OT: Why oil prices are so high?

[flyingvee]

For most basic purposes, yea, people can buy what they want and in essence they are ones paying for all that gas, BUT and the huge BUT is that they consume 3 times more gas than you might, and that multiplies fast, so a major reason we all pay so much at the pump is because of these greedy Hummer and SUV drivers. So it affects all of us.

[spinedoc]

The onus on fuel efficient automobiles should be put on the auto makers, not the citizens. I own an SUV as a second vehicle. Its not much different than a truck, but I use it to cart my dogs around or make a Lowe's trip now and then. I also live four houses down from my practice, so I walk a lot to make up for it though.

I read somewhere that the big three buy the patents of fuel efficient parts and bury them. This story was related to a carburator that nearly quadrupled the mpg of vehicles and they quashed it. They have done it throughout history and have been in bed with the oil industry for far too long. Just look at the hybrids, and their cost. Why so much money for them, and so little amount of pumps? Does the government give you a rebate if you buy one, why not? Instead you have the government giving massive tax rebates to the oil and gas industry and not requiring them to invest into alternative fuels. The priorities are skewed the wrong way imo. Honestly, the whole thing is a scam.

[Potterman]

I think it all basically adds up. You can't put the finger on just one thing. It's odd coincidences that Bush does have "oil interests" and the prices still rise.

It's also a huge factor about developing countries...war scares driving up the price... lack of support to go to another energy standard...

Heck the way I see it i'll keep paying premium in my good ol' Chevy Camaro Z28 until they offer an incentive to go Hybrid. Otherwise I am not putting myself into more debt just to get a Toyota Corolla and save on gas (which btw puts out just as much bad emissions as my Z28).

[ivDT]

semi-serious question:

has anyone met a hummer owner who wasn't some sort of drooling sociopath?

i still remember one of these upper management types from the office across from mine who had a train horn installed in her H3.

a train horn.

and every day, right around closing time, she'd hop into her hummer and blow that goddamn horn like a special needs preschooler.

imo, it really spoke to the mindset of the people who buy these things.

it's almost like people buy hummers as a sort of big metal middle finger to everyone around them.

[ivDT]

Just checking back. Glad to see some of you guy's were interested. I didn't want to turn this into politics. I'm a libertarian.

whoa, wait.

a libertarian who understands the necessity of regulation in certain instances?

god bless your heart, sir.

[Shishnizzle]

I know, this whole situation is challenging everything I believe in. It's hard to want higher oil prices, but in the end we will all benefit.

[flyingvee]

Good point, the automakers are in on it too it seems. But right now maybe they might be feeling a bit double-crossed as lots are full of unsold SUV's. Also has anyone else noticed this. A few years ago you could get a Sentra or Corolla or Civic that actually got in the low 40's on the highway, actual mileage, not EPA. Yet the new cars even the usually exagerrated epa mileage is not higher than 34 mpg? Cars are actually LESS fuel efficient. It's a joke. We alone can't do a thing about it, but its up to us to flood the offices of our elected officials and demand that they at least make some noise, otherwise there is always their opponents to vote for in the next election. Vote all the bums out. Vote for the candidate with the least amount of campaign money and exposure. If they have raised all this money there are interests and lobbyists involved.

[Shishnizzle]

Well thats because they changed the criteria by how you calculate mileage. Now you see what you really get. The Prius gets 45 to 50. There is a vehicle called the VW Polo that is not sold in the U.S yet that gets 80mpg.

Well the diesel version does.

[Potterman]

Still though how much do these fuel efficient vehicles cost. I don't have $20,000+ sitting in a savings account waiting for a new car.

The only way I buy a hybrid is if they come out with one for less then 10(k) and that's with a loan, down payment, and possibly trading in my new car.

[N4U|Redux]

Well thats because they changed the criteria by how you calculate mileage. Now you see what you really get. The Prius gets 45 to 50. There is a vehicle called the VW Polo that is not sold in the U.S yet that gets 80mpg.

Well the diesel version does.

Exactly. Mileage hasn't gotten worse (if it has it's because safety/luxury is increasing; extra weight), the standards have gotten closer to reality. The EPA estimate is no longer a joke.

[N4U|Redux]

The only way I buy a hybrid is if they come out with one for less then 10(k) and that's with a loan, down payment, and possibly trading in my new car.

Do they have many new 'normal' cars for 10k that are decent? Even cars like Hyundai sedans are a good deal more than 10k around here. You sure seem to be asking for a lot.

BTW - Hybrids are overpriced. I was going to buy one for my most recent vehicle, but I didn't think I'd ever make up the additional cost (though, with gas going up faster than I had anticipated before, perhaps it would've..).

[Shishnizzle]

N4 did you see my post on page two about the new EREV's. This is something that I would think you would be interested in.

[aleZ]

Stop whining!
You guys don't know what "high" is, a week in Europe would bring this entire board to their knees, you'd be broke in a couple days.

