The Tobias Harris Situation

[gumbyr24]

It all really depends on his attitude going forward. Does he want to be here? Or is he stuck on NY??
Letting him walk isn't an option..
If he wants to be here, we give the man his money.
If he doesn't want to be here, we match is offer anyway, and try to rob the Knicks.
Some combination of future 1st's, or pick swaps plus them taking Frye.

Okafor
Tobias
Melo
THJR
Scrub

super soft, terrible defensively. The picks could have very good value.

Let's let the Knicks do for us, what Brooklyn did for Boston/ATL

[Bensational]

It all really depends on his attitude going forward. Does he want to be here? Or is he stuck on NY??
Letting him walk isn't an option..
If he wants to be here, we give the man his money.
If he doesn't want to be here, we match is offer anyway, and try to rob the Knicks.
Some combination of future 1st's, or pick swaps plus them taking Frye.

Okafor
Tobias
Melo
THJR
Scrub

super soft, terrible defensively. The picks could have very good value.

Let's let the Knicks do for us, what Brooklyn did for Boston/ATL

you can't do s&t's anymore, can you?

[407Junkie]

I think our best bet is to trade him for players that have potential, maintain our draft position this season, and maintain our cap flexibility.

The fact is with or without Tobias, we do not necessarily have an identity. And that says something right there.

In my opinion, if we are going to max out a player he has to have a tremendous impact on the game. So much so, that the team is completely different when he is on the floor and leads to success.

We had maybe our best two wins of the season against Chicago and Houston without Tobias.

you have to be a little fair with that. Those 2 wins were also at a high pace, which we havent done the past 2 games with Harris back. he may play very well in it, he may not, we just dont know yet

We're not running because he's back stopping us from doing it. How you can't see that and the timing of when it stopped is baffling.

[Orlwillbeback]

I think our best bet is to trade him for players that have potential, maintain our draft position this season, and maintain our cap flexibility.

The fact is with or without Tobias, we do not necessarily have an identity. And that says something right there.

In my opinion, if we are going to max out a player he has to have a tremendous impact on the game. So much so, that the team is completely different when he is on the floor and leads to success.

We had maybe our best two wins of the season against Chicago and Houston without Tobias.

you have to be a little fair with that. Those 2 wins were also at a high pace, which we havent done the past 2 games with Harris back. he may play very well in it, he may not, we just dont know yet

We're not running because he's back stopping us from doing it. How you can't see that and the timing of when it stopped is baffling.

[thelead]

I think our best bet is to trade him for players that have potential, maintain our draft position this season, and maintain our cap flexibility.

The fact is with or without Tobias, we do not necessarily have an identity. And that says something right there.

In my opinion, if we are going to max out a player he has to have a tremendous impact on the game. So much so, that the team is completely different when he is on the floor and leads to success.

We had maybe our best two wins of the season against Chicago and Houston without Tobias.

you have to be a little fair with that. Those 2 wins were also at a high pace, which we havent done the past 2 games with Harris back. he may play very well in it, he may not, we just dont know yet

We're not running because he's back stopping us from doing it. How you can't see that and the timing of when it stopped is baffling.

You can't be serious... Right? Please tell me you're joking.

[OrlandO]

We've still been running. How do you think we scored 118 vs the Pistons. You think the knicks score 113 if were playing slow? Problem is Vaughn has no idea how to put our players in position to defend in this fast system. And Harris loves to run...

[Def Swami]

We can't afford to let him walk for nothing this off-season and I'd be shocked if we do; to lose him as an asset would be a setback. I'm sure we'll do our due diligence at the trade deadline, but I think we'll have a hard time finding suitors who can take their chance at him in free agency this summer; they'd basically be trading assets simply for the right to match.

It only takes one team to bind us into matching a max contract for Harris, and I think he'll have enough suitors to push us there. I'm already prepared for the $63 million/4 years contract some team is going to offer him. I feel okay matching that; I can rationalize the deal to myself. He's 22 years old and playing with pretty good efficiency in an offense that has no rhyme or reason. He has room to improve, has the character to do so, and could benefit by playing under a better coach in the future. And as mentioned before, he could be used in a future trade as well.

[cedric76]

I like Tobias and it would be a shame to lose him
However I don't want to overpay him, we r a lottery team and we can't afford to screw our cap space by overpaying our guys

*letting him walk is out of question
*as for matching contract, what if Harris sign an unfriendly contract (similar to what Chandler signed)?

