Official Speculation Thread ‘17-18’: XVIII: The Long Wait Continues

[Knightro]

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[VFX]

Wait till we sit out Gordon, the prized possession, for nothing but to rest him.

Then everyone will rejoice when Vuc sits out preseason for nothing. Only to see Vuc eat Bamba's minutes again on the first game of the regular season. LOL.

Preseason is where DNP-Rest when happens. Relax guys. lol

The point really isn’t about preseason. It has to do with the fact that Clifford will feel compelled to leave Vuc on the floor even if that means shifting Bamba around to make it happen. Vuc playing minutes over Bamba is one thing, but that’s another situation. He literally said it himself. Maybe he’s telling the media one thing and won’t actually do it, but he did in fact say it. It was confirmed he would do this by Hornets fans.

As long as we have Vuc, he is going to play and get close to 30 mins a game. So would you rather Bamba only gets the minutes Vuc doesn’t play or also gets more now and then next to Vuc?

Accepting that Vuc is here for another season is unfortunately part of the process right now. But 3 months ago folks (maybe you as well)were saying Clifford doesn’t play rookies. Now he is clearly stating that he will and figuring out more ways to get Bamba minutes. I’m just trying to figure out how this is that awful a situation. Especially in a tanking season.

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

[PennytoShaq]

The point really isn’t about preseason. It has to do with the fact that Clifford will feel compelled to leave Vuc on the floor even if that means shifting Bamba around to make it happen. Vuc playing minutes over Bamba is one thing, but that’s another situation. He literally said it himself. Maybe he’s telling the media one thing and won’t actually do it, but he did in fact say it. It was confirmed he would do this by Hornets fans.

As long as we have Vuc, he is going to play and get close to 30 mins a game. So would you rather Bamba only gets the minutes Vuc doesn’t play or also gets more now and then next to Vuc?

Accepting that Vuc is here for another season is unfortunately part of the process right now. But 3 months ago folks (maybe you as well)were saying Clifford doesn’t play rookies. Now he is clearly stating that he will and figuring out more ways to get Bamba minutes. I’m just trying to figure out how this is that awful a situation. Especially in a tanking season.

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that he should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

[MagicFan101]

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So... it's so minor that he could have continued playing if it was a regular season game but so problematic that he's going to miss a game 4 days later?

Or perhaps the fact that this is a pre-season game against a non-NBA club has something to do with this decision? Pair that that with prior issues and it’s a no brainer. Absolutely no reason whatsoever for Isaac to play. I would be upset if he did.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Yeah.. sorry, most of us were to busy with watching him get absolutely annihilated by Embiid the other 99% of the time.

Nik 20 pts 2asts 5rbs 2 blks 52%fg 2-2 ft
Embiid: 21pts 2asts 7rbs 0 blks 61%fg 2-3 ft

I guess Nik annialated Embiid 99% of the time.

But not really right? Through the cloud of bull and hyperbole they seem to have cancelled eachother out rather than anyone annihalating the other.
Also Emiid is a top 5 player in the NBA and not many can stop him. So If youre going to extend that consideration then it needs to apply to everyone not just the players you like.



Sent from my VS501 using RealGM mobile app

First off, that play that was posted happened in the first quarter where Vuc got annihilated in. Embiid went 5/5 on Vuc in that quarter and had his team up 8 points while Vuc went 2/5 acting as a complete turnstile on defense and playing buddy ball with Evan. Only 4 of Embiids points came on Bamba (Bamba actually forced a couple of turnovers while guarding him) and the rest were scored while Vuc was out there.

You can keep posting Vuc's box scores like all of his defenders here like to do but its been pointed out many times how his numbers have no real impact. He is a box score stuffer.

http://www.nba.com/gametracker/#/20181001/ORLPHI/magic/analysis
https://stats.nba.com/game/0011800012/?RangeType=0&StartRange=0&EndRange=28800

1Q
Embiid went 5-9 (55%) and at one point 3-3 on Nik, but at no point went 5-5 as you stated. He went 1-1 on Mo who defended JE for 1:14 and Amir for approximately 3 mins. That's a good quarter but not an annihilation, its pretty much on par for arguably the best center in the NBA being fed the ball while playing in a preseason game.

