Vorkunov: Gambling Investigation Involves April 6, 2023 Cavs-Magic Game

[pepe1991]

Lakers get your star, you "win lottery".
3 times from 2012-2025

Gotta have them in LAL

[jezzerinho]

Lakers get your star, you "win lottery".
3 times from 2012-2025

Gotta have them in LAL

I'd love to know the statistical odds of that.

[pepe1991]

Lakers get your star, you "win lottery".
3 times from 2012-2025

Gotta have them in LAL

I'd love to know the statistical odds of that.

0,225% chance


I just can't stress hard enough how current nba lottery & draft system can't coexist in world of gambling & sports betting being major sponsor of a league.

In other leagues bad teams won't rig (that many) games that will get them relegated to second tear division because they will lose massive amount of money.
In NBA losing is desired outcome of bad teams and they are getting rewarded for being bad.

it's such a fertile soil for all the manipulations, rigging, game fixing. This is why those news are so damn damaging for league and integrity. You had head coach of nba team that was tipping off gamblers about who will play. Again, not losing, but who will play, so they can gamble on players & points/rebounds/assist margins of ones who will play.

You had players involved.

I wrote about Rozier thing that league "cleared him" but FBI didn't, like month ago. Because it was another lie from Silver & company in his damage control.

And we already know at least 1 superstar was paid below desk as "bonus" to avoid salary cap. And yet, all the other owners stayed very quiet about Ballmer cheating. That was such a big red flag. They still are all silenced about 1/30 owners cheating cap. All sacred CBA. That is being played out & cheated.


As for lottery & draft... i just can't convince myself that in room of 30 billionaires they actually care about integrity of sport or anything else but money. Or that in such setting something as stupid as dumb luck would ever play role. They aren't billionaires because they leave anything for Fortuna. They create and control luck.

[SOUL]

I wrote about Rozier thing that league "cleared him" but FBI didn't, like month ago. Because it was another lie from Silver & company in his damage control.

The FBI has like 20x the resources, manpower, and know how than the NBA as far as being able to investigate deeply outside of social media monitoring and getting tipped off/being able to verify said claims. He also mysteriously had an "injury" as soon as the reports came out, so the NBA definitely were not intent on letting him play, although there probably was not enough to confirm or deny completely. I would assume the FBI may have tipped the NBA off on their investigation as well, so maybe there was communication there.

Things would be more believable if people weren't like "The NBA is rife with corruption and cheating and greed but they would put their reputation and standing on the line in order to protect Terry Rozier. But Jontay Porter? **** that guy."

As for lottery & draft... i just can't convince myself that in room of 30 billionaires they actually care about integrity of sport or anything else but money. Or that in such setting something as stupid as dumb luck would ever play role. They aren't billionaires because they leave anything for Fortuna. They create and control luck.

Billionaires are greedy for themselves. I cannot stress how little they would care about "rewarding" Dallas with Flagg just to get heat off of Nico Harrison or make them relevant. Same for giving the Spurs the greatest prospect since Bron.

It has to work both ways - hand-wringing and complaints for 15 years when the Spurs/Duncan were winning as a dynasty about bad ratings/boring finals/bad for the NBA, and then owners deciding to hand that same franchise keys to a mansion in one of the smallest markets.

Again, I can believe in singular conspiracy theories, with bad apples and greed. What some people are saying though feels half-baked and would require WAY more moving parts, something of which literally would not be seen in modern times.

It then would require that to mean that every NBA owner is on the game, and unless you think ONLY the NBA owners are involved in widescale rigging, cheating and swindling, then that means literally every sport has owners involved in this sort of thing, at which point.. why do you guys even watch sports?

[pepe1991]

I wrote about Rozier thing that league "cleared him" but FBI didn't, like month ago. Because it was another lie from Silver & company in his damage control.

