The case for Jonathan Isaac

[fendilim]

Jonathan is a 4?

I thought that was Gordon's spot, after all the experiment last season

Isaac as the next Rashard Lewis has the young kid as a 3-wing for about 7 years and then transitioning to a 4 in the late stages of his NBA career. In the new NBA, he actually might transition from 3 to 5 when he is in his late 20s - early 30s.


..

No way is he Rashard.

Rashard was a really good scorer coming into the league. Isaac is a 3 and D.

[BadMofoPimp]

Jonathan is a 4?

I thought that was Gordon's spot, after all the experiment last season

Isaac as the next Rashard Lewis has the young kid as a 3-wing for about 7 years and then transitioning to a 4 in the late stages of his NBA career. In the new NBA, he actually might transition from 3 to 5 when he is in his late 20s - early 30s.


..

No way is he Rashard.

Rashard was a really good scorer coming into the league. Isaac is a 3 and D.

I can't see Isaac as a 3 because his outside shooting is too poor. In the games I saw, if someone played good defense, he was shooting airballs from 18 feet. His handles are scary bad and his passing IQ is bad as well as evident by his turnovers. I am sure he could become a solid system player, but this team needs scoring and better ball movement. Isaac to me is not that guy.

[Cosmic_Backlash]

Everyone keeps saying he has really poor shooting, but that's not true.

He's a 78% FT shooter, which is one of the best predictors of if they can't shoot at the NBA (means mechanics aren't broken). For example Josh Jackson shot 56% and everyone knows he has a small hitch.

He shot 60% from 2, 35% from 3, and has a 61% TS% because he has high 3P attempt rates AND is great at getting to the line. This tells me he makes really smart decisions with the ball from a shooting perspective and rarely forces shots. Maybe he doesn't have NBA 3P range yet, but nothing suggests it will be a problem. He's suitable from the college 3 and has good mechanics - there is no reason to believe he can't shoot.

As a bonus here is someone's model that uses machine learning to review a players stats and physical traits to see how good they are relative to their position in the draft. In this model Isaac ranks with the highest score. Doesn't mean he'll be the best player, but looks this algorithm says he will likely be a quality draft pick.

http://model284.com/2017-peak-nba-statline-projection-model/
*On a side note this model knocks Josh Jackson for his FT shooting too, but I'd still take him.

[MasterGMer]

You don't come across a guy 6-11 who is smooth with the ball very often.

The last one is Greek Freak.

The only position we draft him is to play him on 3..

Last time I checked, Aaron Gordon is the piece we built at 4


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[Xatticus]

I don't think asthma is a huge deal if he can control it. Harden had it growing up, Rodman had it, a lot of greats in other sports. Anthony Bennett also had it but he would've sucked without it too.

There are different types. Movies and television give a poor representation of it where it is often used to portray weakness. Mine only acted up if I got sick or if I was exposed to smoke. Otherwise, I could run all day without issue. I do wonder if it had something to do with his substitution patterns though. He would literally get subbed in and out 8+ times per game and play in three-minute shifts, though I never saw him use an inhaler.

[Xatticus]

Jonathan is a 4?

I thought that was Gordon's spot, after all the experiment last season

Isaac as the next Rashard Lewis has the young kid as a 3-wing for about 7 years and then transitioning to a 4 in the late stages of his NBA career. In the new NBA, he actually might transition from 3 to 5 when he is in his late 20s - early 30s.


..

No way is he Rashard.

Rashard was a really good scorer coming into the league. Isaac is a 3 and D.

Rashard required development time, though I would agree that they aren't comparable players. Offensively, Rashard is probably Isaac's ceiling, but Isaac has far more potential at the defensive end than Lewis ever had.

[drsd]

..

No way is he Rashard.

Rashard was a really good scorer coming into the league. Isaac is a 3 and D.[/quote]

Lewis scored a huge bulk of points from the 3-ball. Recall he was the league leader in 3-ball attempts with the Magic. Over his career Lewis made an amazing 1787 3-balls (on 4625 attempts = 38.5%).

I would actually argue that Lewis was a 3 and not-D player. He was at the starting end of a trend that has now been perfected.

,,

[drsd]

Rashard required development time, though I would agree that they aren't comparable players. Offensively, Rashard is probably Isaac's ceiling, but Isaac has far more potential at the defensive end than Lewis ever had.

