Official UCF Sports Thread - Basketball: NIT Bid? Football: Spring Practice Underway

[Knightro]

That's getting to be serious money

2.3M guaranteed with the chance to make 2.6M isn’t that outrageous at all.

He’s not even the highest paid G5 coach. 2.3M ranks about 57th in the country.

[nymets1]

So UCF and Gators are working on playing a 1 game(neutral site)?

[Knightro]

So UCF and Gators are working on playing a 1 game(neutral site)?

Not exactly.

Florida's AD Scott Stricklin said the Gators would never do a home and home with a G5 and said they would only consider 2 games in Gainesville and 1 game in Orlando (at the Citrus Bowl, not Spectrum).

Danny White suggested 1 game in Gainesville, 1 game at Spectrum and 1 game at a neutral site or just one game at a neutral site.

I doubt anything happens anytime soon.

[MagicFan101]

This is nothing more than chatting with the cameras at this point as UF and UCF have yet to actually discuss anything.

Still ... given the reply by White I don’t understand how you people continuously make excuses for this clown.

This is a business. When has business ever been fair? It’s not about what you deserve but what you can negotiate and right now UCF can’t negotiate their way to a 50/50 agreement with the top tier opponents they need. Take the good but not perfect offers you can get and build up from there.

[Knightro]

This is nothing more than chatting with the cameras at this point as UF and UCF have yet to actually discuss anything.

Still ... given the reply by White I don’t understand how you people continuously make excuses for this clown.

This is a business. When has business ever been fair? It’s not about what you deserve but what you can negotiate and right now UCF can’t negotiate their way to a 50/50 agreement with the top tier opponents they need. Take the good but not perfect offers you can get and build up from there.

You just answered your own question.

This is a business. Given their tiny TV contract money, UCF needs home game revenue more than they need a stronger SOS to impress people.

The committee is not putting UCF in the playoff regardless of what Power 5 teams they have on their schedule. It's just not happening under any circumstances. On top of that, scheduling tougher games in no way, shape or form actually makes UCF a more attractive expansion/realignment candidate in the future. That is a complete fallacy.

There's just no real benefit, not financially, not in the eyes of the committee, not future expansion wise, for UCF to do 2 on the road for 1 neutral site which is what UF is suggesting. All it does is hurt UCF in the short-term without actually providing any tangible benefit in the long-term.

And for the record, UCF has played two P5 games per year every year for the last decade. They're not "ducking" anybody.

2018 - at UNC (cancelled due to hurricane), Pitt
2017 - Georgia Tech (cancelled due to hurricane), at Maryland
2016 - at Michigan, Maryland
2015 - at Stanford, at South Carolina
2014 - Penn State (in Ireland), at Missouri, BYU
2013 - at Penn State, v. South Carolina
2012 - at Ohio State, v. Missouri
2011 - vs Boston College, independent BYU (ranked 10 win team)
2010 - N.C.State , at Kansas State
2009 - vs Miami, at Texas
2008 - at Boston College, at Miami
2007 - at N.C. State, vs Texas

[MagicFan101]

This is nothing more than chatting with the cameras at this point as UF and UCF have yet to actually discuss anything.

Still ... given the reply by White I don’t understand how you people continuously make excuses for this clown.

This is a business. When has business ever been fair? It’s not about what you deserve but what you can negotiate and right now UCF can’t negotiate their way to a 50/50 agreement with the top tier opponents they need. Take the good but not perfect offers you can get and build up from there.

You just answered your own question.

This is a business. Given their tiny TV contract money, UCF needs home game revenue more than they need a stronger SOS to impress people.

Ah, yes. Classic. "We want all the privilege but we don't want to pay for anything or do any of the hard work."

Then people need to drop the bitching about being left out of the playoffs and stop calling themselves champions. If focusing on short term financial gains is what matters then admit that and show plans for developing infrastructure on campus with those gains. But you can't have it both ways. Not yet. Not until you get into a real conference and that isn't going to happen by passing up opportunities such as these.

Get the clown out of here and hire a real AD.

[UCFJayBird]

This is nothing more than chatting with the cameras at this point as UF and UCF have yet to actually discuss anything.

Still ... given the reply by White I don’t understand how you people continuously make excuses for this clown.

This is a business. When has business ever been fair? It’s not about what you deserve but what you can negotiate and right now UCF can’t negotiate their way to a 50/50 agreement with the top tier opponents they need. Take the good but not perfect offers you can get and build up from there.

You just answered your own question.

