Game Thread 25: Orlando Magic (10-14) vs Denver Nuggets (8-15) 12/10 7PM ET

[JF5]

Madness, are people still arguing that dipo+sabonis package is better than ibaka??

Waky waky, ibaka is so much better.

Eh... Debatable...

Oladipo has put together a pretty solid season in OKC with 16.8 PPG, 4.6 RPG, and 2.9 APG. on 45.8 Percent from the field and 38.1 percent from 3.

Sabonis is averaging 6.6 PPG 3.1 RPG and 1.1 APG on 45.3 percent from the field and 42.9 Percent from 3.

while Ibaka is averaging 14.5 PPG 6.6 RPG and 1.9 BPG on 47.5 percent from the field and 40 percent from 3.
Both sides acting like they fleeced each other but its nearly even (IMO). All players in the trade are playing pretty well.

[cedric76]

Not debatable, there is dozens of players capable of putting dipo s stats.
Ibaka is a rare type of player.

[Jameerthefear]

It doesn't matter if he's rare or not if we lose him next year

[BadMofoPimp]

Madness, are people still arguing that dipo+sabonis package is better than ibaka??

Waky waky, ibaka is so much better.

Eh... Debatable...

Oladipo has put together a pretty solid season in OKC with 16.8 PPG, 4.6 RPG, and 2.9 APG. on 45.8 Percent from the field and 38.1 percent from 3.

Sabonis is averaging 6.6 PPG 3.1 RPG and 1.1 APG on 45.3 percent from the field and 42.9 Percent from 3.

while Ibaka is averaging 14.5 PPG 6.6 RPG and 1.9 BPG on 47.5 percent from the field and 40 percent from 3.
Both sides acting like they fleeced each other but its nearly even (IMO). All players in the trade are playing pretty well.

In 2-3 years, I bet Dipo will be much better than Ibaka at that point. This is sort of like mortgaging the future to compete now move.

[PennytoShaq]

Ibaka- We gave too much up for a potential 1 year rental. Sure he is giving us solid numbers but Ibaka is a Horace Grant- a final piece for a championship/ deep playoff run. He is not the piece to get INTO the playoffs.

I agree on the last part. Horace Grant type. But tell me this; if Hennigan re-signed him would you consider the trade a win for us or even? What if Rob got him to take less than the max?

I know it was a risk but Serge is saying all the right things about staying even during our skid. If he walks, I agree it was a terrible trade on our end. But until the situation happens I think the narrative that Serge is certain to walk is premature.

Here is my issue with the Ibaka trade- if we resign him to the max or slightly below the max, then where do we find cap space to sign that potential all-star/ superstar? We already have Fournier tied up on a large contract and with Ibaka... we have 2 good role players tied up to a major part of our salary cap. So if we already had our superstar on the team, then I can see how the Ibaka trade works for us.

Who exactly are you talking about signing?

[Def Swami]

Here is my issue with the Ibaka trade- if we resign him to the max or slightly below the max, then where do we find cap space to sign that potential all-star/ superstar? We already have Fournier tied up on a large contract and with Ibaka... we have 2 good role players tied up to a major part of our salary cap. So if we already had our superstar on the team, then I can see how the Ibaka trade works for us.

What superstar do you speak of coming out next free agency that is going to want to sign with us? No star player is going to sign here u less we start winning more games.

Agree. That was my earlier point. I was talking about the Ibaka trade and how even resigning him will hamstring us in the future

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

[Blue_and_Whte]

It's a public forum. I'll talk positive about the team when they're playing well and negative about them when they arent. If some of you can't handle facts then buy a therapy dog or leave.

We aren't a good team.

Sent from my D6708 using RealGM mobile app

Agree. Some are hoping for some magical (no pun intended) turnaround. This team is what it is. A bottom lottery team.

I wouldn't go that far, but we definitely aren't good enough to make any noise even if we do make the PO's. This is a poorly constructed team that severely lacks scoring. EDIT.
Right now Mario is dead weight imo. He's absolutely useless and management cant afford to sit around and wait for this dude to figure it out. We need to add some serious talent if we're going to gain any traction and if we want to attract free agents. I just hope they don't make a panic band aid fix move that'll screw us over in the future.

