Official 2020 NBA Draft Thread

[VFX]

Can I ask a honest question: Why is it some people think Terry is a transcendent shooter and think Nesmith is "small sample size" when their 3FA are within 10 of each other?

A few reasons...

1. Nesmith is a year older and a year more experienced than Terry. He only shot .337 from three. At the same age/experience level, Terry **** .408 from three.

2. Terry shot 89% from the FT line, compared to 82% for Nesmith. Not a massive difference, but an indicator of natural shooting ability.

3. Quality of competition. Terry played a full season and actually increased his 3PT% to 42.4% in Pac 12 play when his competition theoretically got tougher.

Nesmith got injured right as SEC play started (he played one conference game) and his shooting numbers are propped up a bit some by a few huge performances against some really terrible teams out of conference (7-11 3PT against Southeast Missouri State who finished last in the Ohio Valley, 7-10 3PT against UNC Wilmington who finished 9th of 10 in the Colonial).

Terry is also criticized for his inability to shoot off the dribble, step back, and side-step 3. In fact, one of the major gripes on his shooting ability is all he can do is pull-up. That seems like a huge negative in this era of NBA ball.

I don't have a dog in the fight. I think either of them would be fine for the Magic. I just don't understand why people think Terry is significantly better when they seem to be the same level of talent with different warts on the offensive side. Defense in a lot of ways doesn't much matter anymore, but Nesmith is considered a plus defender while Terry is considered a liability due to his size.

I’d add that Terry will likely be a pg/sg while Nesmith is more of a sf/sg in terms of defensive assignment. I’m ok with either player, but I think Terry has a bigger skill set and Nesmith’s defensive ability will be weighted at those positions more so than Terry. Ironically, between the two of them I’d say Terry is more of a playmaker.

[MagicFan101]

A few reasons...

1. Nesmith is a year older and a year more experienced than Terry. He only shot .337 from three. At the same age/experience level, Terry **** .408 from three.

2. Terry shot 89% from the FT line, compared to 82% for Nesmith. Not a massive difference, but an indicator of natural shooting ability.

3. Quality of competition. Terry played a full season and actually increased his 3PT% to 42.4% in Pac 12 play when his competition theoretically got tougher.

Nesmith got injured right as SEC play started (he played one conference game) and his shooting numbers are propped up a bit some by a few huge performances against some really terrible teams out of conference (7-11 3PT against Southeast Missouri State who finished last in the Ohio Valley, 7-10 3PT against UNC Wilmington who finished 9th of 10 in the Colonial).

Terry is also criticized for his inability to shoot off the dribble, step back, and side-step 3. In fact, one of the major gripes on his shooting ability is all he can do is pull-up. That seems like a huge negative in this era of NBA ball.

I don't have a dog in the fight. I think either of them would be fine for the Magic. I just don't understand why people think Terry is significantly better when they seem to be the same level of talent with different warts on the offensive side. Defense in a lot of ways doesn't much matter anymore, but Nesmith is considered a plus defender while Terry is considered a liability due to his size.

I’d add that Terry will likely be a pg/sg while Nesmith is more of a sf/sg in terms of defensive assignment. I’m ok with either player, but I think Terry has a bigger skill set and Nesmith’s defensive ability will be weighted at those positions more so than Terry. Ironically, between the two of them I’d say Terry is more of a playmaker.

At #15 I’m not complaining about landing either of them.

If we trade up I start to put on my scouting cap and get more critical.

... but to be honest, if we trade up I’m not thinking Terry or Nesmith at all. I’m thinking bigger prizes.

[VFX]

Terry is also criticized for his inability to shoot off the dribble, step back, and side-step 3. In fact, one of the major gripes on his shooting ability is all he can do is pull-up. That seems like a huge negative in this era of NBA ball.

I don't have a dog in the fight. I think either of them would be fine for the Magic. I just don't understand why people think Terry is significantly better when they seem to be the same level of talent with different warts on the offensive side. Defense in a lot of ways doesn't much matter anymore, but Nesmith is considered a plus defender while Terry is considered a liability due to his size.

I’d add that Terry will likely be a pg/sg while Nesmith is more of a sf/sg in terms of defensive assignment. I’m ok with either player, but I think Terry has a bigger skill set and Nesmith’s defensive ability will be weighted at those positions more so than Terry. Ironically, between the two of them I’d say Terry is more of a playmaker.

At #15 I’m not complaining about landing either of them.

If we trade up I start to put on my scouting cap and get more critical.

... but to be honest, if we trade up I’m not thinking Terry or Nesmith at all. I’m thinking bigger prizes.

Exactly

[basketballRob]

A lot of people will regret passing on Maxey.

I just don't see it.

