Official Spec Thread: Regular Season

[drsd]

52 wins. Book it.

I am going Full Homer: I believe in 50+ wins!

Spoiler:

Not really, but it feels nice to say out load.

[JBSouthpaw]

+ 40 wins I'd give the team an "A" for the season
+38 = B
+36 = C
-36 = F

[JBSouthpaw]

*double post*

[Fortune Teller]

So is anyone surprised that we appear to be starting the season with all 6 guards still on the roster, with our two lottery picks presumably getting third-team minutes?

It makes zero sense, but I'm also zero surprised.

[JBSouthpaw]

So is anyone surprised that we appear to be starting the season with all 6 guards still on the roster, with our two lottery picks presumably getting third-team minutes?

It makes zero sense, but I'm also zero surprised.

The biggest surprise for me was signing the rookies so fast. I thought they should have waited to see if any deals were to be had.

[The-Stallion70]

Looking like another Jokic-orGiannis-Mvp season. The only player they both couldn't beat out is March-Elfrid Payton.

[The-Stallion70]

Wemby

Yes

Chet

No

[KillMonger]

Watch on YouTube

great watch....the team seems to have great vibes

[CarraT]

So is anyone surprised that we appear to be starting the season with all 6 guards still on the roster, with our two lottery picks presumably getting third-team minutes?

It makes zero sense, but I'm also zero surprised.

They are just super afraid of trading the wrong young guy, who will then flourish on a new team. Thats why they sit on their hands, knowing we cant develop all of them and it doesnt make sense keeping all of the young guards.
At some point you have to take a risk to get bettter. But not with our FO, they will do nothing until they are forced to.

[SOUL]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

[Optimus_Steel]

It's just impatience. There is no rush to trade players. There are players that won't be here next year, Harris, Ingles, Chuma, then Issac with his situation may not be here next year. Take a chill pill.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using RealGM mobile app

[OrlChamps2030]

So is anyone surprised that we appear to be starting the season with all 6 guards still on the roster, with our two lottery picks presumably getting third-team minutes?

It makes zero sense, but I'm also zero surprised.

They are just super afraid of trading the wrong young guy, who will then flourish on a new team. Thats why they sit on their hands, knowing we cant develop all of them and it doesnt make sense keeping all of the young guards.
At some point you have to take a risk to get bettter. But not with our FO, they will do nothing until they are forced to.

It’s interesting that throughout their tenure here, the FO has never traded a player that’s on their rookie deal. Young guys getting buried and hinder the development as well as suppress their value imo

[eyriq]

So is anyone surprised that we appear to be starting the season with all 6 guards still on the roster, with our two lottery picks presumably getting third-team minutes?

It makes zero sense, but I'm also zero surprised.

They are just super afraid of trading the wrong young guy, who will then flourish on a new team. Thats why they sit on their hands, knowing we cant develop all of them and it doesnt make sense keeping all of the young guards.
At some point you have to take a risk to get bettter. But not with our FO, they will do nothing until they are forced to.

It’s interesting that throughout their tenure here, the FO has never traded a player that’s on their rookie deal. Young guys getting buried and hinder the development as well as suppress their value imo

This is a great point. Trading future value for current value is not a move you make during a rebuild.

[pepe1991]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

Red and blue contradict each other.

if we are so young, there is no reason to prioritize winning.

if we don't prioritize winning and want to develop, there is zero reasons to judge young players based on performacnes and cut their PT based on it. They are expected to suck.



Again, i don't think there are fans who want to cash in all chips and go for title, knowing it's impossible. I think Magic fan camps are split between:

1) let's develop whole team from ground up and let's keep everybody for as long as it's possible
2) let's develop SOME players but also let's adress our issues to keep sustained growth


We have no control over new contract of Fultz, who is UFA, but we start him over 5th, 6th and 15th own picks.
We have 1# pick and ROY, but we seems to be in no particular hurry to even tweek roster to make his life easier ( rather opposite by decisions who we make, or not make based on our PG-SG rotation).
On other side of a spectrum , we are 100% fine with notion that our two lottery picks won't be in rotation any time soon.


My personal feeling is that we afraid to make moves in fear of "losing" trade that it petrifies us. And that will lead us to position where we will be reacting, instad of being proactive. And we lack guts to make hard decisions.(by "we= Weltman).
So , hard moves won't be our personal decision , rather something or somebody who forced our hand. It's not like this didn't happen in very recent past. Gordon forced their hand 2 years ago after they were perfeclly fine doing nothing for 3 years.

And most important factor here is fact that we are now on borrowed time when it comes to rookie scale contracts and massive exstensions that are lurking. In next two years, Magic are pased to give up multiple +$100M contracts for next half of decade. At some point you will make decisions or decisions will made your future for you.

[eyriq]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

Red and blue contradict each other.

if we are so young, there is no reason to prioritize winning.

if we don't prioritize winning and want to develop, there is zero reasons to judge young players based on performacnes and cut their PT based on it. They are expected to suck.



