Around the League: 2024-25 Season

[pepe1991]

2 wins away from tittle and Pacers look scary.

OKC thrives on pressure on main ball handler. Pacers have like 6 men who can handle the ball.

i disagree. They have McConnell, Haliburton and Nembhard. The others get the ball taken from them a lot.

In this game in particular, aside from 3 people you mentioned, rest of Pacers team combined for 4 TO & 7 assists.

In game 1 it was ugly first half for Pacers from TO pov.

But Siakam for example has 11 assists on 3 TO so far.

[tiderulz]

2 wins away from tittle and Pacers look scary.

OKC thrives on pressure on main ball handler. Pacers have like 6 men who can handle the ball.

i disagree. They have McConnell, Haliburton and Nembhard. The others get the ball taken from them a lot.

In this game in particular, aside from 3 people you mentioned, rest of Pacers team combined for 4 TO & 7 assists.

In game 1 it was ugly first half for Pacers from TO pov.

But Siakam for example has 11 assists on 3 TO so far.

i think a lot is them giving the ball up a lot, not pounding the air out of the ball too often (though it does happen a lot with Siakam).

and I think that quicker ball movement is based on what happened to them the 1st game with Turner 6 TO, Nesmith 5 TO, Toppin 3 TO, TJ 3 TO. Carlisle is a good coach and had them adjust and move the ball around much faster.

[Rainwater]

Both teams are playing with great poise that you just don't see from other NBA teams, but tonight IND was looking special with these number of players who can land into 12+ points or even 16-20+ points on any given night. TJ McConnell was a shorter Jalen Suggs for 15 minutes too.

2 very deep teams obviously but depth is useless if you're heliocentric. Thunder and Pacers though are so democratic with the ball and so good at finding the open guy to trust with the finish. They're both playing disciplined frantic defense but it doesn't feel like it because off-ball movement and total comfort handling the ball makes it easy to find the opening.

This has been what we have lacked.

But I'll give it time to experience for our top guys and our offensive coaches. Part of why I believe our three point shooting was so terrible this year.... even with wide open shots... player lacked confidence to shoot.... once they finally got the ball. We do now know what we have offensively in Paolo and franz... And they are out Alpha 1 and 2 .... Offensive engines. Even in a democratic play scheme ... The ball will still gravitate mainly back to those two players. Just in better spots.

I truly disagree with this. The supporting cast just suck offensively this is why Franz and Paolo are forced to take so many shots. Give Franz and Paolo Indiana’s role players it’s a different story.

[Rainwater]

Pacers have best pace control ( pun i guess) in nba.
They forced OKC into playing their game, Carlisle always keeps starters fresh and has them ready to 4th quarters, that's why they have those "miracle" wins, especially against Knicks, who are polar opposite as Thib plays 6 men rotation.

They have 3 point guards on roster that are in rotation. There are several more players capable of self creation and creation for others, especially Siakam.
This concept of 3 point guards and pace control allows them to never panic, that's why they are so damn elite on a road. They never lose head.

When you look at their shot distribution it's crazy how balanced they are.
Siakam game 1: 15 shots
Siakam game 2 : 11 shots
Siakam game 3: 14 shots

Haliburton: 13,13, 17 shots.
Mathurin 5,7, 12 shots
Toppin 9,8,8 shots

They are so programmed to believe and buy into this team- first- team friendly system that they don't even feel like nba team. They feel like some Euroleague / Maccabi team from mid 2000s where all players were stars but they played in such fashion where you couldn't tell who is "star" and who is "role player" but you couldn't defeat them.

I enjoyed every second of game 3. Pacers were simply better team. OKC has pace issue, they are unsure what they want. Unforced adjustment to rotate I Hart out of starting 5 before series started was big surprise to me. Still can't understand why.

and we.have two guys chucking shots while others watch and rarely touch the ball.

