Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2

Blue_and_Whte · Post #321 » by **Blue_and_Whte** » Fri May 7, 2021 4:03 pm

zaymon wrote:
drsd wrote:
jvdas wrote:There is no way Şengün drops to the second round, I think he is a safe lottery pick. Still don't see him on our team with the logjam at C. And for a PF he lacks the speed and athleticism based on the highlight videos you can watch.

Şengün with the Bulls pick would be a poor outcome for me. He does not fit team needs and there are more clear-cut options available. Even if Moody does not slide, I would muckiest rather see Keon Johnson, Corey Kispert, or Franz Wagner in Magic blue over Şengün.

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Good roller can make your offense. Even if he is Harrell thats a great outcome for mid lottery pick. 6'9 instead of 6'7, better defender, much better passer, better rebounder and better shooter. Can solidify a bench unit for years.

im not big on Sengun either. We’d be developing him along with Isaac and Okeke and I don’t like that. IMO we need more offensive versatility. I have him falling just outside the lottery. Give me Wagner, Kispert, or Johnson as well. Wagner is the most intriguing for me.

zaymon · Post #322 » by **zaymon** » Fri May 7, 2021 7:52 pm

Blue_and_Whte wrote:
zaymon wrote:
drsd wrote:
Şengün with the Bulls pick would be a poor outcome for me. He does not fit team needs and there are more clear-cut options available. Even if Moody does not slide, I would muckiest rather see Keon Johnson, Corey Kispert, or Franz Wagner in Magic blue over Şengün.

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Good roller can make your offense. Even if he is Harrell thats a great outcome for mid lottery pick. 6'9 instead of 6'7, better defender, much better passer, better rebounder and better shooter. Can solidify a bench unit for years.
im not big on Sengun either. We’d be developing him along with Isaac and Okeke and I don’t like that. IMO we need more offensive versatility. I have him falling just outside the lottery. Give me Wagner, Kispert, or Johnson as well. Wagner is the most intriguing for me.

I like Wagner, but his shooting is weird. Propably the best median outcome prospect. Kispert is a player i want on contender more than on rebuilding team. Imagine you draft Kispert instead of Kawhi or Giannis like it happended with Olynyk (good player). Johnson you mean Jalen or Keon ? I am sceptic on both, propably higher on Jalen but he has some serious character issues.

RookieStar · Post #323 » by **RookieStar** » Fri May 7, 2021 8:02 pm

drsd wrote:
RookieStar wrote:Agree. No need to invest so much in the 3rd big.

How is the SRP an investment? There is literally no cheaper contract in the NBA.

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Because our SRP can be considered a HIGH SRP or a low FRP especially in the crazy-stacked draft we have this year. That high srp we have can be packaged to get a player we want or draft a quality pick that can be considered a first-rounder in any other draft aside from this one.

I put it this way : would you use a 3rd 1st round pick just to get and hopefully develop a 3rd big for us? When in reality because of the injury concerns of our bigs ( JI WCJ MO ) we kinda need a NBA-ready big right away.

DiplomaticMagic · Post #324 » by **DiplomaticMagic** » Fri May 7, 2021 8:44 pm

Chad Ford has Jalen Green going #2 to Detroit, and us taking Kuminga at #4 over Suggs.

I assume its just speculation but interesting to see a different mock. The rest is behind a paywall so cant see who we pick with Bulls pick

drsd · Post #325 » by **drsd** » Fri May 7, 2021 9:57 pm

DiplomaticMagic wrote:Chad Ford has ... us taking Kuminga at #4 over Suggs.

Please don't sicken us with these madness thoughts.

If the Magic draft a forward over a guard, WOW.

Just trade down for Moody over drafting Kuminga.

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drsd · Post #326 » by **drsd** » Fri May 7, 2021 9:59 pm

zaymon wrote:I like Wagner, but his shooting is weird. Propably the best median outcome prospect. Kispert is a player i want on contender more than on rebuilding team. Imagine you draft Kispert instead of Kawhi or Giannis like it happended with Olynyk (good player). Johnson you mean Jalen or Keon ? I am sceptic on both, propably higher on Jalen but he has some serious character issues.

Who are you thinking of in the 8-10 range?

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drsd · Post #327 » by **drsd** » Fri May 7, 2021 10:03 pm

RookieStar wrote:Because our SRP can be considered a HIGH SRP or a low FRP especially in the crazy-stacked draft we have this year. That high srp we have can be packaged to get a player we want or draft a quality pick that can be considered a first-rounder in any other draft aside from this one.

I put it this way : would you use a 3rd 1st round pick just to get and hopefully develop a 3rd big for us? When in reality because of the injury concerns of our bigs ( JI WCJ MO ) we kinda need a NBA-ready big right away.

