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Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread

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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1561 » by basketballRob » Sat Feb 24, 2024 1:22 pm

Skybox wrote:
basketballRob wrote:We had a 15-game jump in Shaq and Dwight's rookie seasons. We had a 12-game jump in Paolo's rookie season. We'll have to finish the season 19-7 for AB to break the record.

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:noway: Wow…This has got to be a troll, right?
No. I always hear about rookies' impact on winning. We don't have the record we do now without AB. All of the guards were injured again, and AB stepped in, and we went on a 9 game win streak the longest in franchise history. Why should his impact on winning be any different?

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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1562 » by ORLMagicGirl15 » Sat Feb 24, 2024 1:50 pm

basketballRob wrote:
Skybox wrote:
basketballRob wrote:We had a 15-game jump in Shaq and Dwight's rookie seasons. We had a 12-game jump in Paolo's rookie season. We'll have to finish the season 19-7 for AB to break the record.

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:noway: Wow…This has got to be a troll, right?
No. I always hear about rookies' impact on winning. We don't have the record we do now without AB. All of the guards were injured again, and AB stepped in, and we went on a 9 game win streak the longest in franchise history. Why should his impact on winning be any different?

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We tied the win streak with 9. But that win streak was not all on AB. Also, I’m pretty sure it was our #1 picks we said that about. I don’t remember a 9 game winning streak or an increase in winning games when we drafted Oladipo, Gordon, Hezonja, and Payton.
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Go Magic, Go Dwight, Go Vuc, Go Paolo, Go Keegan :)
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1563 » by p0peye » Sat Feb 24, 2024 1:54 pm

basketballRob wrote:
Skybox wrote:
basketballRob wrote:We had a 15-game jump in Shaq and Dwight's rookie seasons. We had a 12-game jump in Paolo's rookie season. We'll have to finish the season 19-7 for AB to break the record.

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:noway: Wow…This has got to be a troll, right?
No. I always hear about rookies' impact on winning. We don't have the record we do now without AB. All of the guards were injured again, and AB stepped in, and we went on a 9 game win streak the longest in franchise history. Why should his impact on winning be any different?

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While in Shaq's and Dwight's cases impact was legit, Paolo was impactful but not as numbers suggest as Franz had a say in there as well.

Those are usually meaningless numbers, we had 17 games jump in Isaac's rookie season and 10 game jump in Elfrid's rookie season.

When you dive deeper into those teams, you will find that Shaq was win share leader in 92-93 season as was Dwight in 2004-05 season. However, in 2022-23 season win share leader was Franz with WCJ following behind him.

In 2014-15 season actual win share leader was Vučević (followed by Tobias Harris) and in 2017-18 season it was (drumroll) DJ Augustin (followed by Vučević).
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1564 » by drsd » Mon Feb 26, 2024 11:12 am

.368
.500
.560
.462

Those are Orlando's 3ball percentages these last four games. And this is not in low volume, as ....

14 makes
12 makes
14 makes
12 makes
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1565 » by Skybox » Mon Feb 26, 2024 12:10 pm

basketballRob wrote:
Skybox wrote:
basketballRob wrote:We had a 15-game jump in Shaq and Dwight's rookie seasons. We had a 12-game jump in Paolo's rookie season. We'll have to finish the season 19-7 for AB to break the record.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app


:noway: Wow…This has got to be a troll, right?
No. I always hear about rookies' impact on winning. We don't have the record we do now without AB. All of the guards were injured again, and AB stepped in, and we went on a 9 game win streak the longest in franchise history. Why should his impact on winning be any different?

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So, Jett too, I guess
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1566 » by Bergmaniac » Mon Feb 26, 2024 1:53 pm

Fultz's efficiency is down to 49.2 TS% (he has 43.2 TS% in February) despite barely taking any shots from outside the paint. His jumpshot isn't getting better. In his last 10 games he has taken a total of 13 shots from outside the paint and made 4. He isn't doing much playmaking either, on the vast majority of possessions he never touches the ball apart from bringing it up court and giving it to Paolo/Franz/Ingles/Cole/etc. And when he has been the ballhandler in the halfcourt sets he hasn't been good most of the time. Defensively he has been pretty mediocre too, certainly much worse than Black. It boggles my mind that he is still getting major minutes when we are chasing a playoff spot. I know our options at PG are pretty limited and Black is quite raw offensively but it still makes no sense to play Fultz now.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1567 » by Fortune Teller » Mon Feb 26, 2024 2:26 pm

Bergmaniac wrote:Fultz's efficiency is down to 49.2 TS% (he has 43.2 TS% in February) despite barely taking any shots from outside the paint. His jumpshot isn't getting better. In his last 10 games he has taken a total of 13 shots from outside the paint and made 4. He isn't doing much playmaking either, on the vast majority of possessions he never touches the ball apart from bringing it up court and giving it to Paolo/Franz/Ingles/Cole/etc. And when he has been the ballhandler in the halfcourt sets he hasn't been good most of the time. Defensively he has been pretty mediocre too, certainly much worse than Black. It boggles my mind that he is still getting major minutes when we are chasing a playoff spot. I know our options at PG are pretty limited and Black is quite raw offensively but it still makes no sense to play Fultz now.

I can't imagine another organization sticking with this PG rotation despite knowing its jaw-dropping limitations. No explanation is good enough. And this whole "AB is the point guard of the future, he's just not ready yet" talk is crazy based on the empirical evidence.

