The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

[Knightro]

Suggs and F-Wagner. But if your point is about guards, I agree that Anthony, Fultz, Harris, and Ross need to be afterthoughts come draft time. But as Suggs is part of the calculation, this really questions Ivey on this roster. Orlando needs a pure SG next to Suggs, if Fultz is not / cannot start next to him. In this Bennedict Mathurin and Johnny Davis are more reasonable Magicians than Jaden Ivey.

I want Fultz to succeed, but with Suggs, I really do not understand what role he can have on this roster even if he is 100% and gives everything he can. So then what?

I have a few questions in response to this...

1. What do you think Jalen Suggs' ideal role is moving forward? Is it A. ball in his hands every possession and initiate every set point guard? Is it B. grab and go in transition, secondary ball handler and secondary playmaker, on the ball when the point guard is off the floor "1.5" type of combo guard? Is it C. completely off the ball shooting guard?

I like Suggs a lot, but it hasn't been established yet what his ideal role should or will be.

2. What makes Ivey a lesser shooting guard prospect than Davis or Mathurin? Even with his recent shooting slide, he's been far more efficient as a shooter/scorer than Davis and on the same level as Mathurin.

If you think Suggs long-term is option A, then I could understand wanting a more pure off-ball type shooting guard. But Suggs, to date, hasn't shown he's that guy yet.

I still love him as a piece moving forward in *some* capacity, but Suggs just being here is not keeping me from taking another guard if that guard is BPA. I just think Ivey is somewhat clearly better than Davis and Mathurin.

[PrimeThyme]

It's pretty damn close to Jabari/Chet or bust for me. If we fall out of the top 2 I'd probably look to move back and take on additional draft compensation. Ivey would make me hesitate at 3, but I'm still not sold enough on the 4-9 range prospects in this draft.

I see it like this:

Tier 1: Chet/Jabari

Large Gap

Tier 2: Ivey

Small Gap

Banchero/Griffin

Drop off

Tier 3: Mathurin/Davis/TyTy/Murray/Sharpe/Duren/Eason/Daniels/Brown

That third tier of prospects really blends in for me. I'm not sold enough on Banchero/Griffin either. You could just as easily talk me into a Davis/Mathurin. Even Murray who I've been lower on than the consensus. Jabari/Chet are the only homeruns.

[Knightro]

It's pretty damn close to Jabari/Chet or bust for me.

Plenty of time to figure this out, but I'm curious your thoughts.

Let's say every single player on the Magic roster is healthy and available for next season.

What is your rotation for next year if you draft Jabari?

What is your rotation for next year if you draft Chet?

[drsd]

... that tireless "better in the pros" Center ...

This is where Orlando's SRP can be handy. Kentucky's Oscar Tshiebwe is a rebounding factory. His game will translate to the NBA.

..

[PrimeThyme]

What is your rotation for next year if you draft Jabari?

Fultz/Anthony
Suggs/Harris/Hampton
Wagner/Chuma
Chet(or Jabari)/Isaac/Chuma
WCJ/Mo Wagner

Personally, I'd start either Jabari/Chet at the 4. Isaac, despite his contract, is a somewhat nonfactor for me at this point. I'm not sure how to view him as anything but, && I certainly can't prioritize his development over either of those guys. I think, if healthy, he could still play a vital role for this team but with his injury history I wouldn't start him if either of those two fall into our laps.

Isaac will have a lot to prove, most notably with showing that he can sustain a healthy stretch of games after this rehab and look 95-100% of his former self.

[Skybox]

What is your "hope"?


..

My HOPE is an ace scoring SG with size and range...maybe a trade-down to get that tireless "better in the pros" Center AND find a scoring Wing elsewhere?

You have a plan in mind?

Absolutely not...at least none that doesn't involve a tremendous stroke of good luck (like Jaylen Brown demanding to play with Franz)
...how about we trade our Top 3 pick to SAS for Vassell and their 6-10 pick? A lot depends on the lottery of course, but something like that...POR will likely have two lotto picks-maybe Simons and one of theirs to move up and draft a big? Not sure I love Simons that much but that's the line of thinking. I like Josh Hart potentially in that kind of deal too-but he's just solid, not a star upside.

