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Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Magic Expected To Retain Core

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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#141 » by KillMonger » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:32 am

drsd wrote:Orlando has slid to the #9 seed.

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we're trojan-horsing a tank lol....we look like we're doing everything we can except...we're not....i mean we could bring in some vets to start plugging some holes in the sinking ship but.....we're not....other teams have already signed some vets out there to cover for injuries but.....we're riding it out....are they doing it purposely? are they taking their time scouring the market to see what will work for us....or....are they doing what we're all thinking at this point?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#142 » by Blue_and_Whte » Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:57 am

KillMonger wrote:
drsd wrote:Orlando has slid to the #9 seed.

Image

we're trojan-horsing a tank lol....we look like we're doing everything we can except...we're not....i mean we could bring in some vets to start plugging some holes in the sinking ship but.....we're not....other teams have already signed some vets out there to cover for injuries but.....we're riding it out....are they doing it purposely? are they taking their time scouring the market to see what will work for us....or....are they doing what we're all thinking at this point?

Depends on what happens when Fournier comes since he obviously makes us a better team. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's moved at this point. I don't doubt that there's a possibility that they're making sure he's 100% healthy so he can pass a physical if traded.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#143 » by KillMonger » Wed Jan 20, 2021 5:42 am

Blue_and_Whte wrote:
KillMonger wrote:
drsd wrote:Orlando has slid to the #9 seed.

Image

we're trojan-horsing a tank lol....we look like we're doing everything we can except...we're not....i mean we could bring in some vets to start plugging some holes in the sinking ship but.....we're not....other teams have already signed some vets out there to cover for injuries but.....we're riding it out....are they doing it purposely? are they taking their time scouring the market to see what will work for us....or....are they doing what we're all thinking at this point?

Depends on what happens when Fournier comes since he obviously makes us a better team. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's moved at this point. I don't doubt that there's a possibility that they're making sure he's 100% healthy so he can pass a physical if traded.

i think fournier already has his bags packed, rumors about his house that he recently bought put back on the market....he himself on a french podcast or show iirc said if a contender offers him a contract he's gone....writing is on the wall to me as far as evan is concerned....it's not wrong to want to spend the rest of your prime competing for titles and in that respect it works out for us either way so, i'm ready for it.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#144 » by drsd » Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:30 am

Skybox wrote:Boston wouldn't include Smart if Aminu was healthy and Fournier was signed for 5m/yr....Smart is a hugely valuable piece to their success.


My more general point was that I hope Aminu is part of any trade package Orlando fires off.


..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#145 » by drsd » Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:34 am

jonbob17 wrote:Fournier + Aminu for equal expiring or TPE absorption sounds like a win.


Would Orlando trade Fournier and Aminu for a traded player exception only? It is an interestingquestion, but it if came to pass, it would mean Orlando is playing for lottery balls this year.

(Yes Fournier and Aminu cannot technically be traded together for a TPE, but they can be part of coupled traded; on paper it would be something like Fournier for a TPE and Aminu for a 2nd-round pick swap).
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#146 » by drsd » Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:36 am

KillMonger wrote:we're trojan-horsing a tank lol....we look like we're doing everything we can except...we're not....i mean we could bring in some vets to start plugging some holes in the sinking ship but.....we're not....other teams have already signed some vets out there to cover for injuries but.....we're riding it out....are they doing it purposely? are they taking their time scouring the market to see what will work for us....or....are they doing what we're all thinking at this point?


I do think this has occurred, but I do not think it was a per se strategy. Instead Orlando is simply injury riddled such that wins cannot occur; there is a clear lack of both talent and depth on this team right now.

If Fultz, Carter-Williams, Aminu, Fournier and Okeke had all played these last 8 games, many would have been wins.


..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#147 » by pepe1991 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:43 am

Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#148 » by Furinkazan » Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:00 am

pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Why cry? That list is hilarious.I can’t stop laughing.
They got the best job ever ..doing nothing collecting paychecks.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#149 » by pepe1991 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:16 am

Furinkazan wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Why cry? That list is hilarious.I can’t stop laughing.
They got the best job ever ..doing nothing collecting paychecks.


How dare you,they traded Markelle Fultz for second round pick 2 years ago. So impactful, so great, future MVP. Did you know he is more athletic Harden, according to some article from 5 years ago ? :)
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#150 » by Furinkazan » Wed Jan 20, 2021 9:31 am

pepe1991 wrote:
Furinkazan wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Why cry? That list is hilarious.I can’t stop laughing.
They got the best job ever ..doing nothing collecting paychecks.


