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Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic

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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#301 » by bigdogdylan5 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:38 am

pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.

This has to win some kind of award. This post makes the whole big baby Davis gonna prove you wrong posts look smart
Fine print disclaimer for Fultz:
I am high on Markelle Fultz. Yes I understand he is not perfect and needs to shoot more and better and turn the ball over less. I would really like to see him play one more year… and I did and he sucks time to move on.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#302 » by bigdogdylan5 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:44 am

I will to continue to try and preach patience. WeHam and Clifford deserve a lot of credit for the progress we have made as an organization and I really don’t understand how that can be debatable. We are respected around the league and no longer in the perennial basement. This is their jobs and they haven’t given us any reason to doubt them
Fine print disclaimer for Fultz:
I am high on Markelle Fultz. Yes I understand he is not perfect and needs to shoot more and better and turn the ball over less. I would really like to see him play one more year… and I did and he sucks time to move on.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#303 » by thelead » Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:55 am

bigdogdylan5 wrote:I will to continue to try and preach patience. WeHam and Clifford deserve a lot of credit for the progress we have made as an organization and I really don’t understand how that can be debatable. We are respected around the league and no longer in the perennial basement. This is their jobs and they haven’t given us any reason to doubt them

I agree but they’re in a tough spot right now. If they resign Vuc and Ross we’ll have to pray that one of the young guys turns into a top 10 player to truly take the next step forward (or that they can be packaged and traded for one). If they let Vuc and Ross walk, the general fan population won’t understand why we’re taking a step backwards.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#304 » by WillyJakkz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:41 am

SOUL wrote:
WillyJakkz wrote:Said it earlier Okeke is practically a 6'7" Al Horford, not ideal for us.

And the notion of drafting another young PF to serve as a backup is ludicrous when we could address other positions. Too many young guys at that spot for us unless we went with Bol who has the best potential of them all. Go big or go home if you get an injured guy if that's the case.

FA is where we should've gotten a backup PF who we all see as a backup vs the draft.


If we get a 6'7 Al Horford on the roster even if we had 8 PFs at pick 16, I'm stoked.


Yeah but he can't quite do what Horford does because he's 6'7" not 6'10" like Al Horford.

His skillset is similar to Al Horford was my point lol
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#305 » by tiderulz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:51 am

spinedoc wrote:
tiderulz wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
I was going to say Barkley but he was only like 6'5". Maybe Zion Williamson.

Not a good comparison, but Anthony Bennett.
Measuring 6-7 in shoes at the Nike Hoop Summit eight months ago (and at the 2011 LeBron James Skills Academy), Bennett is somewhat undersized for a power forward, but makes up for that with his 7-1 wingspan, strong 239 pound frame, and excellent athleticism.


6-8, 245, and Steven A. Smith's biggest draft bust of all time, lol. And Love, 245 and 6-10. Don't dare mention AG, its my main criticism of him. He's the poster child right now for me. Keep trying. :D

Anthony Bennett Weight: 239 lbs. Height (w/shoes): 6'7" Wingspan: 7'1" - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Anthony-Bennett-5866/ ©DraftExpress

from NBAdraft.net

Code: Select all

Notes: Measured 6'7 (in shoes) 242 lbs, with a 7'1 wingspan at the LeBron James Skills Academy


so 6'7
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#306 » by WillyJakkz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:52 am

SOUL wrote:
WillyJakkz wrote:Bol who has the best potential of them all.


This is just opinion and 29 teams disagreed with it. So while 29 GMs could technically be wrong, it doesn't make your statement true. Just have to wait and see.


Well we saw 9 games from him and he is ridiculously talented.

My belief is the foot injury is just so scary for 7'0"+ players that it's too high a risk when guys like Bill Walton Yao Ming Rik Smits Zydrunas Ilgauskas are the standard bearer for the possible outcome. Though Big Z did well afterwards.

I just think the knee is also a very important part of a basketball players anatomy because of the running and jumping thing those guys do /greenfont.

Then you look at a Derrick Rose etc who were ultra athletic and the regression it had on their game. I'd take my chances with the 7'2" guy who put up 21pts 9rebs 2blks and can shoot the 3 and let him rehab and train for the most part of the season before getting him on the court.

Just seems like we wasted a pick and unlike Fran Vasquez this guy is actually here but other guys were on the board (Little, Fernando, NAW) hell even Tacko Fall at least.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#307 » by tiderulz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:58 am

Message Boar wrote:
Bakomagic wrote:
MagicMatic wrote:
Not necessarily a knock on Okeke. I like the pick in a vacuum for what he can provide. NAW and others would have had more opportunity and could have possibly provided more.



