Official 2024-2025 Magic Trade ideas thread continued

Post #3561 » by **eyriq** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:23 am

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
eyriq wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Gary Harris was the SG

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app
Exactly.

Lineups with greater than 100 minutes had the following backcourts:

Suggs/Harris, 299 min
Fultz/Suggs, 280 min
AB/Suggs, 273 min
Suggs/Caleb, 101

Edit: not to mention that the playoff back court was Suggs/Harris

Swing and miss again lol

Suggs played 31% of his minutes at SG last year vs 18% at PG.

He played the most minutes with AB and Fultz on the court last year than any other Guard. Like you stated a combined 553 minutes.

How is that a swing and miss? The established backcourt used the most and in the playoffs was Suggs at PG and Harris at SG. That's just a fact.

Skybox · Post #3562 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:34 am

eyriq wrote:
MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
eyriq wrote:Exactly.

Lineups with greater than 100 minutes had the following backcourts:

Suggs/Harris, 299 min
Fultz/Suggs, 280 min
AB/Suggs, 273 min
Suggs/Caleb, 101

Edit: not to mention that the playoff back court was Suggs/Harris

Swing and miss again lol

Suggs played 31% of his minutes at SG last year vs 18% at PG.

He played the most minutes with AB and Fultz on the court last year than any other Guard. Like you stated a combined 553 minutes.
How is that a swing and miss? The established backcourt used the most and in the playoffs was Suggs at PG and Harris at SG. That's just a fact.

Isn't it kind of an accepted fact that the offense sucked last year?...so, claiming a leadership (PG) role is nothing to brag about.

We were 24th last season, even lower this season...but jumped after the ASB (health and, more significantly, true PG play from CoJo)

Post #3563 » by **eyriq** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:38 am

Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:
MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
Swing and miss again lol

Suggs played 31% of his minutes at SG last year vs 18% at PG.

He played the most minutes with AB and Fultz on the court last year than any other Guard. Like you stated a combined 553 minutes.
How is that a swing and miss? The established backcourt used the most and in the playoffs was Suggs at PG and Harris at SG. That's just a fact.

Isn't it kind of an accepted fact that the offense sucked last year?...so, claiming a leadership (PG) role is nothing to brag about.

We were 24th last season, even lower this season...but jumped after the ASB (health and, more significantly, true PG play from CoJo)

The common, and incorrect, assertion is that Suggs had a great season because he was a shooting guard. Suggs success was NOT dependent on his playing shooting guard since he was our point guard during his successful season.

Regarding the offense, our top three options were 22 and younger. It was expected.

Skybox · Post #3564 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:41 am

eyriq wrote:
Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:How is that a swing and miss? The established backcourt used the most and in the playoffs was Suggs at PG and Harris at SG. That's just a fact.

Isn't it kind of an accepted fact that the offense sucked last year?...so, claiming a leadership (PG) role is nothing to brag about.

We were 24th last season, even lower this season...but jumped after the ASB (health and, more significantly, true PG play from CoJo)
The common, and incorrect, assertion is that Suggs had a great season because he was a shooting guard. Suggs success was NOT dependent on his playing shooting guard since he was our point guard during his successful season.

Regarding the offense, our top three options were 22 and younger. It was expected.

My contention is that playing guys out of position, at any age, is bad...probably even compounded by being too young to say "Coach, I'm not really a PG...I do best when I spot up for 3's and generate offense with ball pressure and turnovers".

Who decides he was a PG? Just because nobody else he was playing with was a real PG, the robots give him the title?

Post #3565 » by **eyriq** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:43 am

Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:
Skybox wrote:
Isn't it kind of an accepted fact that the offense sucked last year?...so, claiming a leadership (PG) role is nothing to brag about.

We were 24th last season, even lower this season...but jumped after the ASB (health and, more significantly, true PG play from CoJo)
The common, and incorrect, assertion is that Suggs had a great season because he was a shooting guard. Suggs success was NOT dependent on his playing shooting guard since he was our point guard during his successful season.

Regarding the offense, our top three options were 22 and younger. It was expected.

My contention is that playing guys out of position, at any age, is bad...probably even compounded by being too young to say "Coach, I'm not really a PG...I do best when I spot up for 3's and generate offense with ball pressure and turnovers".

He was drafted as a point guard and had his best season last season as our point guard.

Skybox · Post #3566 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:50 am

eyriq wrote:
Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:The common, and incorrect, assertion is that Suggs had a great season because he was a shooting guard. Suggs success was NOT dependent on his playing shooting guard since he was our point guard during his successful season.

