Official Speculation Thread (Pt. XXV: Offseason Edition)

[Def Swami]

Interesting to see that Orton thinks he may play for us during summer league. I wonder how that'll workout since he's a FA.

I thought the same thing, but he could also just be there to hopefully get picked up by another team.

[thelead]

Brian K. Schmitz ‏@MagicInsider
@justinlafferty @BQRMagic Bower built a good team in New Orleans, led relocat to Oklahoma City.

Nope.

Brian K. Schmitz ‏@MagicInsider
@gatorschampions Anybody who says they know is blwing smoke. I'd hire Jeff Bower. He has the most experience.

Otis has experience too

Schmitz is an idiot who can't even do simple research. How is that man hired as a basketball expert?

[T-Cat]

Daniel Orton (@danielorton21)
6/9/12 11:24 PM
I want to become a better shooter this off season. Got a lot to work on but that's a main part of my game I want to work on. Love this game!

Chirper (@chirpingme)
6/9/12 11:31 PM
@danielorton21 are u playing for the magic summer league?

Daniel Orton (@danielorton21)
6/9/12 11:36 PM
@chirpingme don't know just yet. Most likely

i'd prefer he work on his defense.

I would like to have him here...especially if he comes cheap! I wonder where would he rank if he was in this yrs draft?

[glennathan]

Daniel Orton (@danielorton21)
6/9/12 11:24 PM
I want to become a better shooter this off season. Got a lot to work on but that's a main part of my game I want to work on. Love this game!

Chirper (@chirpingme)
6/9/12 11:31 PM
@danielorton21 are u playing for the magic summer league?

Daniel Orton (@danielorton21)
6/9/12 11:36 PM
@chirpingme don't know just yet. Most likely

i'd prefer he work on his defense.

I would like to have him here...especially if he comes cheap! I wonder where would he rank if he was in this yrs draft?

In this years draft I think Orton would be a first round pick assuming he had more playing time at Kentucky. If he was the same skill level as when we drafted him then I think he would be late second round

[arkknight1988]

i've said earlier that we should get lou williams.

williams
jrich
harkless
davis
dwight

[ChildishGambino]

you know i'm kind of optimistic about our bench this upcoming season....should have real versatility and talent and youth.....The new coach coming in will evaluate and we'll really see who deserves to be in the rotation or not.....But my bench if i had control would be the youth movement bench lol.....

PG: Ish Smith-Any new coach will see he should be our backup bar none.....Duhon...out...
SG: DeAndre Liggins- Hardworker and making strides in his development
SF: Quincy Miller- Rook but still skilled...creator....lengthy player that has good size 6"10 at SF
PF: Justin Harper- Showed his all around skills vs Nba Starters...Can shoot/Defend/Handle at 6"10
C: Daniel Orton- Showed some things toward the end of the season that says maybe he can be a decent backup in this league....he can be more than just 6 fouls....

Our bench could be something and that's just the young guys not counting the vets....It's the Starting lineup that needs work......but that bench is not bad...you got speed...you got athleticism....you got a creator....you got guys that's versatile....you got Size at that Center spot....everything i like in a bench personally....

Obviously we didn't Draft Quincy Miller i'm just adding him because it's my scenario that's all lol

[PeePee la Fritz]

you know i'm kind of optimistic about our bench this upcoming season....should have real versatility and talent and youth.....The new coach coming in will evaluate and we'll really see who deserves to be in the rotation or not.....But my bench if i had control would be the youth movement bench lol.....

PG: Ish Smith-Any new coach will see he should be our backup bar none.....Duhon...out...
SG: DeAndre Liggins- Hardworker and making strides in his development
SF: Quincy Miller- Rook but still skilled...creator....lengthy player that has good size 6"10 at SF
PF: Justin Harper- Showed his all around skills vs Nba Starters...Can shoot/Defend/Handle at 6"10
C: Daniel Orton- Showed some things toward the end of the season that says maybe he can be a decent backup in this league....he can be more than just 6 fouls....