The FBI has like 20x the resources, manpower, and know how than the NBA as far as being able to investigate deeply outside of social media monitoring and getting tipped off/being able to verify said claims. He also mysteriously had an "injury" as soon as the reports came out, so the NBA definitely were not intent on letting him play, although there probably was not enough to confirm or deny completely. I would assume the FBI may have tipped the NBA off on their investigation as well, so maybe there was communication there.

Things would be more believable if people weren't like "The NBA is rife with corruption and cheating and greed but they would put their reputation and standing on the line in order to protect Terry Rozier. But Jontay Porter? **** that guy."

As for lottery & draft... i just can't convince myself that in room of 30 billionaires they actually care about integrity of sport or anything else but money. Or that in such setting something as stupid as dumb luck would ever play role. They aren't billionaires because they leave anything for Fortuna. They create and control luck.

Billionaires are greedy for themselves. I cannot stress how little they would care about "rewarding" Dallas with Flagg just to get heat off of Nico Harrison or make them relevant. Same for giving the Spurs the greatest prospect since Bron.

It has to work both ways - hand-wringing and complaints for 15 years when the Spurs/Duncan were winning as a dynasty about bad ratings/boring finals/bad for the NBA, and then owners deciding to hand that same franchise keys to a mansion in one of the smallest markets.

Again, I can believe in singular conspiracy theories, with bad apples and greed. What some people are saying though feels half-baked and would require WAY more moving parts, something of which literally would not be seen in modern times.

It then would require that to mean that every NBA owner is on the game, and unless you think ONLY the NBA owners are involved in widescale rigging, cheating and swindling, then that means literally every sport has owners involved in this sort of thing, at which point.. why do you guys even watch sports?

At the same time, however, Shams Charania conveniently reported on The Pat McAfee Show that Rozier was "cleared" (via ESPN):

"Terry Rozier, as of right now, has been cleared. I mean, he finished the season with Miami. There's really nothing really active as of right now with him ... NBA spokesman Mike Bass did give a statement to me yesterday. He said that the league is cooperating with the federal prosecutors ... This is a federal matter now. This is in the hands of the court."

Barry Jackson attempted to summarize exactly what happened:

"Shams said something not totally clear a month ago that led some people to believe he was reporting that a federal investigation of Terry Rozier involving gambling had stopped and the matter was closed. Pablo Torre reports this week that the federal investigation of Rozier remains ongoing and he has not been cleared. There have no charges filed against Rozier at this time, and a previous NBA investigation uncovered no wrongdoing by the Heat point guard."

This is from July 15, 2025.

And this whole issue. Why Pablo Torre, investigative journalist, knows more about shady things that are happening in nba than, Silver and nba people, with army of lawyers & experts with years of experience?

And that leads me, as spectator to only two logical conclusions:
1) they are dumb, naive and gullible.
2) do their best to sweep everything under a rug and pretend it never happened.

And I highly doubt people who handle nba are dumb , naive and gullible.


Whole concept of billionaires staying silent to me boils down to two words. Shared revenue.
How many owners even watch own teams? How many owners own several other teams ?
Mat Ishbia is Suns owner. United Wholesale Mortgage were Pistons jersey sponsor up until last season. Guess who is CEO & 71% owner of UWM ? Very same Mat Ishbia.
Peter Guber is one of 3 owners of Warriors, and in same time he owns LA Dodgers and MLF team. In both other teams ,other major investor is Magic Johnson. Very same Johnson was in same time President of Basketball operations with Lakers.
In 2016 he stared aXiomatic company. With Ted Leonsis. Who is Ted Leonsis? Literally only Wizards owner. So one of three Warriors owners also has company with soul Wizards owner.
At one point Sportradar group had this people investing in them: Jordan, Cuban and Leonsis. So 3 owners of 3 nba teams investing in same project. What Sportradar does? The company provides sports data services for national and international sports federations, media outlets, and bookmakers.. By the 2015, very same company had partnership with 450 betting houses, including giants like bet365.