He's a 6'3" shooting guard who didn't make shots from pretty much anywhere on the floor in college.

You have to be completely sold that his poor shooting was either a fluke or that he's going to really develop quickly as a shooter because he's Jordan Clarkson otherwise.

Did you watch his workout?

Read on Twitter

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Read on Twitter

?s=19


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[Knightro]

Terry is also criticized for his inability to shoot off the dribble, step back, and side-step 3. In fact, one of the major gripes on his shooting ability is all he can do is pull-up. That seems like a huge negative in this era of NBA ball.

I don't have a dog in the fight. I think either of them would be fine for the Magic. I just don't understand why people think Terry is significantly better when they seem to be the same level of talent with different warts.

I think they will both be able to shoot at a high level. I don't think either of them are Steph Curry level transcendent shooters, but I do think they'll both be plus shooters in the NBA.

Nesmith is a great shooter, but I just don't see him able to do much else. Not a good passer, defender, ball handler, etc. He really does remind me of Buddy Hield or Danny Green without the defense.

When it comes to Terry, I think he has legitimate passing ability and he's a sneaky good finisher despite being so small. I think he could step in and be a nice secondary playmaker and off ball shooter. The kind of guy you want to pair with a big lead guard which is one thing the Magic just so happen to have.

Plus I think it would likely benefit Fultz to not longer have to defend point guards since he dies so easily on ball screens.

[Knightro]

Did you watch his workout?

You serious with this?

Watch on YouTube

Here's 4 and a half minutes of Dennis Smith Jr. dominating a workout. He has a career .475 TS%.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27026501/beilein-wants-cavs-positionless-garland-pick

Here's an article where the Cavs openly admit they were sold on Darius Garland based on him dominating a workout. He posted a .498 TS% as a rookie.

Watch on YouTube

Here's ten minutes of Kevin Knox looking like the next great superstar wing in a workout. He has a career .474 TS%.

Pre-draft workouts mean absolutely nothing.

[Knightro]

At #15 I’m not complaining about landing either of them.

If we trade up I start to put on my scouting cap and get more critical.

... but to be honest, if we trade up I’m not thinking Terry or Nesmith at all. I’m thinking bigger prizes.

Completely agree on the trade up thing.

If the Magic are going to get aggressive and move up in the draft, it certainly needs to be for one of the top guards - Ball, Edwards, Haliburton or Hayes.

[The Effect]

Someone's going to explain this sudden explosion of Maxey love on this site?

He's a fine player but I don't think star when I watch him. Like I said before, he's malik monk with a worse shot.

[MagicFan101]

Someone's going to explain this sudden explosion of Maxey love on this site?

He's a fine player but I don't think star when I watch him. Like I said before, he's malik monk with a worse shot.

Count me as someone who was never excited about Maxey at 15.

I will always give whoever we pick a fair chance. A young kid is not responsible for where they are chosen, that is on the GM. If they receive a poor welcome from fans how can we expect anything from them? I will always (initially) support a young kid wearing a Magic jersey who works hard ... but I won’t be excited on draft night if Maxey is the pick.

Similarly with Okeke. I have come around. I’m pumped and have talked myself into a place where I can see a role for him ... but boy I was deflated when his name was called.

[Xatticus]

Someone's going to explain this sudden explosion of Maxey love on this site?

He's a fine player but I don't think star when I watch him. Like I said before, he's malik monk with a worse shot.

He isn’t Monk. He is a tough defender that can finish in the paint. He’s more like Marcus Smart. He may not have a high-level offensive skill that defines him, but he seems a good bet to become a versatile, solid pro. He’s the sort that can carve out a role with any team in the league.

[Little Digger]

Where’s the -a good one- option on the poll?

No need to draft for need

[Knightro]

Someone's going to explain this sudden explosion of Maxey love on this site?

He's a fine player but I don't think star when I watch him. Like I said before, he's malik monk with a worse shot.

Monk was a monster athlete. Maxey isn't even that. I really just don't get understand the love.

He shot under 50% from 2PT, under 30% from 3PT. He's a good finisher, but he rarely got all the way to the rim at Kentucky because he's not a very good ball handler and has just average speed and explosiveness.

For a guy who has a reputation as a defender, the fact that he didn't generate many steals or deflections gives me concern. Compare that with someone like Marcus Smart who was similarly sized, but absolutely DOMINATED defensively in college. Statistically Maxey was certainly not plus defender, merely above average.

I'm willing to give his shooting a little bit of the benefit of the doubt because of his FT% was good and his overall form doesn't appear broken, but even then he's a 6'3" shooting guard who isn't a great athlete and at best projects to be a pretty good, but not great shooter.

Someone tell me what am I missing?