2Q
JE went 2-2, scoring one shot on Mo and one step back jumper while Nik was on the floor. Nik blocks Fultz at the rim.

3Q
JE went 1 -3 while Nik went 4-5 which should be considered annihilation since apparently 3-3 is. JE also had a TO.

People don't exclusively use box scores to "defend Nik", there have been plenty of times where people have posted all kinds of advanced stats on him in order to make valid points, but I find it funny that you were complaining about me using box scores in this discussion while you were doing the exact same thing.

All said, JE went 9-15 and Nik went 9-17 I'm not arguing efficiency or shot selection but I will say that this doesn't fit the description you're trying to push. On to the next game. I cant wait.

[VFX]

As long as we have Vuc, he is going to play and get close to 30 mins a game. So would you rather Bamba only gets the minutes Vuc doesn’t play or also gets more now and then next to Vuc?

Accepting that Vuc is here for another season is unfortunately part of the process right now. But 3 months ago folks (maybe you as well)were saying Clifford doesn’t play rookies. Now he is clearly stating that he will and figuring out more ways to get Bamba minutes. I’m just trying to figure out how this is that awful a situation. Especially in a tanking season.

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that huge should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Reading comprehension must be hard. I said Vuc is starting because he’s on the roster still. The only positive to Vuc being on the roster still is to ease Bamba into minutes. You brought up tanking purposes and I said Bamba would start if we were truly tanking because he isn’t ready obviously. I didn’t say “Vuc sucks” and never have. I have said Vuc is a crutch to developing a legitimate offense and I stand by that. Bamba is going to be starting Center for Orlando next season barring Vuc being resigned, which would be a mistake.

[pepe1991]

consensus about Vučević:
He is starting level C in nba that is capable of having great games but overall isn't top tear C .
He is better than Bamba today and will start because of it, but on team like Magic, that will probably face lottery again he is also expendable, thefore there is no need for coach to try rotations with him and Bamba because by most odds, he won't be here in 2019. Only question is will he be gone in April or before.

No need to be blind hater because Vučević is good player, but in same time there is no need to build around him ,because he is not that good. Only players worth build around are superstars.

[basketballRob]

As long as we have Vuc, he is going to play and get close to 30 mins a game. So would you rather Bamba only gets the minutes Vuc doesn’t play or also gets more now and then next to Vuc?

Accepting that Vuc is here for another season is unfortunately part of the process right now. But 3 months ago folks (maybe you as well)were saying Clifford doesn’t play rookies. Now he is clearly stating that he will and figuring out more ways to get Bamba minutes. I’m just trying to figure out how this is that awful a situation. Especially in a tanking season.

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that he should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Bamba was clearly better than Vuc in game1. Vuc would've picked up fouls too but he's too wimpy to play defense, he just let Embiid shred him for 8 or 10 points in the first few minutes of the game.


Vuc was getting his points in garbage time against Amir Johnson.

[pepe1991]

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that he should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Bamba was clearly better than Vuc in game1. Vuc would've picked up fouls too but he's too wimpy to play defense, he just let Embiid shred him for 8 or 10 points in the first few minutes of the game.


Vuc was getting his points in garbage time against Amir Johnson.

He wasn't bad but in real game he would foul out by halftime

[basketballRob]

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that he should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Bamba was clearly better than Vuc in game1. Vuc would've picked up fouls too but he's too wimpy to play defense, he just let Embiid shred him for 8 or 10 points in the first few minutes of the game.


Vuc was getting his points in garbage time against Amir Johnson.

He wasn't bad but in real game he would foul out by halftime

Vuc picked up a foul like 30 seconds in the game then let Embiid just have like 4 layups in a row. Vuc is so selfish to think he's that important to stay out of foul trouble. I hope Bamba doesn't learn these loser traits from Vuc. Vuc just wants to pad his stats, he doesn't want to win.

[Optimus_Steel]

Tobias Harris the centerpiece in potential Jimmy Butler trade lmao. The basketball Gods making us pay for back to back #1 picks in the 90s lol.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Bamba was clearly better than Vuc in game1. Vuc would've picked up fouls too but he's too wimpy to play defense, he just let Embiid shred him for 8 or 10 points in the first few minutes of the game.