Isn't Okeke a bigger version of NAW though , like small forward/ small ball power forward Version

NBA Draftnet Bio


I was having this same thought earlier today. Sadly also an injured version (but I'm confident he can bounce back) and at a position where the road to a significant role is a lot more muddled than at either guard position. But if you liked NAW as a prospect you'll probably also like Okeke.

except they are nothing alike as prospects and skill set, except they both can shoot.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#308 » by tiderulz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:00 am

Instincts wrote:
IllMagic04 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.
Its def crossed my mind. Dont forget about the draft flatened out trade, which lead to the Fultz trade. I wouldnt be shocked if Fuktz still aint playing to start next year. I doubt Okeke plays at all next year. Just keep kicking the can down the road. Keep eating off Hennys players and make the playoffs. So now some people actually think they've done something. Its brilliant actually.

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I think people at this point have grown so used to the mediocrity that they have a hard time seeing change even when it is happening right in front of them. Not all these players will hit, but we suddenly have a stable of young talent. And it sounds like a Weltman cliche, but the value of compiling a group of young talented men who have high character, unselfish traits is being underestimated.

Character aside, I like the compilation, talent, and player type being established, reminds me of a young group of raptors, but bigger, faster, and stronger, sure we are still a Kawhi, but so was Toronto last year. We are becoming a real championship setup for right young star. And like or not, Weltman has developed a culture in the organization that is initiative and team focused, and players want to be apart of it. There was a time when Orlando was a free agent destination, I believe those days are close to returning.

only when we overpaid/max paid for them. who were the big names? last one really was Lewis and we drastically overpaid for him
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#309 » by tiderulz » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:02 am

bigdogdylan5 wrote:I will to continue to try and preach patience. WeHam and Clifford deserve a lot of credit for the progress we have made as an organization and I really don’t understand how that can be debatable. We are respected around the league and no longer in the perennial basement. This is their jobs and they haven’t given us any reason to doubt them

ehh, i debate that. the progress made came from Clifford. What key acquisitions have they made for the team that made the playoffs?
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#310 » by pepe1991 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:29 am

Skin wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.

Who did you want them to take?



Guard.
And since NAW was just there, him.
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#311 » by pepe1991 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:37 am

bigdogdylan5 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.

This has to win some kind of award. This post makes the whole big baby Davis gonna prove you wrong posts look smart


Harsh. I said it crossed mine mind.
Two old guys for 3 years refusing to do major moves, at job that is probably their last job in their careers.

They refuse to do anything major, that's factual.
Hennigan's last day at a job had this roster:
Vuc, Gordon,Evan, Ross, DJ Augustin
Magic best 5 players, two years later, under new front office is: Vuc, Gordon, Ross,Evan, Dj Augustin.

They lierally only added Isaac as somebody who has any on court value ( and even he is nothing more but limited role player).
Others? Bunch of draft picks that can't or don't play.

Biggest credit i can give to them is Steve Clifford.
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#312 » by bigdogdylan5 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:54 am

thelead wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:I will to continue to try and preach patience. WeHam and Clifford deserve a lot of credit for the progress we have made as an organization and I really don’t understand how that can be debatable. We are respected around the league and no longer in the perennial basement. This is their jobs and they haven’t given us any reason to doubt them

I agree but they’re in a tough spot right now. If they resign Vuc and Ross we’ll have to pray that one of the young guys turns into a top 10 player to truly take the next step forward (or that they can be packaged and traded for one). If they let Vuc and Ross walk, the general fan population won’t understand why we’re taking a step backwards.

We definitely have some really tough decisions and I am not going to deny that. For me I go back and forth every couple days on Vuc to bring him back. But I think our guys will make the correct call. It’s tough I want to get that superstar to push us into contending but I feel like the better way is building a winning culture and getting respected so we can trade for a star or maybe even get one in FA. The only thing I know for sure is I don’t want to tank.
Fine print disclaimer for Fultz:
I am high on Markelle Fultz. Yes I understand he is not perfect and needs to shoot more and better and turn the ball over less. I would really like to see him play one more year… and I did and he sucks time to move on.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#313 » by bigdogdylan5 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:05 am

tiderulz wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:I will to continue to try and preach patience. WeHam and Clifford deserve a lot of credit for the progress we have made as an organization and I really don’t understand how that can be debatable. We are respected around the league and no longer in the perennial basement. This is their jobs and they haven’t given us any reason to doubt them

ehh, i debate that. the progress made came from Clifford. What key acquisitions have they made for the team that made the playoffs?