Even if you want to go with what Mike Schmitz is saying and suggest all Kentucky perimeter players are held back by Calipari's system, those guys like Herro and Booker and SGA and Murray were all more productive shooters than Maxey was at UK.

Booker: .600 TS%
Murray: .590 TS%
Herro: .580 TS%
SGA: .578 TS%

Maxey is most comparable to Brandon Knight.

Knight: .553 TS%
Maxey: .531 TS%

[RookieStar]

Yeah... what is up with the Maxey love here? I thought we wanted a genuine 3pt shooting/scoring guard or wing?

As to pre draft workouts, I agree that it means absolutely nothing especially in a near-empty gym. Remember that chinese dude who absolutely destroyed the chairs in his workout qnd fooled the Bucka in tqking him in the lotto?

[Knightro]

He isn’t Monk. He is a tough defender that can finish in the paint. He’s more like Marcus Smart. He may not have a high-level offensive skill that defines him, but he seems a good bet to become a versatile, solid pro. He’s the sort that can carve out a role with any team in the league.

I really don't like the Smart comparison for Maxey. They're similarly sized with similar body types and offensively I think they're pretty similar, although Smart was a better passer and got to the line at a much higher rate.

But people forget that Smart was a historically productive defensive guard at the college level. Maxey doesn't even come close.

Smart as a freshman...

.575 FTR, 10.3 REB%, 26.8 AST%, 5.3 STL%, 2.2 BLK%, 2.9 Defensive Win Shares, 6.2 DBPM

Maxey as a freshman...

.342 FTR, 7.3 REB%, 18.7 AST%, 1.5 STL%, 1.3 BLK%, 1.5 Defensive Win Shares, 2.0 DBPM

Smart was the same maniacal effort player who always was around the ball and getting his hands on the ball that he ended up being in the pros. Maxey was just more of a run of the mill good defender who didn't really wreck a lot of havoc turnover wise.

[Xatticus]

He isn’t Monk. He is a tough defender that can finish in the paint. He’s more like Marcus Smart. He may not have a high-level offensive skill that defines him, but he seems a good bet to become a versatile, solid pro. He’s the sort that can carve out a role with any team in the league.

I really don't like the Smart comparison for Maxey. They're similarly sized with similar body types and offensively I think they're pretty similar, although Smart was a better passer and got to the line at a much higher rate.

But people forget that Smart was a historically productive defensive guard at the college level. Maxey doesn't even come close.

Smart as a freshman...

.575 FTR, 10.3 REB%, 26.8 AST%, 5.3 STL%, 2.2 BLK%, 2.9 Defensive Win Shares, 6.2 DBPM

Maxey as a freshman...

.342 FTR, 7.3 REB%, 18.7 AST%, 1.5 STL%, 1.3 BLK%, 1.5 Defensive Win Shares, 2.0 DBPM

Smart was the same maniacal effort player who always was around the ball and getting his hands on the ball that he ended up being in the pros. Maxey was just more of a run of the mill good defender who didn't really wreck a lot of havoc turnover wise.

Yeah. Smart was far more accomplished. The physicality is the point I was trying to highlight. Monk lacks that. Many of the other guards projected to go in the middle of the first round lack that. You aren’t going through Maxey and it enhances his ability to finish in the paint. A lot of guards avoid contact in the paint and are hampered when they get hit. Maxey puts his body into defenders to create the space to get his shots up. He isn’t bothered by the contact at all.

I really wouldn’t have an issue with Maxey. It’s possible there is more to his game than what he showed at Kentucky. He wasn’t the PG. The FT% gives hope for his shot. Even if there isn’t anything more to him offensively, you are looking at Patrick Beverley. I don’t think he is a high-ceiling guy, but I do think his floor has him solidly in an NBA rotation. I greatly prefer Flynn’s game to Maxey’s, but I could see Flynn failing to stick due to his limitations.

This is why I’d like to pick up another pick. I’d love to get one of Mannion and Flynn, but are we going to use 15 on them? They won’t last to our 2nd-round pick.

[Knightro]

Yeah. Smart was far more accomplished. The physicality is the point I was trying to highlight. Monk lacks that. Many of the other guards projected to go in the middle of the first round lack that. You aren’t going through Maxey and it enhances his ability to finish in the paint. A lot of guards avoid contact in the paint and are hampered when they get hit. Maxey puts his body into defenders to create the space to get his shots up. He isn’t bothered by the contact at all.

I really wouldn’t have an issue with Maxey. It’s possible there is more to his game than what he showed at Kentucky. He wasn’t the PG. The FT% gives hope for his shot. Even if there isn’t anything more to him offensively, you are looking at Patrick Beverley. I don’t think he is a high-ceiling guy, but I do think his floor has him solidly in an NBA rotation. I greatly prefer Flynn’s game to Maxey’s, but I could see Flynn failing to stick due to his limitations.

