Celtics, who's Marcus Smat, is 85th percentile ballhandler

You’re right that Marcus Smart is an 85th percentile pick and roll ball handler this year.

He’s also turning 29 years old in about two weeks and in his 9th NBA season.

Want to take a guess where he ranked as a PNR ball handler his entire rookie contract? Spoiler: he wasn’t very good at it.

2015: NBA.com doesn’t keep data this far back, but presumably it was not good as Smart had a meh rookie year
2016: 49th percentile
2017: 25th percentile
2018: 41st percentile
2019: 49th percentile

In 2020, his 6th NBA season did Smart finally crack the code and figure out how to do it at a high level.

2020: 87th percentile
2021: 70th percentile
2022: 23rd percentile
2023: 84th percentile

It’s almost like it’s silly to compare players in year 2 with players in year 9 and equally silly to assume guys in year 2 won’t actually get better.