Gary Trent Jr in the summer?

[Bergmaniac]

I like him better than FVV.

And-1

Not only do I like Trent's game over VanVleet's game, Trent is a much better fit for this team as constructed.

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor. He doesn't need to be the ballhandler on most possessions. He plays very good defense. That's exactly what Paolo and Franz need. Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

[drsd]

I like him better than FVV.

And-1

Not only do I like Trent's game over VanVleet's game, Trent is a much better fit for this team as constructed.

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor. He doesn't need to be the ballhandler on most possessions. He plays very good defense. That's exactly what Paolo and Franz need. Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

Why? Because Orlando needs two SGs. The team has three PGs. Yes maybe none of those three should be starting. But Orlando playing 4-on-5 ob offsets because of ineptitude at the 2, that has to end.

[Bergmaniac]

Funny how Gary Harris has the highest offensive rating of anyone in the main rotation despite supposedly the team playing "4 on 5" when he is on the court. It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG.

[zaymon]

Funny how Gary Harris has the highest offensive rating of anyone in the main rotation despite supposedly the team playing "4 on 5" when he is on the court. It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG.

Suprising how moving the ball and spacing the floor works. Gary Harris is a much better player than Trent MUCH BETTER. He is not selfish so his stats doesnt look sexy outside of efficiency and impact (which not many fans take seriously lol). We also dont have 3 pgs, not being able to shoot doesnt make you pg. We have zero competent pgs, thats sad truth.

[drsd]

Funny how Gary Harris has the highest offensive rating of anyone in the main rotation despite supposedly the team playing "4 on 5" when he is on the court. It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG.

Suprising how moving the ball and spacing the floor works. Gary Harris is a much better player than Trent MUCH BETTER. He is not selfish so his stats doesnt look sexy outside of efficiency and impact (which not many fans take seriously lol). We also dont have 3 pgs, not being able to shoot doesnt make you pg. We have zero competent pgs, thats sad truth.

G-Harris has AVERAGED 56 games played per season over an 8-year career. That is not ok.

[zaymon]

Funny how Gary Harris has the highest offensive rating of anyone in the main rotation despite supposedly the team playing "4 on 5" when he is on the court. It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG.

Suprising how moving the ball and spacing the floor works. Gary Harris is a much better player than Trent MUCH BETTER. He is not selfish so his stats doesnt look sexy outside of efficiency and impact (which not many fans take seriously lol). We also dont have 3 pgs, not being able to shoot doesnt make you pg. We have zero competent pgs, thats sad truth.

G-Harris has AVERAGED 56 games played per season over an 8-year career. That is not ok.

He is injury prone and i agree thats a massive problem but he is also very good team player who proved himself in the playoffs. On the other hand Portland gave up on Trent (basically switched him for another guy playing same position), and Nurse said they wont resign him if he doesnt improve his passing and defense. Thats the biggest of red flags. If both costed the same i would chose Gary and it seems Trent will be much more expensive than Harris (lol)

[basketballRob]

Suprising how moving the ball and spacing the floor works. Gary Harris is a much better player than Trent MUCH BETTER. He is not selfish so his stats doesnt look sexy outside of efficiency and impact (which not many fans take seriously lol). We also dont have 3 pgs, not being able to shoot doesnt make you pg. We have zero competent pgs, thats sad truth.

G-Harris has AVERAGED 56 games played per season over an 8-year career. That is not ok.

He is injury prone and i agree thats a massive problem but he is also very good team player who proved himself in the playoffs. On the other hand Portland gave up on Trent (basically switched him for another guy playing same position), and Nurse said they wont resign him if he doesnt improve his passing and defense. Thats the biggest of red flags. If both costed the same i would chose Gary and it seems Trent will be much more expensive than Harris (lol)

I think Gary is the better player.

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[basketballRob]

I'm not telling which Gary, tho.

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[AaronB]

I'm not telling which Gary, tho.

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You must not know anything about basketball because Gary is a much worse player.

(I ain't telling which one)

[basketballRob]

I'm not telling which Gary, tho.

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You must not know anything about basketball because Gary is a much worse player.

(I ain't telling which one)

Gary can shoot the three-ball, tho.

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[pepe1991]

Funny how Gary Harris has the highest offensive rating of anyone in the main rotation despite supposedly the team playing "4 on 5" when he is on the court. It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG.

It's almost like there is more to offensive impact than PPG

, yea, 1,2 assists and 2 rebounds
And before trade, Bamba had higher off rating, so there goes whole thing right into garbage.