Our bench could be something and that's just the young guys not counting the vets....It's the Starting lineup that needs work......but that bench is not bad...you got speed...you got athleticism....you got a creator....you got guys that's versatile....you got Size at that Center spot....everything i like in a bench personally....

Obviously we didn't Draft Quincy Miller i'm just adding him because it's my scenario that's all lol

None of those guys have proven anything in the NBA. Honestly you cannot say 1 of them will be a solid NBA player at this point. They all have the potential, but you can't win games based off of potential. And that is not a bench that'll compete with OKC, Miami, Chicago (w/healthy Rose), etc

[ChildishGambino]

you know i'm kind of optimistic about our bench this upcoming season....should have real versatility and talent and youth.....The new coach coming in will evaluate and we'll really see who deserves to be in the rotation or not.....But my bench if i had control would be the youth movement bench lol.....

PG: Ish Smith-Any new coach will see he should be our backup bar none.....Duhon...out...
SG: DeAndre Liggins- Hardworker and making strides in his development
SF: Quincy Miller- Rook but still skilled...creator....lengthy player that has good size 6"10 at SF
PF: Justin Harper- Showed his all around skills vs Nba Starters...Can shoot/Defend/Handle at 6"10
C: Daniel Orton- Showed some things toward the end of the season that says maybe he can be a decent backup in this league....he can be more than just 6 fouls....

Our bench could be something and that's just the young guys not counting the vets....It's the Starting lineup that needs work......but that bench is not bad...you got speed...you got athleticism....you got a creator....you got guys that's versatile....you got Size at that Center spot....everything i like in a bench personally....

Obviously we didn't Draft Quincy Miller i'm just adding him because it's my scenario that's all lol

None of those guys have proven anything in the NBA. Honestly you cannot say 1 of them will be a solid NBA player at this point. They all have the potential, but you can't win games based off of potential. And that is not a bench that'll compete with OKC, Miami, Chicago (w/healthy Rose), etc

to me i know talent when i see it and those guys have talent...i've never said it was going to be the best bench i just said it was going be potent....i agree with you that they haven't proven anything but imo a big part of that is opportunity...which under Stan they never really got....A hard summer of working and getting better will do the young guys some good....they have motivation...A new coach is coming in and now they have a real shot at winning either a starting spot or a rotation spot.....one thing though...OKC imo is a one man bench.....Miami....seriously? no bench whatsoever.....Chicago i'll give you they have a great bench.....

[JustinLafferty]

Brian K. Schmitz ‏@MagicInsider
@justinlafferty @BQRMagic Bower built a good team in New Orleans, led relocat to Oklahoma City.

Nope.

Brian K. Schmitz ‏@MagicInsider
@gatorschampions Anybody who says they know is blwing smoke. I'd hire Jeff Bower. He has the most experience.

Otis has experience too

Schmitz is an idiot who can't even do simple research. How is that man hired as a basketball expert?

lol that's me he replied to.... Schmitz is dumb. He had a mediocre team that he didn't even acquire the best pieces from that team... Bower may have just been in a bad situation but when your criteria is bringing in "championship experience"....Bower is not it...

[PeePee la Fritz]

you know i'm kind of optimistic about our bench this upcoming season....should have real versatility and talent and youth.....The new coach coming in will evaluate and we'll really see who deserves to be in the rotation or not.....But my bench if i had control would be the youth movement bench lol.....

PG: Ish Smith-Any new coach will see he should be our backup bar none.....Duhon...out...
SG: DeAndre Liggins- Hardworker and making strides in his development
SF: Quincy Miller- Rook but still skilled...creator....lengthy player that has good size 6"10 at SF
PF: Justin Harper- Showed his all around skills vs Nba Starters...Can shoot/Defend/Handle at 6"10
C: Daniel Orton- Showed some things toward the end of the season that says maybe he can be a decent backup in this league....he can be more than just 6 fouls....

