Official 2021 NBA Draft Thread Part 2

[Knightro]

Yeah I like Carter. I don’t think he’s an elite prospect, but he’s a serviceable Center that can help you win basketball games and not eat heavily into the cap. What more could you ask for? He’s going to get better.

If we are talking about best “fit” for Orlando, Mobley isn’t in the conversation unless you’re Steve Clifford and the year is 1999.

Now, if someone believes he’s the “best talent” on the board... sure whatever.

No argument there.

As presently constructed, Mobley is definitely not the best fit.

My hope is that now that the front office has shown the willingness to shake things up like they did at the deadline, that they are going to just take the BPA (whoever that is) and then balance the roster with trades as necessary.

Like... if they want to pick Mobley in the top 5, that's fine, but they can only make that pick knowing that AT LEAST one and probably two of Isaac/Carter/Bamba gotta be moved depending on what position they think Mobley will be long-term.

Personally, I think he's a center and you'd have to move one of Carter or Bamba immediately, but some folks think he's a PF.

[Xatticus]

Isaac is coming back. He’s locked in to a large contract with Orlando. He’s likely going to be playing PF now that AG is gone.

Orlando just drafted a Center and acquired another from the same exact draft (2018). They are both 22 years old.

Cole Anthony and Markelle Fultz are not starting caliber point guards in the NBA. If they are, then they are bottom 3 out of all teams.

For as much as I like RJ Hampton, he’s not a shooter and is duplicative of Fultz in terms of skills set.

Orlando hasn’t had a true Small Forward since Turk and there are possibly 3 in the top of this draft.

There is no possible way you actually believe adding another Center to replace WCJr is more important than replacing Ennis or Bacon. Either that, or you’re trolling.

I've been very guilty of this in the past myself, but putting this much consideration into what's already here is a mistake IMO.

I don't think the Magic can or should weigh their draft decisions based on some sort of "Center Prospect X is only 20% better than Carter Jr and Wing Prospect Y is 50% better than Ennis and Bacon" criteria.

The only thing that really matters is "Draft prospect X is whatever percentage better than Draft prospect Y".

I like Carter. I don't like Bamba as much. But I would be 100% content moving on from both of them without much of a second thought if a clear elite center prospect presented itself in the draft. They're both ultimately just regular guys, not elite talent.

I'd probably keep Bamba over Carter. I don't know. It's tough. I just think Bamba's ceiling is still quite a bit higher and I've seen enough improvement from him since he has finally gotten some meaningful minutes. WCJ is definitely better right now, but I think there is a higher chance that we end up looking really stupid by letting Bamba go before we know for sure that he won't figure it out.

[VFX]

^care to elaborate on why you'd go with Suggs over Cade? Not saying I disagree necessarily, but it seems like a bit of an outlier opinion.

There’s something special about Suggs imo. He’s a multi-sport athlete that decided winning a championship at the college level was more important than going to the G-league, or staying close to home, knowing he wasn’t guaranteed to go in the top of the lotto. He’s proven to be a clutch player in big games.

I think it’s a toss up between Cade and Suggs for me. However, if I consider all of the intangibles I’d probably go Suggs. If you look down the line at young players most willing to ask for trades down the road, I’d assume Suggs would be least likely out of the top 5.

Of course a lot of these things don’t matter to people, but it matters to me.

Agreed. The thing with Suggs is that his skill base isn't that high, yet he makes plays at a high frequency. He plays the game like a QB/safety. He sees opportunities and goes. He doesn't idle on ball and try to figure things out. He can already run the pick and roll really well. I just think a lot of work on his basic skills will improve his play demonstrably and you don't have to hope that the game just clicks for him at some point. I'd still take Cunningham because we've seen that there is a significant advantage in getting playmaking from someone with a bigger frame.

Yeah, I think whoever lands either of them are going to be extremely happy with their selection. All the other prospects have some questions, but those two to me are obviously on another tier.