Gary Harris has 16 touches per game. At average he spends less than 1 second with a ball.

He simply doesn't contribute to offense in any meaningful fashion other than being spot up treat who occesionally makes more than 2 shots a night. You could replace him with Jodie Meeks and nobody would notice.
Few nights ago he made one jumpshot in first quater, after 14 seconds, and for rest of a game he had 0 points, 2 asists, 3 rebounds.
Same happend vs Indiana. He simply isn't productive enough to be starter any more. Every team has 4 to 6 players who average, at average, more PPGs than him. Yes his percentages are great, but it's simply not torelable to have starter who 2 out of 3 days a week scores between 0 and 8 points and has "pop" of 12 poins night. it could work if you are superteam with 3 megastars that would take bulk of usage, but that's not case on Orlando. I'm just looking at best team in nba, they have similar 3 and D guard today, Grayson Allen. However, guy scored 15 or more points- 12 times. 8 times he had 5+ assists. 17 times he had 5+ rebounds.

Now Gary Harris ( as usual, missing games left and right, therfore sample is lower , witch is yet another knock on him, since he didn't have healthy season in 7 years ):
15 + points -4 times
5 + assists- once
5+ rebounds - once

Magic need more funcional guard than Gary Harris. Somebody who can handle a ball a little bit, change point of attack, somebody who has volumen in his 3s and somebody who can attack rim from time to time.

Gary Harris is just living example how much Magic need spacing. Same was with Bamba and his offensive rating. Just because they provide in ultra low volumen what Magic *need* that does not make them (longer term) solutions. It just means that arhytype of players they are is what team should seek for.

[drsd]

And before trade, Bamba had higher off rating, so there goes whole thing right into garbage.


Gary Harris has 16 touches per game. At average he spends less than 1 second with a ball.

He simply doesn't contribute to offense in any meaningful fashion other than being spot up treat who occesionally makes more than 2 shots a night. You could replace him with Jodie Meeks and nobody would notice.
Few nights ago he made one jumpshot in first quater, after 14 seconds, and for rest of a game he had 0 points, 2 asists, 3 rebounds.
Same happend vs Indiana. He simply isn't productive enough to be starter any more. Every team has 4 to 6 players who average, at average, more PPGs than him. Yes his percentages are great, but it's simply not torelable to have starter who 2 out of 3 days a week scores between 0 and 8 points and has "pop" of 12 poins night. it could work if you are superteam with 3 megastars that would take bulk of usage, but that's not case on Orlando. I'm just looking at best team in nba, they have similar 3 and D guard today, Grayson Allen. However, guy scored 15 or more points- 12 times. 8 times he had 5+ assists. 17 times he had 5+ rebounds.

Now Gary Harris ( as usual, missing games left and right, therfore sample is lower , witch is yet another knock on him, since he didn't have healthy season in 7 years ):
15 + points -4 times
5 + assists- once
5+ rebounds - once

Magic need more funcional guard than Gary Harris. Somebody who can handle a ball a little bit, change point of attack, somebody who has volumen in his 3s and somebody who can attack rim from time to time.

Gary Harris is just living example how much Magic need spacing. Same was with Bamba and his offensive rating. Just because they provide in ultra low volumen what Magic *need* that does not make them (longer term) solutions. It just means that arhytype of players they are is what team should seek for.

Preach preacher!


Look: G-Harris could have a role on offensive without the ball and without shooting, if he was moving (wearing our his defender), setting screens, or any of the other non-ball things. But nope: he sits in the corner and let's the Magic play 4 on 5. This cannot continue.


..

[pepe1991]

And before trade, Bamba had higher off rating, so there goes whole thing right into garbage.


Gary Harris has 16 touches per game. At average he spends less than 1 second with a ball.

He simply doesn't contribute to offense in any meaningful fashion other than being spot up treat who occesionally makes more than 2 shots a night. You could replace him with Jodie Meeks and nobody would notice.
Few nights ago he made one jumpshot in first quater, after 14 seconds, and for rest of a game he had 0 points, 2 asists, 3 rebounds.
Same happend vs Indiana. He simply isn't productive enough to be starter any more. Every team has 4 to 6 players who average, at average, more PPGs than him. Yes his percentages are great, but it's simply not torelable to have starter who 2 out of 3 days a week scores between 0 and 8 points and has "pop" of 12 poins night. it could work if you are superteam with 3 megastars that would take bulk of usage, but that's not case on Orlando. I'm just looking at best team in nba, they have similar 3 and D guard today, Grayson Allen. However, guy scored 15 or more points- 12 times. 8 times he had 5+ assists. 17 times he had 5+ rebounds.

