2022-2023 Regular Season Game 57: Miami Heat (31-25) at Orlando Magic (23-33) - 7pm

[Knightro]

I guess my biggest gripe is the wholesale hockey lineups. Take Suggs out for a few minutes. Put him back in the last 2 minutes. Same with Paolo, Isaac, and Franz.

Just game-planning things out more than just the obvious starters vs bench units. You know? It just doesn’t seem like a decision he’s making actively in the moment, but moreso something he’s preplanned. Maybe I’m completely wrong.

Like I said, I think blaming the rotations is just the easy thing to do when you lose.

The Magic led by 9 points with 2:34 left in the game and the 5 starters got outscored 11-2 down the stretch, ya know? Like at some point the players just have to execute.

Like if you want to say they were cold or whatever, that's fine, but the 5 starters came back and immediately pushed the lead from 5 with 3:20 to 9 with 2:22 and just blew it.

[ORLMagicGirl15]

All people have done for the last three weeks is point out how bad Paolo has played and how he’s smashed into the rookie wall, but the solution tonight is to get even more mad about the fact he only played 34 minutes and not 36 or 37?

We’re killing Mosley because waited too long to bring the guy that’s been struggling for weeks with his workload back into the game?

Yes. He was drafted because he can get us a bucket. He doesn’t learn how to do that during these types of NBA situations unless he’s in the game. He’s one of those people that you hope can struggle all throughout the game and turn it on when necessary. We need him to develop into that.

[Optimus_Steel]

Ultimately it's still our own fault we lost the game and that should always be the focus, but that was obviously a foul on Bam. The salt in the wound was immediately calling the foul on Fultz afterwards to put them at the line to tie the game. If you let the one thing go, you should let the next thing go too. It was two guys going for the ball, resulting in contact. No worse than what had just occurred one second prior. For that reason most of all, it was horse crap, and it sucks to lose to the Heat again.

Apparently air displacement can cause fouls now....as shown on the Suggs foul call on Bam... air causes fouls now...didn't know the Heat had their own special rule book...

[Bakomagic]

BTW, finishing with the 5th worst record while developing guys sounds great to me. We all know we would be in the play-ins, at the very least, right now if were healthy all year. We're in a good spot IMO.

That’s a good point, these games are only frustrating because we have talented players and our expectations have risen. Last year I mostly had feelings of desperation watching blowouts as we trotted out a bunch of G-Leagers.

Paolo and Franz are very talented, Suggs really seems to be putting it together lately and they all seem to have a real disdain for losing.

They should all continue to improve and learn how to win, the fact that they are good enough to be competitive night in and night out this early is something we shouldn’t take for granted.

[MasterGMer]

I can still remember before last year's draft everyone's opinion of Paolo is that he is another Julius Randle type of player.

But I think with his performance this season, that is definitely going away. However, his game is still very inefficient. He needs to improve his shooting and playmaking. But I have faith in him and he will learn throughout the season.

Don't forget, Paolo is only 19 years old. His ceiling is high and he is definitely one of our corner stones in roster construction.

I just want to see him improve!

[Knightro]

Yes. He was drafted because he can get us a bucket. He doesn’t learn how to do that during these types of NBA situations unless he’s in the game. He’s one of those people that you hope can struggle all throughout the game and turn it on when necessary. We need him to develop into that.

But again... the same folks who are suggesting right now in this moment that the priority needs to be developing Paolo and that he should never not be subbed back in so late are the same folks who are complaining about not winning these sort of winnable games too.

And right now it's hard to argue that you can do both (develop Paolo and maximize your chances at winning) successfully with how bad Paolo is playing and how good the bench has been collectively.

Beyond that, we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that Paolo got the game winning shot attempt in regulation and missed it too. It's not like he was frozen out.

He came back in with 3:20 instead of 5:20 to go, that's basically the only thing that happened. He got his opportunity and didn't come through.

[Last Guardian]

BTW, finishing with the 5th worst record while developing guys sounds great to me. We all know we would be in the play-ins, at the very least, right now if were healthy all year. We're in a good spot IMO.

If we somehow got lucky and got Wemby…this defense would be unstoppable.

[SOUL]

Franz is somehow avoiding the criticism levied towards Paolo tonight and he's been just as bad lately. But both are struggling.

[Knightro]

I want to be clear, I'm not down on Paolo at all.

But he's very clearly struggling to the point of actually being harmful to the team's chances at success right now. He shouldn't be benched or anything like that, but they've been winning these last few weeks in spite of him, not because of him.

This is why I've been trying to warn against this halfway in, halfway out thing the Magic are currently doing. If you wanna be a playoff team, then you should have bought. If you want to keep developing your kids, that's fine too, but actually develop them.

Because inevitably one of the two sides (winning v. development) ends up taking a backseat when you try and do both concurrently.

And god forbid something like tonight happens where the star prospect doesn't play as much or get as many opportunities as people want *and* they still lose.

It's pandemonium.

[Knightro]

On the bright side...

Read on Twitter

[Knightro]

Franz is somehow avoiding the criticism levied towards Paolo tonight and he's been just as bad lately. But both are struggling.

A big part of it is that Franz generally plays significant minutes as the lone starter with the bench units that have been doing so well.

IMO that helps to give off the impression he's playing better than actually is.

[eyriq]

This loss still sucks after ice cream and lame TV.

Not really too worried though.

It hurts our play-in chances but any loss does.

It felt like the Knicks game a bit, a defensive battle. Learned a bit about our playoff limitations. Can't lean on rooks and sophomores to win grind it out games. Could we see within season improvement from Franz and Paolo in scenarios like this? I wouldn't be shocked if we did, these two are that good. Also, our coaching staff is low key elite at development. Look at Bol and Cole for exhibits a and b of within season transformations (still early with Bol but I'm sensing a shift).