But this interchanging relationship doesn't stop there, ever wondered why owners had collective "mute" on China topic ? Well, back in 2022 ESPN stil had some credibility, and you could find articles like this

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/33938932/nba-owners-mum-china-relationship-more-10-billion-invested-there


where you can find stuff like this

ets owner Tsai, by virtue of his role with Alibaba, has by far the highest percentage of his net worth -- 53.5% -- tied to China, according to Strategy Risks. Next on the list is Kings co-owner Paul Jacobs, who Strategy Risks estimated has more than 30% of his net worth linked to business there.

Jacobs is heavily invested in wireless technology company Qualcomm, which had two-thirds of total annual revenues earned in China and Hong Kong last year, according to Strategy Risks. Jacobs, a former CEO at Qualcomm, owns shares in the company worth more than $200 million. It's unclear the size of Jacobs' stake in the Kings, but a conservative estimate by Strategy Risks puts his total China exposure at about $140 million.

Jacobs declined to comment.

Another owner, Robert Pera of the Memphis Grizzlies, is the founder and majority shareholder of Ubiquiti, a wireless equipment manufacturer. Ubiquiti derives nearly 10% of its revenue in Asia. More importantly, Ubiquiti's manufacturing and logistics operations are based primarily in southern China.

My point is, all those people are well connected between each other and they don't watch sport like you and me. They are business men who are there for profit, not for some silly trophy.

NBA doesn't have to "fix " everything, League just needs "steer a wheel" in desired direction every one in a while , where owners can turn the blind eye during some moves, for moves that benefit them all.
Last 10-15 years draft results have been so shady that it is kind a impossible to not start questioning what's going on.

I watch sport because i like sport. But if i know for fact that 7 years old boys in soccer teams are being handpicked due who are their parents for selection , I refuse to be naive to fact that money & power make Earth spin. I still like sport, but since there is so much money in sport, it attracts politics, mafia etc. Like... NBA former champion, league's finals MVP, HOF player played poker for mafia. Where you go from there? Racist owner? Owner cheating cap space? Ref rigging games? Wait a sec...oh. Nevermind.

[SOUL]

My point is, all those people are well connected between each other and they don't watch sport like you and me. They are business men who are there for profit, not for some silly trophy.

NBA doesn't have to "fix " everything, League just needs "steer a wheel" in desired direction every one in a while , where owners can turn the blind eye during some moves, for moves that benefit them all.
Last 10-15 years draft results have been so shady that it is kind a impossible to not start questioning what's going on.

I watch sport because i like sport. But if i know for fact that 7 years old boys in soccer teams are being handpicked due who are their parents for selection , I refuse to be naive to fact that money & power make Earth spin. I still like sport, but since there is so much money in sport, it attracts politics, mafia etc. Like... NBA former champion, league's finals MVP, HOF player played poker for mafia. Where you go from there? Racist owner? Owner cheating cap space? Ref rigging games? Wait a sec...oh. Nevermind.

IMO what it seems to me is that there is SO much money to be made in sports/gambling is that there are probably 50,000 flies running into an NBA windshield. Sports betting, mafia, illegal gambling, corrupt refs, NBA players being tempted to make extra money, owners trying to sign players under the table, etc. You will get some of those flies in your car.

Do you remember the health care fraud stuff with a ring of former NBA players? Glen Davis, Dooling, etc. So to me, you will always see issues of greed/cheating/etc. We don't know how many things go unseen. I'm sure there are competitive advantages for superstars. I think Wade was probably on HGH, maybe even LeBron too. MJ definitely got caught up in gambling stuff in his day. Kobe's case probably got preferential treatment.