This is a business. Given their tiny TV contract money, UCF needs home game revenue more than they need a stronger SOS to impress people.

Ah, yes. Classic. "We want all the privilege but we don't want to pay for anything or do any of the hard work."

Then people need to drop the bitching about being left out of the playoffs and stop calling themselves champions. If focusing on short term financial gains is what matters then admit that and show plans for developing infrastructure on campus with those gains. But you can't have it both ways. Not yet. Not until you get into a real conference and that isn't going to happen by passing up opportunities such as these.

Get the clown out of here and hire a real AD.

White's been amazing. Disagreeing with his scheduling strategy is understandable, but labeling him a clown makes you look foolish.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

[Knightro]

Ah, yes. Classic. "We want all the privilege but we don't want to pay for anything or do any of the hard work."

Then people need to drop the bitching about being left out of the playoffs and stop calling themselves champions. If focusing on short term financial gains is what matters then admit that and show plans for developing infrastructure on campus with those gains. But you can't have it both ways. Not yet. Not until you get into a real conference and that isn't going to happen by passing up opportunities such as these.

Get the clown out of here and hire a real AD.

The level to which you think "seizing scheduling opportunities" actually matters to UCF's hopes of getting into a Power 5 conference is absolutely laughable.

If expansion happens in the next 5-10 years, quite literally the ONLY thing that will be a factor for UCF or any other school when it comes to getting an invitation is how much money the conference will generate by adding them.

Two questions will be asked.
1) "Will our conference make more money adding UCF or adding School Y?"
2) "Will our conference make more money adding by adding UCF than by not expanding at all."

If the answer is UCF/yes, they'll get an invite.

If the answer is no, they won't get an invite.

UCF could go to Gainesville and Tallahassee and beat Florida and Florida State for the next 5 years in a row and it's not going to improve their chances of getting into a bigger conference. If it's not a win financially for the conference thinking about expanding, they're not going to do it no matter how good UCF's football product may actually be. A program's football success is nowhere near the top of the list when it comes to expansion.

[dsg2003mach1]

I like how people act like the $ shouldn't be such a factor in the scheduling decisions but it's hard to compete when other programs have 3-4x your budget thanks to all that TV money

[UCF]

We have to maintain six home games to support the program. 2 for 1’s also usually don’t come with a large payout either. Not worth it. We have Stanford at home next year on a 1-1; I’ll take 50 of those over bending a knee to UF’s demands. We’re already embarrassing them by being ranked over them this year and last.

[Knightro]

Ah, yes. Classic. "We want all the privilege but we don't want to pay for anything or do any of the hard work."

Then people need to drop the bitching about being left out of the playoffs and stop calling themselves champions. If focusing on short term financial gains is what matters then admit that and show plans for developing infrastructure on campus with those gains. But you can't have it both ways. Not yet. Not until you get into a real conference and that isn't going to happen by passing up opportunities such as these.

Get the clown out of here and hire a real AD.

This is you right now. Living proof that every single thing Danny White in the last two years has done has worked hook, line and sinker.

Let me make something perfectly clear.

Danny White knows that UCF didn't actually win the National Championship last year. The vast majority of fans know it too. It was at its core a marketing tactic and a HIGHLY effective one at that. The fans and the administration embrace it because it's worked famously so far.

We're a full year removed from it and you're still talking about it. Paul Finebaum is still talking about it. ESPN is still talking about it. College football fans as a whole are still talking about it.

UCF has generated MILLIONS OF DOLLARS worth of exposure off this National Championship claim. More exposure and free marketing than they could EVER get scheduling and winning road games over P5 schools like Florida or Florida State.

UCF got College Gameday to come and got the 8pm ABC national TV slot essentially on the backs of being loud about the situation for goodness sake.

The idea of UCF being deserving (whether they are or aren't is irrelevant) is in people's heads and on their tongues in a way that simply wouldn't happen if they just kept their mouths shut and went about their business as a lowly G5 program is supposed to do.

[tiderulz]

Ah, yes. Classic. "We want all the privilege but we don't want to pay for anything or do any of the hard work."

Then people need to drop the bitching about being left out of the playoffs and stop calling themselves champions. If focusing on short term financial gains is what matters then admit that and show plans for developing infrastructure on campus with those gains. But you can't have it both ways. Not yet. Not until you get into a real conference and that isn't going to happen by passing up opportunities such as these.

Get the clown out of here and hire a real AD.

The level to which you think "seizing scheduling opportunities" actually matters to UCF's hopes of getting into a Power 5 conference is absolutely laughable.

