Official Speculation & Free Agency Thread (Pt X, Mods close)

[rcklsscognition]

Nets & Magic could just make separate trades to stay within the rules of the new CBA. If NJ has the capspace, they'll find a way to take on the extra salary.

What exactly do you mean by this? Can you clarify and/or give an example? They don't have any cap room anymore this year...

This is the trade:

NJ sends- Okur (10,890,000), Humphries (8,000,000), Lopez (3,076,983), Brooks (1,110,120), Mayo (5,632,636) + Picks

ORL sends- Hedo (10,600,000), Dwight (17,885,400), Duhon (3,460,000)

NJ out= $27,709,739
ORL out= $31,945,400

Difference is $4,235,661

New CBA says that..."Taxpaying teams can acquire no more than 125 percent plus $100,000 of the salaries they trade away (same as 2005 CBA). Non-taxpaying teams (based on their post-trade salary level) can acquire up to the lesser of 150 percent plus $100,000, or 100 percent plus $5 million of the salaries they trade away. The cash a team pays or receives in trade is limited to $3 million annually.

The Nets are not a taxpaying team. This trade is allowed under both instances of the new CBA rules, either 100% +5 million ($4,235,000) or 150% + $100,000 ($41,664,608).

What I mentioned about the multiple trades is that they could take advantage of that rule if necessary. Say they didn't have Mayo, so NJ is sending out only $22,077,103. They could cut that trade into 3 parts and take advantage of the rule. They could acquire 150% on each trade.

Trade 1- Hedo for Humphries- NJ out 8,000,000, in 10,600,000 (works under both rules)
Trade 2- Dwight for Okur+Lopez- NJ out $13,966,000 (100% +5 mil)
Trade 3- Duhon for Brooks+Jones- NJ our $2,353,200 (150% + 100k)

The scary thing is that the figures on the Nets work out nearly perfectly to take on Dwight Hedo and Duhon for expirings and young guys from NJ. The figures come out within a few hundred dollars.

Post trade Nets stand at ~62 million in team salary, way under the luxury tax.

[Reverse_Angle]

Couldn't you just edit your post instead of clogging the thread? You act like quite Jameer the stat padder of the forums.

I haven't really read the new CBA, but during the last CBA, the max salary you can take back by a trade can be something like within 25% + $150,000 even if you are over the cap. Should be similar for the new one. Instead of one huge trade, several small trades an be arranged to stay within the rules. In the end, it doesn't matter more than $2-3 mil, but that number can be huge depending on the situation.

[rcklsscognition]

Couldn't you just edit your post instead of clogging the thread? You act like quite Jameer the stat padder of the forums.

I haven't really read the new CBA, but during the last CBA, the max salary you can take back by a trade can be something like within 25% + $150,000 even if you are over the cap. Should be similar for the new one. Instead of one huge trade, several small trades an be arranged to stay within the rules. In the end, it doesn't matter more than $2-3 mil, but that number can be huge depending on the situation.

Here's a brief description of the new CBA and trades. More comparisons on
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/CBA-111128/how-new-nba-deal-compares-last-one

Taxpaying teams can acquire no more than 125 percent plus $100,000 of the salaries they trade away (same as 2005 CBA). Non-taxpaying teams (based on their post-trade salary level) can acquire up to the lesser of 150 percent plus $100,000, or 100 percent plus $5 million of the salaries they trade away. The cash a team pays or receives in trade is limited to $3 million annually.

[Reverse_Angle]

Couldn't you just edit your post instead of clogging the thread? You act like quite Jameer the stat padder of the forums.

I haven't really read the new CBA, but during the last CBA, the max salary you can take back by a trade can be something like within 25% + $150,000 even if you are over the cap. Should be similar for the new one. Instead of one huge trade, several small trades an be arranged to stay within the rules. In the end, it doesn't matter more than $2-3 mil, but that number can be huge depending on the situation.