Vuc was getting his points in garbage time against Amir Johnson.

He wasn't bad but in real game he would foul out by halftime

Vuc picked up a foul like 30 seconds in the game then let Embiid just have like 4 layups in a row. Vuc is so selfish to think he's that important to stay out of foul trouble. I hope Bamba doesn't learn these loser traits from Vuc. Vuc just wants to pad his stats, he doesn't want to win.

Are you trolling? I hope you're trolling.

[basketballRob]

He wasn't bad but in real game he would foul out by halftime

Vuc picked up a foul like 30 seconds in the game then let Embiid just have like 4 layups in a row. Vuc is so selfish to think he's that important to stay out of foul trouble. I hope Bamba doesn't learn these loser traits from Vuc. Vuc just wants to pad his stats, he doesn't want to win.

Are you trolling? I hope you're trolling.

No, are you? That's my opinion of Vuc. He'll play great tonight against a smaller player, but I think Bamba outplays him again. Bamba's a better shooter and defender.

[pepe1991]

Vuc picked up a foul like 30 seconds in the game then let Embiid just have like 4 layups in a row. Vuc is so selfish to think he's that important to stay out of foul trouble. I hope Bamba doesn't learn these loser traits from Vuc. Vuc just wants to pad his stats, he doesn't want to win.

Are you trolling? I hope you're trolling.

No, are you? That's my opinion of Vuc. He'll play great tonight against a smaller player, but I think Bamba outplays him again. Bamba's a better shooter and defender.

[SOUL]

consensus about Vučević:
He is starting level C in nba that is capable of having great games but overall isn't top tear C .
He is better than Bamba today and will start because of it, but on team like Magic, that will probably face lottery again he is also expendable, thefore there is no need for coach to try rotations with him and Bamba because by most odds, he won't be here in 2019. Only question is will he be gone in April or before.

No need to be blind hater because Vučević is good player, but in same time there is no need to build around him ,because he is not that good. Only players worth build around are superstars.

This is how I feel.

Any reason I'm "hating" on Vuc is because I don't want to see us building around him or playing another year with him as our first option. I know how it goes. He is not a bad player, he has some really good qualities as a person and a player, but I've seen enough. It's why I won't take people's opinions seriously when they say the team is bad but won't admit that moving on from Vuc is the best course of action to actually evaluate and see what we have with people in different roles.

But I'll give us until about midseason and if we extend him or like, suck the entire year but don't trade him.. I will be very grumpy.

[PrimeThyme]

Nik 20 pts 2asts 5rbs 2 blks 52%fg 2-2 ft
Embiid: 21pts 2asts 7rbs 0 blks 61%fg 2-3 ft

I guess Nik annialated Embiid 99% of the time.

But not really right? Through the cloud of bull and hyperbole they seem to have cancelled eachother out rather than anyone annihalating the other.
Also Emiid is a top 5 player in the NBA and not many can stop him. So If youre going to extend that consideration then it needs to apply to everyone not just the players you like.



Sent from my VS501 using RealGM mobile app

First off, that play that was posted happened in the first quarter where Vuc got annihilated in. Embiid went 5/5 on Vuc in that quarter and had his team up 8 points while Vuc went 2/5 acting as a complete turnstile on defense and playing buddy ball with Evan. Only 4 of Embiids points came on Bamba (Bamba actually forced a couple of turnovers while guarding him) and the rest were scored while Vuc was out there.

You can keep posting Vuc's box scores like all of his defenders here like to do but its been pointed out many times how his numbers have no real impact. He is a box score stuffer.

http://www.nba.com/gametracker/#/20181001/ORLPHI/magic/analysis
https://stats.nba.com/game/0011800012/?RangeType=0&StartRange=0&EndRange=28800

1Q
Embiid went 5-9 (55%) and at one point 3-3 on Nik, but at no point went 5-5 as you stated. He went 1-1 on Mo who defended JE for 1:14 and Amir for approximately 3 mins. That's a good quarter but not an annihilation, its pretty much on par for arguably the best center in the NBA being fed the ball while playing in a preseason game.