If expansion happens in the next 5-10 years, quite literally the ONLY thing that will be a factor for UCF or any other school when it comes to getting an invitation is how much money the conference will generate by adding them.

Two questions will be asked.
1) "Will our conference make more money adding UCF or adding School Y?"
2) "Will our conference make more money adding by adding UCF than by not expanding at all."

If the answer is UCF/yes, they'll get an invite.

If the answer is no, they won't get an invite.

UCF could go to Gainesville and Tallahassee and beat Florida and Florida State for the next 5 years in a row and it's not going to improve their chances of getting into a bigger conference. If it's not a win financially for the conference thinking about expanding, they're not going to do it no matter how good UCF's football product may actually be. A program's football success is nowhere near the top of the list when it comes to expansion.

i disagree. beating FSU and UF for 5 years in a row raises UCF appeal to a national level higher than it already is, making them someone that people around the country would turn the channel to watch, thus raising TV revenue which would make them more attractive to say the BIG12, giving them a bigger "in" to Florida and the East Coast TV market, much more than West Virginia does.

[nymets1]

I don't know if I really want to play the Gators as that's my 2nd team. I wouldn't care who the matchup. I much rather play FSU or Miami if we can play a Florida team.

[MagicFan101]

Danny White has only been here since 2015. Much (not all) of the success the program is seeing today is to the credit of people (including coaches) who are no longer here.

Danny White will ultimately be graded on the future of the program. If you look at the inability to retain key staff members, the inability to translate on the field success to recruiting wins and the inability to recognize the value of long term over short term $$ gains then you quickly see this all comes crashing down with one pass of a strong graduating class.

Gather your rose buds while ye may Danny.

Drop the arrogant “we deserve better” crap and capilize on the opportunity you have if you want any hope of a SUSTAINED program of success.

[UCF]

We’ve got Stanford, Pitt, Cincinnati and Houston on the schedule next year. All four have a great shot at being ranked given the way they played this year. If USF doesn’t suck (I hope they do) that’s another. That’s plenty to keep the argument going for 2019.

[nymets1]

We’ve got Stanford, Pitt, Cincinnati and Houston on the schedule next year. All four have a great shot at being ranked given the way they played this year. If USF doesn’t suck (I hope they do) that’s another. That’s plenty to keep the argument going for 2019.

Yea but with the scheduling of Cincinnati and Houston those are 2 teams in our conference so we play them every year. Pittsburgh and Stanford ok cool those are out of conference games. But if Stanford, Pitt, Cincy and Houston all become ranked that would be great + Memphis will probably be back and maybe USF/Temple.

Anybody saw this from twitter?

Harvey Birdman - Attorney General
2️⃣
5️⃣-
0️⃣hana
‏ @H_BirdmanAAL
21h21 hours ago

"P5" teams that have scheduled a 1&1 with @UCF_Football:
Stanford
Mizzou
S. Carolina
BC
Pitt
Miami
UNC
GaTech
L'ville

Why would @UCFDannyWhite schedule a 2 for 1 with @GatorsFB when UCF is already getting P5 1&1s? It's not like UF improves the SOS that much over these teams.

-Miami to me definetly stands out from that list as we get to play an in state team.

[drsd]

UCF could go to Gainesville and Tallahassee and beat Florida and Florida State for the next 5 years in a row and it's not going to improve their chances of getting into a bigger conference.

I was going to note that this is reverse-circular logic. But tiderulz has hit the key point. If The Knights getting 10 wins in 5 years off of UF and FSU, UCF would have several games on ESPN a year following that and that would generate huge revenue.

Plus just having one of those two playing in Orlando every year nearly guarantees home sellouts for all 6+ home games (as a marketing package).


Let's look at the SEC and ACC to see where UCF stands talent wise:

SEC: UCF over the last 8 years is on par with: South Carolina, Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Mississippi State, and Arkansas
And the ACC: Syracuse, NC State, Boston College, Wake Forest, Louisville, Duke, and North Carolina

There is little doubt that UCF in either the SEC or ACC would win conference games every year. So going back to the original argument, winning now gets the Knights more TV time to e more financially viable to be a power school. From there, who knows. Maybe the Knights is the next "Louisville" (football wise)

Another point in all of this: UCF getting to a power conference is just as much about the Mens B-ball team as the NCAAF team. That both teams are top-50 programs in their respective sports really helps the case. Add to that the sporting power (although not hard cash) UCF would bring to soccer and baseball, as well as track sports, the Knights have a balanced sporting case to be in a power conference now. All that is needed moving forward is for the NCAAB and NCAAF teams to help make the financial cases.

