Summer Trades...never too early

[Bakomagic]

Please no: not this. Oubre is a terrible three ball shooter. Even worse than Gordon. This trade is awful for Orlando.

The Magic need to wait to see if trading Gordon for a SG makes the most sense, and we fans need to wait to see what Fournier does with his contract.


..

Might want to relook at those Oubre numbers. He is clearly a better shooter. I personally prefer AG's overall game, especially with his playmaking as of late, but Oubre is absolutely a better shooter.

Oubre is shooting 35% from 3 just like AG did last year. AG is only shooting like 30% this year. The last three years he shot 32% and 31% while AG has shot 35 and 33%

I wouldn’t be too sure Oubre is absolutely better than AG from 3. Oubre is a 33 % for his career and AG is 32%. He is skinny AG with less passing ability.

Hell, if we are going to move on from AG for better spacing (and I think we should), we should do it for someone who definitely shoots better than him, like a Joe Harris or something.

I bet Chuma Okeke ends up being an “absolutely” better shooter than AG/Oubre, as he shot 39% from 3p his two years at Auburn. His form looks consistent and it didn’t change when he was contested and or shooting from deeper range.

[pepe1991]

Please no: not this. Oubre is a terrible three ball shooter. Even worse than Gordon. This trade is awful for Orlando.

The Magic need to wait to see if trading Gordon for a SG makes the most sense, and we fans need to wait to see what Fournier does with his contract.


..

Might want to relook at those Oubre numbers. He is clearly a better shooter. I personally prefer AG's overall game, especially with his playmaking as of late, but Oubre is absolutely a better shooter.

Oubre is shooting 35% from 3 just like AG did last year. AG is only shooting like 30% this year. The last three years he shot 32% and 31% while AG has shot 35 and 33%

I wouldn’t be too sure Oubre is absolutely better than AG from 3. Oubre is a 33 % for his career and AG is 32%. He is skinny AG with less passing ability.

Oubre career 421 threes made, 32,9%
Gordon career 435 threes made 31,8%

Non of them is good at it really. Oubre is just little bit better. But Oubre is more natural SF than Gordon.

[Stuff]

I think the Magic need to trade up rather than down, even if it means giving up a player fans want to hang on to.
The only way to win in this league is with top tier talent. And if that means giving up a couple pieces to get that talent, then that's what needs to happen.

[BadMofoPimp]

Might want to relook at those Oubre numbers. He is clearly a better shooter. I personally prefer AG's overall game, especially with his playmaking as of late, but Oubre is absolutely a better shooter.

Oubre is shooting 35% from 3 just like AG did last year. AG is only shooting like 30% this year. The last three years he shot 32% and 31% while AG has shot 35 and 33%

I wouldn’t be too sure Oubre is absolutely better than AG from 3. Oubre is a 33 % for his career and AG is 32%. He is skinny AG with less passing ability.

Oubre career 421 threes made, 32,9%
Gordon career 435 threes made 31,8%

Non of them is good at it really. Oubre is just little bit better. But Oubre is more natural SF than Gordon.

This season alone, Oubre is shooting 35.2% on 5.9 threes a game.
This season alone, Gordon is shooting 30.4% on 3.9 threes a game.

This season:
FT's
Oubre: 78%
Gordon: 67%

FG's
Oubre: 45%
Gordon: 43%

Oubre definitely more efficient on the Offensive scoring end

Rebounds: I say they are fairly close being AG plays more PF
Oubre: 6.4
Gordon: 7.6

Assists: AG is a better team player as evident on Assists
Oubre: 1.5
Gordon: 3.6

Steals: Not sure if this stat is due to Oubre taking more risks in steals or is a better defender as I haven't watched him one on one much
Oubre: 1.3
Gordon: 0.9

Fouls: Oubres Fouls per game is scary
Oubre: 3.4
Gordon: 2.0

[mbn23]

Assuming Fournier opts in, before the trade deadline next season trading with Brooklyn.

Brooklyn out:
Dinwiddiie
Jarrett Allen

Orlando out:
Fournier
Future 2nd rd pick

Offseason:
resign MCW 3yr/$15 mill
resign Iwundu 4yr/ $12 mill

[JRoy]

Assuming Fournier opts in, before the trade deadline next season trading with Brooklyn.

Brooklyn out:
Dinwiddiie
Jarrett Allen

Orlando out:
Fournier
Future 2nd rd pick

Offseason:
resign MCW 3yr/$15 mill
resign Iwundu 4yr/ $12 mill

Fournier isn’t worth either of those guys, let alone both.

[drsd]

Nets Expected To Use Young Talent To Acquire Third Star

Assuming the Nets get Beal, I could see a path of Gordon ending up in DC in this as a three-way trade. Gordon to DC and Beal to Brooklyn.

What would Orlando want?
Would Caris LeVert be presumably what Orlando would build around in return? Is he and a Nets first enough for Gordon? Would a SnT of Harris to the Magic sweeten the deal (presumably for Aminu).