They forced to chuck the ball because nobody else on the team can actually score. Like who on the Magic besides Franz and Paolo can go off for 20 especially when Suggs and Moe are hurt? The Magic are a team filled with none shooters. I just don’t get the idea of blaming Paolo and Franz for the shots they take when they are pretty much the only offensive weapons. The Magic are not Indiana.

[basketballRob]

Not sure what that means...but I can tell you, without a doubt, that Mathurin is contributing to a Finals team atm.

If your contention is that AB > BM

It all depends on matchups. Mathurin can't get anything against Black and has tried to start a fight with him a couple of times. Just brought that up because it seemed like their were insinuations that Black is only getting minutes because he was the 6th pick


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Interesting...and yet, he's killing Caruso, Wallace, JayW

Black had his best game of his career against Caruso.

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[Skybox]

i disagree. They have McConnell, Haliburton and Nembhard. The others get the ball taken from them a lot.

In this game in particular, aside from 3 people you mentioned, rest of Pacers team combined for 4 TO & 7 assists.

In game 1 it was ugly first half for Pacers from TO pov.

But Siakam for example has 11 assists on 3 TO so far.

i think a lot is them giving the ball up a lot, not pounding the air out of the ball too often (though it does happen a lot with Siakam).

and I think that quicker ball movement is based on what happened to them the 1st game with Turner 6 TO, Nesmith 5 TO, Toppin 3 TO, TJ 3 TO. Carlisle is a good coach and had them adjust and move the ball around much faster.

That's true but I don't think it's fair to say the others get the ball "taken" a lot. They are facing perhaps the best defense ever, especially as it relates to harrassing POA, helping, and forcing turnovers...they should roll over most defenses if they're giving OKC all they can handle.

But then I have to ask "why didn't IND win the East going away?"...for the second year, they are peaking at just the right time.

I'm still picking OKC, but IND is fun and Hali is a maestro.

[Skybox]

It all depends on matchups. Mathurin can't get anything against Black and has tried to start a fight with him a couple of times. Just brought that up because it seemed like their were insinuations that Black is only getting minutes because he was the 6th pick


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Interesting...and yet, he's killing Caruso, Wallace, JayW

Black had his best game of his career against Caruso.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

Man, you can generate some obscure stuff

AB is as tall as Michael Jordan too.

[yoyojw17]

2 very deep teams obviously but depth is useless if you're heliocentric. Thunder and Pacers though are so democratic with the ball and so good at finding the open guy to trust with the finish. They're both playing disciplined frantic defense but it doesn't feel like it because off-ball movement and total comfort handling the ball makes it easy to find the opening.

This has been what we have lacked.

But I'll give it time to experience for our top guys and our offensive coaches. Part of why I believe our three point shooting was so terrible this year.... even with wide open shots... player lacked confidence to shoot.... once they finally got the ball. We do now know what we have offensively in Paolo and franz... And they are out Alpha 1 and 2 .... Offensive engines. Even in a democratic play scheme ... The ball will still gravitate mainly back to those two players. Just in better spots.

I truly disagree with this. The supporting cast just suck offensively this is why Franz and Paolo are forced to take so many shots. Give Franz and Paolo Indiana’s role players it’s a different story.

Well.... when paolo went out.... they were able to sustain themselves around franz. We had the initial shock to the system... went on a 5 game losing streak while players adjusted to compensate. Then we went on a tear for a bit 13-3 or something like that.... till we lost franz.... another kick and at that point players were having to be put in primary offensive positions... and we started to crumble.... lost moe... and then ish hit the fan even more. They came back and players remained in their shrunken roles. never got suggs back... never got moe back. And on top of that... some of our role players for the future... are still under the age of 22.... let alone our two stars. lol. Yes.... i can see indiana succeeding... but they have an established star point guard.... 29 yo myles turner.... 31 year old paskal siakim as part of their core....and some younger talent. we are not in the same position as them still. Growth is happening at all levels of our talent pool.

