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Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon

Moderators: UCF, Knightro, UCFJayBird, Def Swami, Howard Mass, ChosenSavior

Should we resign Vuc/Ross

Yes
43
34%
Yes, but just Vuc
9
7%
Yes, but just Ross
51
40%
No
23
18%
 
Total votes: 126

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#601 » by Skin » Fri May 24, 2019 12:22 am

Bensational wrote:
Skin wrote:
Bensational wrote:There is a post on Reddit from someone claiming 'sauces' that offered up some interesting tidbits worth discussing. No point bothering to credit or discredit them, but they give us something to talk about.

Vuc - apparently wants $25M, but WeHam are fixed on $20M. Dallas allegedly prepared to throw $30M at him.

Fournier - WeHam apparently are prepared to use our #16 to trade to trade Fournier for cap space. Allegedly they want to make a run at Brogdon in free agency.

Fultz - still very much injured, apparently.

Discuss away.

I'm a sucker for believing this stuff. Could've said Vuc wants $30M and WeHam are fixed on $25 and I would've believed it.

I'll say this though... $20M is very encouraging. Simply because I think he can get more and if WeHam won't budge then bye bye kind sir! Have doubts on that Dallas offer, but I hope they make it!

Having to attach that pick in order to dump Fournier sounds right. Despite homers thinking Fournier is some valuable asset. tsk tsk.

Fultz :(


I don't share your conviction in moving on from Vuc. $20M or less would be good value in my eyes for what he brings. But I suspect some team will offer him $25M.

I don't understand how they'd be able to move Fournier for capspace, unless they trade him and the #16 for JR Smith's unguaranteed deal. But I would be happy to have Brogdon on the team for the same coin.

Fultz is a bummer. But that just emphasises the importance of management continuing to find backcourt players to develop, because he's not something we can count on yet. All I really want is more backcourt prospects or talent.

Getting Vuc for $20M is not realistic. Would he turn down other offers to take a lot less money and stay here? If he does, then I just hope it's not a 5 year deal. I would barely be agreeable to that offer even if it was 4 years.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#602 » by Def Swami » Fri May 24, 2019 12:24 am

MoMM wrote:The deal I heard is Mozgov + DJ + Bamba for Conley and it works in the trade checker:
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7198770

Personally, I'd accept this deal. Basically we would be moving our expirings from 2020 offseason to 2021 and trading Bamba for Conley.

I wouldn't do this if it involved Bamba.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#603 » by Def Swami » Fri May 24, 2019 12:28 am

Bensational wrote:There is a post on Reddit from someone claiming 'sauces' that offered up some interesting tidbits worth discussing. No point bothering to credit or discredit them, but they give us something to talk about.

Vuc - apparently wants $25M, but WeHam are fixed on $20M. Dallas allegedly prepared to throw $30M at him.

Fournier - WeHam apparently are prepared to use our #16 to trade to trade Fournier for cap space. Allegedly they want to make a run at Brogdon in free agency.

Fultz - still very much injured, apparently.

Discuss away.

$20 mill is about as high as I'd go for Vucevic. Anymore and I'll let him walk and change course.

I dislike attaching assets to rectify other mistakes. Unless the Magic know that they can use that potential cap space productively, I wouldn't just give away the pick for the hope of signing someone. I would love to make a run at Brogdon and bring him in, but I have a hard time seeing the Bucks not matching. He's so vital to what they do. Same thing could be said for D'Angelo Russell.

With regard to Fultz, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#604 » by Catledge » Fri May 24, 2019 12:29 am

The thing that makes me think that Conley might come at a cheap price (like Fournier + Mozgov + low value pick) is that there are other similar or better guard options on the market. With Jrue likely on the trade block, Kemba a free agent, Kyrie a free agent, and Brogdon an RFA, teams will have other good options that they might rather spend their assets and cap space on.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#605 » by ezzzp » Fri May 24, 2019 12:38 am

Bensational wrote:
ezzzp wrote:
His "insider" claim to fame was that he said he knew someone who told him that Bamba was WelHam's pick and MPJr's back was a problem for this season

Hmm so his "source" let him know that:

• A GM duo specifically known to crave players with long wingspans wanted to draft an 8' 10 wingspan guy who projects to be in their draft range and btw their starting C is set to hit free agency...