So they get no credit for hiring Clifford?? I will argue there biggest asset is what I am preaching patience. They could have traded Vuc for pennies on the dollar like most people including me wanted. Then he went and had best season of his career. Now everyone wants them to dump Fournier coming off his bad season. They are building this slow and methodical. There are no short cuts here. You try to do short cuts you end up with the oladipo and Sabonis for ibaka trade and biyombo contract.
Fine print disclaimer for Fultz:
I am high on Markelle Fultz. Yes I understand he is not perfect and needs to shoot more and better and turn the ball over less. I would really like to see him play one more year… and I did and he sucks time to move on.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#314 » by KillMonger » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:29 am

I've calmed down a lot on this pick, I guess we'll have to see if this works out. Why did it have to be a guy who's injured man? If he's projected to return around Jan-Feb would it even make sense to bring him back at all this season?

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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#315 » by Skin » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:25 am

Solid Snake wrote:I've calmed down a lot on this pick, I guess we'll have to see if this works out. Why did it have to be a guy who's injured man? If he's projected to return around Jan-Feb would it even make sense to bring him back at all this season?

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At least we don't have to wait for his body to gain muscle and weight. I'll take half a season of injury recovery over 2-3 years of body development. Be patient my friends. We are not chasing the title tomorrow.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#316 » by paperboymafia » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:33 am

pepe1991 wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.

This has to win some kind of award. This post makes the whole big baby Davis gonna prove you wrong posts look smart


Harsh. I said it crossed mine mind.
Two old guys for 3 years refusing to do major moves, at job that is probably their last job in their careers.

They refuse to do anything major, that's factual.

Hennigan's last day at a job had this roster:
Vuc, Gordon,Evan, Ross, DJ Augustin
Magic best 5 players, two years later, under new front office is: Vuc, Gordon, Ross,Evan, Dj Augustin.

They lierally only added Isaac as somebody who has any on court value ( and even he is nothing more but limited role player).
Others? Bunch of draft picks that can't or don't play.

Biggest credit i can give to them is Steve Clifford.



That's your opinion from the perspective you've collated for yourself. I understand being disappointed but they are assumptions, nothing more, nothing less. It could be that they have tried but the deals couldn't be pulled off for reasons we are not privy to.

Now, over a longer time period if they fail to make us improve, that's on them. but to assume it's for a lack of trying because of fear of a major move or whatever is just totally speculative and slightly paranoid.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#317 » by drsd » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:40 am

Fan reactions here remind me of when Phoenix drafted Dan Majerle. Majerle was a widely booed #14 selection. All he did was give the Suns 7 seasons od defense, high-percentage three balls, and very competent rebound. He was never special, but he was that kind of glue player teams need to become 50+ win clubs.

Here is hoping Okeke is the Magic's Majerle-type player.
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#318 » by Skybox » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:56 am

Skin wrote:
Solid Snake wrote:I've calmed down a lot on this pick, I guess we'll have to see if this works out. Why did it have to be a guy who's injured man? If he's projected to return around Jan-Feb would it even make sense to bring him back at all this season?

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At least we don't have to wait for his body to gain muscle and weight. I'll take half a season of injury recovery over 2-3 years of body development. Be patient my friends. We are not chasing the title tomorrow.


I also like the idea that he can already shoot as opposed to “athletic guy who needs to learn to shoot” model

And...doesn’t need to gain 20 lbs to “ handle rigors of NBA”

Easier to rehab an ACL these days than either of above
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#319 » by zaymon » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:02 am

pepe1991 wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:It feels like whole "masterplan" of Weltman and Hammond is just staling rebuild. Until somebody gets tired of their old a***s and fires them.

Evil in me tells me that i would do the same, being in 60s i would just stale and prolong things until i fill enough pockets to safe retirment.

Not saying that is what they are doing but... not gonna act like that didn't cross my mind couple of times in last year and half.

I mean :
Isaac- injury through rookie year
Bamba- injury through rookie year, sit out half of season
Trade for injuried player- sit out whoel season
Okeke, torn ACL , out for whole seasaon

It's kind a obvious that they collect players that have zero chance to contribute right away due injuries or lack of skill.
And we are entering third season with Hammon and Weltman.