The US is so dirt cheap...

[BassMaster]

I agree that a lot of it has to do with artificial fear infused into the stock market. Futures of oil shouldn't be traded on the market IMO, not a commodity as important as oil. Buying stock in energy companies is a completely different story however. There are multiple reasons for the price going so high. The first on the list is imagine for a moment that Colonel Sanders was president of the United States, chicken would be sky high. It should come as no secret that we have two of the biggest oil men in government and gas has spiked the way it has. There are other issues too however, like Refining, the Iraq war, natural disasters, the strategic oil reserve, and demand, but its fear in the market that is the biggest cause. All of it is by design, it certainly is not incidental. Wake up America.

Actually congress passed an energy bill that included an amendment that would have curbed the speculators in the energy market. Bush vetoed the bill.
Right now it is estimated that from 30% to 60% of all oil prices are because of speculators. I was watching CNN and their expert said it's right around 50% of the market meaning that a barrel of oil should really cost about 65 dollars a barrel instead of the 120 plus dollars.

[Optimus_Steel]

-= original quote snipped =-



Actually congress passed an energy bill that included an amendment that would have curbed the speculators in the energy market. Bush vetoed the bill.
Right now it is estimated that from 30% to 60% of all oil prices are because of speculators. I was watching CNN and their expert said it's right around 50% of the market meaning that a barrel of oil should really cost about 65 dollars a barrel instead of the 120 plus dollars.

Thats how much it was before Katrina. About $60-65.

[yoyo65]

you think gas is high here go to canada its over $5.00 a gal go to briton or france its over $8.00 and $9.00 a gal as for bush member the year we had 3 canes the signs on i4 poped up saying he was to blame peoplem love to blame him for everything hell in a book i read of al gore he wanted gas to rise over $5.00 a gal back than read his book oh ya he wanted that to be in a higher tax on gas ohhhhh my read it

[mhectorgato]

Exactly. Mileage hasn't gotten worse (if it has it's because safety/luxury is increasing; extra weight), the standards have gotten closer to reality. The EPA estimate is no longer a joke.

The estimate is now based on typical driving conditions now. iirc, it used to be highway at 55 mph with a/c off.

*consumer reports verifies this. It also mentions that the old tests were developed in the 70s.

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars ... mpg_ov.htm

. The old system, developed in the 1970s, does not accurately reflect today

[yoyo65]

Stop whining!
You guys don't know what "high" is, a week in Europe would bring this entire board to their knees, you'd be broke in a couple days.

The US is so dirt cheap...

soooo true we have it made in this country the world market is what it is nothing to do with bush

[Shishnizzle]

Well congress has been holding hearings on it, so I'm not sure how Bush vetoed a bill. When they are just now holding hearings on the issue. Even thogh I'm not defending Bush but I would love to see a link with some info about the so called bill that was vetoed.

Here is a link about the hearings that are going on now.

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnf ... _top+story

This is what pisses me off. These are the guy's to blame for high oil prices.

Some experts fault the CFTC, charged with regulating commodities markets, for allowing such loopholes. "Congress has provided the CFTC the power to control this unlimited [speculation]; the law is very specific about establishing position limits," says Steve Briese, author of The Commitments of Traders Bible and CommitmentsOfTraders.org, a site that focuses on U.S. futures markets. "The problem is they have abdicated this role." The dramatic surge in energy prices has helped to spark inflation across the economy and, as others at the hearing testified, has cut into profits of most in the supply chain. Briese points to Treasury reports that the top five users of swap agreements are investment banks, four of which dominate swap dealing in commodities and commodities futures: Bank of America (BAC), Citigroup (C), JPMorgan Chase (JPM), HSBC North America Holdings (HBC), and Wachovia (WB).

[BassMaster]

Well congress has been holding hearings on it, so I'm not sure how Bush vetoed a bill. When they are just now holding hearings on the issue. Even thogh I'm not defending Bush but I would love to see a link with some info about the so called bill that was vetoed.

Here is a link about the hearings that are going on now.

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnf ... _top+story

This is what pisses me off. These are the guy's to blame for high oil prices.

Some experts fault the CFTC, charged with regulating commodities markets, for allowing such loopholes. "Congress has provided the CFTC the power to control this unlimited [speculation]; the law is very specific about establishing position limits," says Steve Briese, author of The Commitments of Traders Bible and CommitmentsOfTraders.org, a site that focuses on U.S. futures markets. "The problem is they have abdicated this role." The dramatic surge in energy prices has helped to spark inflation across the economy and, as others at the hearing testified, has cut into profits of most in the supply chain. Briese points to Treasury reports that the top five users of swap agreements are investment banks, four of which dominate swap dealing in commodities and commodities futures: Bank of America (BAC), Citigroup (C), JPMorgan Chase (JPM), HSBC North America Holdings (HBC), and Wachovia (WB).

Last years energy bill am admentment was added dealing with speculators that energy bill was vetoed.