However, what I DON'T think is that there is some NBA cabal trying to steer rookies towards specific teams and willingly giving talent away to other teams for "the betterment of the NBA" - too many things would need to happen. I think you see a team like LA benefit from being in LA and offering certain things other cities can't. I truly don't think draft stuff is even feasible nowadays. Not since the new way of doing it. There are simply issues with lottery system that isn't like the NFL which the worst teams get the first pick.. but the fans of the NBA were whining about tanking and that happening already, so that also seems hard to just go to as a default thing.

It's not that sports aren't corrupt or that people aren't inherently greedy - it's that the specificities of what people think are going on are probably not happening, and you have a bunch of little things like the Aspiration stuff, sports betting, mafia, etc, that is actually happening, compared to like all the owners being the Illuminati and 50 refs cheating because of bad calls

[pepe1991]

My point is, all those people are well connected between each other and they don't watch sport like you and me. They are business men who are there for profit, not for some silly trophy.

NBA doesn't have to "fix " everything, League just needs "steer a wheel" in desired direction every one in a while , where owners can turn the blind eye during some moves, for moves that benefit them all.
Last 10-15 years draft results have been so shady that it is kind a impossible to not start questioning what's going on.

I watch sport because i like sport. But if i know for fact that 7 years old boys in soccer teams are being handpicked due who are their parents for selection , I refuse to be naive to fact that money & power make Earth spin. I still like sport, but since there is so much money in sport, it attracts politics, mafia etc. Like... NBA former champion, league's finals MVP, HOF player played poker for mafia. Where you go from there? Racist owner? Owner cheating cap space? Ref rigging games? Wait a sec...oh. Nevermind.

IMO what it seems to me is that there is SO much money to be made in sports/gambling is that there are probably 50,000 flies running into an NBA windshield. Sports betting, mafia, illegal gambling, corrupt refs, NBA players being tempted to make extra money, owners trying to sign players under the table, etc. You will get some of those flies in your car.

Do you remember the health care fraud stuff with a ring of former NBA players? Glen Davis, Dooling, etc. So to me, you will always see issues of greed/cheating/etc. We don't know how many things go unseen. I'm sure there are competitive advantages for superstars. I think Wade was probably on HGH, maybe even LeBron too. MJ definitely got caught up in gambling stuff in his day. Kobe's case probably got preferential treatment.

However, what I DON'T think is that there is some NBA cabal trying to steer rookies towards specific teams and willingly giving talent away to other teams for "the betterment of the NBA" - too many things would need to happen. I think you see a team like LA benefit from being in LA and offering certain things other cities can't. I truly don't think draft stuff is even feasible nowadays. Not since the new way of doing it. There are simply issues with lottery system that isn't like the NFL which the worst teams get the first pick.. but the fans of the NBA were whining about tanking and that happening already, so that also seems hard to just go to as a default thing.

It's not that sports aren't corrupt or that people aren't inherently greedy - it's that the specificities of what people think are going on are probably not happening, and you have a bunch of little things like the Aspiration stuff, sports betting, mafia, etc, that is actually happening, compared to like all the owners being the Illuminati and 50 refs cheating because of bad calls

It's matter of own opinion, and ofc i can't "prove " anything, but if we time-travel in 2023 and i tell you one owner is cheating cap space by sending shadow investments through middle company that has shadow contract with player, who is obligated to do nothing by contract, and head coach of nba team is playing poker for mafia, as one former upper level role player is betting on games he plays, would you believe me? I wouldn't believe myself

Draft will always be hottest topic , because that's only path of potential superstar into a league. If you can prove draft is rigged, than whole league loses value and there is no point of watching basketball wwe. If that happens, league will be pretty much dead.
But in same fashion CBA was held as holy Grail of parity until we learned owners cheat.

It will be interesting follow up by NBA in post Aspiration / Billups nba world.

[drsd]

Problem with NBA is how incompetent Silver has been about everything.

If one accepts that Silver works for the owners and that his job is to create as much market evaluation of the teams as possible, with a short term increase in opperating revenues year to year vie TV/streaming deals, under that lens, Silver is a Jedi-master at his job.