[zaymon]

Pacers have best pace control ( pun i guess) in nba.
They forced OKC into playing their game, Carlisle always keeps starters fresh and has them ready to 4th quarters, that's why they have those "miracle" wins, especially against Knicks, who are polar opposite as Thib plays 6 men rotation.

They have 3 point guards on roster that are in rotation. There are several more players capable of self creation and creation for others, especially Siakam.
This concept of 3 point guards and pace control allows them to never panic, that's why they are so damn elite on a road. They never lose head.

When you look at their shot distribution it's crazy how balanced they are.
Siakam game 1: 15 shots
Siakam game 2 : 11 shots
Siakam game 3: 14 shots

Haliburton: 13,13, 17 shots.
Mathurin 5,7, 12 shots
Toppin 9,8,8 shots

They are so programmed to believe and buy into this team- first- team friendly system that they don't even feel like nba team. They feel like some Euroleague / Maccabi team from mid 2000s where all players were stars but they played in such fashion where you couldn't tell who is "star" and who is "role player" but you couldn't defeat them.

I enjoyed every second of game 3. Pacers were simply better team. OKC has pace issue, they are unsure what they want. Unforced adjustment to rotate I Hart out of starting 5 before series started was big surprise to me. Still can't understand why.

and we.have two guys chucking shots while others watch and rarely touch the ball.

They forced to chuck the ball because nobody else on the team can actually score. Like who on the Magic besides Franz and Paolo can go off for 20 especially when Suggs and Moe are hurt? The Magic are a team filled with none shooters. I just don’t get the idea of blaming Paolo and Franz for the shots they take when they are pretty much the only offensive weapons. The Magic are not Indiana.

We had many good shooters, but they just magically forgot how to shoot..... or they got froze out of the offense regularly and were out of rhytm all the time.
Yes we need better shooters, but what Mose, Banchero and Wagner did with our existing options was a crime.

[Rainwater]

and we.have two guys chucking shots while others watch and rarely touch the ball.

They forced to chuck the ball because nobody else on the team can actually score. Like who on the Magic besides Franz and Paolo can go off for 20 especially when Suggs and Moe are hurt? The Magic are a team filled with none shooters. I just don’t get the idea of blaming Paolo and Franz for the shots they take when they are pretty much the only offensive weapons. The Magic are not Indiana.

We had many good shooters, but they just magically forgot how to shoot..... or they got froze out of the offense regularly and were out of rhytm all the time.
Yes we need better shooters, but what Mose, Banchero and Wagner did with our existing options was a crime.

Who exactly were these good shooters that got froze out? JI? Black? Cole? Gogo? WCJ? The only person that could be considered a good shooter is KCP and he is pretty much getting the same shots and shot attempts he was getting in Denver the year before but is just missing. So to blame Mose, Paolo, and Franz for his inability to make shoots is a bit much. To compare magics role players to Indiana’s role players is also unfair.

[pepe1991]

Interesting...and yet, he's killing Caruso, Wallace, JayW

Black had his best game of his career against Caruso.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

Man, you can generate some obscure stuff

AB is as tall as Michael Jordan too.

NPCs from 2000 game stuff

[Idiosyncratic]

Pacers have best pace control ( pun i guess) in nba.
They forced OKC into playing their game, Carlisle always keeps starters fresh and has them ready to 4th quarters, that's why they have those "miracle" wins, especially against Knicks, who are polar opposite as Thib plays 6 men rotation.

They have 3 point guards on roster that are in rotation. There are several more players capable of self creation and creation for others, especially Siakam.
This concept of 3 point guards and pace control allows them to never panic, that's why they are so damn elite on a road. They never lose head.

When you look at their shot distribution it's crazy how balanced they are.
Siakam game 1: 15 shots
Siakam game 2 : 11 shots
Siakam game 3: 14 shots

Haliburton: 13,13, 17 shots.
Mathurin 5,7, 12 shots
Toppin 9,8,8 shots

They are so programmed to believe and buy into this team- first- team friendly system that they don't even feel like nba team. They feel like some Euroleague / Maccabi team from mid 2000s where all players were stars but they played in such fashion where you couldn't tell who is "star" and who is "role player" but you couldn't defeat them.

