Official 2020 NBA Draft Thread

[MasterGMer]

No, we will not trade Bamba. The dude only had 2 seasons in the league and everyone knew he was going to be a project. Project takes time. We will not trade him, period

[Xatticus]

It appears I'm just higher on Haliburton than a lot of you.

I really believe in him as a big point guard prospect. He's not a dynamic shot maker and probably won't become one, but he's a dynamic shot creator and I think there's a lot of value in guys who willingly pass and create easy opportunities for others. I just don't see how he doesn't become a good NBA point guard.

And if I'm wrong about his ability to be an on-ball lead guard, which I certainly could be, it seems like he has enough shooting (and obviously enough passing) to be a high-end secondary playmaker at worst. He just doesn't seem like a guy who takes anything off the table.

I look at what Lonzo did this past year for New Orleans once he overhauled his jump shot and that's what I see as Haliburton's floor. A positive contributor on both sides of the floor playing some 1 and playing some 2.

Yeah. I don't mean to sound down on him. I like him. My concern is that it's tough to create offense out of the pick and roll if you aren't a threat to shoot off the dribble or a threat to get to the rim. I'm not sure he does either of those things well. His release is quick, but his feet are so close together. I'm not sure he'll be able to shoot coming around screens. If he has shown progress in shooting off the dribble in workouts, then that changes things, but he didn't do much of that in college. I don't think he is a guy that is ever going to put a lot of pressure on the rim. He uses the pick and roll to drag guys away from the paint to create passing lanes. I'd like him a lot more if he could manipulate help defenders because we know he can make the reads.

I think Lonzo Ball is a pretty good comp and that's a nice player to have. Do I want to attach value to Kira Lewis/Tyrese Maxey to get him? I'm not so sure. I'd greatly prefer him to Hampton though. If we come out of the draft with Haliburton, I'll be fine with that. My big want from this draft is someone that can run the pick and roll or otherwise create offense for others. Haliburton fits the bill well enough that I'd be pleased. I'm just really tired of watching Fournier and Augustin run the pick and roll with Vucevic and Fultz hasn't shown nearly enough in the half court that I'm confident in him filling that need.

[VFX]

Weighing it up, when you consider that the #15 pick could be any one of:

Nesmith, Lewis, Maxey, Pokusevski, Green, Anthony, McDaniels, Ramsey and possibly a slide from someone like Vassel or Terry.

and the #6 pick could be any of those guys, plus possibly Haliburton, Hayes, Avdija, Toppin.

would you rather:

a) #6 (pick your favourite)

b) Bamba + Aminu + #15 (pick your fav from that range)


I like the idea of getting Aminu off the books, but not at the price of dumping Bamba. And I'm still confident there will be a player available at #15 who will actually end up as one of the top 6 players from the draft. Who that is, time will tell.

But, if WeHam are confident they've found a star, but in a draft this unpredictable they're not sure where exactly he'll go. So they pay the price of Bamba to move up and secure that player. If it actually is a star, I take that deal everyday of the week. Now, do I trust WeHam to make that right decision? Not particularly. But I'd be happy for them to take the shot.

If that player is specifically Haliburton... I'd pay the price. Cut Bamba free, let him get a fresh start. I like Haliburton, and if WeHam are that gung-ho on him then I'd be interested to see how it plays out.

It might be a decent gamble to take if they really don’t plan on trading AG at all. I guess it really just depends on how they feel about Bamba and his future with the team.

Haliburton, Hayes, and Avdija are all players that I believe have much higher ceilings than the tier below. I’m a little lower on Haliburton than the others, but I can see the appeal. Deni seems like Turk-lite while Hayes could become a primary scoring option. Maybe I’m just not seeing the Fultz/Haliburton fit even though i know it shouldn’t really matter.

[The Effect]

I like haliburton.....if he was available at 15 (he wont be obviously). Hes not a player id trade up for

[UnFadeable21]

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If the Magic don’t take Tyrese Maxey at 15, they truly need to be fired and a new regime to take over

[Ducklett]

If Maxey falls to us somehow (totally doubtful at this point) and we don't take him someone should be fired. I said this when we didnt trade up or down for MPJ, for the record, and we saw how that turned out.

