FIRE WELTMAN

[eyriq]

This foolishness never gets boring …every media member, opposing player and fan (not to mention Paolo) knows we lack a REAL PG…but you think that just because Weltman (may have) mislabeled a couple of 3&D guys…we’re good

* I say “may have” because he might have gotten what he wanted, he just has, in that case, a completely misguided vision for a team offense

Fake news.

I really hope you’re just having fun with this…it’s so far off

He was the top NCAA point guard prospect drafted by a team that is developing him as a point guard and is currently playing as a point guard. The only world where he's not a point guard is the make believe world y'all have created.

[pepe1991]

Suggs was the 3rd youngest ever starting PG. I'm not sure how accurate that is.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/youngest-starting-point-guard-in-nba-history

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100% inaccurate

I know you rarely ever start young players at PG unless you're on a tanking team.

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From top of my head: Marbury and Livingston.

Livingston skipped college, Marbury was 19 as a rookie.

Hell, Bub Carrington is yet to turn 20 after full season.

[Skybox]

Fake news.

I really hope you’re just having fun with this…it’s so far off

He was the top NCAA point guard prospect drafted by a team that is developing him as a point guard and is currently playing as a point guard. The only world where he's not a point guard is the make believe world y'all have created.

This is like the scene in “Full Metal Jacket”, at the end of boot camp, where each soldier gets his randomly determined assignment…
“Jones…infantry”
“Joker…press corps”
“Johnson…medic”…”but I have no medical training…”
“Suggs…Point Guard”…”if you say so, Point Guard sounds cool”


Don’t worry…they’ll DEVELOP you

[eyriq]

I really hope you’re just having fun with this…it’s so far off

He was the top NCAA point guard prospect drafted by a team that is developing him as a point guard and is currently playing as a point guard. The only world where he's not a point guard is the make believe world y'all have created.

This is like the scene in “Full Metal Jacket”, at the end of boot camp, where each soldier gets his randomly determined assignment…
“Jones…infantry”
“Joker…press corps”
“Johnson…medic”…”but I have no medical training…”
“Suggs…Point Guard”…”if you say so, Point Guard sounds cool”


Don’t worry…they’ll DEVELOP you

Right... LOL

[Skybox]

Fake news.

I really hope you’re just having fun with this…it’s so far off

He was the top NCAA point guard prospect drafted by a team that is developing him as a point guard and is currently playing as a point guard. The only world where he's not a point guard is the make believe world y'all have created.

Odd that they’d draft AB right on his heels then

[Idiosyncratic]

They probably had a sort of positionless vision where Paolo/Franz can playmake but also that at least one of Suggs or AB would emerge as another viable option to handle the ball while maintaining the defensive vision. I don't think it's that crazy of a concept. I think after this season they will probably admit that they need another option in the backcourt. You can say they obviously needed it before or whatever (respectable opinion), but if they are trying to hit their ultimate upside and slim chance of winning a title in the future, I personally don't mind them trying to develop their own guys' playmaking.

IMO they absolutely should have brought in some other guys in small deals (trades or signings) over the years with offensive skillsets to try and balance the roster. But I don't think they missed out on any kind of window and still have the ability to add some help. Willing to wait and see what they do this offseason. I am very skeptical of the FO as well especially after the Jett pick and last free agency, but we'll see.

[eyriq]

They probably had a sort of positionless vision where Paolo/Franz can playmake but also that at least one of Suggs or AB would emerge as another viable option to handle the ball while maintaining the defensive vision. I don't think it's that crazy of a concept. I think after this season they will probably admit that they need another option in the backcourt. You can say they obviously needed it before or whatever (respectable opinion), but if they are trying to hit their ultimate upside and slim chance of winning a title in the future, I personally don't mind them trying to develop their own guys' playmaking.

IMO they absolutely should have brought in some other guys in small deals (trades or signings) over the years with offensive skillsets to try and balance the roster. But I don't think they missed out on any kind of window and still have the ability to add some help. Willing to wait and see what they do this offseason. I am very skeptical of the FO as well especially after the Jett pick and last free agency, but we'll see.