I enjoyed every second of game 3. Pacers were simply better team. OKC has pace issue, they are unsure what they want. Unforced adjustment to rotate I Hart out of starting 5 before series started was big surprise to me. Still can't understand why.

I guess Hartenstein is out of the starting 5 because the two big lineups haven't been great for them in the playoffs leading up to this series and maybe they fear with two bigs the Pacers will just spread them out and drain 3s. But Cason Wallace has been bad this series, I bet the Thunder will come back around to the 2 big lineup and just try to outrebound the crap out of the Pacers. I think they are missing Hartenstein's playmaking a bit as well.

[zaymon]

They forced to chuck the ball because nobody else on the team can actually score. Like who on the Magic besides Franz and Paolo can go off for 20 especially when Suggs and Moe are hurt? The Magic are a team filled with none shooters. I just don’t get the idea of blaming Paolo and Franz for the shots they take when they are pretty much the only offensive weapons. The Magic are not Indiana.

We had many good shooters, but they just magically forgot how to shoot..... or they got froze out of the offense regularly and were out of rhytm all the time.
Yes we need better shooters, but what Mose, Banchero and Wagner did with our existing options was a crime.

Who exactly were these good shooters that got froze out? JI? Black? Cole? Gogo? WCJ? The only person that could be considered a good shooter is KCP and he is pretty much getting the same shots and shot attempts he was getting in Denver the year before but is just missing. So to blame Mose, Paolo, and Franz for his inability to make shoots is a bit much. To compare magics role players to Indiana’s role players is also unfair.

KCP, Harris, WCJ, Isaac, Suggs all were 37%+ shooters last year.
Difference ? We had Fultz and Ingles ?
You think its all coincidence and we had better offense with Franz and Paolo but others missed becouse of luck of star alignment ? Shooters need rhytm and we had no rhytm in our selfish, iso heavy offense

[Rainwater]

We had many good shooters, but they just magically forgot how to shoot..... or they got froze out of the offense regularly and were out of rhytm all the time.
Yes we need better shooters, but what Mose, Banchero and Wagner did with our existing options was a crime.

Who exactly were these good shooters that got froze out? JI? Black? Cole? Gogo? WCJ? The only person that could be considered a good shooter is KCP and he is pretty much getting the same shots and shot attempts he was getting in Denver the year before but is just missing. So to blame Mose, Paolo, and Franz for his inability to make shoots is a bit much. To compare magics role players to Indiana’s role players is also unfair.

KCP, Harris, WCJ, Isaac, Suggs all were 37%+ shooters last year.
Difference ? We had Fultz and Ingles ?
You think its all coincidence and we had better offense with Franz and Paolo but others missed becouse of luck of star alignment ? Shooters need rhytm and we had no rhytm in our selfish, iso heavy offense

With the exceptions of Harris who is a shell of him, all of these guys are pretty much getting the same amount of shots if not more than they did last year. None of these guys with the exception of KCP and Harris, have consistently shot over 37%. This idea that Franz and Paolo are the reason why they are missing shots is just an excuse for how poorly the supporting cast offensively. I feel like Suggs last year was one of the biggest beneficiaries of Paolo’s passes. Now it is a hinderance because Suggs has decided to miss?

I do agree that Franz and Paolo are taking a lot of shots but if your other guys can’t do much else I can’t blame them especially when your 3rd and fourth options were out.

[Optimus_Steel]

OKC may have doomed themselves when they changed their lineup before game 1. Screams of extreme overreaction and uncertainty. A great coach like Carlisle must have felt like Christmas in June.

[basketballRob]

Paige Buckets is way better than Caitlin Clark. I hope she's able to stay healthy.

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