2Q
JE went 2-2, scoring one shot on Mo and one step back jumper while Nik was on the floor. Nik blocks Fultz at the rim.

3Q
JE went 1 -3 while Nik went 4-5 which should be considered annihilation since apparently 3-3 is. JE also had a TO.

People don't exclusively use box scores to "defend Nik", there have been plenty of times where people have posted all kinds of advanced stats on him in order to make valid points, but I find it funny that you were complaining about me using box scores in this discussion while you were doing the exact same thing.

All said, JE went 9-15 and Nik went 9-17 I'm not arguing efficiency or shot selection but I will say that this doesn't fit the description you're trying to push. On to the next game. I cant wait.

Appreciate it, I was searching for the NBA.com one but couldn't find it and had to use the ESPN one and count their shots out by hand and missed a possession where Embiid took 2 3's back to back and one other: http://www.espn.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=40107724

As I always say though, on paper, it looks good. It wasn't an efficiency argument to begin with but while watching the game I even posted and others did during the game thread that Vuc was getting annihilated during a long stretch in that quarter. Couple what Embiid was doing to him on the other end with some of the bad shot selection I felt he had to start the game and how for the first 6 minutes of the game It was essentially Evan and Vuc buddy ball while we were down and it didn't paint a good picture. It felt like he was getting outplayed very decisively (though he did get better as the game progressed, this whole convo started with the first quarter tho and you turned it into the rest of the game).

I will say a couple things though. Firstly, as I said to start the season, this is not a Vuc vs Bamba thing to start this season for me. Vuc is currently the better player and since he is still on this roster (though I feel he shouldn't be) he will start. Secondly, many of the reasons that I don't like Vuc on this team is due to how this roster is constructed. If there was a playmaker on this team that could find Vuc in his spots and keep everyone involved It would make for a much better offense and make Vuc a more impactful player than he currently is imo. When Evan is the default playmaker though and they get into their two man game it takes everyone else out of the flow of the offense, it doesn't make for an effective one.

I will also say that I feel Vuc thinks he should be the number one option on this team, && with the lack of offensive talent on this roster that we have maybe he is right, but on any real playoff or championship contending team he would be best suited as a 4th option or a sixth man coming off the bench with his particular skill set in today's NBA. I think going to a place like Boston where he could become a 4th option or the 1st option as a 6th man off the bench would do wonders for his career.

Vuc's desire to remain one of the top options and his reluctance to come off the bench is exactly why I would have hoped that Vuc would have been gone by now because on this team yes, he is still one of our best offensive players and yes we are still a bad team so by default he should still be one of our top options and not a 6th man, but for the sake of everyone else's development I don't think that thats what is best for this young team at this place in time. I would rather see AG step into a bigger role on offense.

[PennytoShaq]

To answer your question - if this really was a tanking season ideally Bamba would be starting regardless. It’s a win-win either way. Finding reasons to keep Vuc on the floor isn’t development for Bamba or Isaac. Especially if everyone is sold on this being his last season.

Since Vuc is on the roster I would rather Bamba play back up minutes for Vuc. Having Vuc on the floor doesn’t equate to embracing a “tanking season” regardless of where Bamba plays. If Vucevic is on the floor, the offense is running through him. That was the criticism of the Clifford hire. That and not putting players in the best positions to succeed. But again, who knows if any of this happens. Having Clifford reaffirm this by a direct quote isn’t “nothing”.

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that huge should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Reading comprehension must be hard. I said Vuc is starting because he’s on the roster still. The only positive to Vuc being on the roster still is to ease Bamba into minutes. You brought up tanking purposes and I said Bamba would start if we were truly tanking because he isn’t ready obviously. I didn’t say “Vuc sucks” and never have. I have said Vuc is a crutch to developing a legitimate offense and I stand by that. Bamba is going to be starting Center for Orlando next season barring Vuc being resigned, which would be a mistake.

I have zero issue with understanding what you said. I just think you dont know as much as you think you do.

If Vuc is a crutch to a legitimate offense, what do you think his trade value would be?