Our bench could be something and that's just the young guys not counting the vets....It's the Starting lineup that needs work......but that bench is not bad...you got speed...you got athleticism....you got a creator....you got guys that's versatile....you got Size at that Center spot....everything i like in a bench personally....

Obviously we didn't Draft Quincy Miller i'm just adding him because it's my scenario that's all lol

None of those guys have proven anything in the NBA. Honestly you cannot say 1 of them will be a solid NBA player at this point. They all have the potential, but you can't win games based off of potential. And that is not a bench that'll compete with OKC, Miami, Chicago (w/healthy Rose), etc

to me i know talent when i see it and those guys have talent...i've never said it was going to be the best bench i just said it was going be potent....i agree with you that they haven't proven anything but imo a big part of that is opportunity...which under Stan they never really got....A hard summer of working and getting better will do the young guys some good....they have motivation...A new coach is coming in and now they have a real shot at winning either a starting spot or a rotation spot.....one thing though...OKC imo is a one man bench.....Miami....seriously? no bench whatsoever.....Chicago i'll give you they have a great bench.....

I hope you are right. I would love to see a nice young nucleus put together that can compete for years to come. Thats why I am keeping my fingers crossed for Lindsey. A guy like him can definitely build off of the young pieces we have.

[OrlandO]

Dwight's holding a bball camp on July 1-2 (he'll be there). Good sign that he's still making plans in Orlando around the time he's going to be asked to sign an extension?

[dwightsmight12]

I wouldn't mind seeing the new coach come in and bench Hedo once (not if) he starts slacking. He needs to make an example out of him and Duhon that laziness won't be tolerated.

[Def Swami]

Dwight's holding a bball camp on July 1-2 (he'll be there). Good sign that he's still making plans in Orlando around the time he's going to be asked to sign an extension?

He usually holds the camp in August. Maybe he's not planning to be here then.

[CPBalla2003 n da 863]

anyone can point me to the page with Tom Penn info, i think it was posted here, seeing a lot of things on Twitter he's being interviewed by the DeVos family.

[ChildishGambino]

i have a feeling Tom Penn is going to be our guy.....but all in all we can't screw it up if those are the finalist for the position.....except Bower....

[CPBalla2003 n da 863]

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/ ... l-manager/

Tom Penn and Kevin Pritchard were a team in Portland — Pritchard was the face of the general manager role and he was the player/personnel specialist, Tom Penn was the cap guru who understood both basketball and business.

In the last few days, Penn’s name has come up a few places as a guy seriously in the running to be the next general manager of the Orlando Magic. The latest is this from Gery Woelfel of the Journal-Times in Wisconsin.

I’m hearing Tom Penn is legit GM candidate for Orlando.
Penn is currently employed by ESPN and was at the NBA Draft Combine in Chicago for them.

[Def Swami]

anyone can point me to the page with Tom Penn info, i think it was posted here, seeing a lot of things on Twitter he's being interviewed by the DeVos family.

Not sure what page that was, but this a some stuff I found on Penn...
As an NBA Executive: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Penn

From 2007 to 2010, Penn spent four seasons with the Portland Trail Blazers as Vice President of Basketball Operations and Assistant General Manager. Penn is a top expert on the NBA salary cap and collective bargaining agreement.[4] Penn worked with General Manager Kevin Pritchard as they restored the Blazers from the "Jail Blazers" era. The Blazers won 54 games in 2008–09 and again reached 50 wins in 2009-10 in spite of a number of injuries to key players. During the summer of 2009, Penn was offered the General Manager job with the Minnesota Timberwolves, but he turned down the job, deciding to stay with the Blazers after a promotion to Vice President of Basketball Operations.[5] Ten months later, Penn was fired in what one writer called a "drive by" shooting that warned Kevin Prichard might be next.[6] On July 24, 2010, the day of the NBA Draft, Kevin Pritchard was also fired by the Blazers.[7]

Penn worked for seven seasons with the Memphis Grizzlies as Assistant General Manager and Legal Counsel from 2000–07. For five of those seasons in Memphis, Penn worked closely with Jerry West and Chuck Daly.[8] The Grizzlies made the playoffs three straight seasons but never advanced passed the first round. In 1999, Penn worked as part of prospective NBA owner Michael Heisley's NBA acquisition team. Penn worked with Dick Versace and Heisley's team to help guide Heisley through the NBA acquisition process until Heisley ultimately purchased the Vancouver Grizzlies in May 2000.[9] After one season in Vancouver, Heisley moved the team to Memphis.