Now Gary Harris ( as usual, missing games left and right, therfore sample is lower , witch is yet another knock on him, since he didn't have healthy season in 7 years ):
15 + points -4 times
5 + assists- once
5+ rebounds - once

Magic need more funcional guard than Gary Harris. Somebody who can handle a ball a little bit, change point of attack, somebody who has volumen in his 3s and somebody who can attack rim from time to time.

Gary Harris is just living example how much Magic need spacing. Same was with Bamba and his offensive rating. Just because they provide in ultra low volumen what Magic *need* that does not make them (longer term) solutions. It just means that arhytype of players they are is what team should seek for.

Preach preacher!


Look: G-Harris could have a role on offensive without the ball and without shooting, if he was moving (wearing our his defender), setting screens, or any of the other non-ball things. But nope: he sits in the corner and let's the Magic play 4 on 5. This cannot continue.


..

It's just frustrating as hell.
He only took 147 threes whole year for player that plays only to shoot 3s.
And his percentages are very inflated due shot quality he prefers. Out of 147 shots he took 132 were split between wide open (66) and open ( 66 ).
And also 124 of 147 threes are taken within at least 7 sec on a clock, witch again shows that he simply flat out won't take shots that could hinder his 3%

I'm not sure how his minutes are split, but it's also worth notihng that 51 out of 147 threes he took happened in first quaters. And only 17 threes in 4th quaters when teams actually focus on defense ( or at least pretend that they are focused).

And lastly, 121 out of 147 threes were taken with 0 dribbles. This is not knock against him, but also goes to show how limited he is in his role.

Gary Harris is what Gary Harris today is. Bench body to play 12-15 mpg on probably front louded contender that can't afford solid bench so any player that flat out doesn't blow is positive contributor by default.
In entire nba only 13 players average at least 24 mpg with sub 9 points and sub 2 assists. His production is flat out poor for starting guard no matter how his percentages look.

[zaymon]

And before trade, Bamba had higher off rating, so there goes whole thing right into garbage.


Gary Harris has 16 touches per game. At average he spends less than 1 second with a ball.

He simply doesn't contribute to offense in any meaningful fashion other than being spot up treat who occesionally makes more than 2 shots a night. You could replace him with Jodie Meeks and nobody would notice.
Few nights ago he made one jumpshot in first quater, after 14 seconds, and for rest of a game he had 0 points, 2 asists, 3 rebounds.
Same happend vs Indiana. He simply isn't productive enough to be starter any more. Every team has 4 to 6 players who average, at average, more PPGs than him. Yes his percentages are great, but it's simply not torelable to have starter who 2 out of 3 days a week scores between 0 and 8 points and has "pop" of 12 poins night. it could work if you are superteam with 3 megastars that would take bulk of usage, but that's not case on Orlando. I'm just looking at best team in nba, they have similar 3 and D guard today, Grayson Allen. However, guy scored 15 or more points- 12 times. 8 times he had 5+ assists. 17 times he had 5+ rebounds.

Now Gary Harris ( as usual, missing games left and right, therfore sample is lower , witch is yet another knock on him, since he didn't have healthy season in 7 years ):
15 + points -4 times
5 + assists- once
5+ rebounds - once

Magic need more funcional guard than Gary Harris. Somebody who can handle a ball a little bit, change point of attack, somebody who has volumen in his 3s and somebody who can attack rim from time to time.

Gary Harris is just living example how much Magic need spacing. Same was with Bamba and his offensive rating. Just because they provide in ultra low volumen what Magic *need* that does not make them (longer term) solutions. It just means that arhytype of players they are is what team should seek for.

Preach preacher!


Look: G-Harris could have a role on offensive without the ball and without shooting, if he was moving (wearing our his defender), setting screens, or any of the other non-ball things. But nope: he sits in the corner and let's the Magic play 4 on 5. This cannot continue.


..

Gary Harris travels more distance per minute than Banchero, more than Suggs, more than Ross did and he also has normal screen assist numbers for a guard. Arguments regarding Gary Harris are looking more and more like flat earth arguments. Twisting narratives and disregarding statistics.
So now his biggest flaw is that he quickly moves the ball, takes smart shots and provides spacing no other player on our team can provide ?

[Orl_Magic]

Could use his steals per game and 3pt%. Can he create offense for himself in our half court offense or is he just going to stand in the corner? Maybe if we play him 25 million/ year. Coach Mose will run some plays for him.