..

[Knightro]

I was going to note that this is reverse-circular logic. But tiderulz has hit the key point. If The Knights getting 10 wins in 5 years off of UF and FSU, UCF would have several games on ESPN a year following that and that would generate huge revenue.

Plus just having one of those two playing in Orlando every year nearly guarantees home sellouts for all 6+ home games (as a marketing package).

Let's look at the SEC and ACC to see where UCF stands talent wise:

SEC: UCF over the last 8 years is on par with: South Carolina, Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Mississippi State, and Arkansas
And the ACC: Syracuse, NC State, Boston College, Wake Forest, Louisville, Duke, and North Carolina

There is little doubt that UCF in either the SEC or ACC would win conference games every year. So going back to the original argument, winning now gets the Knights more TV time to e more financially viable to be a power school. From there, who knows. Maybe the Knights is the next "Louisville" (football wise)

Another point in all of this: UCF getting to a power conference is just as much about the Mens B-ball team as the NCAAF team. That both teams are top-50 programs in their respective sports really helps the case. Add to that the sporting power (although not hard cash) UCF would bring to soccer and baseball, as well as track sports, the Knights have a balanced sporting case to be in a power conference now. All that is needed moving forward is for the NCAAB and NCAAF teams to help make the financial cases.

Two points...

UCF played 12 games this season. Every single one of them was played on the ESPN family of networks anyway, including 3 on ABC and 3 on ESPN. Literally half of their games were on the two biggest television networks for college football. They're getting plenty of exposure regardless of opponent.

ABC: 3
ESPN: 3
ESPN2: 2
ESPNU: 3
ESPN3: 1

They also averaged 44,019 per game over eight home games this season. The stadium capacity is 44,206. They didn't have what I would consider a single marquee home opponent this year and were still at 99.7% capacity for the season.

[UCFJayBird]

Danny White has only been here since 2015. Much (not all) of the success the program is seeing today is to the credit of people (including coaches) who are no longer here.

Danny White will ultimately be graded on the future of the program. If you look at the inability to retain key staff members, the inability to translate on the field success to recruiting wins and the inability to recognize the value of long term over short term $$ gains then you quickly see this all comes crashing down with one pass of a strong graduating class.

Gather your rose buds while ye may Danny.

Drop the arrogant “we deserve better” crap and capilize on the opportunity you have if you want any hope of a SUSTAINED program of success.

ummm...no.

Danny White was hired in November of 2015. We had just had our 0-12 disaster under O'Leary, who was also serving as Interim-AD at the time. Here's a few of the things he's done since taking over.

• hired Frost, who turned around the program in amazing fashion and took a winless 0-12 team to 13-0 in two years, including winning UCF's second NY6 bowl game and finishing in the Top 10 of the final AP.
  
• Declared UCF national champs and created millions in free publicity and national exposure, even obtaining a parade at Magic Kingdom. Difficult to express how big this was, as you could argue this also led to our first college gameday visit with primetime game on ABC that evening, as well as our greatest attendance figures ever. Heck, we saw over 10,000 new season tickets this year.
  
• Hired Huepel, who has led us to another conference title and undefeated regular season and run the winning streak and 30+ points scored streak to 25-0. Both Heupel and Frost were considered young up and comers, but weren't being considered for many HC jobs elsewhere, certainly not at P5 schools. This to me shows great judgment and insight, though I suppose it's possible he's just been lucky.
  
• The UCF gameday experience is 100% different than it was just 3 years ago. It's so much better. The stadium's concessions and amenities have improved tenfold, tailgating areas are better, concert series, pregame activities, etc. Tons better than when he took over.
  
• hired Johnny Dawkins (jury is still out, his recruiting has been pretty poor, but his results good for what he's worked with, could have UCF in the NCAA Tournament for the first time since 2005).
  
• hired Katie Abrahamson-Henderson who took a 7 win women's basketball team to 21 wins in her first year, and 22 wins in her 2nd.
  
• hired Greg Lovelady for baseball. Arguably his worst hire so far as Lovelady hasn't accomplished as much as was hoped, but jury is still out.
  
• I don't have numbers in front of me, but I believe we're experience record setting donations to the athletic program.

You keep claiming people are short sighted, but then you talk about recruiting numbers when we've had two new coaches in 3 years. How is that not the most short sighted argument?