[Xatticus]

Cade
Suggs

Green

Mobley

Kuminga

No particular order for the chi pick. I havent watched Bouknight, Moody or Keon Johnson so far.
Giddey
Barnes
Springer
Wagner
J. Johnson

btw. Whats the appeal of K. Johnson, because i saw him high on some lists here & mocks. Like i wrote, i havent watched him at all but his profile looks not really interesting for me. Bad shooter + suspect handle + pretty bad off. advanced stats, except FTr

The physical tools are really good and he plays really hard. He also improved as the season went along. The shooting is the major issue. It isn't just that he didn't shoot well, but there isn't anything indicating that he is better than the numbers, which is really concerning to me. Some guys you can look at and see how good they could be if the shot comes along, but then there are guys where you kind of know that the shot never will get much better. That's what scares me about both Keon Johnson and Scottie Barnes, so I don't see high ceilings with either. At the same time though, both should be able to carve out careers in NBA rotations.

[VFX]

I'm not trolling, I don't do that or dismiss someones opinion (not saying you have). F

For me it's simply BPA, when I consider fit with it's Mobley. I believe Fultz will comeback and be a good enough starting PG, and we have 2 other prospects.

I believe Okeke can play SF, and I've also said in the Chicago thread Barnes would be my ideal pick with that pick to play 3 and 4.

All that being said I'm not concrete on that opinion, as we get closer and more info comes out Mobley could slide and not make sense for his perceived ceiling.

I don't believe in WCJ is more than a back up, and I hate to say I think Bamba will ne moved, I hope I'm wrong.

I get why people wouldn't want another center too, as a fan I wouldn't either

Yeah, I think WCJ are Bamba peak at starters and we have 3 prospects in the backcourt. There is also no guarantee we resign WCJ or Bamba


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Isaac is coming back. He’s locked in to a large contract with Orlando. He’s likely going to be playing PF now that AG is gone.

Orlando just drafted a Center and acquired another from the same exact draft (2018). They are both 22 years old.

Cole Anthony and Markelle Fultz are not starting caliber point guards in the NBA. If they are, then they are bottom 3 out of all teams.

For as much as I like RJ Hampton, he’s not a shooter and is duplicative of Fultz in terms of skills set.

Orlando hasn’t had a true Small Forward since Turk and there are possibly 3 in the top of this draft.

There is no possible way you actually believe adding another Center to replace WCJr is more important than replacing Ennis or Bacon. Either that, or you’re trolling. OR are you not really talking about fit at all?

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Then you’re talking about BPA and not fit.

That’s fine, but what you’re describing isn’t “fit” based on the current roster.



In regards to your Mobley/Barnes scenario with the Bulls pick..

Who is shooting the basketball with a potential starting lineup of-

Fultz
Hampton
Barnes/Okeke
Isaac/Barnes
Mobley/WCJr

Seems completely contrary to modern basketball.

[KillMonger]

Why Mobley last?

Cade
Green
Kuminga
Suggs
Mobley

In that order


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he's just my least favorite out of the five....not to say he doesn't have massive potential he does....but for me....i like what he brings on defense, like his passing ability....don't believe in his jumpshot...like at all....question his ability to bang in the paint on the next level....last time i checked he measures in about 7 foot but he's 215 lbs....for comparisons Suggs weighs 205 lbs....he only weighs 10 more pounds than a 6'3/6'4 guard who's not all that big himself.....like i said before though even though he's my least favorite i still think he has star potential

[RookieStar]

Why Mobley last?

Cade
Green
Kuminga
Suggs
Mobley

In that order


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he's just my least favorite out of the five....not to say he doesn't have massive potential he does....but for me....i like what he brings on defense, like his passing ability....don't believe in his jumpshot...like at all....question his ability to bang in the paint on the next level....last time i checked he measures in about 7 foot but he's 215 lbs....for comparisons Suggs weighs 205 lbs....he only weighs 10 more pounds than a 6'3/6'4 guard who's not all that big himself.....like i said before though even though he's my least favorite i still think he has star potential

TBF, JI coming into the league was only 210 I think. And look at him now. Difference between the two was JI's skill-set was more on the defensive side while Mobley is on the offense.

[KillMonger]

Why Mobley last?