Here's a brief description of the new CBA and trades. More comparisons on
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/CBA-111128/how-new-nba-deal-compares-last-one

Taxpaying teams can acquire no more than 125 percent plus $100,000 of the salaries they trade away (same as 2005 CBA). Non-taxpaying teams (based on their post-trade salary level) can acquire up to the lesser of 150 percent plus $100,000, or 100 percent plus $5 million of the salaries they trade away. The cash a team pays or receives in trade is limited to $3 million annually.

Sounds much more flexible. Maybe too much flexible.

[MagicFan41]

Nets & Magic could just make separate trades to stay within the rules of the new CBA. If NJ has the capspace, they'll find a way to take on the extra salary.

What exactly do you mean by this? Can you clarify and/or give an example? They don't have any cap room anymore this year...

This is the trade:

NJ sends- Okur (10,890,000), Humphries (8,000,000), Lopez (3,076,983), Brooks (1,110,120), Mayo (5,632,636) + Picks

ORL sends- Hedo (10,600,000), Dwight (17,885,400), Duhon (3,460,000)

NJ out= $27,709,739
ORL out= $31,945,400

Difference is $4,235,661

New CBA says that..."Taxpaying teams can acquire no more than 125 percent plus $100,000 of the salaries they trade away (same as 2005 CBA). Non-taxpaying teams (based on their post-trade salary level) can acquire up to the lesser of 150 percent plus $100,000, or 100 percent plus $5 million of the salaries they trade away. The cash a team pays or receives in trade is limited to $3 million annually.

The Nets are not a taxpaying team. This trade is allowed under both instances of the new CBA rules, either 100% +5 million ($4,235,000) or 150% + $100,000 ($41,664,608).

What I mentioned about the multiple trades is that they could take advantage of that rule if necessary. Say they didn't have Mayo, so NJ is sending out only $22,077,103. They could cut that trade into 3 parts and take advantage of the rule. They could acquire 150% on each trade.

Trade 1- Hedo for Humphries- NJ out 8,000,000, in 10,600,000 (works under both rules)
Trade 2- Dwight + Duhon for Okur+Lopez+Brooks- NJ out $15,077,103 (100% +5 mil)
Trade 3- Duhon for Brooks+Jones- NJ our $2,353,200 (150% + 100k)

The scary thing is that the figures on the Nets work out nearly perfectly to take on Dwight Hedo and Duhon for expirings and young guys from NJ. The figures come out within a few hundred dollars.

Post trade Nets stand at ~62 million in team salary, way under the luxury tax.

Well that is a completely different trade than what was being discussed. You have added Humphries and Mayo, and removed JRich. So this is a completely different discussion. Also, are you positive you can just break a trade up into multiple trades like that? There are typically rules against this sort of loophole so that the original intent of the rules apply. Otherwise you could theoretically take on $45mil more on a $30mil trade if you could break it down into three $10mil trades (taking on $15mil each), even though the point of the rule was that you would only be allowed to take on $35mil total ("the lesser of 150% + 100k and 100% + 5mil"). I'm not 100% sure that is allowed, maybe it is, I would be somewhat surprised though.

Also, your Trade 2 doesn't appear to work from my calculations? Dwight + Duhon are over $21mil. You also included Duhon in 2 separate trades? I assume you meant for Trade 2 to simply be Dwight alone? You also included Brooks in Trades 2 and 3. I know you can probably re-tool the 3 trades properly to make it work, but I think part of the reason you might not be able to do 3 separate trades is that each one has to be signed off on individually, and a team could back out of one of the trades once another had been approved? I think they have to be in one packaged trade for that reason, but again, not 100% positive.

[rcklsscognition]

Gotta go back and check my post, I had put Duhon on trade 2 when I did calculations for a 3rd trade. No, there are no rules against this, it was designed to allow for more trades. NJ can take on 150% of the salary they send up to the point where they go over the luxury tax, which I believe is 70 million.

I guess that means there are rules, the luxury tax threshold one.

[MagicFan41]

Gotta go back and check my post, I had put Duhon on trade 2 when I did calculations for a 3rd trade. No, there are no rules against this, it was designed to allow for more trades. NJ can take on 150% of the salary they send up to the point where they go over the luxury tax, which I believe is 70 million.