I'm not in love with Chet and I really don't like Banchero. If I could be convinced Ivey is going to grow a couple inches and his shooting was for real-he'd be my easy #1. Sharpe is unknown. The rest are a mass of meh to me. Good players but no clear stars (I'm sure they're in there, but haven't revealed themselves yet)

IF we score big in the lottery and someone MUST have Chet or Jabari, I'd definitely see what we could get to move down into the guards...or take one of their guards and their pick.

[RookieStar]

... that tireless "better in the pros" Center ...

This is where Orlando's SRP can be handy. Kentucky's Oscar Tshiebwe is a rebounding factory. His game will translate to the NBA.

..

Ummm what? Have you watched his game?

He has no offense except probably his offensive rebounds. He isn't that athletic so he can't jump out of the gym, he isn't that tall because he is 6'9 in shoes. Sure he is heavy and can throw his body around and tough for college kids to move him when he has position. He is too slow laterally so you can be sure he will be targeted during switches.

When he faces NBA bigs like our very own WCJ, can he move him for the rebound? When he faces like Mitch / Javale/ CLint, he would just get out-jumped and "out-lengthed "

I mean don't get me wrong, if he proves me wrong and his game will be effective in the league I'll be more than happy. I am one of those that believes in hard work beats skilled and lazy all the time after all.

[VFX]

Suggs and F-Wagner. But if your point is about guards, I agree that Anthony, Fultz, Harris, and Ross need to be afterthoughts come draft time. But as Suggs is part of the calculation, this really questions Ivey on this roster. Orlando needs a pure SG next to Suggs, if Fultz is not / cannot start next to him. In this Bennedict Mathurin and Johnny Davis are more reasonable Magicians than Jaden Ivey.

I want Fultz to succeed, but with Suggs, I really do not understand what role he can have on this roster even if he is 100% and gives everything he can. So then what?

I have a few questions in response to this...

1. What do you think Jalen Suggs' ideal role is moving forward? Is it A. ball in his hands every possession and initiate every set point guard? Is it B. grab and go in transition, secondary ball handler and secondary playmaker, on the ball when the point guard is off the floor "1.5" type of combo guard? Is it C. completely off the ball shooting guard?

I like Suggs a lot, but it hasn't been established yet what his ideal role should or will be.

2. What makes Ivey a lesser shooting guard prospect than Davis or Mathurin? Even with his recent shooting slide, he's been far more efficient as a shooter/scorer than Davis and on the same level as Mathurin.

If you think Suggs long-term is option A, then I could understand wanting a more pure off-ball type shooting guard. But Suggs, to date, hasn't shown he's that guy yet.

I still love him as a piece moving forward in *some* capacity, but Suggs just being here is not keeping me from taking another guard if that guard is BPA. I just think Ivey is somewhat clearly better than Davis and Mathurin.

Going to jump in here.

Ivey or Sharpe makes sense IF Orlando can capitalize on moving Fultz. If not, then they should just take any of the bigs left on the table (I'd probably include Murray in that group at this point).

Suggs/Cole
Ivey (or Sharpe)/RJ

This rotation makes more sense on paper. They need Suggs to have the ball in his hands if the decision is between him and Fultz. Orlando loses a lot more on the defensive end, then they gain on the offensive, with Fultz on the floor instead of Suggs. I cant see the combo of Fultz/Suggs on the floor together, with the already limited outside shooting elsewhere, as a smart idea. People should also forgo the idea that they are going to move Cole. There is like a 5% chance that happens even after he's extended.

If we are being entirely realistic Orlando is likely going to end up with something like:

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/RJ
Wagner / Okeke
(Jabari/Chet/Murray/Paolo)/Isaac
WCJr/ Bamba

Is this a balanced lineup? Not at all. So it will likely happen. Orlando hasn't been a franchise that shuffles through rookie contract and non-vet players to make the minutes make sense. Therefore, the draft decision matters more than "who cares draft talent", they'll even say as much when they talk about putting players in positions to succeed. Case in point - RJ Hampton. The guy is a complete afterthought now because he'll never see the floor.