If you are arguing for resigning Wagner as the 3rd stringer combo-big, sure.

Then this high SRP could go to Mr. Upside. The combo-guards Joel Ayayi and Chris Duarte could be such considerations.

Any thoughts on Terrence Clarke? Good size and has hops. Just needs to learn how to play basketball.

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The Effect · Post #328 » by **The Effect** » Fri May 7, 2021 10:07 pm

drsd wrote:
RookieStar wrote:Because our SRP can be considered a HIGH SRP or a low FRP especially in the crazy-stacked draft we have this year. That high srp we have can be packaged to get a player we want or draft a quality pick that can be considered a first-rounder in any other draft aside from this one.

I put it this way : would you use a 3rd 1st round pick just to get and hopefully develop a 3rd big for us? When in reality because of the injury concerns of our bigs ( JI WCJ MO ) we kinda need a NBA-ready big right away.

If you are arguing for resigning Wagner as the 3rd stringer combo-big, sure.

Then this high SRP could go to Mr. Upside. The combo-guards Joel Ayayi and Chris Duarte could be such considerations.

Any thoughts on Terrence Clarke? Good size and has hops. Just needs to learn how to play basketball.

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Xatticus · Post #329 » by **Xatticus** » Fri May 7, 2021 10:23 pm

drsd wrote:
RookieStar wrote:Because our SRP can be considered a HIGH SRP or a low FRP especially in the crazy-stacked draft we have this year. That high srp we have can be packaged to get a player we want or draft a quality pick that can be considered a first-rounder in any other draft aside from this one.

I put it this way : would you use a 3rd 1st round pick just to get and hopefully develop a 3rd big for us? When in reality because of the injury concerns of our bigs ( JI WCJ MO ) we kinda need a NBA-ready big right away.

If you are arguing for resigning Wagner as the 3rd stringer combo-big, sure.

Then this high SRP could go to Mr. Upside. The combo-guards Joel Ayayi and Chris Duarte could be such considerations.

Any thoughts on Terrence Clarke? Good size and has hops. Just needs to learn how to play basketball.

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He passed away two weeks ago. I'm assuming that was an honest question.

drsd · Post #330 » by **drsd** » Fri May 7, 2021 10:37 pm

Xatticus wrote:He passed away two weeks ago. I'm assuming that was an honest question.

Sorry.

RookieStar · Post #331 » by **RookieStar** » Fri May 7, 2021 11:15 pm

drsd wrote:
RookieStar wrote:Because our SRP can be considered a HIGH SRP or a low FRP especially in the crazy-stacked draft we have this year. That high srp we have can be packaged to get a player we want or draft a quality pick that can be considered a first-rounder in any other draft aside from this one.

I put it this way : would you use a 3rd 1st round pick just to get and hopefully develop a 3rd big for us? When in reality because of the injury concerns of our bigs ( JI WCJ MO ) we kinda need a NBA-ready big right away.

If you are arguing for resigning Wagner as the 3rd stringer combo-big, sure.

Then this high SRP could go to Mr. Upside. The combo-guards Joel Ayayi and Chris Duarte could be such considerations.

Any thoughts on Terrence Clarke? Good size and has hops. Just needs to learn how to play basketball.

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Have you been livng on a cave these past few months? I meant that with all due respect.

RookieStar · Post #332 » by **RookieStar** » Fri May 7, 2021 11:21 pm

But.. God rest his soul.. Clarke was available, Id rather get Zaire over him. Now if you are talking about that other UK kid Boston.. because your description fits him as well.. " just needs to learn how to play basketball".. again just choose Zaire over them. At least Zaire has the "mystique" of not being able to showcase all his arsenal over them.

Yeah, sign Wagner as the 3rd stringer PF/C rather than use our asset in getting a 3rd stringer PF/C.

Skin · Post #333 » by **Skin** » Sat May 8, 2021 8:53 am

The ONLY thing in life that is keeping me from going insane while watching the Magic win games down the stretch... is Keon Johnson.

Watch on YouTube

zaymon · Post #334 » by **zaymon** » Sat May 8, 2021 9:28 am

drsd wrote:
zaymon wrote:I like Wagner, but his shooting is weird. Propably the best median outcome prospect. Kispert is a player i want on contender more than on rebuilding team. Imagine you draft Kispert instead of Kawhi or Giannis like it happended with Olynyk (good player). Johnson you mean Jalen or Keon ? I am sceptic on both, propably higher on Jalen but he has some serious character issues.

Who are you thinking of in the 8-10 range?

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I dont have clear favourite. I like prospects who can quickly process the game. Thats why i didnt like Bamba and thats why i was very high on Okeke.
Barnes, Sengun, Giddey, Wagner, Bouknight, Springer. You can propably talk me into any of them.