[basketballRob]

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If the Magic don’t take Tyrese Maxey at 15, they truly need to be fired and a new regime to take over

Says Maxey is a bucket. He reminds me of Jamal Murray.

If Maxey doesn't fall, I like Saddiq Bey. He seems like the perfect SF with an NBA ready body.

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[UnFadeable21]

If Maxey falls to us somehow (totally doubtful at this point) and we don't take him someone should be fired. I said this when we didnt trade up or down for MPJ, for the record, and we saw how that turned out.

That’s the Magic’s number 1 need.

Dynamic combo scoring guard

[drsd]

Answer: no. It is a 80¢ to the dollar trade, and the Magic is not looking to tank by trading away Bamba.

Considering Bamba played 14 MPG this past year and the player they'd be acquiring for him (Haliburton) would presumably play at least 20 if not 25-28 minutes a night, I'm not really sure where you're going with this.

It would be a win-now move.

Now if you want to argue they're not good enough to make win-now moves, then that's a different conversation. But I don't see many scenarios where Haliburton isn't a bigger contributor to the Magic's success than Bamba is over the next two years.

Haliburton at best would be a 15-20 mpg backup PG for Orlando. More realistically he would be a 3rd stringer next season. I cannot see the Magic trading a Bamba that (finally) is physically developed to assess his game for a deep-bench prospect.


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[drsd]

would you rather:

a) #6 (pick your favourite)

b) Bamba + Aminu + #15 (pick your fav from that range)

I would much rather have option B. For one, the players in the 5-15 range all kind of project similarly (upside as a marginal starter and a high floor).

But you make these things as an either or. The Magic for example could probably package Aminu, #15 and a future FRP to the Knicks for Smith and #8. Would I rather the Magic swallow Smith to unload Aminu and move up in the draft WHILST KEEPING Bamba? Yes.


My question to you: do you see a large difference between #6 and #8 this year? Given that players like Onyeka Okongwu and Isaac Okoro are in this range (and no way is the Magic moving up in the draft to select either), then #8 might make more sense than #6 anyhow.

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[drsd]

No, we will not trade Bamba. The dude only had 2 seasons in the league and everyone knew he was going to be a project. Project takes time. We will not trade him, period

There are scenarios were Bamba gets traded. But I totally agree that the Magic is not shopping him and that a trade would have to return $1.20 to the dollar for he to be included. That basically means a trade of Gordon-or-Fournier and Bamba for an all-star wing.
(( and why would any team want that trade at their end ??? ))

I cannot see any other trade Orlando would contemplate including Bamba in.


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[Knightro]

Haliburton at best would be a 15-20 mpg backup PG for Orlando. More realistically he would be a 3rd stringer next season. I cannot see the Magic trading a Bamba that (finally) is physically developed to assess his game for a deep-bench prospect.

Just so I have this right...

Hailburton would be a deep-bench prospect and a third stringer, but Bamba - who was less experienced and way more raw - stepped right into Clifford's rotation as a rookie despite clearly not being ready for minutes?

If the Magic were going to make a move into the top 6 for a player like Haliburton (or Hayes, or anyone other guard at that level), it's a near-guarantee that player will be Orlando's primary backup PG or primary backup SG next year.

[drsd]

Haliburton at best would be a 15-20 mpg backup PG for Orlando. More realistically he would be a 3rd stringer next season. I cannot see the Magic trading a Bamba that (finally) is physically developed to assess his game for a deep-bench prospect.

Just so I have this right...

Hailburton would be a deep-bench prospect and a third stringer, but Bamba - who was less experienced and way more raw - stepped right into Clifford's rotation as a rookie despite clearly not being ready for minutes?

If the Magic were going to make a move into the top 6 for a player like Haliburton (or Hayes, or anyone other guard at that level), it's a near-guarantee that player will be Orlando's primary backup PG or primary backup SG next year.