This article about Penn being fired in Portland gives insight into his responsibilities as Asst. GM and President of Basketball Operations: http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazer ... lazer.html

Tom Penn, the right-hand man to general manager Kevin Pritchard, has been fired by the Trail Blazers. Tuesday’s decision comes nearly 10 months after he was promoted to vice president of Basketball Operations.

Penn late Tuesday night said he was “surprised” and “disappointed” when team president Larry Miller called him into his Rose Quarter offices Tuesday afternoon and informed him he was being relieved of his duties.

Penn, however, would not say why he was fired.

“I can’t speak to specifics and I prefer not to,’’ Penn said. “I don’t think it is appropriate.’’

Penn was gracious and thankful Tuesday night.

“I’ve moved on. It’s been an unbelievable run,’’ Penn said. “I fell in love with Rip City.’’

In a prepared statement, Miller cited philosophical differences as the reason for the dismissal of Penn, who joined the Trail Blazers as assistant general manager in 2007.

“We felt it was in the organization's best interest to move in a different direction at this time,” Miller said. “This was not an easy decision, as Tom has played an integral role for us the past three seasons. We thank him for his contributions and wish him the best in the future.”

Penn came to the Blazers from the Memphis Grizzlies in May of 2007 and served as the team’s assistant general manager until he was promoted to vice president on May 18, 2009.

A former criminal defense lawyer in Illinois, Penn’s duties with the Blazers included negotiating player contracts, structuring player trades, evalutating talent and managing day-to-day basketball operations. Prior to entering sports management, he served as a basketball player agent in 1994.

Around the league he is widely regarded as a salary cap expert. He helped the NBA in the drafting of the 2005 Collective Bargaining Agreement.

His expertise with league rules and the salary cap allowed the Blazers to gain a trade exception in the 2007 NBA draft, which allowed them to make a trade with Phoenix for the rights to Rudy Fernandez.

Penn was pursued heavily last spring for the general manager position with the Minnesota Timberwolves, but turned down the job after the Blazers promoted him.

With Penn and Pritchard, the Blazers had 41, 54, and 50 win seasons. Upon their departure, they had a 48 and 28 win season.

I was a interested in why Penn was fired and in my search I found this, also a good read on Penn's vision and desire to put his stamp on a franchise:

As Ben has kept you apprised of this evening the internet is alive with reports that Kevin Pritchard's right-hand man, Tom Penn, has been sacked by the club. The official team release cites "philosophical differences". The rest of us are left to puzzle out what that means and what it adds up to.

Tom Penn came from the Memphis organization with the reputation of having a shrewd eye for cap maneuvering and a deep knowledge of the CBA. Having worked under Jerry West, among other NBA notables, he also had aspirations on the strictly basketball side. Young, confident, and working for one of the rising teams in the league he was driven to make his mark from the start.

Penn's public contributions to the Blazers can best be described as "value added". Kevin Pritchard nearly always defers credit to his staff as a whole, preferring to speak of decisions in terms of "we" rather than "I". But he was quick to laud Penn for pointing out obscure facets of deals which opened up trade exceptions or cap-saving potential, giving the Blazers extra assets or wiggle-room over and above the obvious value of their trades. Whether or not the team was able to take full advantage of those perks, they certainly exuded confidence that they were getting the maximum out of their deals and cap structure. That will be Tom Penn's legacy here.