..

[Max Power]

If Orlando got into that deal I’d certainly hope Lavert and or Dinwiddie were involved. I think an Aaron Gordon/Aminu for one of those guys, a first and Joe Harris is very fair. It leaves us a little shaky at the 4 with Issac and Okeke not exactly proven durable yet, but it certainly gives us scoring guard depth. I prefer Levert I think to Dinwiddie only because I don’t want to see Fultz demoted right as he’s blossoming. I think the Nets are sitting pretty as is, but if they want to load up and go super team, giving up Gordon for Dinwiddie/Lavert/ Harris and a pick would be a great return for the Magic.

[tiderulz]

If Orlando got into that deal I’d certainly hope Lavert and or Dinwiddie were involved. I think an Aaron Gordon/Aminu for one of those guys, a first and Joe Harris is very fair. It leaves us a little shaky at the 4 with Issac and Okeke not exactly proven durable yet, but it certainly gives us scoring guard depth. I prefer Levert I think to Dinwiddie only because I don’t want to see Fultz demoted right as he’s blossoming. I think the Nets are sitting pretty as is, but if they want to load up and go super team, giving up Gordon for Dinwiddie/Lavert/ Harris and a pick would be a great return for the Magic.

I just dont think AG has that value from other teams.

[Max Power]

Tide, I actually agree whole heartedly with you there. Although I do believe Gordon’s value has increased since the All Star break, he’s not all of the sudden turned into Karl Malone. My only point was that I’d be ecstatic with a return of that magnitude for him. I think Lavert or Dinwiddie alone makes trading him to Brooklyn a great pick up.

[J the Drafter]

I don’t believe a summer trade would necessarily be a good thing. It may be better to keep players and flexibility than to deplete assets for gains that do little to improve the team. NBA history is littered with instances of miscalculations that hindered the long-term successes of teams.i just don’t think a trade is essential, and I don’t think the lack of a trade means that WeltHam aren’t doing what’s best for the team.

[NYG]

What would you want if you traded Fournier?

[MagicFan101]

What would you want if you traded Fournier?

A bag of Florida Oranges. We don’t get great oranges out here in Texas. That seems like a fair trade to me.

[Skin]

What would you want if you traded Fournier?

Stale bread will do.

[Skybox]

What would you want if you traded Fournier?

From which team?

Our need is primarily shooting, which Evan brings, and/or a true scoring SF. If (when) he opts in, I'd like to see him in a package to a contender, possibly with AG or even Vuc, for a young wing like Levert (and more). The Nets have two of the best creators in the league PLUS Dinwiddie and Levert. I'd like to think they need to fill out their championship roster with better complements...defenders and shooters to spread the floor. I keep thinking AG would be great there, doing the dirty work on D and filing the lanes, playing offense off of the stars. They have Harris, but could always use another shooter like Evan (more than they need Levert AND Dinwiddie). Just thinking.

Again...whose inquiring?

[pepe1991]

OPP had really interesting article about Evan's impact

Fournier shot 40.6% from deep over the course of the season, launching 6.7 attempts per game and nailing 2.7 of them. It was a true bounce back year for him from behind the arc, and the most accurate campaign he has enjoyed since his rookie season (on, it should be noted, significantly more attempts). The shot made up almost half of his offensive diet — 46.7% of his total shot chart — and he made them in a multitude of ways: coming around screens, off the dribble, from the corners, and in the clutch. Orlando needed every single one of them.

The Magic’s two-guard finished 21st league-wide in terms of three-point accuracy, and while that might seem a long way from a rank befitting an MVP case, consider this: to remove Fournier’s field goal percentage on triples from the Orlando lineup would see the team plummet from their current standing as an insipid three-point shooting team (25th league-wide on 34.1%) to truly awful (32.4%, a figure which would be good for dead last). In fact, one would have to go back five years to find a team that shot worse than the hypothetically Fournier-less Magic (the 2015-16 Lakers). In a rapidly evolving game he’s the only thing keeping the team from resembling a relic of a bygone era.

Fournier’s three-point shooting is proven even more valuable when you consider it alongside some of his marksmen contemporaries. Pulling his contributions drops Orlando’s long-range field goal percentage to a woebegone 32.4%, a decline of 1.7 percentage points that is unmatched across the league by anyone. It doesn’t matter which sniper you remove from their respective team’s data — not George Hill, not JJ Redick, not even the scarily voluminous and accurate Duncan Robinson — no absence of a single player has as significant an impact on their team’s overall shooting figures as Fournier.

It’s an unusual case befitting an unusual season. But considering the sprawlball nature of the current NBA it’s also an irrefutable case: Evan Fournier’s three-point shooting is so valuable to the Magic that he is inarguably, in 2019/20, the NBA’s Most Valuable Player.