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he's just my least favorite out of the five....not to say he doesn't have massive potential he does....but for me....i like what he brings on defense, like his passing ability....don't believe in his jumpshot...like at all....question his ability to bang in the paint on the next level....last time i checked he measures in about 7 foot but he's 215 lbs....for comparisons Suggs weighs 205 lbs....he only weighs 10 more pounds than a 6'3/6'4 guard who's not all that big himself.....like i said before though even though he's my least favorite i still think he has star potential

TBF, JI coming into the league was only 210 I think. And look at him now. Difference between the two was JI's skill-set was more on the defensive side while Mobley is on the offense.

sure but.....i have yet to see said offense as far as mobley is concerned....also with JI i wasn't expecting him to be a big man and to anchor the defense coming in....that's what i expect from mobley

[RookieStar]

he's just my least favorite out of the five....not to say he doesn't have massive potential he does....but for me....i like what he brings on defense, like his passing ability....don't believe in his jumpshot...like at all....question his ability to bang in the paint on the next level....last time i checked he measures in about 7 foot but he's 215 lbs....for comparisons Suggs weighs 205 lbs....he only weighs 10 more pounds than a 6'3/6'4 guard who's not all that big himself.....like i said before though even though he's my least favorite i still think he has star potential

TBF, JI coming into the league was only 210 I think. And look at him now. Difference between the two was JI's skill-set was more on the defensive side while Mobley is on the offense.

sure but.....i have yet to see said offense as far as mobley is concerned....also with JI i wasn't expecting him to be a big man and to anchor the defense coming in....that's what i expect from mobley

Ah I see... well the few games I saw him I was thinking already raw PF. But that's just me.

As for Mobley, you really haven't seen it? To me, he probably was the anchor/linchpin of their offense.

[CZ Eddie]

You cant be first option with his level of reading the game and passing. Almost zero percent he gets there, he shows no signs.
His likely outcome is overrated second option. Streaky shooting and below average defense. Thats not a good skill set for second option.
He is still great prospect but i wouldnt take him above Suggs and Mobley who seem to process the game on a higher level.

SO let me get this straight....An 19 year old, who is rated as one of the best SG prospects to come out in years, lit up the G league and has a top level work ethic WILL NEVER IMPROVE??
this easily one of the most asinine comments ive ever read on this, or any bball board.

Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is . The best SG in nba is who really? Beal, healthy Thompson?

There is lot of Zach Lavine in Green. Is that bad outcome of draft ? Not really. But probably not player that will be your lead guy to wins.

"Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is "

uh,, ever hear of a guy named Michael Jordan?

[CZ Eddie]

I like someone we have at every position, so this draft should be about drafting the BPA if we pick up one of the top four draft slots. Anything beyond #4 and I hope we draft for best fit/need.

[RookieStar]

SO let me get this straight....An 19 year old, who is rated as one of the best SG prospects to come out in years, lit up the G league and has a top level work ethic WILL NEVER IMPROVE??
this easily one of the most asinine comments ive ever read on this, or any bball board.

Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is . The best SG in nba is who really? Beal, healthy Thompson?

There is lot of Zach Lavine in Green. Is that bad outcome of draft ? Not really. But probably not player that will be your lead guy to wins.

"Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is "

uh,, ever hear of a guy named Michael Jordan?

you gotta add Kobe as well. lol but i think he means in this new era of the NBA

[Xatticus]

Moody’s shooting profile isn’t anywhere near what Redick’s was. Nobody in this class is Redick. The only one I’d have as being somewhat close is Hyland. There are 3 predictors for 3-point ability: FT%, 3PAr, and 3P%.

I want to point out that Moody’s numbers are inflated because he played a lot of minutes. He had a decent rebound rate and a good free throw rate. His numbers are otherwise rather pedestrian. I think people are seeing something more in him because his per game numbers are better than the other wing prospects in his tier, but that’s all about his minutes. He really isn’t all that appealing unless you believe his shooting is vastly superior to what he demonstrated this year.

What are your thoughts on Duane Washington Jr.? If he stays in the draft, is he worth the Magic's SRP?


..

He looks really limited to me. He isn't a PG. He has below average tools for a two. He isn't explosive. He doesn't get to the rim. He doesn't finish well. He has really low steal and block rates. His rebound rate is low. I just don't see what he does well aside from shooting, but even his shooting profile isn't anything special. He doesn't get to the FT line. He'll probably be alright at catch-and-shoots, but that's about all I'd expect from him as a shooter. I don't think he has much upside at the defensive end. I think there has to be more appealing prospects available. I think it's unlikely he gets drafted.

[pepe1991]

Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is . The best SG in nba is who really? Beal, healthy Thompson?