*looking at our need I think a trade with hornets could benefit both teams

Hornets ' ownership want playoff and are done with rebuilding

Harris for vonleh (hopefully can fit our big/3+D guy) +2015 pick(very nice asset)

This is a very good for a 6th man (what most people view Harris as)

Sent from my HTC One using RealGM Forums mobile app

[Edual]

Talking about pace, for most the season we were ranked about 28th in pace, for the past 6 games we lead the league in pace, ranked #1 at 104.05 poss per game, last 2 games with tobias pace is up a little to 104.30

Offensive rating 8th best now, was also near the bottom for most the season

[Skin]

Oh my gosh... here comes the "Vonleh" talk.

[MagicStarwipe]

what have you seen that shows this?

That's my projection for him. His combination of size, athleticism, basketball skills, IQ and motor are special. He's always doing things on the floor and making plays that you look on the floor and realise no other player on either team could make that play or make it so effortlessly. Whether it's recovering to block a 3 pointer, catching the ball in traffic in transition, spinning and finishing at the rim. He makes special plays.

Lol sure man. He is really raw and needs to develop before he can really contribute. Hes a looooong term project.

Lol sure man what? He does have a special set of attributes and does make special plays when he's on the floor. He's not "really raw" and is already contributing. He just needs to refine his game, make his shooting consistent and gain some experience in the league. You want raw? Dante Exum is raw. Moe Harkless is raw. Maybe some people need to read box scores and watch per game averages to evaluate players. Some people actually look at a guys game, his skill-set and his physical attributes and measure them against his peers.

[cedric76]

Oh my gosh... here comes the "Vonleh" talk.

Had to come

Sent from my HTC One using RealGM Forums mobile app

[OrlChamps2030]

It's one thing to question whether or not Tobias is in the long term plans but letting him walk would be a major head scratcher.

If we offered him 8 mill it must have been a negotiation tactic.. I mean we gave Channing garrity 8 mill. No way both guys are valued the same in an open market.

Were going to need him either way.. As a scoring gun or an asset for a trade

[drsd]

For me resolutions around Harris start with Gordon-A. Is Gordon-A a starter and is he a SF or a PF. Can he play PF next to Harris playing SF. Or vice versa. If Gordon-A projects as a SF, then this kind of means that Harris would be part of a package to bring in a defensive-minded PF. But then were will the offense come from?

This is all tricky stuff.

[Skin]

I'd be interested in this trade:

OKC gets: Tobias Harris, Moe Harkless, Andrew Nicholson

ORL get: Reggie Jackson, Jeremy Lamb, Perry Jones

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nk3r3qw

I want to keep Tobias, but my ultimate role for him is as a super 6th man. If I can replace that, I'm good. We have a big need at back up PG and Reggie Jackson is a super 6th man for OKC. He would compliment our backcourt amazingly as he can play some SG as well. He's also a RFA. But making the trade now would give us the advantage in being able to match offers. I can see him taking the $8M per year that we offered Tobias last summer.

Lamb gives us SF depth to the departed Harris. Gives us range that Gordon is currently working on. ...and PJ3 can give depth with his arsenal of unused and under-appreciated skills.

PG Elfrid Payton / Reggie Jackson
SG Victor Oladipo / Evan Fournier
SF Aaron Gordon / Jeremy Lamb
PF Myles Turner or Karl Towns / Kyle O'Quinn / Perry Jones
C Nikola Vucevic / Dewayne Dedmon

OKC's bench really struggled to carry the load when Westbrook and Durant were out earlier in the year. Having a legitimate scorer like Harris would be a huge get for them. Lamb hardly cracks their rotation these days. A swap a scenery between him and Harkless might help them both out... and PJ3 is their victory cigar like AN is ours.

[BadWolf]

It is tricky. 47/39/80 are really nice shooting numbers to go with18/7/2. But then I dig deeper and I see an offensive rating of 104 on 24% usage, a per of 17, and a WS/48 of .092 and I'm less impressed. He lacks playmaking, turns it over more than he should, is a bit of an ego, and lacks any elite physical skills. Ultimately matching an offer sheet and rolling with him is my choice but if we could trade him and our pick for Aldridge or Love id prefer that.

Just saw this on first page of general board, Is Hayward the number one option Jazz are looking for? If not where is the bar at?

19ppg
4.7rpg
4.2apg
1.3spg
.575 TS%
25.2 USG%

Doesn't look that much better. Specially if you consider he's the focal point of the team, has the ball in his hands a lot and is 2 years older. And he's not winning any more and Jazz are probably a year further in the rebuild and have a much better coach.

I really don't care how much money any of the guys get,but you can see where the market sets the price for this kind of production.

I wasn't on this board much before last two years, but did you always hate your guys like this? Being benched for marble, who looks like the worst player in NBA, is really not a way to treat a guy you plan on keeping and developing as an important part of your team. Harris already said he doesn't like it. I guess he's gone soon, probably in the off-season, there won't be any suitors that would pay solid value at the deadline, thanks to Hennigan (which gets autocorrected to Hannibal for me )

[ivDT]

That's my projection for him. His combination of size, athleticism, basketball skills, IQ and motor are special. He's always doing things on the floor and making plays that you look on the floor and realise no other player on either team could make that play or make it so effortlessly. Whether it's recovering to block a 3 pointer, catching the ball in traffic in transition, spinning and finishing at the rim. He makes special plays.