Again, i don't think there are fans who want to cash in all chips and go for title, knowing it's impossible. I think Magic fan camps are split between:

1) let's develop whole team from ground up and let's keep everybody for as long as it's possible
2) let's develop SOME players but also let's adress our issues to keep sustained growth


We have no control over new contract of Fultz, who is UFA, but we start him over 5th, 6th and 15th own picks.
We have 1# pick and ROY, but we seems to be in no particular hurry to even tweek roster to make his life easier ( rather opposite by decisions who we make, or not make based on our PG-SG rotation).
On other side of a spectrum , we are 100% fine with notion that our two lottery picks won't be in rotation any time soon.


My personal feeling is that we afraid to make moves in fear of "losing" trade that it petrifies us. And that will lead us to position where we will be reacting, instad of being proactive. And we lack guts to make hard decisions.(by "we= Weltman).
So , hard moves won't be our personal decision , rather something or somebody who forced our hand. It's not like this didn't happen in very recent past. Gordon forced their hand 2 years ago after they were perfeclly fine doing nothing for 3 years.

And most important factor here is fact that we are now on borrowed time when it comes to rookie scale contracts and massive exstensions that are lurking. In next two years, Magic are pased to give up multiple +$100M contracts for next half of decade. At some point you will make decisions or decisions will made your future for you.

This is a great post. At some point we need to zoom in on a build around Paolo and Franz. The young core overachieved last season, providing an indication that it's worth investing in. We have evidence that we can start to build around Paolo and Franz. Make this decision and then focus on identifying an optimal style of play and work to acquire the optimal role players to put around them.

This could be what we're already doing. We just aren't being assertive about it. Yet.

If we don't think we have a championship core, we'll have to cash in for an all-star. Timing there would still be a few seasons away though. Tanking for a franchise player has to be out of the question given the wealth of draft capital and prospects we've already accumulated.

My expectations are that in 4 seasons we'll have 2, maybe 3, players on this current team still around. Moves will be made.

[SOUL]

I don't think it's contradictory - you can prioritize a plan for winning and be smart with your chips. If you're playing poker you can fold and lose a minimal amount or you can keep raising the pot with a hand that you know isn't the best and lose chips for no reason. There's absolutely no reason to make a bunch of trades at this moment, before the season, that can't wait until mid-season or 2024 with a clearer view of what the guard situation will be like and plans for the rookies as well.

Once that pressure is put on them internally, external pressure heats up. Weltman has already addressed he knows he hasn't made a lot of moves and this year is important for a lot of players. It's easy to be a doubting fan and be like "blah, blah, Weltman didn't make moves last year or two so why is he doing it now?" - that's like saying "I've never been hit by a car, it surely can't happen today" - same stuff was going on with Vuc-Gordon-Fournier core until all of them got shipped out, regardless of AG's insistence, it signaled a total tear down.

We can always tweak... you have to know WHAT to tweak to do that. I guarantee you nobody can tell me specific trades Denver or Milwaukee or Philly made in 1st/2nd years of getting what they assumed was their star. You can name the bigger moves later on like getting Jrue or AG/Bruce Brown/KCP to bolster depth or getting Butler/Harden and attempting to win (Philly failed, other teams succeeded), but every team is different. I think we have a decent number of keepers for role guys already and what we're really looking for will take a specific guy to come out of who we have now OR be traded for in the upcoming year or two.

And for those who think the answer is easy on who to trade, extend, start, etc.. look at this forum as an example. Fultz hive, Suggs hive, Cole hive, Black hive.. if every poster is backing different horses, there is no easy choice to make at this moment because everyone's easy choice is different.

I think Harris is probably the only one people feel is expendable, only if we acquire another shooter or someone can get to his level.

[SOUL]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

Red and blue contradict each other.

if we are so young, there is no reason to prioritize winning.

if we don't prioritize winning and want to develop, there is zero reasons to judge young players based on performacnes and cut their PT based on it. They are expected to suck.



Again, i don't think there are fans who want to cash in all chips and go for title, knowing it's impossible. I think Magic fan camps are split between:

1) let's develop whole team from ground up and let's keep everybody for as long as it's possible
2) let's develop SOME players but also let's adress our issues to keep sustained growth


We have no control over new contract of Fultz, who is UFA, but we start him over 5th, 6th and 15th own picks.
We have 1# pick and ROY, but we seems to be in no particular hurry to even tweek roster to make his life easier ( rather opposite by decisions who we make, or not make based on our PG-SG rotation).
On other side of a spectrum , we are 100% fine with notion that our two lottery picks won't be in rotation any time soon.


My personal feeling is that we afraid to make moves in fear of "losing" trade that it petrifies us. And that will lead us to position where we will be reacting, instad of being proactive. And we lack guts to make hard decisions.(by "we= Weltman).
So , hard moves won't be our personal decision , rather something or somebody who forced our hand. It's not like this didn't happen in very recent past. Gordon forced their hand 2 years ago after they were perfeclly fine doing nothing for 3 years.