On the flip side, Penn's desire to make that mark may have been behind the "philosophical differences" that led to his departure. For all of the titular glory he enjoyed, the Blazers hired him primarily as a capologist. The chance to grow and flex his basketball muscles was certainly a bonus for him but with Pritchard himself being relatively new in the position at the time of Penn's hiring, it's not likely they were looking for a true backup GM, let alone GM #1A. Subtle rumblings coming out of Blazer headquarters in recent months had Penn with his fingers in a few pies, none of them relating to the cap. Tracing the practical chain of command in Portland's hierarchy is challenging in the best of times. Perhaps Penn's (alleged) expansion of power was planned. On the other hand those philosophical differences may have resulted from the organization discovering it had a V.P. of Basketball Operations who wanted to spread his wings farther than the team was comfortable with or prepared for. In the end the Blazers likely still wanted a great capologist who could work as part of the decision-making team. If Penn wanted more, if heads butted over more...well...it wouldn't be the first time that happened in business. (In fact it's an eerie parallel to some of the on-court roster issues the Blazers are facing.) Sometimes the direct resolution is the best resolution.http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/3/17/13 ... l-tom-penn

This also speaks to this...

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA
RT @DonDannyPR: Penn w Lindsey or Weaver would make a good team. ---> not what will happen.

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA
RT @MagicMikeZ: Any chance the Magic get a combo? I.e. Lindsey/Penn? ---> No. Penn looking for his own situation.

Penn is looking to be the head honcho and mold the team the way he wants to. He wants freedom to make the moves he wants to. I'll reserve judgement on that front.

[Def Swami]

The Orlando Sentinel interviewed Penn last December after Dwight made his trade request and he basically plays the role of our GM and provides his insight. Very good interview if you're looking to see his approach. You can definitely see his acumen for the salary cap and player contracts. http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/sports ... arios.html

Orlando Sentinel: What do the Magic do now? How do they proceed?

Tom Penn: They do the delicate dance of trying to explore all trade options and finding the best possible trade, knowing that some component of that involves satisfying Dwight Howard, too.

OS: How much leverage do the Magic have? He’s indicated that he wants to go to — in alphabetical order — the Dallas Mavericks, the Los Angeles Lakers or the New Jersey Nets. Doesn’t that mean that the other 26 NBA teams’ trade offers will be worse than what the Mavs, Lakers and Nets offer?

Penn: The main lever here is with Dwight in a way, because he has the ability to declare where he wants to play or not play long-term. So, if you aren’t on Dwight’s list, it’s tough as management to make a significant offer hoping that you can change his mind after you get him. Presumably, the Magic will want strong value for Dwight Howard. So, if you’re going to satisfy them and give up that value, usually as management you need to be assured that Dwight intends to stay with you.

OS: How complicated could a deal be? Although the Lakers, the Nets and the Mavs have been mentioned, it doesn’t have to be a two-team trade, right?

Penn: It depends on what the Magic are looking for. Typically, when you trade an MVP-caliber or a first-team all-star, you either look for a first-team all-star in return, or you look for multiple young assets and multiple draft picks that allow you to rebuild more organically. . . .

There just typically isn’t a dancing partner out there that offers all those things itself, so that’s why these deals get complicated and you need to see other teams get involved with three-team and four-team transactions.

OS: People are focusing on Andrew Bynum or Brook Lopez as being involved in a deal. Who would you rather have?

Penn: They’re both young and both developing. Contractually, I would probably prefer Brook Lopez because of the contractual advantage I would have. He is still on his rookie-scale contract, which means that the Magic would have the opportunity to extend his contract and be the only team that could do so, and they would have restricted free-agency rights. The likelihood of having a stable, long-term center would be there with Brook.

Bynum’s got an injury history, and Lopez has been pretty solid.

OS: That brings up a question a lot of people have. Bynum has had knee problems. How much of a red flag is that?

Penn: Well, we’ve had a bad run lately of all the big, big men in the NBA being hurt, and Andrew is at the top of the list of the big, big men that are still playing in the NBA. He has had a significant history with his knees and with injuries, so that has to factor into your decision-making of who you’re getting, how durable he can be and how long he can hold up.

