2012 Orland Magic NBA draft thread ...

[ChildishGambino]

my thing with Marshall is....does he has any real upside? i mean how much better can he get? just not enamored with picking a passer unless he's a once in a generation type passer.....and from what i hear he isn't that....he's just a great passer....don't get me wrong though that isn't a bad thing....but i just need someone to convince me on him.....i'm not sold even if he were to "fall" to us......

[BelgianMagic]

This team still needs a pass-first PG. With the best big man in the league + some of the league's best shooters, our PG should easily be able to average 11apg-12apg ..

Is Kendall Marshall that guy? IMO yes. He's a phenomenal passer & could just be that guy that makes this team a lot better.

I like Jameer a lot, but not as our main ball-handler. Give him the Jason Terry role, he could even become 6th OTY .. And Hedo? Well, Heshouldn'tanymore. He's done. Our next GM should get us a defensive SF, someone who won't let LeBron score 50 on us.

If it were up to me, I'd pick him without a second of doubt or trade up for him if he's not available with our pick.

[Neon1]

Please, please, please explain to me why everyone is STILL in 2012, on this "Pass First PG" BS?

Out of the consistently top tier teams look at who the PG's have been.

SPURS : Tony Parker
HEAT: Mario Chalmers
THUNDER: Russell Westbrook
BULLS: Derrick Rose
LAKERS: Fisher/Sessions
CELTICS: Rajon Rondo

This isn't a recent thing. It has been the case for at LEAST 25 YEARS. Where does it come from that you need some pass only type of PG to contend? It is just flat out WRONG. History has proven over and over and over that teams with offensive skilled PG's consistently win in this league.

[BelgianMagic]

Please, please, please explain to me why everyone is STILL in 2012, on this "Pass First PG" BS?

Out of the consistently top tier teams look at who the PG's have been.

SPURS : Tony Parker
HEAT: Mario Chalmers
THUNDER: Russell Westbrook
BULLS: Derrick Rose
LAKERS: Fisher/Sessions
CELTICS: Rajon Rondo

This isn't a recent thing. It has been the case for at LEAST 25 YEARS. Where does it come from that you need some pass only type of PG to contend? It is just flat out WRONG. History has proven over and over and over that teams with offensive skilled PG's consistently win in this league.

I was only talking about OUR team, not other contenders. This team struggles with offense, there is hardly any creativity offensively ..

Our offense at times has been "BOMBS AWAY !!!", that's not gonna win you a championship. Why do you think people say Nash/CP3/Rondo would make this team so much better? I don't think it's their scoing ..

Guys like CP3/Deron/Rose/Parker, who are good playmakers&scorers, don't grow on trees, so let's find a PG who's a better passer than scorer. That's why I said this team needs a pass-first PG. Or call it a "better passing PG than Jameer" for all I care.

Call it whatever you want, we need a better playmaker with better passing. There's no reason to NOT average 10apg with all our shooters+Dwight. Hedo's done & Jameer's getting older, we need improvement on those positions .. Every team you mentioned has a top-tier playmaker, WE DON'T.

Or are you saying you liked our offense this season? That's fine .. I didn't

[Neon1]

I was only talking about OUR team, not other contenders. This team struggles with offense, there is hardly any creativity offensively ..

Exactly why adding another guy that can't score (at ALL) is counter productive.

Our offense at times has been "BOMBS AWAY !!!", that's not gonna win you a championship. Why do you think people say Nash/CP3/Rondo would make this team so much better? I don't think it's their scoing ..

Thats where you are wrong. Those guys CAN and DO score. Passing is not all they do. Passing is ALL guys like Kendall Marshall can do. Even Rondo can score the ball when needed, and even when he doesn't he does EVERYTHING else. CP3, Nash are scorers along with racking up assists.

Guys like CP3/Deron/Rose/Parker, who are good playmakers&scorers, don't grow on trees, so let's find a PG who's a better passer than scorer. That's why I said this team needs a pass-first PG. Or call it a "better passing PG than Jameer" for all I care.