And most important factor here is fact that we are now on borrowed time when it comes to rookie scale contracts and massive exstensions that are lurking. In next two years, Magic are pased to give up multiple +$100M contracts for next half of decade. At some point you will make decisions or decisions will made your future for you.

This is a great post. At some point we need to zoom in on a build around Paolo and Franz. The young core overachieved last season, providing an indication that it's worth investing in. We have evidence that we can start to build around Paolo and Franz. Make this decision and then focus on identifying an optimal style of play and work to acquire the optimal role players to put around them.

This could be what we're already doing. We just aren't being assertive about it. Yet.

If we don't think we have a championship core, we'll have to cash in for an all-star. Timing there would still be a few seasons away though. Tanking for a franchise player has to be out of the question given the wealth of draft capital and prospects we've already accumulated.

My expectations are that in 4 seasons we'll have 2, maybe 3, players on this current team still around. Moves will be made.

No offense, you called pepe's post great and then said what I said which was.. these players will be identified in due time, which doesn't have to be literally right this second

[SOUL]

There just isn't a highlighted player to ship out right this second outside of Harris who has one foot out anyway.

At some point, posters are going to have to specify who is moving out right now and for what sort of return that makes sense, and I guarantee those opinions will vastly differ. It's the same frustration you'd get with your girlfriend if she said she's hungry but doesn't tell you where she wants to eat.. at some point you just say there's food at the house

Posters like Ben and Audi have full confidence in Fultz and are okay with the current process. MagicMatic is a believer in Suggs but not Fultz, pepe constantly talks about how Cole is our best offensive option at guard, thinks Fultz isn't good but still better than Suggs, eyriq is all in on Black and doesn't like Cole, Knightro is hard to read on a lot of stuff because of everything being a bad lineup but loves FVV - would he have wanted him at $128 mil?

[tiderulz]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

you can only play 5 people at a time. so we keep all the players and play them 20 mpg, stunt their development (or their showing they wont develop)? we will be 4 years from now still talking about "potential" of players.

[tiderulz]

Our fans are so hungry to trade players that played good together and like each other lol.. it's amazing to me that thought process considering we're not winning it all this year and other way better teams are going all in and our best two players are literal 21 and 22 year olds.

So yes, seeing how we made dumbass trades in the past because of an itch to "get better", it backfired and created a limited 8th seed with less assets to trade until we hit the reset button. The same hypocritical fans who wanted a get rich quick scheme are quick to point fingers at Hennigan like they weren't drooling on themselves to hurry the process up because they were spoiled from Dwight era winning.

Also if we're not sure who is a keeper between Fultz, Suggs and Cole yet, other teams aren't going to fairly value them either. It's easy to say trade these guys, nobody ever provides a trade that isn't a complete rip off for the other team or one that makes sense from both teams POV.

Not to mention, a desire to naturally win, as the team currently has been talking about since the end of last year, creates more expectation and accountability. Movement is inevitable. Good play from what is conducive to winning will get rewarded, bad play will spell trades or benching.

The names don't matter, so player fans will have to suck it up. I'm sure 49ers fans didn't think Brock Purdy would be their future

Red and blue contradict each other.

if we are so young, there is no reason to prioritize winning.

if we don't prioritize winning and want to develop, there is zero reasons to judge young players based on performacnes and cut their PT based on it. They are expected to suck.



Again, i don't think there are fans who want to cash in all chips and go for title, knowing it's impossible. I think Magic fan camps are split between:

1) let's develop whole team from ground up and let's keep everybody for as long as it's possible
2) let's develop SOME players but also let's adress our issues to keep sustained growth


We have no control over new contract of Fultz, who is UFA, but we start him over 5th, 6th and 15th own picks.
We have 1# pick and ROY, but we seems to be in no particular hurry to even tweek roster to make his life easier ( rather opposite by decisions who we make, or not make based on our PG-SG rotation).
On other side of a spectrum , we are 100% fine with notion that our two lottery picks won't be in rotation any time soon.


My personal feeling is that we afraid to make moves in fear of "losing" trade that it petrifies us. And that will lead us to position where we will be reacting, instad of being proactive. And we lack guts to make hard decisions.(by "we= Weltman).
So , hard moves won't be our personal decision , rather something or somebody who forced our hand. It's not like this didn't happen in very recent past. Gordon forced their hand 2 years ago after they were perfeclly fine doing nothing for 3 years.

And most important factor here is fact that we are now on borrowed time when it comes to rookie scale contracts and massive exstensions that are lurking. In next two years, Magic are pased to give up multiple +$100M contracts for next half of decade. At some point you will make decisions or decisions will made your future for you.

completely agree on all of this. especially the part about this FO being afraid of losing a trade.