There is lot of Zach Lavine in Green. Is that bad outcome of draft ? Not really. But probably not player that will be your lead guy to wins.

"Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is "

uh,, ever hear of a guy named Michael Jordan?

you gotta add Kobe as well. lol but i think he means in this new era of the NBA

Kobe played most of his career in era before 3 point barage.

Nowdays best SGs are Mitchell, Lavine, Booker, SGA, Beal... Almost all belong in same "high usage, no playoff sucess" category other than Klay Thompson, who is 6'7 and could also play SF if needed.

[RookieStar]

"Tbh SG is by far least impacful nba positions there is "

uh,, ever hear of a guy named Michael Jordan?

you gotta add Kobe as well. lol but i think he means in this new era of the NBA

Kobe played most of his career in era before 3 point barage.

Nowdays best SGs are Mitchell, Lavine, Booker, SGA, Beal... Almost all belong in same "high usage, no playoff sucess" category other than Klay Thompson, who is 6'7 and could also play SF if needed.

Its the times. SGs before were usually 6'6 to 6'9 ( MJ kobe rip Tmac Reggie Houston ) they could play SF as well but they had bigger teammates who could take the punishment. Nowadays 6'3 above and you can be considered a SG.. and SFs are 6'6 to 6'8.

[RookieStar]

But yeah.. 90s to 2010 the most famous/desirable/glamorous position was the SG.. ot coule be said it was the most impactful outside of a big physical C downlow....after that it became the SF...

[pepe1991]

you gotta add Kobe as well. lol but i think he means in this new era of the NBA

Kobe played most of his career in era before 3 point barage.

Nowdays best SGs are Mitchell, Lavine, Booker, SGA, Beal... Almost all belong in same "high usage, no playoff sucess" category other than Klay Thompson, who is 6'7 and could also play SF if needed.

Its the times. SGs before were usually 6'6 to 6'9 ( MJ kobe rip Tmac Reggie Houston ) they could play SF as well but they had bigger teammates who could take the punishment. Nowadays 6'3 above and you can be considered a SG.. and SFs are 6'6 to 6'8.

I agree with this.
Average size of shooting guard in 2020 was 6'4. Average size of shooting gaurd in 2001 was 6'5
Average size of SF in 2020 was 6'4... in 2011 was almost 6'8.

Average weight of SF in 2020 is 213 lbs, in 2013 it was 223.

Players shrunk

Basically most of today's PFs were considered SFs in past and most of past SGs would be SFs nowdays.

So yea T mac, Kobe, even Jordan would probably play SF if they play today.

But guys like Mitchell ( 6'2 at most ) , Beal ( 6'3), McCullum are even underszied by today's standards of height. Most of them struggle a lot to lift their teams to contending level in playoffs and size is probably one of factors why. Since Jordan era only finals MVPs who were guards (both PGs or SGs) are Billups, Wade, Parker and Kobe.

SFs who are 6'7-6'10 seems to have biggest impacts on winning among suprestar players. Basically perfect player is Kawhi, Lebron, Durant type player. Tall ballhandler.

[drsd]

He looks really limited to me. He isn't a PG. He has below average tools for a two. He isn't explosive. He doesn't get to the rim. He doesn't finish well. He has really low steal and block rates. His rebound rate is low. I just don't see what he does well aside from shooting, but even his shooting profile isn't anything special. He doesn't get to the FT line. He'll probably be alright at catch-and-shoots, but that's about all I'd expect from him as a shooter. I don't think he has much upside at the defensive end. I think there has to be more appealing prospects available. I think it's unlikely he gets drafted.

For me Washington's upside is as a bench guard playing solely as a catch and shoot 3rd ball gunslinger. That is, his higest possible upside is as Steve Kerr. But, that level of shooting competence must have a role in the NBA.

If the Magic is going to draft a shooter, there might not be a better player in this draft. But that is probably the ONLY NBA skill he has.
..

[OrlChamps2030]

Bro if the Magic draft Mobley I would be worried about the collective well-being of the posters on this board

[VFX]

Bro if the Magic draft Mobley I would be worried about the collective well-being of the posters on this board

Yeah, some of us don’t want to watch another 7 years of a big taking 25 shots a game, surrounded by players that can’t shoot the basketball. Post traumatic stress disorder.