[JoshuaPotter]

And-1

Not only do I like Trent's game over VanVleet's game, Trent is a much better fit for this team as constructed.

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor. He doesn't need to be the ballhandler on most possessions. He plays very good defense. That's exactly what Paolo and Franz need. Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

Why? Because Orlando needs two SGs. The team has three PGs. Yes maybe none of those three should be starting. But Orlando playing 4-on-5 ob offsets because of ineptitude at the 2, that has to end.

I need to have that screenshot ready on demand where green goes into the paint with westbrook and it essentially becomes 4-5 offensive with westbrook being dared to shoot a 3.

Thats the NBA we live in.

[drsd]

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor.

I suspect you don't see VanVleet as a "fit" but rather as a replacement. That is you imagine benching Fultz. But that is not likely. What is likely is that VanVleet and Fultz would share the backcourt. Do you see that as a "fit".


Ask yourself a different question, if Fultz/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter are certain to start next season, what (realistic) additional player would you add to those four? I would be shocked if your answer was "VanVleet".

And thus we are back to Trent.

Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

What else does Orlando need offense from the 2 than distance buckets. My real concern for Trent is whether he can bring in needed defensive intensity. And then we are back to VanVleet again.

[Skybox]

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor.

I suspect you don't see VanVleet as a "fit" but rather as a replacement. That is you imagine benching Fultz. But that is not likely. What is likely is that VanVleet and Fultz would share the backcourt. Do you see that as a "fit".


Ask yourself a different question, if Fultz/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter are certain to start next season, what (realistic) additional player would you add to those four? I would be shocked if your answer was "VanVleet".

And thus we are back to Trent.

Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

What else does Orlando need offense from the 2 than distance buckets. My real concern for Trent is whether he can bring in needed defensive intensity. And then we are back to VanVleet again.

If you're basing your major free agent acquisition as building around Fultz, you're missing the whole idea of FVV. IF the FO is clinging to Fultz, it would be stupid to sign FVV (and just plain stupid overall). Everyone in NBA fandom is watching Westbrook get bounced around due to his "obsolete game" and we're quietly arguing over the JV version in ORL.

I like GTJ's game, but it's a secondary priority, IMO. I'd be very happy to sign GTJ if we draft Scoot.

[Bergmaniac]

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor.

I suspect you don't see VanVleet as a "fit" but rather as a replacement. That is you imagine benching Fultz. But that is not likely. What is likely is that VanVleet and Fultz would share the backcourt. Do you see that as a "fit".

If we get VanVleet, most likely he won't play with Fultz because this would be really stupid. We most likely will trade Fultz in such a case and just let him walk.

The fit that matters and what I was talking about is how FVV fits with our key players, Paolo and Franz. That's what all the roster decisions on this team should be based around for the forseeable future.

[pepe1991]

How? FVV is a great fit IMO. A PG who can create at a good level as a ballhandler but also can be used very effectively to space the floor.

I suspect you don't see VanVleet as a "fit" but rather as a replacement. That is you imagine benching Fultz. But that is not likely. What is likely is that VanVleet and Fultz would share the backcourt. Do you see that as a "fit".


Ask yourself a different question, if Fultz/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter are certain to start next season, what (realistic) additional player would you add to those four? I would be shocked if your answer was "VanVleet".

And thus we are back to Trent.

Trent can shoot, sure, but not much else.

What else does Orlando need offense from the 2 than distance buckets. My real concern for Trent is whether he can bring in needed defensive intensity. And then we are back to VanVleet again.

If you're basing your major free agent acquisition as building around Fultz, you're missing the whole idea of FVV. IF the FO is clinging to Fultz, it would be stupid to sign FVV (and just plain stupid overall). Everyone in NBA fandom is watching Westbrook get bounced around due to his "obsolete game" and we're quietly arguing over the JV version in ORL.

I like GTJ's game, but it's a secondary priority, IMO. I'd be very happy to sign GTJ if we draft Scoot.

If Fultz is on : NYN, Nets, LAL or LAC he would be as grilled in media as Westbrook is for identical reasons.
But on Orlando nobody cares since major media outlets flat out out don't watch anything Orlando related.
Banchero is averaging 20 ppg and he wasn't talking topic since summer.


Whole Fultz bubble will burst once Magic make playoffs and someone is tasked to actually analyze Magic games to figure how 4 on 5 spacing looks like. Until that point, Fultz fans will have free reing of barking how amazing 12 ppg and 5,5 apg is