Official 2025 Offseason Thread

[MagicTownBaller]

We are hard capped. We can not exceed the 1st apron under any circumstances.

We have roughly 1.5 million left. Caleb is a 4 year player so his vet min is higher and we can’t sign him to a standard contract.

A two-way contract may be viable but I’m Caleb is looking for more.

Respectfully, that simply is untrue. If it were true, then a team could not go from the 1st to 2nd apron, obviously.

What is true, I believe, is that the vet min deals cannot be for a second year and can only be for one year.

Under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll. By definition then, there must ALWAYS be a mechanism to sign a player to get to 14, no matter what the cap is at. And that is one-year vet-min deals.

With respect.

Cap experts would actually disagree with you then. From my understanding, even reading that long book of a CBA agreement, once the team has been restricted to a certain apron, there is no option to exceed that apron for that calendar year.

Now, you are right, you can exceed the first apron to the second apron, but for many teams this year, they are restricted from entering the first apron due to using more than $5.7M of the MLE, that means we cannot enter the first apron until the 26-27 season. It doesn't matter if we don't have players or not, the NBA placed these restrictions in place to prevent teams from spending all their money on a few players and then trying to fill out the roster with veterans minimum players.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

We are hard capped. We can not exceed the 1st apron under any circumstances.

We have roughly 1.5 million left. Caleb is a 4 year player so his vet min is higher and we can’t sign him to a standard contract.

A two-way contract may be viable but I’m Caleb is looking for more.

Respectfully, that simply is untrue. If it were true, then a team could not go from the 1st to 2nd apron, obviously.

What is true, I believe, is that the vet min deals cannot be for a second year and can only be for one year.

Under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll. By definition then, there must ALWAYS be a mechanism to sign a player to get to 14, no matter what the cap is at. And that is one-year vet-min deals.

With respect.

Cap experts would actually disagree with you then. From my understanding, even reading that long book of a CBA agreement, once the team has been restricted to a certain apron, there is no option to exceed that apron for that calendar year.

Now, you are right, you can exceed the first apron to the second apron, but for many teams this year, they are restricted from entering the first apron due to using more than $5.7M of the MLE, that means we cannot enter the first apron until the 26-27 season. It doesn't matter if we don't have players or not, the NBA placed these restrictions in place to prevent teams from spending all their money on a few players and then trying to fill out the roster with veterans minimum players.

So what happens if you cannot sign a 14th player if that is also mandatory?

Edit: Just found out that one option is to sign a 10-day.

[RichCollab]

We are hard capped. We can not exceed the 1st apron under any circumstances.

We have roughly 1.5 million left. Caleb is a 4 year player so his vet min is higher and we can’t sign him to a standard contract.

A two-way contract may be viable but I’m Caleb is looking for more.

Respectfully, that simply is untrue. If it were true, then a team could not go from the 1st to 2nd apron, obviously.

What is true, I believe, is that the vet min deals cannot be for a second year and can only be for one year.

Under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll. By definition then, there must ALWAYS be a mechanism to sign a player to get to 14, no matter what the cap is at. And that is one-year vet-min deals.

With respect.

You need to do your research when the MLE triggers the hard cap. That’s the key.

[Nyce_1]

We are hard capped. We can not exceed the 1st apron under any circumstances.

We have roughly 1.5 million left. Caleb is a 4 year player so his vet min is higher and we can’t sign him to a standard contract.

A two-way contract may be viable but I’m Caleb is looking for more.

Respectfully, that simply is untrue. If it were true, then a team could not go from the 1st to 2nd apron, obviously.

What is true, I believe, is that the vet min deals cannot be for a second year and can only be for one year.

Under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll. By definition then, there must ALWAYS be a mechanism to sign a player to get to 14, no matter what the cap is at. And that is one-year vet-min deals.

With respect.

The Tyus signing triggered the 1st apron hard cap for THIS season (use of MLE). Next summer, hard cap disappears and we can re-sign Mo (bird rights, and Caleb too) to anything (without a hard cap being triggered) well into 2nd apron. Though that comes with more maneuverable restrictions, no hard cap. As long as we like our team, and we're winning, we can stay as is.

Next summer, if we elect to use the TMLE, we won't be allowed because it'll hard cap us at 2nd apron, with Paolo's extension kicking in (assuming he signs it this summer). So, if we wanted to keep Tyus, without bird rights or an exception to use, we can only offer him vet min (maybe thats why we overpaid this summer?)

[drsd]

Cap experts would actually disagree with you then. From my understanding, even reading that long book of a CBA agreement, once the team has been restricted to a certain apron, there is no option to exceed that apron for that calendar year.

Now, you are right, you can exceed the first apron to the second apron, but for many teams this year, they are restricted from entering the first apron due to using more than $5.7M of the MLE, that means we cannot enter the first apron until the 26-27 season. It doesn't matter if we don't have players or not, the NBA placed these restrictions in place to prevent teams from spending all their money on a few players and then trying to fill out the roster with veterans minimum players.