I guess that means there are rules, the luxury tax threshold one.

Well, no. NJ can't take on 150% of the salary they send. They can take on "THE LESSER of 150% or 100% + 5 mil". THE LESSER is extremely important there. That's what I am saying. Which means if they send out $30 mil, they can't take on $45 mil, they can only take on $35 mil, because $35 mil is THE LESSER of $35 mil and $45 mil.

[rcklsscognition]

Check the math. They can send out the lower of 100% + 5 million or 150% + 100k. This isn't one trade, it's 3. The rule does not say the total team trades for a season can be the lesser of those figures, it's each trade.

Trade 1- Hedo for Humphries- NJ out 8,000,000, in 10,600,000 (works under both rules)
100% + 5 mil= 13,000,000
150% + 100k= 12,100,000 (OK)

Trade 2- Dwight for Okur+Lopez- NJ out $13,966,000 (100% +5 mil)
100% + 5 mil= $18,966,000
150% + 100k= 21,049,000 (OK)

Trade 3- Duhon for Brooks+Jones- NJ our $2,353,200 (150% + 100k)
100% + 5 mil= 7,353,200
150% + 100k= 3,629,800 (OK)

Humphries would be needed in a J-Rich deal.

[MagicFan41]

Check the math. They can send out the lower of 100% + 5 million or 150% + 100k. This isn't one trade, it's 3. The rule does not say the total team trades for a season can be the lesser of those figures, it's each trade.

I understand what you are saying, I am agreeing that the math can work out as such, I am simply doubting that you are allowed to split a trade into multiple trades. Like I said, maybe you can, maybe you can't, but doing so would completely negate the intent of the rule, so I am suspect that the NBA would allow it. In fact, this clause is simply what people have reported, you haven't seen the exact language of every piece of an extremely long CBA have you? It could easily nullify this loophole. In the past it didn't really matter because there wasn't the provision of "the lesser of" so and so....it was simply 125% right? So whether you broke the trade up or not, it came out to the same thing.

Also, like I said....I don't think trades get immediately approved simultaneously by the NBA and all parties involved. What would happen if they submitted those 3 trades, trade 1 gets approved, then one of the teams pulls out of trades 2 and 3? I don't know the exact logistics of trade approvals in the NBA office, but I could see something like that happening. I don't know how we will ever get a real answer on this, but my hunch is that you aren't allowed to do this.

[SEBAS-07]

If bringing Amar`e Stoudemire would make Dwight stay, would anyone do this?

Orlando Trades: Jameer Nelson, Jason Richardson. Glen Davis, Quentin Richardson and Chris Duhon.

Receives: Amare Stoudemire, Baron Davis, Iman Shumpert, Toney Douglas, Landry Fields.

THE TRADE WOULD HAPPEN IN MARCH 1, 2012.

Orl Rotation

Baron Davis/Toney Douglas
JJ Redick/Iman Shumpert
Hedo/Fields
Amare/Anderson
Dwight/Earl Clark

Knicks rotation

Nelson/Duhon
Jason Richardson/Bill Walker
Carmelo/Q Richardson
Glen Davis/Harrelson
Chandler/Jeffries

[MagicFan41]

Check the math. They can send out the lower of 100% + 5 million or 150% + 100k. This isn't one trade, it's 3. The rule does not say the total team trades for a season can be the lesser of those figures, it's each trade.

Trade 1- Hedo for Humphries- NJ out 8,000,000, in 10,600,000 (works under both rules)
100% + 5 mil= 13,000,000
150% + 100k= 12,100,000 (OK)

Trade 2- Dwight for Okur+Lopez- NJ out $13,966,000 (100% +5 mil)
100% + 5 mil= 22885400
150% + 100k= 21,049,000 (OK)

Trade 3- Duhon for Brooks+Jones- NJ our $2,353,200 (150% + 100k)
100% + 5 mil= 8460000
150% + 100k= 5,290,000 (OK)

Humphries would be needed in a J-Rich deal.