Is Anthony Black a point guard? Settle the debate!

[Idiosyncratic]

They probably had a sort of positionless vision where Paolo/Franz can playmake but also that at least one of Suggs or AB would emerge as another viable option to handle the ball while maintaining the defensive vision. I don't think it's that crazy of a concept. I think after this season they will probably admit that they need another option in the backcourt. You can say they obviously needed it before or whatever (respectable opinion), but if they are trying to hit their ultimate upside and slim chance of winning a title in the future, I personally don't mind them trying to develop their own guys' playmaking.

IMO they absolutely should have brought in some other guys in small deals (trades or signings) over the years with offensive skillsets to try and balance the roster. But I don't think they missed out on any kind of window and still have the ability to add some help. Willing to wait and see what they do this offseason. I am very skeptical of the FO as well especially after the Jett pick and last free agency, but we'll see.

Is Anthony Black a point guard? Settle the debate!

I'm not sure I see the requisite ball-handling ability, pressure bothers him a lot. Has anybody ever gone from being very bothered by ball pressure to a good PG? That would be my question. And seriously I don't know the answer to it, I would guess not super often. I won't write him off completely though because he does show an ability to get by people and get to the hoop pretty often, there is obviously something there in his ball-handling. It would just require a leap that I consider probably unlikely.

I think AB will be a very good combo guard. I think your 15-5-5 with 2 steals and a block take is spot on. All while playing terrific on ball defense. Great complementary piece. Think like Dyson Daniels this year except fewer steals, but I like AB's scoring upside a little more. I think he is a better spot shooter and I think he has real upside as a slasher if he gets a tiny bit stronger and more confident. Dyson has better around the basket touch than AB-- I don't love AB's touch on floaters and such, he has to be more of a bruiser IMO.

[eyriq]

They probably had a sort of positionless vision where Paolo/Franz can playmake but also that at least one of Suggs or AB would emerge as another viable option to handle the ball while maintaining the defensive vision. I don't think it's that crazy of a concept. I think after this season they will probably admit that they need another option in the backcourt. You can say they obviously needed it before or whatever (respectable opinion), but if they are trying to hit their ultimate upside and slim chance of winning a title in the future, I personally don't mind them trying to develop their own guys' playmaking.

IMO they absolutely should have brought in some other guys in small deals (trades or signings) over the years with offensive skillsets to try and balance the roster. But I don't think they missed out on any kind of window and still have the ability to add some help. Willing to wait and see what they do this offseason. I am very skeptical of the FO as well especially after the Jett pick and last free agency, but we'll see.

Is Anthony Black a point guard? Settle the debate!

I'm not sure I see the requisite ball-handling ability, pressure bothers him a lot. Has anybody ever gone from being very bothered by ball pressure to a good PG? That would be my question. And seriously I don't know the answer to it, I would guess not super often. I won't write him off completely though because he does show an ability to get by people and get to the hoop pretty often, there is obviously something there in his ball-handling. It would just require a leap that I consider probably unlikely.

I think AB will be a very good combo guard. I think your 15-5-5 with 2 steals and a block take is spot on. All while playing terrific on ball defense. Great complementary piece. Think like Dyson Daniels this year except fewer steals, but I like AB's scoring upside a little more. I think he is a better spot shooter and I think he has real upside as a slasher if he gets a tiny bit stronger and more confident. Dyson has better around the basket touch than AB-- I don't love AB's touch on floaters and such, he has to be more of a bruiser IMO.

Fair enough. You are now dead to me though.

[CLosP]

I mean AB avg over 3 tpg in college & is scared to dribble the ball this series but sure he’s a PG lol.

[three3d]

I mean AB avg over 3 tpg in college & is scared to dribble the ball this series but sure he’s a PG lol.

His assist to turnover ratio in college was like 1 to 1 I believe lol

[Idiosyncratic]

I mean AB avg over 3 tpg in college & is scared to dribble the ball this series but sure he’s a PG lol.

His assist to turnover ratio in college was like 1 to 1 I believe lol

I mean my top 2 PGs this year in the draft have pretty garbage rates their freshman year. AB was 3.9 AST 3 TO. Harper was 4 AST 2.4 TO. Fears 4.1 AST 3.4 TO.