Call it whatever you want, we need a better playmaker with better passing. There's no reason to NOT average 10apg with all our shooters+Dwight. Hedo's done & Jameer's getting older, we need improvement on those positions .. Every team you mentioned has a top-tier playmaker, WE DON'T.

Or are you saying you liked our offense this season? That's fine .. I didn't

No i do not like the offense. We need people that can score the ball out of any set or broken play. The point i am making is that i don't think you guys really understand what type of players these guys are.

Nash is a 16.5-18.5ppg guy they guy gets buckets.
Paul is a 18-20ppg guy, again......buckets.
Deron Williams is another that gets talked about.....18-21ppg guy.

These guys are all SCORERS. Yes they still get 8-11apg, but that has a lot to do with the fact that they completely dominate the ball all game long. "Ballhogging" if you will.

All you guys are doing is looking at APG totals and trying to determine a PG's worth or style of play without looking deeper.

There is a huge difference between players like that and guys that only get 8-10 apg because they NEVER EVER shoot the ball. These guys effect outcomes of games by dominating it. Guys like Marshall cannot take the game over, apg numbers for a guy that dominates the ball all game but never shoots are the epitomy of hollow stats. Jose Calderon/Brevin Knight assists. THOSE GUYS don't win you games.

[BelgianMagic]

I was only talking about OUR team, not other contenders. This team struggles with offense, there is hardly any creativity offensively ..

Exactly why adding another guy that can't score (at ALL) is counter productive.

Our offense at times has been "BOMBS AWAY !!!", that's not gonna win you a championship. Why do you think people say Nash/CP3/Rondo would make this team so much better? I don't think it's their scoing ..

Thats where you are wrong. Those guys CAN and DO score. Passing is not all they do. Passing is ALL guys like Kendall Marshall can do. Even Rondo can score the ball when needed, and even when he doesn't he does EVERYTHING else. CP3, Nash are scorers along with racking up assists.

Guys like CP3/Deron/Rose/Parker, who are good playmakers&scorers, don't grow on trees, so let's find a PG who's a better passer than scorer. That's why I said this team needs a pass-first PG. Or call it a "better passing PG than Jameer" for all I care.

Call it whatever you want, we need a better playmaker with better passing. There's no reason to NOT average 10apg with all our shooters+Dwight. Hedo's done & Jameer's getting older, we need improvement on those positions .. Every team you mentioned has a top-tier playmaker, WE DON'T.

Or are you saying you liked our offense this season? That's fine .. I didn't

No i do not like the offense. We need people that can score the ball out of any set or broken play. The point i am making is that i don't think you guys really understand what type of players these guys are.

Nash is a 16.5-18.5ppg guy they guy gets buckets.
Paul is a 18-20ppg guy, again......buckets.
Deron Williams is another that gets talked about.....18-21ppg guy.

These guys are all SCORERS. Yes they still get 8-11apg, but that has a lot to do with the fact that they completely dominate the ball all game long. "Ballhogging" if you will.

All you guys are doing is looking at APG totals and trying to determine a PG's worth or style of play without looking deeper.

There is a huge difference between players like that and guys that only get 8-10 apg because they NEVER EVER shoot the ball. These guys effect outcomes of games by dominating it. Guys like Marshall cannot take the game over, apg numbers for a guy that dominates the ball all game but never shoots are the epitomy of hollow stats. Jose Calderon/Brevin Knight assists. THOSE GUYS don't win you games.

I think you still don't get my point. I know all these guys are great scorers too, I even literally said that in my post.

All I'm talking about is playmaking. We don't have a playmaker like all those other contenders have. I brought up those names and said "they're great scorers AND passers", but since we probably can't get a PG who's great at passing AND scoring like those guys, I said "we need a pass-first PG" meaning let's go for a PG who's passing/playmaking is as good as those guys, but maybe not as good a scorer as those guys. A PG like that is probably easier to get.