There’s nothing worse from a coaching standpoint than the question of the availability of your center and your player. Of course, Dwight has been one of the most durable players in the league and likely will be for years to come, so that’s part of the charm with him.

OS: The new collective bargaining agreement features some new rules. If Dwight wants to go to a new team and also get a five-year deal with 7.5 percent annual raises, he needs to be traded to that new team before he becomes a free agent and can get that extra year and money. Then, he would opt out and then re-sign with that team. Do the Magic consider calling his bluff and holding onto him past the March 15 trade deadline?

Penn: I think they do that if they believe it can get them a better deal for the long haul.

This is a franchise-level decision. This isn’t a decision that’s being made just for this season.

On the one hand, you risk a Carmelo Anthony type of disruption, where it’s undoubtedly going to be an enormous distraction through the season to have the “Dwight Howard Trade Watch” ongoing, particularly with the All-Star Game coming to town.

However, the short-term pain that that would cause the franchise is probably worth it if waiting gets you a much better deal for Dwight Howard, because there will be a general pressure point of the trade deadline coming-and-going with nothing happening.

However, one nuance in the new collective bargaining agreement is the change in the sign-and-trade rules. That hurts the Magic at the end of the day, because should they hold onto Dwight and he does opt out of his contract and becomes a free agent, if he selects a team that has cap room — the Nets, for example, if they hold onto their cap room — there’s no longer any advantage for the player to sign-and-trade with his former team.

Under the old rules, the former team could give him an extra year and higher raises. In the cases of LeBron James and Chris Bosh, you saw sign-and-trades happen there, because the former teams at least got something else. But, now, a new deal in a sign-and-trade is identical in terms of years and raises to the free-agent deals to a new team, so there’s a higher likelihood that the original team — the Magic, in this case — could be left without any compensation, which would be a horrible scenario.

OS: Because of all those reasons, do the Magic dare hold onto Howard past the March 15 trade deadline in the hope that he changes his mind and wants to remain with the Magic?

Penn: Maybe. It depends on how poor these offers they get and how satisfying they are. It wasn’t that long ago that Kobe Bryant dramatically — emphatically — demanded a trade from the Lakers. And the Lakers held onto Kobe, and in January, they were able to pull off the Pau Gasol trade that got them to the Finals for three straight years with two rings.

Dwight is a good enough player, and stranger things have happened, where, I guess in theory, if the offers are not satisfying for Orlando . . . could they use Jameer Nelson and other assets to package something together to go get a player that would satisfy Dwight and change his mind? I don’t know.

So, logic should tell you they do what they’re doing now, and that’s to pursue all trade avenues and hope someone comes forward with a reasonable offer. But it’s certainly possible they wait if they don’t get that offer.

OS: What else haven’t we covered?

Penn: This concept of jettisoning Hedo Turkoglu’s contract is only a reality for the period of time that the receiving team has cap room to take him, and that window’s going to close in a hurry, because a number of these teams have to fill out rosters, and they may not have the $11 million extra in room that they’ll need to absorb his contract.

OS: But one of those teams could divest themselves of players of equal monetary value, right?

Penn: They could, but that guy’s coming back to the Magic then.

My point is, in this unusual preseason right now, there are still slots and places for an $11 million Hedo contract to go. But people aren’t lining up for that. Nor are they going to hold out room for that. So the team that’s most willing to take on Hedo’s going to be the one that gets Dwight. That space could go away as the season begins.

So if that’s part of the equation, they need to move a little bit quicker on finding a home for Hedo before all this cap-room space dries up.

[CPBalla2003 n da 863]

Thanks VGO, i sworn i saw you or someone post some stuff on him before.

[Def Swami]

Thanks VGO, i sworn i saw you or someone post some stuff on him before.

No problem. I threw some old articles and blog posts about Lindsey and Weaver, never got around to Penn, but glad I did. He seemed to have had a team on the rise in Portland and it sounded like he was critical in making a lot of personnel moves. I'm still not sure why the Blazers would mess up such a good thing. Maybe I'll take it to the Blazers board and ask for questions.