Lol sure man. He is really raw and needs to develop before he can really contribute. Hes a looooong term project.

Lol sure man what? He does have a special set of attributes and does make special plays when he's on the floor. He's not "really raw" and is already contributing. He just needs to refine his game, make his shooting consistent and gain some experience in the league. You want raw? Dante Exum is raw. Moe Harkless is raw. Maybe some people need to read box scores and watch per game averages to evaluate players. Some people actually look at a guys game, his skill-set and his physical attributes and measure them against his peers.

+1

a.g., at this early stage of his career is pretty much right where tobias was at the same point. not the largest sample size, sure, but i'd have to think we've seen enough to dispel the "looooong term project" stuff we were hearing prior to the season.

a long-term project might need the entire length of his rookie contract just to become a contributor. i fully expect aaron to be a better pro 3 years into his career than tobias was 3 years into his.

[cedric76]

I'd be interested in this trade:

OKC gets: Tobias Harris, Moe Harkless, Andrew Nicholson

ORL get: Reggie Jackson, Jeremy Lamb, Perry Jones

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nk3r3qw

I want to keep Tobias, but my ultimate role for him is as a super 6th man. If I can replace that, I'm good. We have a big need at back up PG and Reggie Jackson is a super 6th man for OKC. He would compliment our backcourt amazingly as he can play some SG as well. He's also a RFA. But making the trade now would give us the advantage in being able to match offers. I can see him taking the $8M per year that we offered Tobias last summer.

Lamb gives us SF depth to the departed Harris. Gives us range that Gordon is currently working on. ...and PJ3 can give depth with his arsenal of unused and under-appreciated skills.

PG Elfrid Payton / Reggie Jackson
SG Victor Oladipo / Evan Fournier
SF Aaron Gordon / Jeremy Lamb
PF Myles Turner or Karl Towns / Kyle O'Quinn / Perry Jones
C Nikola Vucevic / Dewayne Dedmon

OKC's bench really struggled to carry the load when Westbrook and Durant were out earlier in the year. Having a legitimate scorer like Harris would be a huge get for them. Lamb hardly cracks their rotation these days. A swap a scenery between him and Harkless might help them both out... and PJ3 is their victory cigar like AN is ours.

RJ want to be a starter, he would be a distraction in this team

Sent from my HTC One using RealGM Forums mobile app

[Bensational]

We can't afford to let him walk for nothing this off-season and I'd be shocked if we do; to lose him as an asset would be a setback. I'm sure we'll do our due diligence at the trade deadline, but I think we'll have a hard time finding suitors who can take their chance at him in free agency this summer; they'd basically be trading assets simply for the right to match.

It only takes one team to bind us into matching a max contract for Harris, and I think he'll have enough suitors to push us there. I'm already prepared for the $63 million/4 years contract some team is going to offer him. I feel okay matching that; I can rationalize the deal to myself. He's 22 years old and playing with pretty good efficiency in an offense that has no rhyme or reason. He has room to improve, has the character to do so, and could benefit by playing under a better coach in the future. And as mentioned before, he could be used in a future trade as well.

yeah... i wouldn't be too keen on matching that.

i wouldn't let him walk, but finding someone to take him off your hands at over $15M a season is gonna be hard, unless he finds a way to step up into the 20ppg stratosphere.

trading him before the deadline this season works because he can be moved for cheap, and teams taking him on will know that they'll get him for another 4 years at least (even if they have to pay for it). i'm just not sure what players are out there that would be suitable as a return. i wouldn't bother speculating, either, given Henny always finds players i've never even heard of. Vuc, Tobias, Fournier. I'm sure any player coming back in a Tobias trade would be equally unheard of.

[Bensational]

I'd be interested in this trade:

OKC gets: Tobias Harris, Moe Harkless, Andrew Nicholson

ORL get: Reggie Jackson, Jeremy Lamb, Perry Jones

why don't we go for the guy we really want?

BKN gets: Tobias + Perkins

OKC gets: Lopez + AN + B.Gordon

ORL gets: Ibaka


Brooklyn get a legit young stud to start rebuilding around.

Oklahoma get a legit big man who can anchor a defense and score well on the other end. They also get AN, whom they were rumoured to have coveted in that draft.

Orlando gets our rim protecting, 3 point shooting big man.

That said, I'm not 100% sold on Ibaka being the answer. I remember reading somewhere that his blocks are misleading and that he's not as much of a defensive presence as those numbers would imply. But, still...