This is why I’d like to pick up another pick. I’d love to get one of Mannion and Flynn, but are we going to use 15 on them? They won’t last to our 2nd-round pick.

Here's a hot take for you.

I'd take Flynn over Maxey at 15.

[MagicFan101]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-lamelo-ball-jumps-up-to-no-1-selection-by-the-timberwolves-in-first-two-round-mock/amp/


If Josh Green and Tyrell Terry fall to the 2nd Round you have to buy a pick and grab one of them. No excuse not to.

[basketballRob]

Did you watch his workout?

You serious with this?

Watch on YouTube

Here's 4 and a half minutes of Dennis Smith Jr. dominating a workout. He has a career .475 TS%.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27026501/beilein-wants-cavs-positionless-garland-pick

Here's an article where the Cavs openly admit they were sold on Darius Garland based on him dominating a workout. He posted a .498 TS% as a rookie.

Watch on YouTube

Here's ten minutes of Kevin Knox looking like the next great superstar wing in a workout. He has a career .474 TS%.

Pre-draft workouts mean absolutely nothing.

Watch the extended workout, he makes like 30 consecutive 3's. He will be a Jamal Murray type guard. Mike Schmitz compares him to Donovan Mitchell. Mitchell **** 25% from 3 and had a 527 ts as a freshman. Mitchell's sophomore season wasn't much better shooting.

I don't like Terry at all. Best case scenario for him will be a DJ Augustine career backup. Maxey will probably start next year.


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[Bensational]

Yeah. Smart was far more accomplished. The physicality is the point I was trying to highlight. Monk lacks that. Many of the other guards projected to go in the middle of the first round lack that. You aren’t going through Maxey and it enhances his ability to finish in the paint. A lot of guards avoid contact in the paint and are hampered when they get hit. Maxey puts his body into defenders to create the space to get his shots up. He isn’t bothered by the contact at all.

I really wouldn’t have an issue with Maxey. It’s possible there is more to his game than what he showed at Kentucky. He wasn’t the PG. The FT% gives hope for his shot. Even if there isn’t anything more to him offensively, you are looking at Patrick Beverley. I don’t think he is a high-ceiling guy, but I do think his floor has him solidly in an NBA rotation. I greatly prefer Flynn’s game to Maxey’s, but I could see Flynn failing to stick due to his limitations.

This is why I’d like to pick up another pick. I’d love to get one of Mannion and Flynn, but are we going to use 15 on them? They won’t last to our 2nd-round pick.

Here's a hot take for you.

I'd take Flynn over Maxey at 15.

Flynn gives me DJ vibes, which isn't a bad thing for a backup PG, but not what I'd be chasing at #15. I like Mannion's passing game more than Flynn and feel Mannion gets his players better open looks that require less from them - he will put them in position by pulling defenders away whereas Flynn still needs guys to move and execute strongly off the ball to complete rolls. Mannion gives me Racer vibes, and Rafer was always the most underrated piece to our 09 run. But then, Flynn is the steady and reliable hand of the two and less turnover prone.

Maxey looks like someone with a knack for getting to the hoop and knowing how to use his body to finish well. That's what I liked about Mitchell, though Mitchell had the freak athleticism, wingspan and great defense.

[pepe1991]

Did you watch his workout?

You serious with this?

Watch on YouTube

Here's 4 and a half minutes of Dennis Smith Jr. dominating a workout. He has a career .475 TS%.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27026501/beilein-wants-cavs-positionless-garland-pick

Here's an article where the Cavs openly admit they were sold on Darius Garland based on him dominating a workout. He posted a .498 TS% as a rookie.

Watch on YouTube

Here's ten minutes of Kevin Knox looking like the next great superstar wing in a workout. He has a career .474 TS%.

Pre-draft workouts mean absolutely nothing.

Watch the extended workout, he makes like 30 consecutive 3's. He will be a Jamal Murray type guard. Mike Schmitz compares him to Donovan Mitchell. Mitchell **** 25% from 3 and had a 527 ts as a freshman. Mitchell's sophomore season wasn't much better shooting.

I don't like Terry at all. Best case scenario for him will be a DJ Augustine career backup. Maxey will probably start next year.


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I watched shootarounds of Derick Rose during his ACL recovery before games while he was held up by a team as part of recovery, before comming to play. Guy would on regualr bases make 50 out of 60 threes like it's nothing.
Guy is career 30% for 3 player.

Bottom line, people don't understand that almost every single nba player looks like god at practice.
There is Myles Leonard video of him looking like prime Hakeem but with 3 point range, guy is thrid string C .

Watch on YouTube

Wiggins killing in practice...