[BadMofoPimp]

What superstar do you speak of coming out next free agency that is going to want to sign with us? No star player is going to sign here u less we start winning more games.

Agree. That was my earlier point. I was talking about the Ibaka trade and how even resigning him will hamstring us in the future

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

[Def Swami]

Agree. That was my earlier point. I was talking about the Ibaka trade and how even resigning him will hamstring us in the future

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

Completely agree. Just don't think the Magic fully understand that.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Agree. That was my earlier point. I was talking about the Ibaka trade and how even resigning him will hamstring us in the future

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

If Hezonja had a chance of being good he would've shown some progress this season even in limited minutes. I don't think there's this universal age where all players suddenly figure it out. Even if they aren't at their peak you can still see consistent flashes of what they'll become. Payton, Mario, and possibly AG have shown that they're role players. Ibaka is saying what he needs to say so teams will ante up if they really want him, including Orlando.

[BadMofoPimp]

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

Completely agree. Just don't think the Magic fully understand that.

I bet if the Magic kept all their youth they had, this team coulda been dangerous in 2-3 more years. Perhaps, Devos wanted to win now like the rest of us and Henny made panic moves in Ibaka and Bigmack.

[BadMofoPimp]

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

If Hezonja had a chance of being good he would've shown some progress this season even in limited minutes. I don't think there's this universal age where all players suddenly figure it out. Even if they aren't at their peak you can still see consistent flashes of what they'll become. Payton, Mario, and possibly AG have shown that they're role players.

Otto Porter didn't look good for his first 2 years. Happens more often than you actually think. Hassan Whiteside is another example.

[OrlandoDream]

The Magic will have to move some of their other big contracts if they intend to be big players in free agency and keep Ibaka. Think the Magic really banked on Payton, Gordon, and Hezonja taking leaps or at least showing gradual improvement as internal growth would carry this team in the future. Seems to have stagnated or regressed in some cases and now the Magic are at an interesting crossroads.

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

Completely agree. Just don't think the Magic fully understand that.

Those who know basketball in the organization like Rob and Vogel do but those who have no knowledge of how to run an NBA franchise aka Martins and co, have this imaginary deadline where they must win now or restart again. Yes it's tough to hit the reset again but the future of this team will rely on the young guys. These vets will get us in the 8th so be swept by cavs with no guarantee for the future seasons. We have an ownership with treadmill mentality. If we are gonna fire Rob at the end of the season, then Martins follows. He has done nothing and we wasted last year on their Skiles idea.

[OrlandoDream]

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

If Hezonja had a chance of being good he would've shown some progress this season even in limited minutes. I don't think there's this universal age where all players suddenly figure it out. Even if they aren't at their peak you can still see consistent flashes of what they'll become. Payton, Mario, and possibly AG have shown that they're role players.

Otto Porter didn't look good for his first 2 years. Happens more often than you actually think. Hassan Whiteside is another example.

Jimmy Butler.

[Blue_and_Whte]

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

If Hezonja had a chance of being good he would've shown some progress this season even in limited minutes. I don't think there's this universal age where all players suddenly figure it out. Even if they aren't at their peak you can still see consistent flashes of what they'll become. Payton, Mario, and possibly AG have shown that they're role players.

Otto Porter didn't look good for his first 2 years. Happens more often than you actually think. Hassan Whiteside is another example.

That's a flawed statement, Porter was injured midway his first year and absolutely played well his second year. He was playing 20 mpg and was at least defending well and in the regular rotation contributing. Mario cant even get in on garbage time. It doesn't matter because we don't live in a bubble. Mario isn't likely to follow the exact path of development that Otto did.

[Furinkazan]

tho our main guys are in 3rd year not 2nd
Jimmy showed a big improvement in 3rd year and jumped to star lv in 4th...
so far our guys look almost the same as they looked year one
either our development sux or players ...maybe both maybe none I dunno maybe Im impatient

[NBlue]

Madness, are people still arguing that dipo+sabonis package is better than ibaka??