Given the Magic's assets, if Augustin and/or Carter-Williams is resigned, then yes Hailburton could easily be a deep bench player.

That Orlando has poor depth at the PF slot means that Bamba will get huge minutes at backup Center next year.

These two events (PG depth and C depth) are totally unrelated. And no I am not happy to swallow the reality of all of this.

EDIT: in conclusion, trading for Hailburton, the Magic would NEED to nether resign Augustin nor Carter-Williams.

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[Knightro]

Given the Magic's assets, if Augustin and/or Carter-Williams is resigned, then yes Hailburton could easily be a deep bench player.

That Orlando has poor depth at the PF slot means that Bamba will get huge minutes at backup Center next year.

These two events (PG depth and C depth) are totally unrelated. And no I am not happy to swallow the reality of all of this.

EDIT: in conclusion, trading for Hailburton, the Magic would NEED to nether resign Augustin nor Carter-Williams.

The draft comes before free agency so the Magic would have significant control over how much or how little a rookie guard would play next year. If they wanted Haliburton or Hayes to be their primary backup PG or SG, they would be able to easily make that happen by simply not offering Augustin or Carter-Williams new contracts.

If the Magic choose to create a logjam at their point guard spot, that's on them. They've already shown they're willing to do this at other positions (resigning Vucevic after drafting Bamba, signing Aminu after drafting Okeke specifically), but that doesn't make it the right decision.

Also... considering Bamba and Vucevic absolutely CANNOT be on the floor at the same time, I'm failing to see how the poor depth at the PF slot is going to lead to "huge" minutes for Bamba at backup C.

Under Clifford, Vucevic has played about 32 MPG over the last two seasons. Considering Vucevic is the team's best player, that only leaves 16 MPG for Bamba at best.

And also as it stands right now you have Gordon, Aminu, Okeke and Clark under contract and all natural PF, so they go four-deep at the 4 spot. I'd argue it's the deepest position on the team.

[Knightro]

Just to be clear, I don't *want* the Magic to trade Mo Bamba. In fact, I wish he was the team's starting center right this very second, but the front office has tied their own hands in this case.

Weltman and Hammond are the ones who forced themselves down this path when they opted to resign Vucevic to a 4/100M contract one year after selecting a center in the top half of the draft lottery.

And since the Magic have opted to field the most competitive team they can, the odds of them unloading Vucevic and allowing Bamba to become the starting center - and subsequently accepting the growing pains and on-court step backwards that would obviously come with that - seem incredibly unlikely.

The Magic's front office has created a scenario where their No. 6 overall pick is limited to being a 15 MPG backup his entire cost-controlled rookie contract. It is a case of tremendously poor roster management.

The other piece of this is the fact that backup centers, especially ones who are only playing 15 MPG behind a quality starter, are extremely fungible. Khem Birch is perfectly capable of filling that 15 MPG backup role behind Vucevic at a highly competent level.

If the Magic can use Bamba to improve their long-term outlook at guard, I think it's worth exploring. And not because I want that to be the case, but because that's the situation the front office has put this team in.

[Def Swami]

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[Def Swami]

I'd be in favor of this deal.

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[sChOlaRlY_Magi]

I'd be in favor of this deal.

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+100

[Knightro]

I'd be in favor of this deal.

Let's play the hypothetical game...

The Magic trade Vucevic (and probably 15 if we're being realistic) for Wiggins and 2.

Who do you select at 2?

This is going to be unpopular, but if Edwards went 1st, I would probably take LaMelo Ball and immediately shop Fultz.

[cedric76]

I'd be in favor of this deal.

Let's play the hypothetical game...

The Magic trade Vucevic (and probably 15 if we're being realistic) for Wiggins and 2.

Who do you select at 2?

This is going to be unpopular, but if Edwards went 1st, I would probably take LaMelo Ball and immediately shop Fultz.

You only do that deal if the player you want is available at 2