• A guy coming off of spinal surgery the previous month won't be ready to go the upcoming season...

...call me crazy, but this doesn't seem at all credible

On that note:

Sacramento and Dallas are both interested in Tobias Harris: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/04/tobias-harris-will-draw-plenty-of-interest-in-free-agency.html


Like I said, there's no point trying to prove he's credible or not. They just serve as interesting talking points.

Teams will be linked to lots of players over the next few months. 4 teams are said to be interested in Harris, 5 if you include Philly. There's only one Tobias Harris to go around though, so a lot of them will be considering other options.


Well, it is worth pushing back if its obvious he's just feeding the anti Vucevic/Fournier hate machine that dominates that Reddit and then is brought here to push similar agenda.

Also, we've been discussing Vucevic salary and Fournier trades over and over x 1000, so exactly how are these "interesting talking points" any different?

...curious that you discredit a respected journalist that says that Dallas and Sacramento are interested in using their cap space on a forward...two teams the anti-Vucevic people have been saying are destinations for him...but a random redditor making obviously biased claims is worthy of discussion.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#606 » by Bensational » Fri May 24, 2019 2:17 am

ezzzp wrote:
Bensational wrote:
ezzzp wrote:
His "insider" claim to fame was that he said he knew someone who told him that Bamba was WelHam's pick and MPJr's back was a problem for this season

Hmm so his "source" let him know that:

• A GM duo specifically known to crave players with long wingspans wanted to draft an 8' 10 wingspan guy who projects to be in their draft range and btw their starting C is set to hit free agency...

• A guy coming off of spinal surgery the previous month won't be ready to go the upcoming season...

...call me crazy, but this doesn't seem at all credible

On that note:

Sacramento and Dallas are both interested in Tobias Harris: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/04/tobias-harris-will-draw-plenty-of-interest-in-free-agency.html


Like I said, there's no point trying to prove he's credible or not. They just serve as interesting talking points.

Teams will be linked to lots of players over the next few months. 4 teams are said to be interested in Harris, 5 if you include Philly. There's only one Tobias Harris to go around though, so a lot of them will be considering other options.


Well, it is worth pushing back if its obvious he's just feeding the anti Vucevic/Fournier hate machine that dominates that Reddit and then is brought here to push similar agenda.

Also, we've been discussing Vucevic salary and Fournier trades over and over x 1000, so exactly how are these "interesting talking points" any different?

...curious that you discredit a respected journalist that says that Dallas and Sacramento are interested in using their cap space on a forward...two teams the anti-Vucevic people have been saying are destinations for him...but a random redditor making obviously biased claims is worthy of discussion.


You really need to lay off trying to paint a tribal view of Vuc and anti-Vuc people and supposed agendas. You're making it too personal. I didn't try to 'discredit' that journalist at all, just pointed out that there's only 1 Harris to fill the demand. The teams that miss out will need to consider alternatives. That's just simple fact and logic.

And I didn't try to fluff up that poster's claims, either. Just shared them. They're interesting talking points because they're already talking points. If there's truth in them, it's reason to consider WeHam's thought process behind those choices. Or, you can cover your ears and say 'la la la la la can't hear you" and spend your time trying to refute the notion management might consider the option, and spend your energy discrediting an anonymous poster who's thoughts could just be as speculative as your own. The choice is up to you. I'm already familiar with your stance,band I respect that, so I don't see a need to go back and forth on it.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#607 » by taj2133 » Fri May 24, 2019 2:32 am

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#608 » by taj2133 » Fri May 24, 2019 2:33 am

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#609 » by ezzzp » Fri May 24, 2019 4:04 am

Bensational wrote:
You really need to lay off trying to paint a tribal view of Vuc and anti-Vuc people and supposed agendas. You're making it too personal. I didn't try to 'discredit' that journalist at all, just pointed out that there's only 1 Harris to fill the demand. The teams that miss out will need to consider alternatives. That's just simple fact and logic.