We don't have a lot of guys who can create their own shot, that's the whole problem .. So IMO this team needs a better playmaker who can create for others .. Someone who can split the defense and pass. Right now, everyone's taking contested 3's at will. That's horrible offense. EVERY contender has a good playmaker, we don't.

I get your point, but in this case, the APG stat isn't blinding me but concerning me. We have struggled to score against decent defensive teams, to solve that we either have to find 2-3 guys who can create for themselves, or someone who can create for others. It's as simple as that.

[ChildishGambino]

Still not sold on Marshall...i'm sorry....i'm just not interested in a player where all he can do is pass......look at rubio....offensively he's not that great but he's a great passer and he can get rebounds....steals....actually one of the better defensive PG in the league imo.....From what i hear Marshall doesn't really have a reliable jumper.....doesn't have much athleticism to speak of which hurts him both offensively and defensively even at a college level.....

what is there to like other than passing imo? i'll be glad to be proven wrong but i'm not hearing anything substantial.....All i hear is passing this passing that......can he do it on THIS level?...can he do it in the NBA? Talent level is a huge jump between college and the big leagues....i don't know maybe i'll hold off until he does some workouts.....but isn't he projected to go lotto? If he falls that low to us is he really as good as some of you guys think?

[Skin]

I think we have a shot at Terrence Jones. Noticed he wasn't listed in the vote. So I went with Teague. I can't believe how many votes Wroten has. Dude can't shoot to save his life...and isn't known for his passing at all.

[arkknight1988]

I think we have a shot at Terrence Jones. Noticed he wasn't listed in the vote. So I went with Teague. I can't believe how many votes Wroten has. Dude can't shoot to save his life...and isn't known for his passing at all.

we need a good ball handler/backup pg. he can attack off the dribble which is something we don't have. is 6'5 and can also play sg.

[tiderulz]

we need a good ball handler/backup pg. he can attack off the dribble which is something we don't have. is 6'5 and can also play sg.

he just cant shoot

i kid, i dont know much about him other than what has been written about him. But I agree that something the team is lacking is someone that can get their own shot, jump shot or to the basket, on their own or break down a defense for someone else.

[JBSouthpaw]

I think we have a shot at Terrence Jones. Noticed he wasn't listed in the vote. So I went with Teague. I can't believe how many votes Wroten has. Dude can't shoot to save his life...and isn't known for his passing at all.

we need a good ball handler/backup pg. he can attack off the dribble which is something we don't have. is 6'5 and can also play sg.

The problem with his HORRIBLE shooting, it will allow his man to sag/ double team. Also, it's harder to attack the basket if your man is playing way off you, can still get in front of you.

[tiderulz]

I think we have a shot at Terrence Jones. Noticed he wasn't listed in the vote. So I went with Teague. I can't believe how many votes Wroten has. Dude can't shoot to save his life...and isn't known for his passing at all.

we need a good ball handler/backup pg. he can attack off the dribble which is something we don't have. is 6'5 and can also play sg.

The problem with his HORRIBLE shooting, it will allow his man to sag/ double team. Also, it's harder to attack the basket if your man is playing way off you, can still get in front of you.

to be fair, people still sag off Rondo and that doesnt stop him.

[BadMofoPimp]

Rondo is a top 5 PG that is an Elite Passer and an Elite Rebounding PG. Who cares if he can shoot. Rondo smokes Meer and Duhon combined. Plus, he is freakin 6'5" that can defend! Most teams would kill for a PG of that caliber. Kidd was never a great shooter either and he will be a hall of famer. Rondo may end up being one also.

Most people just like to trash Rondo for being Rondo. But, they are just jealous because he is not on their team and he is on a hated team like the Celtics. I hate the Celtics with a passion, but I respect Rondo.