How dare you,they traded Markelle Fultz for second round pick 2 years ago. So impactful, so great, future MVP. Did you know he is more athletic Harden, according to some article from 5 years ago ? :)

Actually imo
He was a solid gamble and only trade they did right.
Giving contracts to both Isaac and Fultz ahead of time was a mistake though.They thought they outsmarted everyone.
Professional team ..... minus Fournier and Vuc 3 point percentage...rest of the team is like 12%from 3 pt line ? XD.....that’s professional team in the nba,,,. In 1968 maybe,,,, that’s how they shaped the roster....trully genius minds,,,
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#151 » by deggett » Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:37 am

pepe1991 wrote:
Furinkazan wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Why cry? That list is hilarious.I can’t stop laughing.
They got the best job ever ..doing nothing collecting paychecks.


How dare you,they traded Markelle Fultz for second round pick 2 years ago. So impactful, so great, future MVP. Did you know he is more athletic Harden, according to some article from 5 years ago ? :)


It wasn't second round pick, we gave up this year #21 (Tyrese Maxey)
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#152 » by jonbob17 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:58 pm

drsd wrote:
jonbob17 wrote:Fournier + Aminu for equal expiring or TPE absorption sounds like a win.


Would Orlando trade Fournier and Aminu for a traded player exception only? It is an interestingquestion, but it if came to pass, it would mean Orlando is playing for lottery balls this year.

(Yes Fournier and Aminu cannot technically be traded together for a TPE, but they can be part of coupled traded; on paper it would be something like Fournier for a TPE and Aminu for a 2nd-round pick swap).


It wouldn't be for the exception. Boston would need to to use the exception to take on the salary. Fournier is probably worth a late first or early second. We would have to attach a pick to move Aminu at the moment, probably in the same range. They sort of net each other out. Aminu is a big negative, unless he proves otherwise on the court.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#153 » by Skybox » Wed Jan 20, 2021 5:02 pm

Our most LIKELY move (other than none) is peddling AG and/or Evan to a contender for picks or young'uns who haven't shown much yet.

As far as blockbusters, who are the biggest names that MAYBE could be had for the right (giant) offer?
*This is just a starting point, there are obviously good and bad deals and good and bad potential fits for us.

Guys that are good or have reason to believe could be really good in a new spot and MAY be available based on team situations:
(call it a white board)
ATL - Collins, big numbers, I'm not a fan and sure don't want to pay him what he wants (or lose him for nothing)
BOS- TPE gives them some flexibility to take on contracts but give back what? Nesmith, Langford, maybe ghost of Kemba? Nah
BRK-another win now situation unless Kyrie melts down, could Dinwiddie be signed for a today contributor for them?
CHA-now that they've invested in Hayward they may think they're win-now. Only guy I like is Washington, but they do too. Maybe Bamba?
CHI- Lavine is exactly the profile I meant, might be a team shift but they'd want a lot back, Lauri has skills-maybe a fit issue
CLE-don't really see anything that fits
DAL-Outside of their unavailable big 2, I don't see much but an expiring THardaway-might as well pay Evan then
DEN-Michael Porter jr. is the big fish here, IF they determine the fit is wrong - or the attitude, could parlay him to fit win-now needs
DET-nada, but if a complete teardown were the goal, Blake's only one more year on his mammoth deal, and their picks will be high
GSW-That MIN pick is the thing. GSW may shift from win-now to win-next-year with Klay, so perhaps a big deal (Vuc?AG?Wigs + pick)
HOU-Oladipo...flight risk, to say the least.
IND-solid young team, most likely drama free other than question of whether Turner fits, probably not a trade partner for us
LAC-not really that interesting, Kawhi could flake out and flee (but not to us), If PG poops the playoff bed again?
LAL-nothing of note unless you want to get in a bidding war for the surprising but so what guy we gifted them (Horton-Tucker)(I don't)
MEM-their best guys are young, well-matched and under contract
MIA-only opportunity (no blockbuster) MIGHT be if they frantically try to clear cap (Robinson? Herro?) to sign a big name FA
MIL-don't really see any trade opportunities or upcoming shifts
MIN-good match for AG, I'd like Beasley back, or Culver AND McDaniels (lots of upside-no progress yet)
NOLA - not even sure what they need but my best guess would be Bamba for long-term pairing with Zion - NAW needs to come back
NY -cupboard is still bare there...Barrett is only one I'd chase but not likely available for what I'd pay
OKC - tons of picks and cap space but they probably have big plans for both that don't include us
PHI - All I could see is taking Tobias' big contract (and big scoring) along with young talent (Maxey, Joe, Reed)...if Morey re-shapes
PHO - maybe they decide they don't need Bridges AND Cam Johnson and would move one for a defender like AG? unlikely
POR - interesting. If they were ever going to bust up the backcourt and help Dame win-now...other smaller targets like Collins, Simons
SAC- Hield scares me, Bagley too...Barnes is sneaky valuable, but not our likeliest trade partner
SAS- it would require a timeline shift for Popovich, but they have a handful of intriguing wings, perhaps POP could see Vuc or AG
TOR-Could Siakim really be replaced by OG to sell Siakim for missing pieces (Vuc +)? I've always felt Powell could take a bigger role
UTA- Outside of Mitchell, I don't see anything young enough and good enough to chase
WAS-Beal, of course...could taking Westbrook's massive deal be (part of) the price to get Beal? I'd decimate the roster for both.(& Vuc)