Waky waky, ibaka is so much better.

Eh... Debatable...

Oladipo has put together a pretty solid season in OKC with 16.8 PPG, 4.6 RPG, and 2.9 APG. on 45.8 Percent from the field and 38.1 percent from 3.

Sabonis is averaging 6.6 PPG 3.1 RPG and 1.1 APG on 45.3 percent from the field and 42.9 Percent from 3.

while Ibaka is averaging 14.5 PPG 6.6 RPG and 1.9 BPG on 47.5 percent from the field and 40 percent from 3.
Both sides acting like they fleeced each other but its nearly even (IMO). All players in the trade are playing pretty well.

Maybe. Dipo is putting up those numbers playing off a top 5 player in the league. Who, exactly, is taking the attention off Serge on the Magic?

[Mc-o]

I wouldn't just give up on the young guys until they are 23-25 because that is when most finally get it.

Completely agree. Just don't think the Magic fully understand that.

Those who know basketball in the organization like Rob and Vogel do but those who have no knowledge of how to run an NBA franchise aka Martins and co, have this imaginary deadline where they must win now or restart again. Yes it's tough to hit the reset again but the future of this team will rely on the young guys. These vets will get us in the 8th so be swept by cavs with no guarantee for the future seasons. We have an ownership with treadmill mentality. If we are gonna fire Rob at the end of the season, then Martins follows. He has done nothing and we wasted last year on their Skiles idea.

How was last year wasted ? we won 10 more games with our young core, what has set us back is the trades and putting AG out of position . Also Mario not looking like an nba player and ELF not able to hit a jump shot is hurting our team. the magic were relying heavily on our young players to do things they have never done before and so far it isnt working out.... The best we can hope for is AG to take another step and mario to finally figure it out, both of which seem less likely each week that passes.

[Mc-o]

Madness, are people still arguing that dipo+sabonis package is better than ibaka??

Waky waky, ibaka is so much better.

Eh... Debatable...

Oladipo has put together a pretty solid season in OKC with 16.8 PPG, 4.6 RPG, and 2.9 APG. on 45.8 Percent from the field and 38.1 percent from 3.

Sabonis is averaging 6.6 PPG 3.1 RPG and 1.1 APG on 45.3 percent from the field and 42.9 Percent from 3.

while Ibaka is averaging 14.5 PPG 6.6 RPG and 1.9 BPG on 47.5 percent from the field and 40 percent from 3.
Both sides acting like they fleeced each other but its nearly even (IMO). All players in the trade are playing pretty well.

Maybe. Dipo is putting up those numbers playing off a top 5 player in the league. Who, exactly, is taking the attention off Serge on the Magic?

dipo averaged pretty much the same stats last year while playing with us . He is slightly more efficient but not by much . It could be attributed to westbrook or natural improvement or small sample size or a little bit of everything . Point is dipo would probably be able to produce those numbers if he was on our team this year since he did it last year. the main difference playing with westbrook is that he is on a winning team and actually will be in the playoffs.

[BadMofoPimp]

Madness, are people still arguing that dipo+sabonis package is better than ibaka??

Waky waky, ibaka is so much better.

Eh... Debatable...

Oladipo has put together a pretty solid season in OKC with 16.8 PPG, 4.6 RPG, and 2.9 APG. on 45.8 Percent from the field and 38.1 percent from 3.

Sabonis is averaging 6.6 PPG 3.1 RPG and 1.1 APG on 45.3 percent from the field and 42.9 Percent from 3.

while Ibaka is averaging 14.5 PPG 6.6 RPG and 1.9 BPG on 47.5 percent from the field and 40 percent from 3.
Both sides acting like they fleeced each other but its nearly even (IMO). All players in the trade are playing pretty well.

Maybe. Dipo is putting up those numbers playing off a top 5 player in the league. Who, exactly, is taking the attention off Serge on the Magic?