You still aren't doing the calculations right, anyways. Ugh. A team can acquire 150% + 100k of the salary it sends out. So, for example, in trade 2, NJ can acquire 100% + 5mil of the $13966000 it sends out, NOT of Dwight's salary, which you used to get your $22885400. It still works, but you are doing the calculations wrong for the record. They can only acquire $18966000 in that trade. Also, it's James, not Jones. You again in trade 3 messed up and used the 150% of Duhon's salary. It should be that they can acquire $3629800, which Duhon just fits under. So it works, but you're doing it incorrectly. You also then say Humphries would be needed in a JRich deal, but then include him in the non JRich deal?

[MagicFan41]

If bringing Amar`e Stoudemire would make Dwight stay, would anyone do this?

Orlando Trades: Jameer Nelson, Jason Richardson. Glen Davis, Quentin Richardson and Chris Duhon.

Receives: Amare Stoudemire, Baron Davis, Iman Shumpert, Toney Douglas, Landry Fields.

THE TRADE WOULD HAPPEN IN MARCH 1, 2012.

Orl Rotation

Baron Davis/Toney Douglas
JJ Redick/Iman Shumpert
Hedo/Fields
Amare/Anderson
Dwight/Earl Clark

Knicks rotation

Nelson/Duhon
Jason Richardson/Bill Walker
Carmelo/Q Richardson
Glen Davis/Harrelson
Chandler/Jeffries

Lol. I'm pretty sure you won't find a person on the planet who is a Magic fan who wouldn't do that....

[rcklsscognition]

My bad on the one figure for Dwight. As for a J-Rich trade, something like this could be done. If NJ doesn't have cash or can't include that in a trade, they could add James to the 1st trade.

Trade 1- Hedo+ Duhon for Humphries+Brooks+Cash Considerations (200k)- NJ out 9,310,120
100% + 5 mil= 14,310,120
150% + 100k= $14,065,180 (OK)

Trade 2- Dwight for Okur+Lopez- NJ out $13,966,000 (100% +5 mil)
100% + 5 mil= 18,966,000 (OK)
150% + 100k= 21,049,000

Trade 3- J-Rich for Mayo+Picks- NJ out $5,632,636 (150% + 100k)
100% + 5 mil= $10,632,636
150% + 100k= $8,548,954 (OK)

NJ takes on $37,340,400 and sends $28,908,756. NJ is at $67,738,605 and still under the luxury tax threshold for these trades to go through.

Just pointing out that the OP was correct to post that Humphries needs to be in these trades for them to work. The original proposal didn't have him in it but he's changed it since then.

[rcklsscognition]

Also, Nets have until the end of day today to acquire Mayo or he cannot be traded before the deadline this year and wouldn't be able to be included in a Magic deal in March if there was one.

[j_n]

If bringing Amar`e Stoudemire would make Dwight stay, would anyone do this?

Orlando Trades: Jameer Nelson, Jason Richardson. Glen Davis, Quentin Richardson and Chris Duhon.

Receives: Amare Stoudemire, Baron Davis, Iman Shumpert, Toney Douglas, Landry Fields.

THE TRADE WOULD HAPPEN IN MARCH 1, 2012.

Orl Rotation

Baron Davis/Toney Douglas
JJ Redick/Iman Shumpert
Hedo/Fields
Amare/Anderson
Dwight/Earl Clark

Knicks rotation

Nelson/Duhon
Jason Richardson/Bill Walker
Carmelo/Q Richardson
Glen Davis/Harrelson
Chandler/Jeffries

Pretty sure you could take shumpert and fields off the deal and switch davis with ryno and most pepole here would still go for it IF it makes dwight stay.

[cb1115]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qg7qk_qD4lI&feature=related[/youtube]

Hilarious.