Most NBA teams increase in value 20%-40% annually. Is there another investment on Earth that pays that sort of return?

With another lens, Silver is running one of the great Ponzi schemes of our time; perhaps behind crypto currency, but way ahead of Amway!

[Indomitable]

So we allow teams to essentially throw games all the time on purpose by tanking. It’s for the organizations benefit? Now tie in betting sponsors every where.

Players colluding is a major problem but it’s openly ok to tank and reap benefits.

It is human nature. Always trying to take easiest road.

[BadMofoPimp]

Has to be one of:

Moritz Wagner
Chuma Okeke
Bol Bol
Jalen Suggs
Caleb Houstan

or 2nd game of:
Paolo Banchero
Franz Wagner
Wendell Carter Jr.
Markelle Fultz
Gary Harris

Probably the game where the backups started

[KillMonger]

magic says it doesn't think any of their current players had anything to do with it....

[BadMofoPimp]

I could see someone like Bol Bol being he could use extra cash loot spending pocket cash.

[SOUL]

I could see someone like Bol Bol being he could use extra cash loot spending pocket cash.

There was no implication that said player was betting on games like Rozier/Porter - only that someone "leveraged" their friendship with a player to learn the team was sitting guys.

[BadMofoPimp]

I could see someone like Bol Bol being he could use extra cash loot spending pocket cash.

There was no implication that said player was betting on games like Rozier/Porter - only that someone "leveraged" their friendship with a player to learn the team was sitting guys.

So, what you are saying, is helping the Mob make money with insider info is that much better? Better than Rozier intentionally tanking in games possibly.

[SOUL]

So, what you are saying, is helping the Mob make money with insider info is that much better? Better than Rozier intentionally tanking in games possibly.

I mean, it would be entirely dependent on if they knew what the person was getting into or not behind the scenes. I'd say it's already extremely iffy to mention anything to anybody, but if you're assuming you're telling a friend you think is sports betting that your team isn't playing their normal starters that night versus actively betting on games (Jontay) or manipulating injuries mid-game (Rozier), there's obviously levels to it lol.

If I tell my cousin that some store that I work at is going to close early, and he goes in and robs the place because he knows some extra information, there's a difference between if I know he's going to rob the place versus thinking he just wants to pick some item up.

I'm just going by the words they used - "leveraged", not implicated or directly involved (as of yet). Also, it's information that would've came out regardless before the game, but this was probably before any big changes from the sportsbooks.

[Skybox]

Shocking


Probably Fultz, imo. That’s why he wasn’t brought back last year imo.

There’s probably 100 pages of why he wasn’t brought back …by any team

[VFX]

Lakers get your star, you "win lottery".
3 times from 2012-2025

Gotta have them in LAL

.02% chance Dallas won the Cooper Flagg sweepstakes after trading their generational talent for crippled aging Anthony Davis.

Totally not the same thing as Pelicans forced into trading Anthony Davis to LA and winning the Zion sweepstakes for equally skewed odds right?

Totally a coincidence! Odds and statistics yknow?! People are gullible thinking there isn’t money to be earned behind such miracle chances. The nba thinks its fans are stupid and that’s because 90% probably are that dumb.

When Doncic is 40 he’ll be traded for some established generational allstar to Memphis and they’ll “win” some heralded talent probably with .001 odds.

[basketballRob]

I think people will start questioning tank moves by coaches. It's obvious they try to lose to get a higher draft pick, but now they will have more scrutiny.

Sent from my SM-G998U1 using RealGM mobile app

[davey_wavy]

Rumor around Orlando... It was Travis Diener

[basketballRob]

Rumor around Orlando... It was Travis Diener

I could see KCP being involved in gambling.

I also think people had inside info on Paolo being the #1 pick because the betting lines flipped right before the draft, like big money had just been bet on Paolo being the #1.

Sent from my SM-G998U1 using RealGM mobile app