Good points.

Let's recall that Lewis was a two-time Allstar (once with Orlando). If Isaac has a 20 ppg game like Lewis AND plays defense, well .... WOW !!!!


..

[Def Swami]

I don't think asthma is a huge deal if he can control it. Harden had it growing up, Rodman had it, a lot of greats in other sports. Anthony Bennett also had it but he would've sucked without it too.

There are different types. Movies and television give a poor representation of it where it is often used to portray weakness. Mine only acted up if I got sick or if I was exposed to smoke. Otherwise, I could run all day without issue. I do wonder if it had something to do with his substitution patterns though. He would literally get subbed in and out 8+ times per game and play in three-minute shifts, though I never saw him use an inhaler.

This was a problem for Javale McGee throughout his career and his inability to play long spurts. But you're right. If Isaac's asthma is exercise-induced, that may be an issue, but by no means a certain detriment. So many athletes control their exercise-induced asthma by taking a puff of their inhaler before exercise and face no problems.

[pepe1991]

I don't think asthma is a huge deal if he can control it. Harden had it growing up, Rodman had it, a lot of greats in other sports. Anthony Bennett also had it but he would've sucked without it too.

There are different types. Movies and television give a poor representation of it where it is often used to portray weakness. Mine only acted up if I got sick or if I was exposed to smoke. Otherwise, I could run all day without issue. I do wonder if it had something to do with his substitution patterns though. He would literally get subbed in and out 8+ times per game and play in three-minute shifts, though I never saw him use an inhaler.

"However recently I came across Isaac's Asthma problem in the draftexpress weakness video.
Has Asthma, easily winded.
It was mentioned in his 2015 DX scouting report
-Asthmatic, which affects his conditioning significantly at times. Looked very winded with the extreme altitude in Colorado Springs
I have also found it affecting his game performance against Syracuse.
This was evidenced on Saturday not only by the 20-4 run Syracuse ended the first half on after Isaac left the game with asthma complications.
Thinking that given your history of trading for Anthony Bennett and Adreian Payne, perhaps you will be more hesitant about drafting Isaac?"

from reddit - i really don't know much about asthma, i have little 7 years old cousin who gets winded faster than other kids and i know that Javale McGee had problems playing in Denver ( lot of problems) due his condition.

[drsd]

"However recently I came across Isaac's Asthma problem in the draftexpress weakness video.
Has Asthma, easily winded.

James Harden has asthma.



..

[MagicFan101]

Isaac absolutely has a smoothness to his game on both ends of the floor to have me excited about him. I would say he needs development for sure, but that smoothness and comfortability to his game has me reluctant to use the word "raw" when describing him.

Like others in this class, I'm not predicting super star status for him but I won't be the least bit disappointed if we draft him at 6.

[Xatticus]

I don't think asthma is a huge deal if he can control it. Harden had it growing up, Rodman had it, a lot of greats in other sports. Anthony Bennett also had it but he would've sucked without it too.

There are different types. Movies and television give a poor representation of it where it is often used to portray weakness. Mine only acted up if I got sick or if I was exposed to smoke. Otherwise, I could run all day without issue. I do wonder if it had something to do with his substitution patterns though. He would literally get subbed in and out 8+ times per game and play in three-minute shifts, though I never saw him use an inhaler.

"However recently I came across Isaac's Asthma problem in the draftexpress weakness video.
Has Asthma, easily winded.
It was mentioned in his 2015 DX scouting report
-Asthmatic, which affects his conditioning significantly at times. Looked very winded with the extreme altitude in Colorado Springs
I have also found it affecting his game performance against Syracuse.
This was evidenced on Saturday not only by the 20-4 run Syracuse ended the first half on after Isaac left the game with asthma complications.
Thinking that given your history of trading for Anthony Bennett and Adreian Payne, perhaps you will be more hesitant about drafting Isaac?"

from reddit - i really don't know much about asthma, i have little 7 years old cousin who gets winded faster than other kids and i know that Javale McGee had problems playing in Denver ( lot of problems) due his condition.

Yeah. It could be an issue. We just have to trust the Magic's medical team, as I'm sure the teams considering drafting him will have access to that information.

[Ferulci]

What would be the plan if Isaac is drafted ? Play him as a 3,4, 5 ? Move from Gordon ? Do you expect him to be the missing blue chip ?