[MagicFan32]

Of course NJ talked to dwight! they tampered and the only reason Orlando hasn't dropped those charges on them is b/c they may need a dance partner. Dwight is hooked on NJ for a reason....Because they bypassed the rules to sell him. Dwights a double talking prick in my book, winning has nothing to do with this b.s

now if we could get a mayo/brooks/lopez/okur/firsts package i do that, Mayo would fit well here, brooks is a stud, and that nets pick should be top 5

But when push comes to shove, I expect LA to cave and offer Bynum.Gasol or Bynum, Morris, multiple firsts or something. Kobe is sending a message by shooting so much. he wants dwight,and LA needs a superstar for the post Kobe era

[MagicFan32]

From Sentinel:

The elephant in the room was Dwight Howard's wayward free-throw shooting. Not the only elephant, mind you. There were plenty of pachyderms outside the Magic's practice door Saturday at Amway Center, what with the circus in town. "I just think everybody needs to stop talking about it," Howard said. "There's more to life than free throws."

----

Seriously? Why don't you man-up for once in your life and take responsibility for your shortcomings, Dwight? What a complete cop-out. You may as well say "there's more to basketball than winning" or "there's more to life than a big Adidas contract". I mean, stop being a damn hypocrite and saying basketball ("free throws") isn't everything in life, but then acting like it is by calling out your team, city, organization by saying you "just want to win" and bailing on them. You'd probably win a whole lot more if you improved your HORRENDOUS FT%. Have FUN with the NYC media, if you think the ORL media is tough on you and your 40% FT rate.....LOL. Grow up. Man up. That's what true winners do, they look in the mirror and see their shortcomings and overcome them. They don't ignore them or make excuses for them.

Dwights acting like a little kid, does he realize his pathetic foul shooting is one of the reasons he doesn't have a ring?

[jadewbj]

Kobe is trying to show they dont need bynum and gasol buly just not including them.

[BadMofoPimp]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/orlando-magic/dwight-howard/os-bianchi-dwight-howard-media-0115-20120114,0,7318422.column

Talks about how hard the media will be on Dwight if he left for a bigger market and how great he has it here.

Lebron gets worked by everybody and is always a butt to everyones jokes. If Dwight leaves, he is opening himself up to a mass of haters even from fans and media of his own team's market.

Those are just some of the caustic, biting words used to describe Howard in a column earlier this week by the Chicago Tribune's resident rabble-rouser Steve Rosenbloom. It seems Rosenbloom had venom and vitriol pouring from his laptop because Howard has had the gall to leave the Chicago Bulls off of his preferred destination list.

"I have an issue with Dwight Howard," Rosenbloom railed. "He sounds like an idiot. He sounds like a loser. … That's the Howard we're seeing now. The idiot Howard. … If Howard doesn't want to come to Chicago, do you really want him? Do you want someone that stupid?"

It will be fascinating to see how the ultrasensitive Howard handles the intense media scrutiny he will get in places where the tabloids, the TMZs and the goon columnists take a machete to his every fault, foible and failing. Howard is a guy who actually thinks the Orlando Sentinel is tough on him when mostly all we columnists do is write about how great he is, how much we will miss him and how devastating it will be for the team and the town once his trade request is actually executed.

And remember three years ago when the Magic were in the Finals against the Lakers and Howard missed two free throws at the end of Game 4 that allowed L.A. to rally, win the game and pretty much secure the series? Can you imagine how he would have been portrayed in New York if he were to cost the Knicks a potential championship with his abysmal free-throw shooting? He'd have been portrayed as the biggest sports choker since Bill Buckner.

Do we need to remind Dwight again what a megastar he has become as a member of the Magic?

He's the leading vote-getter for this year's All-Star Game and set an all-time record for All-Star votes (in 2009) right here in Orlando.

He's the runner-up for the MVP and the only player in history to win three straight Defensive Player of the Year Awards right here in Orlando.

He's a social-media trendsetter who has nearly 3 million Twitter followers right here in Orlando.

He's made movies and been on Jay Leno right here in Orlando.

He's got all the major national endorsements — McDonald's, adidas, Gatorade, T-Mobile, Call of Duty, etc. — right here in Orlando.

He's a global icon and the second-most-popular American athlete in China right here in Orlando.

During the past four seasons, he's played on the third-winningest franchise in the NBA (both regular season and playoffs) with the fourth-highest payroll in all of sports right here in Orlando.

He's been able to accomplish all of the above — and not once has anybody in the Orlando media ever called him an idiot, a chump or a loser.