This draft for Orlando is predicated on two factors.

1) Where they end up picking (obviously)
2) How they view Jonathan Isaac moving forward.

Do they view him as the obvious starter? No way in hell Wagner comes off the bench and Isaac was previously viewed as the best talent on the roster.

[Skin]

Suggs and F-Wagner. But if your point is about guards, I agree that Anthony, Fultz, Harris, and Ross need to be afterthoughts come draft time. But as Suggs is part of the calculation, this really questions Ivey on this roster. Orlando needs a pure SG next to Suggs, if Fultz is not / cannot start next to him. In this Bennedict Mathurin and Johnny Davis are more reasonable Magicians than Jaden Ivey.

I want Fultz to succeed, but with Suggs, I really do not understand what role he can have on this roster even if he is 100% and gives everything he can. So then what?

I have a few questions in response to this...

1. What do you think Jalen Suggs' ideal role is moving forward? Is it A. ball in his hands every possession and initiate every set point guard? Is it B. grab and go in transition, secondary ball handler and secondary playmaker, on the ball when the point guard is off the floor "1.5" type of combo guard? Is it C. completely off the ball shooting guard?

I like Suggs a lot, but it hasn't been established yet what his ideal role should or will be.

2. What makes Ivey a lesser shooting guard prospect than Davis or Mathurin? Even with his recent shooting slide, he's been far more efficient as a shooter/scorer than Davis and on the same level as Mathurin.

If you think Suggs long-term is option A, then I could understand wanting a more pure off-ball type shooting guard. But Suggs, to date, hasn't shown he's that guy yet.

I still love him as a piece moving forward in *some* capacity, but Suggs just being here is not keeping me from taking another guard if that guard is BPA. I just think Ivey is somewhat clearly better than Davis and Mathurin.

Appreciate the question digging. Thought provoking.

For me, I see Suggs career trending more along the career similar to Marcus Smart, Dejounte Murray or maybe Jrue Holiday. All had slow starts, but dug their way out of it with hard work as they had the underlying talent for it.

What I don't see is a Damian Lillard, James Harden, Bradley Beal or even a Devin Booker level star to emerge out of him. Ivey might be. That's why I am so high on him.

But Ivey could just as easily NOT end up on that level, so what happens to the Magic if he isn't? His fit is not ideal with the talent that currently exists. Is our roster assembly just headed for another mess like the days of Oladipo/Fournier/Hezonja/Harris/Gordon?

Makes me think that I'd rather focus on building a roster that works together cohesively rather than chase a ghost. Champion Teams like Dallas, Detroit, San Antonio beat more talented star studded teams because they were built to compliment each other.

This team is still in dire need of Guards who can shoot. Suggs still cheers like he's surprised every time a 3 point goes in. I expected it to be rough for him in his rookie year, but not 22% from 3 rough. That's alarming. He's on the slow track to success now. It's just going to take a while. So bringing him off the bench in the mean time is ideal. No sense in forcing the issue if we can find help elsewhere.

I do feel like Mathurin and Griffin will be good 3pt shooters in the NBA. Neither are Top 4 draft considerations so that makes it hard to fall head over heels for them. Mathurin has a more balanced game than Griffin right now, but Griffin has better handles and a 7' wingspan. What if Jabari is Lamarcus Aldridge and Chet is Porzingis, big whoop-ti-doo.

How could we be the worst team again in a terrible year for elite draft prospects. This is so frustrating. It's like the Mike Miller and Victor Oladipo drafts where we had high picks and could not get a stud star player. Sucks to be us.

[BCS]

People should also forgo the idea that they are going to move Cole. There is like a 5% chance that happens even after he's extended.

I disagree. I believe trading Cole is on their list. Of course I mean trading him, not giving him away, I believe that is a reason why Hammond mentioned players improving and not losing value. Weltman and Hammond mention words a lot of interchangeable and positionless basketball. Cole goes against that way of thinking, Fultz and Suggs are big guards that can switch and hold their own against stronger players. I envision that is what they eventually want this team to become. A team that can switch everything and they can hold their own.

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[KillMonger]

Watch on YouTube

[Knightro]

Going to jump in here.