Clayton would be my 3rd PG and he wasn't even great this year and was terrible until he was a senior. 1.6 AST 1.1 TO as a freshman. 4.2 AST as a senior. I think a lot of college freshman PG's are going to have terrible ast/to ratios. Maxey's was bad, Brunson, Steph ( 1 to 1 I believe) , Garland, Murray (both), I'm sure there are more those are just off the top of my head.

Those are some better PGs and they had terrible ratios their freshman years. Not implying at all AB is going to be as good as those guys (obviously), but college and pro game is so different and being a freshman PG is hard. You are banking on upside most of the time and them learning to read the defense and take care of the ball. Also the fact that modern PG position is changing, but that is a whole different discussion.

I mean I mostly agree AB is trending to not being a PG, but I don't think freshman year assist stat in retrospect is that relevant. If you want to argue the tape showed a loose handle or whatever I think that is fine. I still think he was a fine pick even if he doesn't end up at PG. I don't think he wasn't worth trying at the PG spot and hope he still gets some reps there next year even if they acquire someone and he moves to a more off-ball role as he did toward the end of this year.

[Bensational]

Is Anthony Black a point guard? Settle the debate!

<summary: respectable, balanced take on AB>

Fair enough. You are now dead to me though.

Stay true to the cause!

[eyriq]

<summary: respectable, balanced take on AB>

Fair enough. You are now dead to me though.

Stay true to the cause!

It’s a thing of principle at this point

[basketballRob]

I mean AB avg over 3 tpg in college & is scared to dribble the ball this series but sure he’s a PG lol.

His assist to turnover ratio in college was like 1 to 1 I believe lol

He was 18 for the majority of the college season. When players come out of high school a year early. You need to factor that in. At that age, he was the best player on a Sweet 16 team.

Sent from my SM-G998U1 using RealGM mobile app

[fendilim]

Who cares.

You are arguing between a choice of a:

32 year old role player journeyman, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, who is only good in a system that makes sense.

35 year old guy, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, and no longer in a great system and is cooked defensively.

The money shouldn’t have been spent on either of them. Orlando doesn’t have an offense that even highlights their only real ability, which is shooting the basketball. What? You are upset we didn’t get a guy that would touch the ball 6 times a game? Pointless.

How about having higher standards for free agents and trade targets that don’t have their best basketball behind them? Maybe we should call Afflalo out of retirement so he can stand on the perimeter as he watches 2 guys eat up 90% usage in losses.

Well, its kind of nonsense that you’re arguing stuff one year later, because at that time the decisions were made, KCP was shooting 3s at a higher percentage.

I was on the Klay bandwagon last offseason, shocked to see us sign KCP, but that deal made sense at that time.

I don’t blame Weltman for KCP not being able to hit his 3s though. That’s on the player, not management. If we’re blaming Weltman for KCP’s poor shooting, might as well blame him for Franz’ too, which no one has even blamed Weltman for. Lol

[VFX]

Who cares.

You are arguing between a choice of a:

32 year old role player journeyman, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, who is only good in a system that makes sense.

35 year old guy, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, and no longer in a great system and is cooked defensively.

The money shouldn’t have been spent on either of them. Orlando doesn’t have an offense that even highlights their only real ability, which is shooting the basketball. What? You are upset we didn’t get a guy that would touch the ball 6 times a game? Pointless.

How about having higher standards for free agents and trade targets that don’t have their best basketball behind them? Maybe we should call Afflalo out of retirement so he can stand on the perimeter as he watches 2 guys eat up 90% usage in losses.

Well, its kind of nonsense that you’re arguing stuff one year later, because at that time the decisions were made, KCP was shooting 3s at a higher percentage.

I was on the Klay bandwagon last offseason, shocked to see us sign KCP, but that deal made sense at that time.

I don’t blame Weltman for KCP not being able to hit his 3s though. That’s on the player, not management. If we’re blaming Weltman for KCP’s poor shooting, might as well blame him for Franz’ too, which no one has even blamed Weltman for. Lol

You don’t understand that I’m not blaming Weltman for KCP not shooting well.