[VFX]

Bamba would not be starting regardless. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that he is still undersized and needs to put on weight. Plus he is going to pick up fast fouls like all rookie bigs tend to do. Bamba is clearly going to be better than Vuc, but until he can bang 30 minutes plus a night, he is simply a guy that could incur injury and foul a out a lot if he starts. Then you all will be saying he is made of glass and too skinny and complaining about that.

It’s a circular argument where no matter what happens you just want to make it out like Clifford is always going to do the same thing “because Charlotte”. And again, if you think Bamba playing the 4 now and then doesn’t put him in a situation to succeed, you probably should go post on multiple team boards, since many GMs ask their coaches to play young guys out of position all the time.

And finally, you say Vuc sucks and that huge should be traded. If you as a casual fan think Vuc sucks, what do you think GMs think? And what would benching him accomplish if you want him to be traded? There are a lot of contradictions here.

Reading comprehension must be hard. I said Vuc is starting because he’s on the roster still. The only positive to Vuc being on the roster still is to ease Bamba into minutes. You brought up tanking purposes and I said Bamba would start if we were truly tanking because he isn’t ready obviously. I didn’t say “Vuc sucks” and never have. I have said Vuc is a crutch to developing a legitimate offense and I stand by that. Bamba is going to be starting Center for Orlando next season barring Vuc being resigned, which would be a mistake.

I have zero issue with understanding what you said. I just think you dont know as much as you think you do.

If Vuc is a crutch to a legitimate offense, what do you think his trade value would be?

I could say the same to you, other than the fact that you’ll find a silver lining to anything and trust whatever management decides to do or say detrimental or not.

As far as Vuc’s value goes, it’s entirely dependent on the situation obviously. He could put a good team lacking offense elsewhere over the edge for a deep playoff run, or he could be in a similar situation with Orlando. He’s a good stats - bad team guy that would do significantly less surrounded by actual talent.

Here’s a better question - would Orlando have been drafting higher had Vuc not been on the team for the last 3 years? Has running our offense through him helped us at all?

[MagicStarwipe]

It's so depressing that we still have to keep having these long arguments about Vucevic. Management have really dropped the ball here.

We wont get anything significant in a trade for him. I'd waive him. Addition by subtraction. More minutes for people that look like they actually care about winning. Namely Birch.

[PennytoShaq]

Reading comprehension must be hard. I said Vuc is starting because he’s on the roster still. The only positive to Vuc being on the roster still is to ease Bamba into minutes. You brought up tanking purposes and I said Bamba would start if we were truly tanking because he isn’t ready obviously. I didn’t say “Vuc sucks” and never have. I have said Vuc is a crutch to developing a legitimate offense and I stand by that. Bamba is going to be starting Center for Orlando next season barring Vuc being resigned, which would be a mistake.

I have zero issue with understanding what you said. I just think you dont know as much as you think you do.

If Vuc is a crutch to a legitimate offense, what do you think his trade value would be?

I could say the same to you, other than the fact that you’ll find a silver lining to anything and trust whatever management decides to do or say detrimental or not.

As far as Vuc’s value goes, it’s entirely dependent on the situation obviously. He could put a good team lacking offense elsewhere over the edge for a deep playoff run, or he could be in a similar situation with Orlando. He’s a good stats - bad team guy that would do significantly less surrounded by actual talent.

Here’s a better question - would Orlando have been drafting higher had Vuc not been on the team for the last 3 years? Has running our offense through him helped us at all?

Your cant say the same for me because I dont find silver linings. I use rationale thought based on actual experience of playing basketball and knowing some of these guys who get discussed. I know that many front office moves that seem so simple to you are actually not. And I realize when the team is crappy and awful and I call it out - just not during preseason when its premature.

You are asking me to live in the past and assume that Vuc was traded? For whom? I’m still trying to understand your scenario in which we got rid of him so easily. And what would the return have been? That all affects the answer.

Does runninng the offense through him help? No. I have never been a fan of it but the fact is that he has really been the only guy we can run it through. Clearly that is going to change soon, another reason why all the hand wringing over Vuc seems pointless.