Ivey or Sharpe makes sense IF Orlando can capitalize on moving Fultz. If not, then they should just take any of the bigs left on the table (I'd probably include Murray in that group at this point).

So here's my thing on Fultz.

Nice story. I absolutely want him to succeed, but for all intents and purposes next year is the last year of his contract and then he's free to leave.

I would not factor his presence in towards any decision to add any guard in this upcoming draft who could be here 8-10 years depending on if they get a 2nd contract.

At least with Cole and RJ and Suggs it's different because they're under team control for an undermarket price for the next several seasons.

[drsd]

how about we trade our Top 3 pick to SAS for Vassell and their 6-10 pick.

For me this is a value trade. And the kind of trade I would like to see more often. It's also a grade GMs are afraid to make.

I like it. Orlando would be trading a big for a sharp-shooting SG and Vassell as bench depth. AND would probably be saving in cap space by doing so.

[drsd]

Ummm what? Have you watched his game?

I think Tshiebwe will be a very nice 3rd string combo-big. He has a clear NBA skill and can grow in to being a capable NBA backup.

PLUS: he would be an excellent practice squad player.

I guess you point is that his office upside is to set brick-wall screens. I enjoy watching bigs lay out opponent guards though. That's just me.

[Skin]

Suggs and F-Wagner. But if your point is about guards, I agree that Anthony, Fultz, Harris, and Ross need to be afterthoughts come draft time. But as Suggs is part of the calculation, this really questions Ivey on this roster. Orlando needs a pure SG next to Suggs, if Fultz is not / cannot start next to him. In this Bennedict Mathurin and Johnny Davis are more reasonable Magicians than Jaden Ivey.

I want Fultz to succeed, but with Suggs, I really do not understand what role he can have on this roster even if he is 100% and gives everything he can. So then what?

I have a few questions in response to this...

1. What do you think Jalen Suggs' ideal role is moving forward? Is it A. ball in his hands every possession and initiate every set point guard? Is it B. grab and go in transition, secondary ball handler and secondary playmaker, on the ball when the point guard is off the floor "1.5" type of combo guard? Is it C. completely off the ball shooting guard?

I like Suggs a lot, but it hasn't been established yet what his ideal role should or will be.

2. What makes Ivey a lesser shooting guard prospect than Davis or Mathurin? Even with his recent shooting slide, he's been far more efficient as a shooter/scorer than Davis and on the same level as Mathurin.

If you think Suggs long-term is option A, then I could understand wanting a more pure off-ball type shooting guard. But Suggs, to date, hasn't shown he's that guy yet.

I still love him as a piece moving forward in *some* capacity, but Suggs just being here is not keeping me from taking another guard if that guard is BPA. I just think Ivey is somewhat clearly better than Davis and Mathurin.

Going to jump in here.

Ivey or Sharpe makes sense IF Orlando can capitalize on moving Fultz. If not, then they should just take any of the bigs left on the table (I'd probably include Murray in that group at this point).

Suggs/Cole
Ivey (or Sharpe)/RJ

This rotation makes more sense on paper. They need Suggs to have the ball in his hands if the decision is between him and Fultz. Orlando loses a lot more on the defensive end, then they gain on the offensive, with Fultz on the floor instead of Suggs. I cant see the combo of Fultz/Suggs on the floor together, with the already limited outside shooting elsewhere, as a smart idea. People should also forgo the idea that they are going to move Cole. There is like a 5% chance that happens even after he's extended.

If we are being entirely realistic Orlando is likely going to end up with something like:

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/RJ
Wagner / Okeke
(Jabari/Chet/Murray/Paolo)/Isaac
WCJr/ Bamba

Is this a balanced lineup? Not at all. So it will likely happen. Orlando hasn't been a franchise that shuffles through rookie contract and non-vet players to make the minutes make sense. Therefore, the draft decision matters more than "who cares draft talent", they'll even say as much when they talk about putting players in positions to succeed. Case in point - RJ Hampton. The guy is a complete afterthought now because he'll never see the floor.

This draft for Orlando is predicated on two factors.

1) Where they end up picking (obviously)
2) How they view Jonathan Isaac moving forward.