And I didn't try to fluff up that poster's claims, either. Just shared them. They're interesting talking points because they're already talking points. If there's truth in them, it's reason to consider WeHam's thought process behind those choices. Or, you can cover your ears and say 'la la la la la can't hear you" and spend your time trying to refute the notion management might consider the option, and spend your energy discrediting an anonymous poster who's thoughts could just be as speculative as your own. The choice is up to you. I'm already familiar with your stance,band I respect that, so I don't see a need to go back and forth on it.



Its not a secret that Magic fans are divided on Vucevic. There is a daily back and forth on Vucevic every day by the same people, you are one of them. You need to lay off trying to pretend that you haven't been knee deep in it and now accusing others of making it personal because they won't just accept agenda being veiled in naiveté.

Here you are getting personal and passive aggressive in the same comment you are accusing others of getting personal: "You can cover your ears and say 'lalalala can't hear you" etc...How about you stare hard into a mirror and heed your own words when your pov gets challenged by an equally legitimate pov.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#610 » by Bensational » Fri May 24, 2019 4:45 am

ezzzp wrote:
Bensational wrote:
You really need to lay off trying to paint a tribal view of Vuc and anti-Vuc people and supposed agendas. You're making it too personal. I didn't try to 'discredit' that journalist at all, just pointed out that there's only 1 Harris to fill the demand. The teams that miss out will need to consider alternatives. That's just simple fact and logic.

And I didn't try to fluff up that poster's claims, either. Just shared them. They're interesting talking points because they're already talking points. If there's truth in them, it's reason to consider WeHam's thought process behind those choices. Or, you can cover your ears and say 'la la la la la can't hear you" and spend your time trying to refute the notion management might consider the option, and spend your energy discrediting an anonymous poster who's thoughts could just be as speculative as your own. The choice is up to you. I'm already familiar with your stance,band I respect that, so I don't see a need to go back and forth on it.



Its not a secret that Magic fans are divided on Vucevic. There is a daily back and forth on Vucevic every day by the same people, you are one of them. You need to lay off trying to pretend that you haven't been knee deep in it and now accusing others of making it personal because they won't just accept agenda being veiled in naiveté.

Here you are getting personal and passive aggressive in the same comment you are accusing others of getting personal: "You can cover your ears and say 'lalalala can't hear you" etc...How about you stare hard into a mirror and heed your own words when your pov gets challenged by an equally legitimate pov.


Well then I apologize if that offended you.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#611 » by ezzzp » Fri May 24, 2019 4:58 am

Bensational wrote:
Well then I apologize if that offended you.


no worries man, we're all passionate Magic fans here
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#612 » by pepe1991 » Fri May 24, 2019 6:53 am

Unrelated to thread but boy oh boy Leonard is impressive
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#613 » by Bensational » Fri May 24, 2019 8:00 am

pepe1991 wrote:Unrelated to thread but boy oh boy Leonard is impressive


He's ridiculous. He's playing the best basketball in the league right now.

Here's my completely unrealistic re-do of the last offseason and season.

Draft:
SGA

Trade:
Biyombo for Dwight
Vuc + Fournier + Isaac for Kawhi + Green

Mid-season Trade:
Dwight for M.Gasol
Simmons for Fultz

Current Lineup:

Gasol/Birch
Gordon/?
Kawhi/Iwundu
Green/Ross
SGA/DJ/Fultz

One can dream... or play 2K. 8-)
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#614 » by Skybox » Fri May 24, 2019 11:15 am

Def Swami wrote:
Bensational wrote:There is a post on Reddit from someone claiming 'sauces' that offered up some interesting tidbits worth discussing. No point bothering to credit or discredit them, but they give us something to talk about.