In blaming him for wasting the money on a SG that doesn’t work well in the system HE created by not acquiring players with proper skillsets prior to signing KCP.

Signing a high or low volume SG means nothing when your system doesn’t move the ball well or set those guys up to get touches even. KCP barely gets in rhythm to shoot the ball and even when he does he sucks.

Get it?

[fendilim]

Who cares.

You are arguing between a choice of a:

32 year old role player journeyman, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, who is only good in a system that makes sense.

35 year old guy, that has posted his worst numbers since his rookie season, and no longer in a great system and is cooked defensively.

The money shouldn’t have been spent on either of them. Orlando doesn’t have an offense that even highlights their only real ability, which is shooting the basketball. What? You are upset we didn’t get a guy that would touch the ball 6 times a game? Pointless.

How about having higher standards for free agents and trade targets that don’t have their best basketball behind them? Maybe we should call Afflalo out of retirement so he can stand on the perimeter as he watches 2 guys eat up 90% usage in losses.

Well, its kind of nonsense that you’re arguing stuff one year later, because at that time the decisions were made, KCP was shooting 3s at a higher percentage.

I was on the Klay bandwagon last offseason, shocked to see us sign KCP, but that deal made sense at that time.

I don’t blame Weltman for KCP not being able to hit his 3s though. That’s on the player, not management. If we’re blaming Weltman for KCP’s poor shooting, might as well blame him for Franz’ too, which no one has even blamed Weltman for. Lol

You don’t understand that I’m not blaming Weltman for KCP not shooting well.

In blaming him for wasting the money on a SG that doesn’t work well in the system HE created by not acquiring players with proper skillsets prior to signing KCP.

Signing a high or low volume SG means nothing when your system doesn’t move the ball well or set those guys up to get touches even. KCP barely gets in rhythm to shoot the ball and even when he does he sucks.

Get it?

so you’re blaming him for the system that doesn’t move the ball well? Isn’t that on Mosely…? Which I would agree lol

[VFX]

Well, its kind of nonsense that you’re arguing stuff one year later, because at that time the decisions were made, KCP was shooting 3s at a higher percentage.

I was on the Klay bandwagon last offseason, shocked to see us sign KCP, but that deal made sense at that time.

I don’t blame Weltman for KCP not being able to hit his 3s though. That’s on the player, not management. If we’re blaming Weltman for KCP’s poor shooting, might as well blame him for Franz’ too, which no one has even blamed Weltman for. Lol

You don’t understand that I’m not blaming Weltman for KCP not shooting well.

In blaming him for wasting the money on a SG that doesn’t work well in the system HE created by not acquiring players with proper skillsets prior to signing KCP.

Signing a high or low volume SG means nothing when your system doesn’t move the ball well or set those guys up to get touches even. KCP barely gets in rhythm to shoot the ball and even when he does he sucks.

Get it?

so you’re blaming him for the system that doesn’t move the ball well? Isn’t that on Mosely…? Which I would agree lol

Both of them to different degrees

[RichCollab]

Well, its kind of nonsense that you’re arguing stuff one year later, because at that time the decisions were made, KCP was shooting 3s at a higher percentage.

I was on the Klay bandwagon last offseason, shocked to see us sign KCP, but that deal made sense at that time.

I don’t blame Weltman for KCP not being able to hit his 3s though. That’s on the player, not management. If we’re blaming Weltman for KCP’s poor shooting, might as well blame him for Franz’ too, which no one has even blamed Weltman for. Lol

You don’t understand that I’m not blaming Weltman for KCP not shooting well.

In blaming him for wasting the money on a SG that doesn’t work well in the system HE created by not acquiring players with proper skillsets prior to signing KCP.

Signing a high or low volume SG means nothing when your system doesn’t move the ball well or set those guys up to get touches even. KCP barely gets in rhythm to shoot the ball and even when he does he sucks.

Get it?

so you’re blaming him for the system that doesn’t move the ball well? Isn’t that on Mosely…? Which I would agree lol

Is Weltman in charge of leaving Mosely in place? Your argument is just as damming.