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Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#161 » by pepe1991 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:47 pm

rcklsscognition wrote:
Read on Twitter
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LOL
Over 3 games Vučević is averaging 17-10-7 on 121 off rating and +5,8 real plus minus on offense (also positive on defense ).

At this point if team wants to win games, and i guess that's the plan, him should be vocal point of offense and used as Jokić, also if that's the case (and should be ) DJ should be moved to bench for Ross (or Simmons ).

Grand and Briscoe are DNP players at this point and it's no suprise that Grant has right now offensive rating of 72. It's pointless to point out that anything below 90 miserable.

sry for double post :-?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#162 » by PennytoShaq » Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:55 pm

I would give briscoe more time than condemning him after one half of play in his first serious NBA game, but that's just me.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#163 » by drsd » Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:05 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
rcklsscognition wrote:
Read on Twitter
/photo/1


LOL
Over 3 games Vučević is averaging 17-10-7 on 121 off rating and +5,8 real plus minus on offense (also positive on defense ).

At this point if team wants to win games, and i guess that's the plan, him should be vocal point of offense and used as Jokić, also if that's the case (and should be ) DJ should be moved to bench for Ross (or Simmons ).

Grand and Briscoe are DNP players at this point and it's no suprise that Grant has right now offensive rating of 72. It's pointless to point out that anything below 90 miserable.

sry for double post :-?



I get sick of the anti-Vučević rants.

Here is metric proof that he is still both the best offensive and defensive Magician.


..
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#164 » by pepe1991 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:28 pm

PennytoShaq wrote:I would give briscoe more time than condemning him after one half of play in his first serious NBA game, but that's just me.


My mindset is that Grant outplayed him in camp and does that on training and that's why he is above Briscoe in rotation. Using that logic, i assume he is terrible if Grant can outplay him.
Sure ,over season we will have chance to see him more.

What's up with Frazier? Not sure it's possible to be worst than Iwundu at this point.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#165 » by PennytoShaq » Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:59 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
PennytoShaq wrote:I would give briscoe more time than condemning him after one half of play in his first serious NBA game, but that's just me.


My mindset is that Grant outplayed him in camp and does that on training and that's why he is above Briscoe in rotation. Using that logic, i assume he is terrible if Grant can outplay him.
Sure ,over season we will have chance to see him more.

What's up with Frazier? Not sure it's possible to be worst than Iwundu at this point.


Its very rare that first year deep reserves "beat out" vets in camp regardless of the level of play. There are exceptions but it makes no sense to trade for Grant and then bench him for an undrafted free agent when the season starts.

Frazier is better than iwundu in my opinion. But he's still a rookie and iwundu has experience.

These guys slide into the rotation over time. Birch did not play immediately yet he was our most effective 5 on d last year if you are a fan of the per 100 stat.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#166 » by NavalAviator94 » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:04 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
rcklsscognition wrote:
Read on Twitter
/photo/1


LOL
Over 3 games Vučević is averaging 17-10-7 on 121 off rating and +5,8 real plus minus on offense (also positive on defense )


And you me and handful of others are the crazy ones. Smdh
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#167 » by SOUL » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:07 pm

I mean, posting that after his literal best game in probably the last 2 years in a 3 game sample size means absolutely nothing. There's a reason it wasn't posted after 2 games lol.

Oh wait, there was one.

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Briscoe is our best player!!!
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#168 » by FFBlitzace » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:18 pm

That graph has been the Vuc holy grail for awhile now. I just don't know how you can watch the games and think Vuc is our best defensive player. He does some specific things well, but those things are dwarfed by the sheer number of times teams put him in situations that he can't defend. Like basic pick and roll. Every possession.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#169 » by stalucci » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:29 pm

Vuc was -47 through the first 2 games of the season. Got absolutely abused in the pick and roll against Charlotte despite having 4 blocks he was a liability.

Posting this graph after what was probably his best game ever doesn't prove much.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#170 » by rcklsscognition » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:35 pm

Yeah I know Vuc finished last year and/or the year before that pretty much exactly where he was in the latest graph. He's usually one of the only guys on the team that is in the positive on offense and defense. It is interesting though because if you go to the NBA Math website, there is a lot more information. They break down each team and player by their stats, and split them up into different tiers. There are not just a couple, there are 12 I think. Vuc and AG are in our top tier, tier 6 of 12, rated as "solid starters" I think. Fournier is in the tier below, tier 5 "low-end starter". Simmons, Isaac, and Hezonja came in at tier 4, High-End Backups, and DJ, Bismack, Ross, Mack, and Speights came in at tier 3, "depth pieces". I'm not sure where Gordon came in high from, it is a projection, because he never scored a TPA that high in his career, in fact, he's only had a positive TPA rating in his 2nd season.

Here's the link to the 2017-2018 season breakdown after it was over. https://nbamath.com/crystalbasketball-ranking-the-orlando-magic-after-2017-18/

If you want to read about the TPA model and what it is made up of: https://nbamath.com/tpa-model/
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#171 » by rcklsscognition » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:43 pm

SOUL wrote:I mean, posting that after his literal best game in probably the last 2 years in a 3 game sample size means absolutely nothing. There's a reason it wasn't posted after 2 games lol.

Oh wait, there was one.

Read on Twitter


Briscoe is our best player!!!


You have something to say to me Soul?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#172 » by SOUL » Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:55 pm

rcklsscognition wrote:
SOUL wrote:I mean, posting that after his literal best game in probably the last 2 years in a 3 game sample size means absolutely nothing. There's a reason it wasn't posted after 2 games lol.

Oh wait, there was one.

Read on Twitter


Briscoe is our best player!!!


You have something to say to me Soul?


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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#173 » by NavalAviator94 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:13 am

Vuc is hands down our best player and capable of more. Deal with it. boom


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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#174 » by MagicFan4Lyfe » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:15 am

The debate about Vuc is kinda pointless. He won’t be after this season. It will be BAMBA time soon!!!
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#175 » by NavalAviator94 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:17 am

BAMBAEXPRESS wrote:The debate about Vuc is kinda pointless. He won’t be after this season. It will be BAMBA time soon!!!


Bamba will never be the passer Vuc is. Vuc is on the path to Jokic! Trade Bamba for a PG. green font from my iPad.


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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#176 » by Nemesis21 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:47 am

Read on Twitter
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#177 » by MagicStarwipe » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:06 am

Read on Twitter


But Payton "sucks". I guess these graphs are only relevant when they're used to pump up Vucevic.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#178 » by Blue_and_Whte » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:08 am

Lol people actually mad that vooch is good. As predicted. They actually want him to fail.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#179 » by KillMonger » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:15 am

Payton is still being discussed around here...... Um.... Redundant?

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XIX: Rise of the BIG 

Post#180 » by MagicStarwipe » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:26 am

Yes, mostly by people that don't like him. I'm not even big on these graphs, just pointing out double standards on these boards. Can't have it both ways.
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