Do they view him as the obvious starter? No way in hell Wagner comes off the bench and Isaac was previously viewed as the best talent on the roster.

I think that one of the smarter things that Mosely figured out this year was that he could get the most out of WCj by playing him at PF. It allows the Magic to use Bamba on the perimeter to stretch the floor while WCj operates inside, but still allows WCj the freedom to score from anywhere. It also masks WCj defensive weaknesses.

When Isaac returns, I would assume that the best move would be for him to play the role that Bamba has played this year. Isaac can stretch the floor like Bamba, but has the superior defense. So the Magic would have that formidable defensive presence in the paint that is lacking from both WCj and Bamba.

It also keeps Isaac safer from injury since playing Center doesn't require him to make as many sudden cuts that put pressure on his knees. The more we can keep him going North-South and jumping vertical instead of running East-West, and jumping horizontal, the better it will be for his longevity.

This is why I'm not as hyped for Jabari/Chet as others. I still believe in Isaac and how the new Magic line up could look like. Meanwhile, our guards can't shoot.

PG Markelle Fultz
SG ???
SF Franz Wagner
PF Wendell Carter
C Jonathan Isaac

6th Suggs - Suggs shooting has left everyone disappointed. We can't rush him to get better. The best way to utilize him is as a 6th man until he raises his game which may take 3-4 years. Luckily he has the ability to play both guard spots and could be a spot starter at any time.

Every other bench player has to be able to shoot from 3 or they should be shipped off. Cole and RJ lead that pack.

[Knightro]

I think that one of the smarter things that Mosely figured out this year was that he could get the most out of WCj by playing him at PF. It allows the Magic to use Bamba on the perimeter to stretch the floor while WCj operates inside, but still allows WCj the freedom to score from anywhere. It also masks WCj defensive weaknesses.

It's semantics, but Bamba plays PF and Carter plays C despite them being listed as the opposite.

And also those two as a combo are actually really bad together and the Magic are wildly better when Carter is on the floor playing center without Bamba.

[RookieStar]

Ummm what? Have you watched his game?

I think Tshiebwe will be a very nice 3rd string combo-big. He has a clear NBA skill and can grow in to being a capable NBA backup.

PLUS: he would be an excellent practice squad player.

I guess you point is that his office upside is to set brick-wall screens. I enjoy watching bigs lay out opponent guards though. That's just me.

If we get him as a 3rd big, then no need for our high srp. You can get them from the undrafted pool. Just sign him right off. Our high srp should be for a backup big who i think would replace Bamba ( assuming we start JI with WCJ )

[VFX]

I have a few questions in response to this...

1. What do you think Jalen Suggs' ideal role is moving forward? Is it A. ball in his hands every possession and initiate every set point guard? Is it B. grab and go in transition, secondary ball handler and secondary playmaker, on the ball when the point guard is off the floor "1.5" type of combo guard? Is it C. completely off the ball shooting guard?

I like Suggs a lot, but it hasn't been established yet what his ideal role should or will be.

2. What makes Ivey a lesser shooting guard prospect than Davis or Mathurin? Even with his recent shooting slide, he's been far more efficient as a shooter/scorer than Davis and on the same level as Mathurin.

If you think Suggs long-term is option A, then I could understand wanting a more pure off-ball type shooting guard. But Suggs, to date, hasn't shown he's that guy yet.

I still love him as a piece moving forward in *some* capacity, but Suggs just being here is not keeping me from taking another guard if that guard is BPA. I just think Ivey is somewhat clearly better than Davis and Mathurin.

Going to jump in here.

Ivey or Sharpe makes sense IF Orlando can capitalize on moving Fultz. If not, then they should just take any of the bigs left on the table (I'd probably include Murray in that group at this point).

Suggs/Cole
Ivey (or Sharpe)/RJ

This rotation makes more sense on paper. They need Suggs to have the ball in his hands if the decision is between him and Fultz. Orlando loses a lot more on the defensive end, then they gain on the offensive, with Fultz on the floor instead of Suggs. I cant see the combo of Fultz/Suggs on the floor together, with the already limited outside shooting elsewhere, as a smart idea. People should also forgo the idea that they are going to move Cole. There is like a 5% chance that happens even after he's extended.