Respectfully, how can this plausibly be true given that under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll.

[drsd]

So what happens if you cannot sign a 14th player if that is also mandatory?

Edit: Just found out that one option is to sign a 10-day.

Again, this cannot be true. As 10-day contracts can only be signed starting January 5th. A team MUST have 14 players - all season long.

What is true is that a 10-day contract counts as Mr 14, and twice when a team was previously FORCED to sign a 14th player, with times, this was what happened.

But for opening night: not an option. The season MUST start with 14 players on the payroll. The league has mechanisms to FORCE a team to get to 14.

[drsd]

So, if we wanted to keep Tyus, without bird rights or an exception to use, we can only offer him vet min (maybe thats why we overpaid this summer?)

Are you saying Jones at 5M is an overpay? Just curious.

[RichCollab]

Cap experts would actually disagree with you then. From my understanding, even reading that long book of a CBA agreement, once the team has been restricted to a certain apron, there is no option to exceed that apron for that calendar year.

Now, you are right, you can exceed the first apron to the second apron, but for many teams this year, they are restricted from entering the first apron due to using more than $5.7M of the MLE, that means we cannot enter the first apron until the 26-27 season. It doesn't matter if we don't have players or not, the NBA placed these restrictions in place to prevent teams from spending all their money on a few players and then trying to fill out the roster with veterans minimum players.

Respectfully, how can this plausibly be true given that under ALL circumstances, a team MUST have 14 players on the payroll.

Read the rules.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

So what happens if you cannot sign a 14th player if that is also mandatory?

Edit: Just found out that one option is to sign a 10-day.

Again, this cannot be true. As 10-day contracts can only be signed starting January 5th. A team MUST have 14 players - all season long.

What is true is that a 10-day contract counts as Mr 14, and twice when a team was previously FORCED to sign a 14th player, with times, this was what happened.

But for opening night: not an option. The season MUST start with 14 players on the payroll. The league has mechanisms to FORCE a team to get to 14.

Well, if you must have 14 players and you’re also hard capped at the 1st apron with no exceptions, you either sign a player that won’t exceed the hard cap or if all possibilities aren’t feasible, you either accept the fines, ask for relief, get very creative, or amend this part of the CBA for this specific scenario the next time it comes around. I’m sure the players also want to make sure that they can get roster spots so they probably won’t have too much trouble figuring out a solution for the next CBA.

[drsd]

Well, if you must have 14 players ...., you .... accept the fines, .....

Bingo!

A team chooses to be in financial hell. The fine must be paid.

[RichCollab]

Well, if you must have 14 players ...., you .... accept the fines, .....

Bingo!

A team chooses to be in financial hell. The fine must be paid.

We are still hard capped and can’t sign Caleb unless we make a move.

Not sure what your bingo moment was.

[drsd]

Well, if you must have 14 players ...., you .... accept the fines, .....

Bingo!

A team chooses to be in financial hell. The fine must be paid.

We are still hard capped and can’t sign Caleb unless we make a move.

Not sure what your bingo moment was.

Orlando has 14 players. Not sure what the discussion is on. The Magic is fine.
But if the Magic was on 13 players, there would need to be a way found to get the roster up to 14. That's just how it is.

p.s. I think the Magic is better without Houstan than with him. I am really OK with the Magic not having Mr #15. The million and change will be useful in a late-season, pro-rated contract.

Related: I think there is a great opportunity for the Magic to be creative with its early-season use of two-way players.

[Nyce_1]

So, if we wanted to keep Tyus, without bird rights or an exception to use, we can only offer him vet min (maybe thats why we overpaid this summer?)

Are you saying Jones at 5M is an overpay? Just curious.

Personally, thats ($5M) fine for me (we paid $7M), but he was a vet min player last season, and didnt have a redeeming season to warrant more. The only rumored teams after him again this summer where Orl, Phx, & NY. The other 2 likely only offering vet min deals.

[orlando_joe]

So, if we wanted to keep Tyus, without bird rights or an exception to use, we can only offer him vet min (maybe thats why we overpaid this summer?)

Are you saying Jones at 5M is an overpay? Just curious.

Personally, thats ($5M) fine for me (we paid $7M), but he was a vet min player last season, and didnt have a redeeming season to warrant more. The only rumored teams after him again this summer where Orl, Phx, & NY. The other 2 likely only offering vet min deals.

i would bet he could have got more last season ..he waited it out and then took a ring chase deal and bet on himself still shot over 41% from 3 and still had his ast to to ..and played in 81 games ....the team was just bad..and really are you saying and going with 7 mill 1 yr deal is overpay? really? one of the better under 30 yr old 7 mill backup pg out there not on rookie deal..or wrong side of 30....please name others? i am pretty sure he could have got more money and yrs if he went to any team and did not care

[ORLMagicGirl15]

I can’t wait to have Jalen back. I missed his gambling for steals and his hard nose defense. I also miss his football style throws to Franz and Paolo.