[Nemesis21]

What would be the plan if Isaac is drafted ? Play him as a 3,4, 5 ? Move from Gordon ? Do you expect him to be the missing blue chip ?

Play him at SF on offense, at PF defense. No do not move on from AG. AG at 4 on offense, AG at SF on defense. Isaac could also play some 4 & 5 with small ball lineups.

[fendilim]

..

No way is he Rashard.

Rashard was a really good scorer coming into the league. Isaac is a 3 and D.

Lewis scored a huge bulk of points from the 3-ball. Recall he was the league leader in 3-ball attempts with the Magic. Over his career Lewis made an amazing 1787 3-balls (on 4625 attempts = 38.5%).

I would actually argue that Lewis was a 3 and not-D player. He was at the starting end of a trend that has now been perfected.

,,[/quote]
In Orlando he was, but in Seattle he wasnt limited to a 3 and D.

Anyway, I wouldnt draft a 3 and D player at 6th. That is just terrible.

[tiderulz]

Lewis scored a huge bulk of points from the 3-ball. Recall he was the league leader in 3-ball attempts with the Magic. Over his career Lewis made an amazing 1787 3-balls (on 4625 attempts = 38.5%).

I would actually argue that Lewis was a 3 and not-D player. He was at the starting end of a trend that has now been perfected.

,,

Lewis was a much better defender than most people think or realize.

[Cosmic_Backlash]

Anyway, I wouldnt draft a 3 and D player at 6th. That is just terrible.

How do you feel about Klay Thompson, Kawhi Leonard his first 4 years, Otto Porter, etc? Would you rather take a risk on a high flyer with superstar potential... like a.. Mario Hezonja type?

The teams that stay in the dumpsters are the ones that make multiple bad draft picks consecutively. There is nothing wrong with grabbing a really good 3 & D player at 6. Expecting to land a superstar play maker at 6 is often a pipe dream. DSJ is the only player that might be there with that kind of potential, every single other player in the draft will be gone or isn't the type of player you will want. You can't really be disgusted with a drafting a really high potential 3 & D player. They are a near necessity in todays game and getting a good makes your team much better.

[tiderulz]

Anyway, I wouldnt draft a 3 and D player at 6th. That is just terrible.

How do you feel about Klay Thompson, Kawhi Leonard his first 4 years, Otto Porter, etc? Would you rather take a risk on a high flyer with superstar potential... like a.. Mario Hezonja type?

The teams that stay in the dumpsters are the ones that make multiple bad draft picks consecutively. There is nothing wrong with grabbing a really good 3 & D player at 6. Expecting to land a superstar play maker at 6 is often a pipe dream. DSJ is the only player that might be there with that kind of potential, every single other player in the draft will be gone or isn't the type of player you will want. You can't really be disgusted with a drafting a really high potential 3 & D player. They are a near necessity in todays game and getting a good makes your team much better.

i agree with you. But Klay isnt a good example, he was putting up 20 ppg in college, he was a scorer, not a 3 & D player

[pepe1991]

Anyway, I wouldnt draft a 3 and D player at 6th. That is just terrible.

How do you feel about Klay Thompson, Kawhi Leonard his first 4 years, Otto Porter, etc? Would you rather take a risk on a high flyer with superstar potential... like a.. Mario Hezonja type?

The teams that stay in the dumpsters are the ones that make multiple bad draft picks consecutively. There is nothing wrong with grabbing a really good 3 & D player at 6. Expecting to land a superstar play maker at 6 is often a pipe dream. DSJ is the only player that might be there with that kind of potential, every single other player in the draft will be gone or isn't the type of player you will want. You can't really be disgusted with a drafting a really high potential 3 & D player. They are a near necessity in todays game and getting a good makes your team much better.

you picked some bad examples.

Klay averaged 17 ppg in second season , hell he was lights out in rookie year as well.
Leonard won finals MVP in third year i belive ?

3 and D player is somebody like KCP ( picked 8# in draft ) and Porter . Again, good players but having Porter on team without Wall and Beal would look like having Evan Fournier on Magic (probably even worst).
With Isaac and his anemic 34,8% on 1 made three per game you are not even sure you are getting good outside shooter ( also looking at some college footage it's clear that he doesn't have nba range yet, guy was shooting 19 feet airballs )