If we are being entirely realistic Orlando is likely going to end up with something like:

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/RJ
Wagner / Okeke
(Jabari/Chet/Murray/Paolo)/Isaac
WCJr/ Bamba

Is this a balanced lineup? Not at all. So it will likely happen. Orlando hasn't been a franchise that shuffles through rookie contract and non-vet players to make the minutes make sense. Therefore, the draft decision matters more than "who cares draft talent", they'll even say as much when they talk about putting players in positions to succeed. Case in point - RJ Hampton. The guy is a complete afterthought now because he'll never see the floor.

This draft for Orlando is predicated on two factors.

1) Where they end up picking (obviously)
2) How they view Jonathan Isaac moving forward.

Do they view him as the obvious starter? No way in hell Wagner comes off the bench and Isaac was previously viewed as the best talent on the roster.

I think that one of the smarter things that Mosely figured out this year was that he could get the most out of WCj by playing him at PF. It allows the Magic to use Bamba on the perimeter to stretch the floor while WCj operates inside, but still allows WCj the freedom to score from anywhere. It also masks WCj defensive weaknesses.

When Isaac returns, I would assume that the best move would be for him to play the role that Bamba has played this year. Isaac can stretch the floor like Bamba, but has the superior defense. So the Magic would have that formidable defensive presence in the paint that is lacking from both WCj and Bamba.

It also keeps Isaac safer from injury since playing Center doesn't require him to make as many sudden cuts that put pressure on his knees. The more we can keep him going North-South and jumping vertical instead of running East-West, and jumping horizontal, the better it will be for his longevity.

This is why I'm not as hyped for Jabari/Chet as others. I still believe in Isaac and how the new Magic line up could look like. Meanwhile, our guards can't shoot.

PG Markelle Fultz
SG ???
SF Franz Wagner
PF Wendell Carter
C Jonathan Isaac

6th Suggs - Suggs shooting has left everyone disappointed. We can't rush him to get better. The best way to utilize him is as a 6th man until he raises his game which may take 3-4 years. Luckily he has the ability to play both guard spots and could be a spot starter at any time.

Every other bench player has to be able to shoot from 3 or they should be shipped off. Cole and RJ lead that pack.

The problem with this lineup is that you have 4 guys on the court that aren't keeping the defense honest from beyond the arc. Moving Suggs and starting Fultz changes nothing.

I have no problem with Isaac starting C if he can stay on the floor. I just seriously doubt the FO is going to pass on the consensus top 4 bigs to try this experiment.

[VFX]

People should also forgo the idea that they are going to move Cole. There is like a 5% chance that happens even after he's extended.

I disagree. I believe trading Cole is on their list. Of course I mean trading him, not giving him away, I believe that is a reason why Hammond mentioned players improving and not losing value. Weltman and Hammond mention words a lot of interchangeable and positionless basketball. Cole goes against that way of thinking, Fultz and Suggs are big guards that can switch and hold their own against stronger players. I envision that is what they eventually want this team to become. A team that can switch everything and they can hold their own.

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I would be absolutely shocked if this FO moved on from Cole after drafting him a few years ago. Have they ever actually indicated they would move on from him despite what a majority of fans might want?
Also, how much value does Cole actually hold under his rookie deal?

[VFX]

Going to jump in here.

Ivey or Sharpe makes sense IF Orlando can capitalize on moving Fultz. If not, then they should just take any of the bigs left on the table (I'd probably include Murray in that group at this point).

So here's my thing on Fultz.

Nice story. I absolutely want him to succeed, but for all intents and purposes next year is the last year of his contract and then he's free to leave.

I would not factor his presence in towards any decision to add any guard in this upcoming draft who could be here 8-10 years depending on if they get a 2nd contract.

At least with Cole and RJ and Suggs it's different because they're under team control for an undermarket price for the next several seasons.

Yes I agree. This is why I see Fultz as the odd man out.

I would view it as a way of boosting an asset over the course of a few years at the cost of potentially Tyrese Maxey.

Much easier to trade him than to start moving rookie deal guys they were committed to.