I'm not saying White is perfect, i'm not saying he can't do more. In fact, i'm pretty annoyed if it's true he never reached out to UF about scheduling a series (though he seems correct in his assumption that they want it heavily favored in their direction). And you're right, it's still early in his tenure and it'll be awhile before we can fully gauge his impact.

But he's been here 3 years, and accomplished a tremendous amount in that short time. For football, if we beat LSU we'll finish in the Top 10 for a second straight year. Two Top 10 finishes in his first three years, and you're giving credit to "those who came before him"?

Just...

[MagicFan101]

Danny White has only been here since 2015. Much (not all) of the success the program is seeing today is to the credit of people (including coaches) who are no longer here.

Danny White will ultimately be graded on the future of the program. If you look at the inability to retain key staff members, the inability to translate on the field success to recruiting wins and the inability to recognize the value of long term over short term $$ gains then you quickly see this all comes crashing down with one pass of a strong graduating class.

Gather your rose buds while ye may Danny.

Drop the arrogant “we deserve better” crap and capilize on the opportunity you have if you want any hope of a SUSTAINED program of success.

ummm...no.

Danny White was hired in November of 2015. We had just had our 0-12 disaster under O'Leary, who was also serving as Interim-AD at the time. Here's a few of the things he's done since taking over.

• hired Frost, who turned around the program in amazing fashion and took a winless 0-12 team to 13-0 in two years, including winning UCF's second NY6 bowl game and finishing in the Top 10 of the final AP.
  
• Declared UCF national champs and created millions in free publicity and national exposure, even obtaining a parade at Magic Kingdom. Difficult to express how big this was, as you could argue this also led to our first college gameday visit with primetime game on ABC that evening, as well as our greatest attendance figures ever. Heck, we saw over 10,000 new season tickets this year.
  
• Hired Huepel, who has led us to another conference title and undefeated regular season and run the winning streak and 30+ points scored streak to 25-0. Both Heupel and Frost were considered young up and comers, but weren't being considered for many HC jobs elsewhere, certainly not at P5 schools. This to me shows great judgment and insight, though I suppose it's possible he's just been lucky.
  
• The UCF gameday experience is 100% different than it was just 3 years ago. It's so much better. The stadium's concessions and amenities have improved tenfold, tailgating areas are better, concert series, pregame activities, etc. Tons better than when he took over.
  
• hired Johnny Dawkins (jury is still out, his recruiting has been pretty poor, but his results good for what he's worked with, could have UCF in the NCAA Tournament for the first time since 2005).
  
• hired Katie Abrahamson-Henderson who took a 7 win women's basketball team to 21 wins in her first year, and 22 wins in her 2nd.
  
• hired Greg Lovelady for baseball. Arguably his worst hire so far as Lovelady hasn't accomplished as much as was hoped, but jury is still out.
  
• I don't have numbers in front of me, but I believe we're experience record setting donations to the athletic program.

You keep claiming people are short sighted, but then you talk about recruiting numbers when we've had two new coaches in 3 years. How is that not the most short sighted argument?

I'm not saying White is perfect, i'm not saying he can't do more. In fact, i'm pretty annoyed if it's true he never reached out to UF about scheduling a series (though he seems correct in his assumption that they want it heavily favored in their direction). And you're right, it's still early in his tenure and it'll be awhile before we can fully gauge his impact.

But he's been here 3 years, and accomplished a tremendous amount in that short time. For football, if we beat LSU we'll finish in the Top 10 for a second straight year. Two Top 10 finishes in his first three years, and you're giving credit to "those who came before him"?

Just...

People always say that if you can’t say something nice then don’t say anything at all. So I will start off with:

Missing the point is a skill you have mastered.

There you go. Your one compliment of the day.


Now, I understand that I have the luxury of being a long time fan of multiple programs with very different history. People who have known nothing but UCF are new to this so allow me to enlighten you. No program is defined by a single year or even stretch of years. No program is immune to down eras. Similarly, even the lowliest of programs can strike gold with the right recruiting class and experience unsustainable success.

So what is it about some programs which allows them to endure down times which a program like UCF could focus on to sustain their current success?

Your list here is a perfect example of focusing on the wrong items. True, a lot of it expands beyond football and is irrelivent to this discussion. You’re focusing on spot instance events rather than building roots for the future. Tangible things which correlate to a constant stream of success are not trending away from the norm over the past 10 years. All signs point to recent success being a flash in the pan.

Let’s see if Danny’s scheduling bluff works out and / or if recruiting finishes strong.