[drsd]

Cap experts would actually disagree with you then. From my understanding, even reading that long book of a CBA agreement, once the team has been restricted to a certain apron, there is no option to exceed that apron for that calendar year.

Now, you are right, you can exceed the first apron to the second apron, but for many teams this year, they are restricted from entering the first apron due to using more than $5.7M of the MLE, that means we cannot enter the first apron until the 26-27 season. It doesn't matter if we don't have players or not, the NBA placed these restrictions in place to prevent teams from spending all their money on a few players and then trying to fill out the roster with veterans minimum players.

Thinking this through, and came to this.


The Problem

NBA Rule: Teams must carry at least 14 players on standard contracts (excluding two-ways), with a two-week grace period allowed to drop below.

CBA Hard Cap Rule: If a team triggers the first or second apron hard cap (by using certain exceptions like the full MLE or taking in more salary in a trade), then they cannot exceed that apron number under any circumstances.

This leads to a potential conflict:
What happens if a team is at the hard cap and has only 13 players, but cannot legally add another player without exceeding the cap?

1. The Hard Cap Is Real — Not Waivable
There is no override or exemption to surpass the first or second apron cap — not even to meet the 14-player minimum.
A team cannot sign anyone if doing so would push them even $1 over the hard cap. This is an absolute limit.

2. If a Team Is at 13 Players and Fully Maxed Out
If they are literally at the hard cap, with no financial room left — they cannot sign anyone.
In this case, their only options are:
* Trade a player for less salary (e.g., trade a $5M player for a $2M return).
* Waive a player with a partially guaranteed or non-guaranteed contract.
* Use the 2-week grace period to delay the 14th signing while they clear space.


In Short
The hard cap is truly a hard stop, and the 14-player rule is enforced with a 2-week buffer.
Teams thus must manage their books carefully, because if they’re hard-capped and at 13 players, the only way forward is to create cap room or wait out the grace period while clearing cap space.

[yoyojw17]

7 NBA teams that got better this offseason, ranked by how much they improved - SBNation.com https://share.google/M3tc2Dv7ypqZVvMdn

1. Orlando Magic
The Magic went .500 last season despite being one of the worst three-point shooting teams in league history relative to era while also watching their three best players miss substantial time with the same muscle injury. Orlando relied on an elite defense just to be an average team, and their task this offseason was figuring out how to improve the offense without sacrificing defense. The Desmond Bane deal accomplished both, which is why he was worth four first-round picks to Orlando. Bane is one of the best off-ball scoring guards in the game, and he’s also a good perimeter defender. He’s not the traditional point guard some have clamored for the Magic to sign, but he’ll form an excellent backcourt next to Jalen Suggs that will complement star forward Paolo Banchero and Franz Wagner well. Olando also added two players I like in the draft in Jase Richardson and Noah Penda, and I wouldn’t be shocked to see both get rotation minutes as rookies. The Magic probably still need one more shooter in the rotation, but this feels like a legit Eastern Conference contender this year. That’s pretty wild for a team that was the 7th seed in a disappointing conference last season.

"Game recognize game" lol... They liked what "Olando" did this off-season.

And I've agreed. Coaching staff improvements were my #1 desires and they did so with two great additions. Outside of that they nailed it in the trade market, NBA draft, and free agency market. I'm excited about every player on our roster for next year!

[drsd]

I am "in" the most boring working ZOOM of all time. ARRRGGGGG

At least there are cat videos I can watch.,

Watch on YouTube

[eyriq]

Our core four will command an above-average share of the cap, but that’s the cost of building a contender. It will limit what we can pay to lower-priority players and sets up a tough conversation on AB’s extension, but beyond that the structure is very sustainable.

The core four combined over the first three seasons of Paolo's extension with make:
2027: $155.0M
2028: $161.3M
2029: $167.6M

The cap is projected at:
2027: $165.5M
2028: $173.7M
2029: $182.4M

As a percentage of the cap that is:
2027: 93.7%
2028: 92.9%
2029: 91.9%

This season here is the allocation of the cap to the top 4 players by team:

PHX 120.00%
MIL 108.28%
DEN 103.95%
PHI 102.37%
BOS 101.95%
MIN 101.07%
MIA 97.86%
NOP 96.45%
NYK 95.38%
LAL 87.98%
GSW 84.76%
IND 83.41%
MEM 82.66%
SAC 82.62%
DAL 82.22%
LAC 80.98%
BKN 77.83%
CLE 77.36%
POR 74.91%
ATL 74.16%
CHI 72.86%
UTA 71.98%
TOR 71.70%
OKC 67.83%
HOU 64.15%
WAS 62.82%
CHA 62.59%
SAS 59.10%
ORL 51.80%
DET 50.15%

[Knightro]

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