Regarding the offense, our top three options were 22 and younger. It was expected.

My contention is that playing guys out of position, at any age, is bad...probably even compounded by being too young to say "Coach, I'm not really a PG...I do best when I spot up for 3's and generate offense with ball pressure and turnovers".
He was drafted as a point guard and had his best season last season as our point guard.

If you keep saying it ...it will be true. Tonight, I'm going to repeat "Isaac is a PG" 1000x and manifest it like you're trying to do.

Post #3567 » by **eyriq** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:53 am

Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:
Skybox wrote:
My contention is that playing guys out of position, at any age, is bad...probably even compounded by being too young to say "Coach, I'm not really a PG...I do best when I spot up for 3's and generate offense with ball pressure and turnovers".
He was drafted as a point guard and had his best season last season as our point guard.

If you keep saying it ...it will be true. Tonight, I'm going to repeat "Isaac is a PG" 1000x and manifest it like you're trying to do.

Who was the starting point guard for most of the season and the playoffs? Why debate something so factual?

GelbeWand09 · Post #3568 » by **GelbeWand09** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 6:29 am

eyriq wrote:
Skybox wrote:
eyriq wrote:How is that a swing and miss? The established backcourt used the most and in the playoffs was Suggs at PG and Harris at SG. That's just a fact.

Isn't it kind of an accepted fact that the offense sucked last year?...so, claiming a leadership (PG) role is nothing to brag about.

We were 24th last season, even lower this season...but jumped after the ASB (health and, more significantly, true PG play from CoJo)
The common, and incorrect, assertion is that Suggs had a great season because he was a shooting guard. Suggs success was NOT dependent on his playing shooting guard since he was our point guard during his successful season.

Regarding the offense, our top three options were 22 and younger. It was expected.

We played with NO PG and 2 shooting guards/combo guards. Just because the NBA still has to label everything to the old 5 positions doesn't mean the 5 players on the court are playing those positions.
When you doesn't have PG duties but they label you as one because they have to label someone as one in the starting 5 to not disturb the viewers who are used to those terms, you are still not a PG.

cedric76 · Post #3569 » by **cedric76** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 7:12 am

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
eyriq wrote:
basketballRob wrote:Gary Harris was the SG

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app
Exactly.

Lineups with greater than 100 minutes had the following backcourts:

Suggs/Harris, 299 min
Fultz/Suggs, 280 min
AB/Suggs, 273 min
Suggs/Caleb, 101

Edit: not to mention that the playoff back court was Suggs/Harris

Swing and miss again lol

Suggs played 31% of his minutes at SG last year vs 18% at PG.

He played the most minutes with AB and Fultz on the court last year than any other Guard. Like you stated a combined 553 minutes.

31% of his minutes at SG
18% of his minutes at PG
And 51% of his minutes at C??

Swing and miss with math :-)

MartinsIzAfraud · Post #3570 » by **MartinsIzAfraud** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 12:27 pm

cedric76 wrote:
MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
eyriq wrote:Exactly.

Lineups with greater than 100 minutes had the following backcourts:

Suggs/Harris, 299 min
Fultz/Suggs, 280 min
AB/Suggs, 273 min
Suggs/Caleb, 101

Edit: not to mention that the playoff back court was Suggs/Harris

Swing and miss again lol

Suggs played 31% of his minutes at SG last year vs 18% at PG.

He played the most minutes with AB and Fultz on the court last year than any other Guard. Like you stated a combined 553 minutes.

31% of his minutes at SG
18% of his minutes at PG
And 51% of his minutes at C??

Swing and miss with math

Here’s the data for your own eyes.

https://www.82games.com/2324/23ORL4.HTM

Min represents the percentage of the team's total minutes the player was at that position.

The same point VFX Skybox and I have been pounding for 2 years still stands. We have 0 Guards on this roster (to build with) with actual PG skills and anyone with basketball knowledge knows that. Corey **** Joseph is the best PG we’ve had since Jameer.

From the trade and transaction board here’s some outside opinions.

Orlando has got to get a decent PG. It's just painful to watch, and it's beyond ridiculous that Cory Joseph is good enough as their starting PG to send them on a run of wins.

Coby White for Orlando. Give up Black+ if you have to; a White-Suggs backcourt could put them right there with the best of the best in this league...plus you could stagger their rest so that one of them is always out there to guide the offense.