So, what is the lesson? Obviously, that I need to get back to work and my (alleged) life :crazy:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#154 » by OrlandO » Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:02 pm

pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Weltman was probably hoping to develop his young players for a few years and then make a big trade in hopes to tie it all together. Problem is all his young players either couldn't stay on the floor to develop or are just slow developers to begin with. Now he's going to be backed into a corner for his contract year where his young players aren't where he hoped yet he still has to present a "finished" product to upper management. So what happens when he's finally pressured to make a big trade for a player he thinks can immediately help his team? Should we brace for a hennigan-level disaster trade?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#155 » by JBSouthpaw » Wed Jan 20, 2021 6:20 pm

Right now, I think Birch is our best trade chip. His salary matches up with young players still on their rookie deal.

Look at Portland, just lost Nurkic for 6 weeks. a trade of Birch, for Simmons or Little would benefit both teams. I'd like Trent Jr., but I think they need him, plus he's a FA after this year. The other 2 we'd have for at least 2 years.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#156 » by pepe1991 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 9:37 pm

OrlandO wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Weltman was probably hoping to develop his young players for a few years and then make a big trade in hopes to tie it all together. Problem is all his young players either couldn't stay on the floor to develop or are just slow developers to begin with. Now he's going to be backed into a corner for his contract year where his young players aren't where he hoped yet he still has to present a "finished" product to upper management. So what happens when he's finally pressured to make a big trade for a player he thinks can immediately help his team? Should we brace for a hennigan-level disaster trade?



Pretty much be ready for Derozan type trade i guess...
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#157 » by Furinkazan » Wed Jan 20, 2021 9:51 pm

JBSouthpaw wrote:Right now, I think Birch is our best trade chip. His salary matches up with young players still on their rookie deal.

Look at Portland, just lost Nurkic for 6 weeks. a trade of Birch, for Simmons or Little would benefit both teams. I'd like Trent Jr., but I think they need him, plus he's a FA after this year. The other 2 we'd have for at least 2 years.

They got Kanter I dont see that need forBirch
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#158 » by OrlandO » Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:42 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
OrlandO wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Every single trade made by the current FO. . .

Ivan Rabb for a 2nd round pick

Anzejs Pasecniks for a 1st rounder and a future 2nd

Elfrid Payton for a 2nd round pick

Jarred Vanderbilt for Justin Jackson & 2nd rounder

Biz Biyombo + 2nd rounder for Tim Mozgrov & Jerian Grant

Rodney Purvis for Dakari Johnson + cash

Jonathan Simmons + 2nd rounder for Markelle Fultz

Talen Horton-Tucker for 2nd rounder + cash

2nd rounder for James Ennis

2nd rounder for 2 future 2nd rounders

Let's gather together and cry

Weltman was probably hoping to develop his young players for a few years and then make a big trade in hopes to tie it all together. Problem is all his young players either couldn't stay on the floor to develop or are just slow developers to begin with. Now he's going to be backed into a corner for his contract year where his young players aren't where he hoped yet he still has to present a "finished" product to upper management. So what happens when he's finally pressured to make a big trade for a player he thinks can immediately help his team? Should we brace for a hennigan-level disaster trade?



Pretty much be ready for Derozan type trade i guess...

Wake up one morning to trades for aging derozan and washed up draymond lol
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#159 » by Furinkazan » Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:54 pm

Also Portland can easily sign Len or dunno Dedmon without giving up anything and get similar production from them.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VII: Where do we go from here? 