Not to mention that if Vuc and Ross walk, they will just ride " now we need to tank " excuse for additional 2,3 years.

This has to win some kind of award. This post makes the whole big baby Davis gonna prove you wrong posts look smart


Harsh. I said it crossed mine mind.
Two old guys for 3 years refusing to do major moves, at job that is probably their last job in their careers.

They refuse to do anything major, that's factual.
Hennigan's last day at a job had this roster:
Vuc, Gordon,Evan, Ross, DJ Augustin
Magic best 5 players, two years later, under new front office is: Vuc, Gordon, Ross,Evan, Dj Augustin.

They lierally only added Isaac as somebody who has any on court value ( and even he is nothing more but limited role player).
Others? Bunch of draft picks that can't or don't play.

Biggest credit i can give to them is Steve Clifford.

One of the angriest and least logical piece you ever wrote pepe :p Of all people i wouldnt expect it from you. Weltman wants to stale and retire and thats why he makes risky huge upside decisions ?
If what you wrote was true he wouldnt draft and force played Bamba last year and he would draft someone like NAW, Clarke this year. It would gave him better chance to make plays every year until Vucevic declains.
He made small changes in the S5 ? He maximised the human potential he inherited. Should he make changes for the worse ?
What we do behind our veteran core ? We develop Fultz, Frazier, Okeke, Isaac, Bamba hmm could it be large core of the future ? Is rehabing and developing so much youth easier or harder than signing veterans ?
Is changing much part of the organization personel easier or harder than retaining everybody ?
If we dont resign Vuc and Ross, next draft suppose to have bunch of creators, not bad timing.
Weltman brought huge weight on his shoulders and i support him.
My money is on Banchero going number 1 !
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Re: Chuma Okeke drafted #16 by the Orlando Magic 

Post#320 » by pepe1991 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:08 am

zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
bigdogdylan5 wrote:This has to win some kind of award. This post makes the whole big baby Davis gonna prove you wrong posts look smart


Harsh. I said it crossed mine mind.
Two old guys for 3 years refusing to do major moves, at job that is probably their last job in their careers.

They refuse to do anything major, that's factual.
Hennigan's last day at a job had this roster:
Vuc, Gordon,Evan, Ross, DJ Augustin
Magic best 5 players, two years later, under new front office is: Vuc, Gordon, Ross,Evan, Dj Augustin.

They lierally only added Isaac as somebody who has any on court value ( and even he is nothing more but limited role player).
Others? Bunch of draft picks that can't or don't play.

Biggest credit i can give to them is Steve Clifford.

One of the angriest and least logical piece you ever wrote pepe :p Of all people i wouldnt expect it from you. Weltman wants to stale and retire and thats why he makes risky huge upside decisions ?
If what you wrote was true he wouldnt draft and force played Bamba last year and he would draft someone like NAW, Clarke this year. It would gave him better chance to make plays every year until Vucevic declains.
He made small changes in the S5 ? He maximised the human potential he inherited. Should he make changes for the worse ?
What we do behind our veteran core ? We develop Fultz, Frazier, Okeke, Isaac, Bamba hmm could it be large core of the future ? Is rehabing and developing so much youth easier or harder than signing veterans ?
Is changing much part of the organization personel easier or harder than retaining everybody ?
If we dont resign Vuc and Ross, next draft suppose to have bunch of creators, not bad timing.
Weltman brought huge weight on his shoulders and i support him.


I don't find it harsh. I was semi - joking , but as i said, i would lie if i didn't thought about it more than once.
I find people as super selfish creatures, i think that people do stuff to benefit them subconsciously, and on their path find a ways how to justfy that actions.

Getting youth that can't play due injuries is stailing process because it's buying time. " See, he is injuried, oh well, we will have to wait".
And keeping same vets around singlas lack of guts to do gusty moves that could backfire and lead to departure.
If i'm GM and i just enjoy money with no moves ,i would do what they do. Draft injuried players and prospects , trade for injuried players, trade away second round picks and never do jack s*** about roster that actually plays night in and night out.

I know that i'm more negative person in general, not just basketball related,but i will not be suprised, and i actually think it will happen- in moment they step down, team will be in idential spot where they were when they took over. Needing another rebuild without any playoff sucess ( other than apperance ) with them, without any star to show for.

Do i think they have "masterplan" how to steal money from stupid franchise? No. I think they know they are doing their last NBA gigs so they take their sweet time while not being in rush to retire.
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon

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