[MagicHolland]

OPP had really interesting article about Evan's impact

Fournier shot 40.6% from deep over the course of the season, launching 6.7 attempts per game and nailing 2.7 of them. It was a true bounce back year for him from behind the arc, and the most accurate campaign he has enjoyed since his rookie season (on, it should be noted, significantly more attempts). The shot made up almost half of his offensive diet — 46.7% of his total shot chart — and he made them in a multitude of ways: coming around screens, off the dribble, from the corners, and in the clutch. Orlando needed every single one of them.

The Magic’s two-guard finished 21st league-wide in terms of three-point accuracy, and while that might seem a long way from a rank befitting an MVP case, consider this: to remove Fournier’s field goal percentage on triples from the Orlando lineup would see the team plummet from their current standing as an insipid three-point shooting team (25th league-wide on 34.1%) to truly awful (32.4%, a figure which would be good for dead last). In fact, one would have to go back five years to find a team that shot worse than the hypothetically Fournier-less Magic (the 2015-16 Lakers). In a rapidly evolving game he’s the only thing keeping the team from resembling a relic of a bygone era.

Fournier’s three-point shooting is proven even more valuable when you consider it alongside some of his marksmen contemporaries. Pulling his contributions drops Orlando’s long-range field goal percentage to a woebegone 32.4%, a decline of 1.7 percentage points that is unmatched across the league by anyone. It doesn’t matter which sniper you remove from their respective team’s data — not George Hill, not JJ Redick, not even the scarily voluminous and accurate Duncan Robinson — no absence of a single player has as significant an impact on their team’s overall shooting figures as Fournier.

It’s an unusual case befitting an unusual season. But considering the sprawlball nature of the current NBA it’s also an irrefutable case: Evan Fournier’s three-point shooting is so valuable to the Magic that he is inarguably, in 2019/20, the NBA’s Most Valuable Player.

While this may be true, I’m curious about our 3pt % in games played without EF. Probably too small a sample size but some of our best/most entertaining games have been without EF. Possibly ballmovement was better, resulting in better shot selection?

Not going on stats here, just the eye test..

[pepe1991]

OPP had really interesting article about Evan's impact

Fournier shot 40.6% from deep over the course of the season, launching 6.7 attempts per game and nailing 2.7 of them. It was a true bounce back year for him from behind the arc, and the most accurate campaign he has enjoyed since his rookie season (on, it should be noted, significantly more attempts). The shot made up almost half of his offensive diet — 46.7% of his total shot chart — and he made them in a multitude of ways: coming around screens, off the dribble, from the corners, and in the clutch. Orlando needed every single one of them.

The Magic’s two-guard finished 21st league-wide in terms of three-point accuracy, and while that might seem a long way from a rank befitting an MVP case, consider this: to remove Fournier’s field goal percentage on triples from the Orlando lineup would see the team plummet from their current standing as an insipid three-point shooting team (25th league-wide on 34.1%) to truly awful (32.4%, a figure which would be good for dead last). In fact, one would have to go back five years to find a team that shot worse than the hypothetically Fournier-less Magic (the 2015-16 Lakers). In a rapidly evolving game he’s the only thing keeping the team from resembling a relic of a bygone era.

Fournier’s three-point shooting is proven even more valuable when you consider it alongside some of his marksmen contemporaries. Pulling his contributions drops Orlando’s long-range field goal percentage to a woebegone 32.4%, a decline of 1.7 percentage points that is unmatched across the league by anyone. It doesn’t matter which sniper you remove from their respective team’s data — not George Hill, not JJ Redick, not even the scarily voluminous and accurate Duncan Robinson — no absence of a single player has as significant an impact on their team’s overall shooting figures as Fournier.

It’s an unusual case befitting an unusual season. But considering the sprawlball nature of the current NBA it’s also an irrefutable case: Evan Fournier’s three-point shooting is so valuable to the Magic that he is inarguably, in 2019/20, the NBA’s Most Valuable Player.

While this may be true, I’m curious about our 3pt % in games played without EF. Probably too small a sample size but some of our best/most entertaining games have been without EF. Possibly ballmovement was better, resulting in better shot selection?

Not going on stats here, just the eye test..

We really cought fire in that period. But it was unrealistic and not sustainable.
I mean MCW made 4 of 8 threes
Ross 11-22 for 3 over 3 games
DJ Augustin 7-13


That's 22 -43 / = 51,27% for 3

All of that production was off bench. Players that for vast majority of their min and shots get when all starters, including Evan are out.

[basketballRob]

Vucevic and 1st for "patient zero", Rudy Gobert.

Gobert on a Clifford team with Isaac would be the best defensive team in the league.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[OrlandoNed]

Vucevic and 1st for "patient zero", Rudy Gobert.

Gobert on a Clifford team with Isaac would be the best defensive team in the league.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

I don’t think adding a 1st would be necessary, especially if Utah is desperate to prevent a locker room mutiny. Utah would gladly be down with a simple 1 for 1 trade for starting centers of similar talent levels.

I don’t know how the team would function on the floor after swapping Vuc for Gobert, but I would do the trade only because Gobert’s contract expires a year sooner than Vuc’s.