Vuc - apparently wants $25M, but WeHam are fixed on $20M. Dallas allegedly prepared to throw $30M at him.

Fournier - WeHam apparently are prepared to use our #16 to trade to trade Fournier for cap space. Allegedly they want to make a run at Brogdon in free agency.

Fultz - still very much injured, apparently.

Discuss away.

$20 mill is about as high as I'd go for Vucevic. Anymore and I'll let him walk and change course.

I dislike attaching assets to rectify other mistakes. Unless the Magic know that they can use that potential cap space productively, I wouldn't just give away the pick for the hope of signing someone. I would love to make a run at Brogdon and bring him in, but I have a hard time seeing the Bucks not matching. He's so vital to what they do. Same thing could be said for D'Angelo Russell.

With regard to Fultz, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


I heard same stuff (all of it) from a very good source. I didn't specifically hear Fournier but that the pick could be traded for cap space (with someone)...who the target is with that cap space if up for debate but Brogdon or Russell make some sense-obviously all of these things are dependent on others playing along...I absolutely believe that WeHam would hold the line on Vuc $$$, even if the intention is to bring him back. $20m may well be OUR number and $25+ is someone else's...heard that Fultz's injury is physical, but largely in his head (not imaginary-just difficult to overcome). I don't necessarily take that as a bad thing. The Magic are being patient and supportive-giving him best chance to overcome it...same source who last year said those things about Bamba and Porter. Heard it with my ears.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#615 » by Bensational » Fri May 24, 2019 11:23 am

Skybox wrote:
Def Swami wrote:
Bensational wrote:There is a post on Reddit from someone claiming 'sauces' that offered up some interesting tidbits worth discussing. No point bothering to credit or discredit them, but they give us something to talk about.

Vuc - apparently wants $25M, but WeHam are fixed on $20M. Dallas allegedly prepared to throw $30M at him.

Fournier - WeHam apparently are prepared to use our #16 to trade to trade Fournier for cap space. Allegedly they want to make a run at Brogdon in free agency.

Fultz - still very much injured, apparently.

Discuss away.

$20 mill is about as high as I'd go for Vucevic. Anymore and I'll let him walk and change course.

I dislike attaching assets to rectify other mistakes. Unless the Magic know that they can use that potential cap space productively, I wouldn't just give away the pick for the hope of signing someone. I would love to make a run at Brogdon and bring him in, but I have a hard time seeing the Bucks not matching. He's so vital to what they do. Same thing could be said for D'Angelo Russell.

With regard to Fultz, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


I heard same stuff (all of it) from a very good source. I didn't specifically hear Fournier but that the pick could be traded for cap space (with someone)...who the target is with that cap space if up for debate but Brogdon or Russell make some sense-obviously all of these things are dependent on others playing along...I absolutely believe that WeHam would hold the line on Vuc $$$, even if the intention is to bring him back. $20m may well be OUR number and $25+ is someone else's...heard that Fultz's injury is physical, but largely in his head (not imaginary-just difficult to overcome). I don't necessarily take that as a bad thing. The Magic are being patient and supportive-giving him best chance to overcome it...same source who last year said those things about Bamba and Porter. Heard it with my ears.


Are you that poster on Reddit? Or someone who has the same friend in common?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#616 » by Skybox » Fri May 24, 2019 1:16 pm

Bensational wrote:
Skybox wrote:
Def Swami wrote:$20 mill is about as high as I'd go for Vucevic. Anymore and I'll let him walk and change course.

I dislike attaching assets to rectify other mistakes. Unless the Magic know that they can use that potential cap space productively, I wouldn't just give away the pick for the hope of signing someone. I would love to make a run at Brogdon and bring him in, but I have a hard time seeing the Bucks not matching. He's so vital to what they do. Same thing could be said for D'Angelo Russell.