[Neon1]

I think we have a shot at Terrence Jones. Noticed he wasn't listed in the vote. So I went with Teague. I can't believe how many votes Wroten has. Dude can't shoot to save his life...and isn't known for his passing at all.

we need a good ball handler/backup pg. he can attack off the dribble which is something we don't have. is 6'5 and can also play sg.

The problem with his HORRIBLE shooting, it will allow his man to sag/ double team. Also, it's harder to attack the basket if your man is playing way off you, can still get in front of you.

He can definitely create a shot and/or draw a LOT of contact to get to the line all game long.

Problem with that is he shoots 58% from there. He dominates the ball all game long while MISSING most of his shots and free throws. He is just sooo ineffeicient.

I love that he plays defense.

but the serverely bad shooting and the fact that he is not really an actual PG is a huge problem. He will end up getting moved off the ball like Tyreke Evans, Wroten just isnt a point.

[eraman2008]

What is Mark Price's role with this team, I'm not sayin he can turn Wroten into Rondo but i mean
he can work with him and show him a different view of the game. I think he would listen to Mark unlike somebody..

[magicman123]

Please, please, please explain to me why everyone is STILL in 2012, on this "Pass First PG" BS?

Out of the consistently top tier teams look at who the PG's have been.

SPURS : Tony Parker
HEAT: Mario Chalmers
THUNDER: Russell Westbrook
BULLS: Derrick Rose
LAKERS: Fisher/Sessions
CELTICS: Rajon Rondo

This isn't a recent thing. It has been the case for at LEAST 25 YEARS. Where does it come from that you need some pass only type of PG to contend? It is just flat out WRONG. History has proven over and over and over that teams with offensive skilled PG's consistently win in this league.

i think its because a pass first PG would do wonders for dwight and this team the way its constructed (shooters galore), people are also tired of jameer running the show, and its probably easier to obtain a passing point guard than a durant, kobe, lebron, pierce, etc, in a perfect world you want that perimeter player, it comes down to the more realistic option at the moment

[G-Heel]

Rondo is a top 5 PG that is an Elite Passer and an Elite Rebounding PG. Who cares if he can shoot. Rondo smokes Meer and Duhon combined. Plus, he is freakin 6'5" that can defend! Most teams would kill for a PG of that caliber. Kidd was never a great shooter either and he will be a hall of famer. Rondo may end up being one also.

Most people just like to trash Rondo for being Rondo. But, they are just jealous because he is not on their team and he is on a hated team like the Celtics. I hate the Celtics with a passion, but I respect Rondo.

Rondo is good, but it annoys me whenever I see people said he's the best PG in the game. There's at least 5 PG that I'd take over him. He's like Blake Griffin, overrated.

[Ahmadab]

Apparently Terrence Ross is doing well in the workouts. I really like him with the 19

[Skin]

Apparently Terrence Ross is doing well in the workouts. I really like him with the 19

People are really sleeping on him. What I like about him is his DEFENSE. We really could use him.

Can't believe he has 0 votes in this thread. Probably because we have way too many JJ Redick fans who don't want to see him replaced.

Dion Waiters is another guy that we need to look at. Especially since he can play PG too.

[tiderulz]

Rondo is a top 5 PG that is an Elite Passer and an Elite Rebounding PG. Who cares if he can shoot. Rondo smokes Meer and Duhon combined. Plus, he is freakin 6'5" that can defend! Most teams would kill for a PG of that caliber. Kidd was never a great shooter either and he will be a hall of famer. Rondo may end up being one also.

Most people just like to trash Rondo for being Rondo. But, they are just jealous because he is not on their team and he is on a hated team like the Celtics. I hate the Celtics with a passion, but I respect Rondo.

Rondo is good, but it annoys me whenever I see people said he's the best PG in the game. There's at least 5 PG that I'd take over him. He's like Blake Griffin, overrated.

he isnt overrated. Not a great shooter, outstanding passer, great at steals, rebounding.