A better creator is what they need. Someone who can run a PnR, and id sacrifice some defense for it.

I’m done on this topic because it’s soo obvious what the issue is. Let’s go make a series with Boston and pray our FO make moves that actually improve this roster not make more confusion.

Skybox · Post #3571 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 12:30 pm

POR is becoming my side piece…I really think this makes sense for both, need for need. If POR has some lottery luck, they could go from “talented but confused” to formidable pretty quick. Billups re-upped and defense has become their thing lately. Simple:

ORL sends: KCP
POR sends: Simons
POR has a solid 3-guard rotation with Scoot, Sharpe and KCP, who can also defend up at the 3 at times.

Trade #2
ORL sends: WCJ, Jett
TOR sends: Poeltl
Why: TOR drafts Maluach at 7, WCJ is more versatile than Poeltl and can play PF or just different looks at C while Maluach learns. Howard a salary dump.

Trade #3
ORL sends Cole Anthony, #46, future srp
BRK sends future top 55 protected srp (cap space rental for a year…but Cole really could blow up in NYC)

ORL drafts Sorber at #16 (to ultimately replace Isaac) and Walter Clayton at #24

ORL signs Ty Jerome to MLE

Poeltl, Goga, Moe
Paolo, Sorber, Isaac
Franz, TdS, Houstan
Suggs, AB
Jerome, Simons, Clayton
*Simons is early favorite for 6MOY, getting plenty of minutes and shots. Depending on Moe, Isaac, Goga, Sorber dynamic, there could be more moves at TD. Poeltl collects many boards on both ends, good ball mover and smart screener. Tons of offensive firepower and playmaking now in the backcourt, but still stocked with multiple defenders for varying matchups.

Skybox · Post #3572 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 1:08 pm

Skybox wrote:
MasterGMer wrote:Skybox, what should be a good trade package for Ja Morant? I am interested to hear one

I can't imagine it wouldn't have to involve Franz...they have Bame already so: (I'll try to keep it simple-not easy for me)

I think Ja for Franz works straight up, contract-wise and I know there'd be a ton of disagreement about who's worth more (I say Franz is far more complete and makes for a nice complementary core with Bame and JJJ and Edey)....but Ja is a dawg among dawgs, electrifying player...just imagine the sparks from a Suggs/Morant backcourt

ORL sends: Franz Wagner (38.7m est. + 4 more up to 51), DEN 25 frp #24
MEM sends: Ja Morant (36.7m + 3 more up to 45m), Jaylen Wells (1.9m + 2 more)
*MEM does not have a frp this summer. Honestly, I don't know if this would fly for either side, but I think it's fair.

WCJ, Goga, Moe
Paolo, Isaac
Wells, TdS, Houstan
Suggs, KCP, Jett
Morant, AB, Cole

Follow ups…
1. Draft Liam McNeeley at #16 to be a young Ingles/Turkoglu at 3/4
2. Trade Goga, Isaac & Cole with 26 frp (top 5) to BRK for Claxton
3. Draft Kam Jones at #24 or Clayton

Claxton, WCJ, Moe
Paolo, WCJ, TdS
Wells, McNeeley, KCP
Suggs, KCP, AB
Morant, AB, Jones

Skybox · Post #3573 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 1:28 pm

Trade 1…
ORL sends: Franz Wagner, Jonathan Isaac, Caleb Houstan, #24
MIA sends: Tyler Herro, Andrew Wiggins, #18

Trade 2…
ORL sends KCP, Goga, Jett, ORL 26 frp
BRK sends Claxton
Why: BRK believes in a cheaper Goga (at least short term) and they can likely flip KCP at TD, add a pick and a prospect for temporarily absorbing about $10m.

ORL drafts Liam McNeeley #16 and Thomas Sorber at #18

Claxton, WCJ, Moe
Paolo, Sorber, TdS
Wiggins, McNeeley, TdS
Suggs, AB, Wiggins
Herro, AB, CoJo

Post #3574 » by **eyriq** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 1:44 pm

Skybox wrote:
Skybox wrote:
MasterGMer wrote:Skybox, what should be a good trade package for Ja Morant? I am interested to hear one

I can't imagine it wouldn't have to involve Franz...they have Bame already so: (I'll try to keep it simple-not easy for me)

I think Ja for Franz works straight up, contract-wise and I know there'd be a ton of disagreement about who's worth more (I say Franz is far more complete and makes for a nice complementary core with Bame and JJJ and Edey)....but Ja is a dawg among dawgs, electrifying player...just imagine the sparks from a Suggs/Morant backcourt

ORL sends: Franz Wagner (38.7m est. + 4 more up to 51), DEN 25 frp #24
MEM sends: Ja Morant (36.7m + 3 more up to 45m), Jaylen Wells (1.9m + 2 more)
*MEM does not have a frp this summer. Honestly, I don't know if this would fly for either side, but I think it's fair.