With regard to Fultz, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


I heard same stuff (all of it) from a very good source. I didn't specifically hear Fournier but that the pick could be traded for cap space (with someone)...who the target is with that cap space if up for debate but Brogdon or Russell make some sense-obviously all of these things are dependent on others playing along...I absolutely believe that WeHam would hold the line on Vuc $$$, even if the intention is to bring him back. $20m may well be OUR number and $25+ is someone else's...heard that Fultz's injury is physical, but largely in his head (not imaginary-just difficult to overcome). I don't necessarily take that as a bad thing. The Magic are being patient and supportive-giving him best chance to overcome it...same source who last year said those things about Bamba and Porter. Heard it with my ears.


Are you that poster on Reddit? Or someone who has the same friend in common?


I'm not. but I'm pretty sure I know who is.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#617 » by Nyce_1 » Fri May 24, 2019 1:46 pm

I read a Grizzlies beat writer propse this trade:

Conley for Fournier/Mozgov/16

I'd do that, keep Ross, Vuc, Birch, Martin and use MLE on Jeremy Lamb.

Conley/Augustin/Fultz
Ross/Iwundu/#46
Isaac/Lamb/Frazier
Gordon/Martin
Vuc/Bamba/Birch
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#618 » by j-ragg » Fri May 24, 2019 2:41 pm

Nyce_1 wrote:I read a Grizzlies beat writer propse this trade:

Conley for Fournier/Mozgov/16

I'd do that, keep Ross, Vuc, Birch, Martin and use MLE on Jeremy Lamb.

Conley/Augustin/Fultz
Ross/Iwundu/#46
Isaac/Lamb/Frazier
Gordon/Martin
Vuc/Bamba/Birch

That deal has been the discussion the past few pages. I’d do it, I’m not big on #16 in this trash draft, and think Conley would make the younger guys’ lives easier on offense. But I wouldn’t include anything valued more than 16 (someone else suggested tossing in Bamba for some reason).
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#619 » by swarlesbarkley » Fri May 24, 2019 3:05 pm

Nyce_1 wrote:I read a Grizzlies beat writer propse this trade:

Conley for Fournier/Mozgov/16

I'd do that, keep Ross, Vuc, Birch, Martin and use MLE on Jeremy Lamb.

Conley/Augustin/Fultz
Ross/Iwundu/#46
Isaac/Lamb/Frazier
Gordon/Martin
Vuc/Bamba/Birch


I'm not sure why we'd want Conley at this point. Just to snag a 6-8 seed? Just to shed Fournier & Mosgov? Conley doesn't move the needle enough to make noise in the playoffs. I think we can get a solid SG at #16 and deal Fournier for bench depth. Start Ross or whoever we draft at #16 (Langford hopefully!) in place of Fournier. If Fultz is a bust, we're still a 6-8 seed next year. If Fultz is a starter, who knows!
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#620 » by Nyce_1 » Fri May 24, 2019 3:33 pm

j-ragg wrote:
Nyce_1 wrote:I read a Grizzlies beat writer propse this trade:

Conley for Fournier/Mozgov/16

I'd do that, keep Ross, Vuc, Birch, Martin and use MLE on Jeremy Lamb.

Conley/Augustin/Fultz
Ross/Iwundu/#46
Isaac/Lamb/Frazier
Gordon/Martin
Vuc/Bamba/Birch

That deal has been the discussion the past few pages. I’d do it, I’m not big on #16 in this trash draft, and think Conley would make the younger guys’ lives easier on offense. But I wouldn’t include anything valued more than 16 (someone else suggested tossing in Bamba for some reason).
Ahhh that's right. I read the last few pages early yesterday then saw the trade on Twitter. Twitter stuck to the forefront of my mind.

My apologies to the great posters of RealGM, lol.

But I agree. No way we give up anything more for an expensive PG over 30yrs old.

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