Post#160 » by MagicHolland » Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:15 pm

Skybox wrote:Our most LIKELY move (other than none) is peddling AG and/or Evan to a contender for picks or young'uns who haven't shown much yet.

As far as blockbusters, who are the biggest names that MAYBE could be had for the right (giant) offer?
*This is just a starting point, there are obviously good and bad deals and good and bad potential fits for us.

Guys that are good or have reason to believe could be really good in a new spot and MAY be available based on team situations:
(call it a white board)
ATL - Collins, big numbers, I'm not a fan and sure don't want to pay him what he wants (or lose him for nothing)
BOS- TPE gives them some flexibility to take on contracts but give back what? Nesmith, Langford, maybe ghost of Kemba? Nah
BRK-another win now situation unless Kyrie melts down, could Dinwiddie be signed for a today contributor for them?
CHA-now that they've invested in Hayward they may think they're win-now. Only guy I like is Washington, but they do too. Maybe Bamba?
CHI- Lavine is exactly the profile I meant, might be a team shift but they'd want a lot back, Lauri has skills-maybe a fit issue
CLE-don't really see anything that fits
DAL-Outside of their unavailable big 2, I don't see much but an expiring THardaway-might as well pay Evan then
DEN-Michael Porter jr. is the big fish here, IF they determine the fit is wrong - or the attitude, could parlay him to fit win-now needs
DET-nada, but if a complete teardown were the goal, Blake's only one more year on his mammoth deal, and their picks will be high
GSW-That MIN pick is the thing. GSW may shift from win-now to win-next-year with Klay, so perhaps a big deal (Vuc?AG?Wigs + pick)
HOU-Oladipo...flight risk, to say the least.
IND-solid young team, most likely drama free other than question of whether Turner fits, probably not a trade partner for us
LAC-not really that interesting, Kawhi could flake out and flee (but not to us), If PG poops the playoff bed again?
LAL-nothing of note unless you want to get in a bidding war for the surprising but so what guy we gifted them (Horton-Tucker)(I don't)
MEM-their best guys are young, well-matched and under contract
MIA-only opportunity (no blockbuster) MIGHT be if they frantically try to clear cap (Robinson? Herro?) to sign a big name FA
MIL-don't really see any trade opportunities or upcoming shifts
MIN-good match for AG, I'd like Beasley back, or Culver AND McDaniels (lots of upside-no progress yet)
NOLA - not even sure what they need but my best guess would be Bamba for long-term pairing with Zion - NAW needs to come back
NY -cupboard is still bare there...Barrett is only one I'd chase but not likely available for what I'd pay
OKC - tons of picks and cap space but they probably have big plans for both that don't include us
PHI - All I could see is taking Tobias' big contract (and big scoring) along with young talent (Maxey, Joe, Reed)...if Morey re-shapes
PHO - maybe they decide they don't need Bridges AND Cam Johnson and would move one for a defender like AG? unlikely
POR - interesting. If they were ever going to bust up the backcourt and help Dame win-now...other smaller targets like Collins, Simons
SAC- Hield scares me, Bagley too...Barnes is sneaky valuable, but not our likeliest trade partner
SAS- it would require a timeline shift for Popovich, but they have a handful of intriguing wings, perhaps POP could see Vuc or AG
TOR-Could Siakim really be replaced by OG to sell Siakim for missing pieces (Vuc +)? I've always felt Powell could take a bigger role
UTA- Outside of Mitchell, I don't see anything young enough and good enough to chase
WAS-Beal, of course...could taking Westbrook's massive deal be (part of) the price to get Beal? I'd decimate the roster for both.(& Vuc)

So, what is the lesson? Obviously, that I need to get back to work and my (alleged) life :crazy:


Lol I was looking to get that done without Isaac and Vuc..

Orlando trades: Fournier, Fultz, Bamba and 2021 FRP to Washington. Aminu and MCW to GS. Ross to Phili.

Orlando receives: Westbrook and Beal

Washington trades: Beal and Westbrook

Washington receives: Fournier (exp), Fultz, Bamba, Oubre(exp), Green(exp) and 2021 FRP from Orlando.

GS trades: Oubre

GS receives: Aminu, MCW and 2021 SRP from Philly

Phili trades: Green and 2021 SRP.

Phili receives: Ross.

Westbrook/Anthony
Beal/Mane
Bacon/Ennis
Gordon/Okeke (Isaac)
Vucevic/Birch

:o 8-) :lol:

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