WCJ, Goga, Moe
Paolo, Isaac
Wells, TdS, Houstan
Suggs, KCP, Jett
Morant, AB, Cole

Follow ups…
1. Draft Liam McNeeley at #16 to be a young Ingles/Turkoglu at 3/4
2. Trade Goga, Isaac & Cole with 26 frp (top 5) to BRK for Claxton
3. Draft Kam Jones at #24 or Clayton

Claxton, WCJ, Moe
Paolo, WCJ, TdS
Wells, McNeeley, KCP
Suggs, KCP, AB
Morant, AB, Jones

YOU ARE HIRED

Edit: wait, just realized you traded Franz instead of Suggs

Skybox · Post #3575 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:20 pm

From TNT board:

LAL sends: Reaves to DAL, Hachimura to ORL
LAL gets: Lively, Klay, Martin

DAL sends: Lively, Klay, Martin to LAL, Gafford to ORL
DAL gets: Reaves, WCJ, Goga, Howard

ORL sends: WCJ, Goga, Jett Howard to DAL
ORL gets: Gafford, Hachimura

I don’t see a loser here or a need for draft equity…I think I maintained all of the principals, except Klay to LAL is an even better story. ORL just keeps KCP and DAL keeps Christie. WCJ is more versatile than Lively or Gafford, so with AD & Goga, I believe DAL doesn’t lose ground in their frontcourt, while adding Reaves and a young, cheap shooter. ORL doesn’t really need Hachimura, but his versatility could lead to other moves. Gafford is kind of lateral, value-wise, but a far better fit with Paolo & Franz.

Trade 2…
ORL sends: Franz Wagner, Jonathan Isaac, Caleb Houstan, #24
MIA sends: Tyler Herro, Andrew Wiggins, #18

ORL drafts McNeeley at #16 and Sorber at #18…Maxime Raynaud & Tyreese Proctor in second round. Raynaud could make Moe’s $11m expendable, especially since he likely won’t return until 2026. Alternatively, Moe might pair nicely with Sorber off the bench. The hope for McNeeley is that he emulates Franz/Ingles/Turkoglu, to some extent. Herro & Paolo are the clear 1&2 offensively but have improved shooting & rebounding all around.

Gafford, Sorber, Moe
Paolo, Hachimura, Sorber
Wiggins, TdS, McNeeley
Suggs, AB, Harris or Queen (@$3m, not 7.5)
Herro, AB, Cole

MartinsIzAfraud · Post #3576 » by **MartinsIzAfraud** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:26 pm

Bless your heart SkyBox. Weltman will make 1 small trade. Pick up Houstan option, Moe W option, Howard stays draft 1 player trade the other and punt the 2nds.

Skybox · Post #3577 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 2:52 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Bless your heart SkyBox. Weltman will make 1 small trade. Pick up Houstan option, Moe W option, Howard stays draft 1 player trade the other and punt the 2nds.

Agreed...I truly hope it's not his call. Griffin will make things jump for Paolo

Post #3578 » by **Knightro** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 3:21 pm

Skybox wrote:Trade 1…
ORL sends: Franz Wagner

Vacate the premises immediately.

Post #3579 » by **Knightro** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 3:26 pm

Skybox wrote:Trade 1…
ORL sends: Franz Wagner, Jonathan Isaac, Caleb Houstan, #24
MIA sends: Tyler Herro, Andrew Wiggins, #18

This is one of the literal worst trades ever conceptualized.

Skybox · Post #3580 » by **Skybox** » Sat Apr 19, 2025 3:46 pm

Knightro wrote:
Skybox wrote:Trade 1…
ORL sends: Franz Wagner, Jonathan Isaac, Caleb Houstan, #24
MIA sends: Tyler Herro, Andrew Wiggins, #18

This is one of the literal worst trades ever conceptualized.

You're right they'll never trade an All-Star modern 3-level scoring lead guard and a recent Finals MVP AND drop back 6 spots for Franz and 10 mpg of Isaac