Post #335 » by **Bensational** » Sat May 8, 2021 10:03 am

I know Keon can’t shoot, but seeing that he already knows how to use his athleticism along with crafty pivots and fakes is what makes me think he will figure it out. His mid range jumper is like Ross’ - he gets up too high to block it. If he can extend that to 3pt range he will be a big deal.

He might just be another Hamadou Diallo, but I’d still take a chance on him.

Post #336 » by **Knightro** » Sat May 8, 2021 10:22 am

Someone else mentioned it earlier, but Franz Wagner reminds me of Chuma Okeke.

A heady 3/4 who can shoot, defend and pass a little bit, but isn’t great at anything in particular.

The main thing working in Wagner’s favor in this Okeke comparison is that he is coming into the NBA as freshman and not a sophomore and doesn’t have an impending missed season due to a blown out knee.

Wagner will start his rookie season having just turned 20 rather than 22 like Chuma.

Once you get past pick 6-7, he certainly becomes an more viable option.

Post #337 » by **Knightro** » Sat May 8, 2021 10:32 am

I also think an Isaac/Sengun front court could really work, but I ask myself two questions.

1. Is Sengun definitively better than Carter and Bamba?

2. Are the Magic willing to move on from semi-productive/productive bigs immediately to better balance the roster?

The answer to No. 2 should obviously be yes at all times, but this front office only just recently showed any desire to move things around so I’m skeptical they’re going to ready and willing to move on from young guys when the time comes.

My biggest fear would be they pick someone like Sengun and then *don't* unload Bamba or WCJ and then someone who needs those minutes gets unnecessarily squeezed out for no reason other than front office inaction.

drsd · Post #338 » by **drsd** » Sat May 8, 2021 10:36 am

zaymon wrote:I dont have clear favourite. I like prospects who can quickly process the game. Thats why i didnt like Bamba and thats why i was very high on Okeke.
Barnes, Sengun, Giddey, Wagner, Bouknight, Springer. You can propably talk me into any of them.

I had not read up on Josh Giddey. A dominance rebounder with excellent court vision. He seems like he could be a on-the-ball SG with Fultz being an off-the-ball PG. If the Magic draft Mobley up top, Giddey could be an interesting option to flush out the core roster for this team.

Perhaps from 2022/23 the roster would evolve around:
Fultz/Anthony
Giddey/Hampton
Isaac/Ross
Mobley/Okeke
Carter/Bamba

Add to that another two players on rookie deals (the 2021 SRP and the 2022 FRP), the Magic would actually only be two FAs away from a full roster.

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basketballRob · Post #339 » by **basketballRob** » Sat May 8, 2021 10:45 am

Knightro wrote:Someone else mentioned it earlier, but Franz Wagner reminds me of Chuma Okeke.

A heady 3/4 who can shoot, defend and pass a little bit, but isn’t great at anything in particular.

The main thing working in Wagner’s favor in this Okeke comparison is that he is coming into the NBA as freshman and not a sophomore and doesn’t have an impending missed season due to a blown out knee.

Wagner will start his rookie season having just turned 20 rather than 22 like Chuma.

Once you get past pick 6-7, he certainly becomes an more viable option.

Wagner is actually younger than Suggs and Mobley, and less than a month older than Cade. Not saying he's in the same league as those guys, but I do think he can make an impact next season. His BPM is actually way higher than Cade or Suggs. He was also the leader of the #5 defense.

Looks like Wagner's BPM was just below the top 100 of all time for one season, or at least as long as they've measured it. He is 57th for career BPM.

If we end up with like the 10th pick, I could see a possible promise being made to Wagner, so he doesn't workout for another team. It might be attractive to come here, if his brother is already here.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/leaders/bpm-player-season.html

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RookieStar · Post #340 » by **RookieStar** » Sat May 8, 2021 11:31 am

Knightro wrote:Someone else mentioned it earlier, but Franz Wagner reminds me of Chuma Okeke.

A heady 3/4 who can shoot, defend and pass a little bit, but isn’t great at anything in particular.

The main thing working in Wagner’s favor in this Okeke comparison is that he is coming into the NBA as freshman and not a sophomore and doesn’t have an impending missed season due to a blown out knee.

Wagner will start his rookie season having just turned 20 rather than 22 like Chuma.

Once you get past pick 6-7, he certainly becomes an more viable option.

Difference is that while Wagner is taller than Okeke, he is nowhere near the defensive presence of chuma. I mean chuma battled and stopped Ziom when they natched up in the NCAA. you gotta be hecka strong to bang bodies with a 280lb high leaping phenom...