Weltman botched the 2023 draft in a big way. He should've traded one or both lottery picks for a legitimate guard, instead of using #6 on a PG who doesn't even play PG, and #11 on a reach-pick who's not even good enough to make the rotation when several guys are injured.

Welt committed further malpractice when, seeing how little Black and Howard were going to contribute, he did nothing at the trade deadline while multiple guards were moved.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1568 » by basketballRob » Mon Feb 26, 2024 2:30 pm

Oh lord, 200 negative posts about Anthony Black every day.

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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1569 » by Magicman125 » Mon Feb 26, 2024 2:40 pm

Every loss that highlights our weak offensive guard play, I will relive my disappointment we did nothing at the trade deadline to improve our PG rotation.

Sure AB is green, but I've seen enough from him to have him in over Fultz. Would have loved to have AB back up Tyus Jones or if we really swung for the fences, DJM.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1570 » by pepe1991 » Mon Feb 26, 2024 2:43 pm

Fultz reached " unplayable " phase. Payton 2 at this point.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1571 » by Knightro » Mon Feb 26, 2024 4:43 pm

basketballRob wrote:AB may help the Magic have one of the biggest jumps in team record for a rookie. Last season, we lost a bunch of games when all the guards were injured. This season, we went on a 9 game win streak.


Did you know that the Magic's record with Gary Harris plays this season is 22-13?
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1572 » by eyriq » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:00 pm

basketballRob wrote:Oh lord, 200 negative posts about Anthony Black every day.

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Help me understand because I just can't. Outside of the theory that Fultz haters see Fultz in him and Fultz lovers see Fultz's replacement in him, that is.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1573 » by Knightro » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:08 pm

eyriq wrote:Help me understand because I just can't. Outside of the theory that Fultz haters see Fultz in him and Fultz lovers see Fultz's replacement in him, that is.


I like Anthony Black. I really do. I think he *can* be a good NBA player on a good team and ultimately make a lot of money.

But I really do find it comical the mental gymnastics and you and BasketballRob (y'all are the two most guilty) have been doing to suggest Black is A. better than he has actually been and B. has some crazy star upside that he absolutely hasn't shown whatsoever.

It's possible to like a guy and not think things about him that appear to not be anywhere close to reality.

That's all.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1574 » by thelead » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:08 pm

pepe1991 wrote:Fultz reached " unplayable " phase. Payton 2 at this point.

It’s sad. He was decent enough to be a backup last year but he has fallen off a cliff.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1575 » by fendilim » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:12 pm

thelead wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Fultz reached " unplayable " phase. Payton 2 at this point.

It’s sad. He was decent enough to be a backup last year but he has fallen off a cliff.

About time wheels fall off from a broken car.

Same with what “contributed” to causing Princess Diana’s death, a refurbished broken car.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1576 » by Audi » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:15 pm

pepe1991 wrote:Fultz reached " unplayable " phase. Payton 2 at this point.


Eh. Two guys who failed to reach their potential due to two very different reasons.

I'd argue Bamba was Payton 2.0.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1577 » by eyriq » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:15 pm

Knightro wrote:
eyriq wrote:Help me understand because I just can't. Outside of the theory that Fultz haters see Fultz in him and Fultz lovers see Fultz's replacement in him, that is.


I like Anthony Black. I really do. I think he *can* be a good NBA player on a good team and ultimately make a lot of money.

But I really do find it comical the mental gymnastics and you and BasketballRob (y'all are the two most guilty) have been doing to suggest Black is A. better than he has actually been and B. has some crazy star upside that he absolutely hasn't shown whatsoever.

It's possible to like a guy and not think things about him that appear to not be anywhere close to reality.

That's all.
Mental gymnastics like:
1. Pointing out he was the best freshman PG in the NCAA?
2. Pointing out that as the number six pick there is implicitly a decent probability that he'll develop into a star?
3. Pointing out that he's already a top 20% defender and
4. That he already contributes to winning as a starter?

Those kind of gymnastics? I mean honestly if that qualifies as gymnastics then I've barely scratched the surface.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1578 » by Knightro » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:23 pm

eyriq wrote:Mental gymnastics like:
1. Pointing out he was the best freshman PG in the NCAA?
2. Pointing out that as the number six pick there is implicitly a decent probability that he'll develop into a star?
3. Pointing out that he's already a top 20% defender and
4. That he already contributes to winning as a starter?

Those kind of gymnastics? I mean honestly if that qualifies as gymnastics then I've barely scratched the surface.


1. This literally means nothing towards his ability to succeed or fail in the NBA
2. See No. 1
3. This is a good thing that I generally agree with
4. This is more debatable than you think considering Black has a a negative NET rating, negative BPM and a negative EPM - it stands to reason they're winning more in spite of him and not because of his contributions
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1579 » by pepe1991 » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:24 pm

Audi wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Fultz reached " unplayable " phase. Payton 2 at this point.


Eh. Two guys who failed to reach their potential due to two very different reasons.

I'd argue Bamba was Payton 2.0.


Yea, i guess if you look from that perspective.
But i was more refering to main problem of him and Payton. Inability to shoot and zero desire to attemp any jumpshots.
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Re: Official 2023-2024 Magic General Season Thread 

Post#1580 » by thelead » Mon Feb 26, 2024 5:24 pm

AB and our lotto pick (if we lose out in the play-in) for Dejounte? If Dillingham is off the board, I’m in. What about ya’ll?
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