Another thing is that teams aren't taking us for granted. Miami squeezed blood from a stone to pull this one out.

My final thought is that Harris feels like the odd man out. He's blocking Caleb, who deserves reps as he would balance rotations better. Suggs is the better shooting guard and also deserves increased reps.

[mattyBoi]

Franz is somehow avoiding the criticism levied towards Paolo tonight and he's been just as bad lately. But both are struggling.

They're both struggling, I think the long season is catching up to them.

[Knightro]

Jalen Suggs last 9 games

12-26 3PT for .462%.

[KillMonger]

Yes. He was drafted because he can get us a bucket. He doesn’t learn how to do that during these types of NBA situations unless he’s in the game. He’s one of those people that you hope can struggle all throughout the game and turn it on when necessary. We need him to develop into that.

But again... the same folks who are suggesting right now in this moment that the priority needs to be developing Paolo and that he should never not be subbed back in so late are the same folks who are complaining about not winning these sort of winnable games too.

And right now it's hard to argue that you can do both (develop Paolo and maximize your chances at winning) successfully with how bad Paolo is playing and how good the bench has been collectively.

Beyond that, we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that Paolo got the game winning shot attempt in regulation and missed it too. It's not like he was frozen out.

He came back in with 3:20 instead of 5:20 to go, that's basically the only thing that happened. He got his opportunity and didn't come through.

honestly even that is still kind of a problem....especially this game when he was out of the game before the 3rd quarter was even over....you didn't even need to take out all the guys on the bench...you could've took out bol because i don't even know what he was doing out there at times....Yeah development is a top priority but lets take that out of the equation....even if you're trying to win this game you can't expect the bench to stop a run when the heat brings their starters back they have fresh legs and our bench is running out of gas......At that point why even bring paolo back? he was cold before but at that point in the game he must've been freezing....getting brought back with 5 minutes left in the game isn't enough for paolo to work through the issues and finish strong....he should be getting brought back at that 8 or 7 minute mark at the latest....you just don't see ANY other team doing that....not even by mistake

also just to add, Franz isn't getting away with his play either he needs to also work through his issues.....of course as long as he can actually get some consistent touches when he's with the bench...sometimes it seems franz is a bystander in that bench unit when in reality it should be focused around him.

[Knightro]

honestly even that is still kind of a problem....especially this game when he was out of the game before the 3rd quarter was even over....you didn't even need to take out all the guys on the bench...you could've took out bol because i don't even know what he was doing out there at times....Yeah development is a top priority but lets take that out of the equation....even if you're trying to win this game you can't expect the bench to stop a run when the heat brings their starters back they have fresh legs and our bench is running out of gas......At that point why even bring paolo back? he was cold before but at that point in the game he must've been freezing....getting brought back with 5 minutes left in the game isn't enough for paolo to work through the issues and finish strong....he should be getting brought back at that 8 or 7 minute mark at the latest....you just don't see ANY other team doing that....not even by mistake

also just to add, Franz isn't getting away with his play either he needs to also work through his issues.....of course as long as he can actually get some consistent touches when he's with the bench...sometimes it seems franz is a bystander in that bench unit when in reality it should be focused around him.

It's just tough. It just sort of feels like a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario for Mosley.

The bench played really well in the first half of the 4th quarter and extended the lead to 10 with 6 minutes left.

If Mosley goes back to the starters, who for the most part did not play well, right then and there and they blow it - then he's catching heat for not riding the bench longer, ya know?

He gambled that the bench would continue to build/maintain the lead and got burned a bit when Miami went on a 5-0 run over the next two minutes.

But even with that 5-0 Heat run, once all the Magic's starters came back in with 3:20 to go, Orlando still scored the next two buckets to go back up 9.

It was the defense that really failed them as Miami scored on their next four possessions. Should they have had Suggs out there? Maybe, but he exhausted coming off 13 straight minutes to help build the lead in the first place.

And of all the things to be concerned about, for me personally Paolo's minutes aren't one of them. He's playing 34 MPG and even that has proven to be quite the strain on him recently. If anything they should be looking for ways to keep him more fresh versus grinding him straight into powder.

[pepe1991]

Magic are younger than Heat .
Heat survived OT in first night of back to backs before this game

Heat were down by 9 with 2:30 min to play.
Heat were down by 4 with 80 seconds on the clock.
Magic had full shot clock to kill game in last 20 sec before OT. Instad they they sent Heat to FT line below Heat's rim and stopped clock.
Magic also had game winning shot with 5 sec on the clock.
Magic should have had more energy in OT

Instad, Heat jumped them in OT and last 2 min it was brickfest for both teams-



It's bad loss but it is what it is.
I think that Paolo and Franz are being scouted better and that's one of reasons why their performances are so poor late. Paolo is kind a bad 3 point shooter who lives off baiting for fouls. Franz won't attemp shots that aren't layups and 3s.

Right now Magic depend way too much on bench to dig them up from slumps starters create

[zaymon]

honestly even that is still kind of a problem....especially this game when he was out of the game before the 3rd quarter was even over....you didn't even need to take out all the guys on the bench...you could've took out bol because i don't even know what he was doing out there at times....Yeah development is a top priority but lets take that out of the equation....even if you're trying to win this game you can't expect the bench to stop a run when the heat brings their starters back they have fresh legs and our bench is running out of gas......At that point why even bring paolo back? he was cold before but at that point in the game he must've been freezing....getting brought back with 5 minutes left in the game isn't enough for paolo to work through the issues and finish strong....he should be getting brought back at that 8 or 7 minute mark at the latest....you just don't see ANY other team doing that....not even by mistake

also just to add, Franz isn't getting away with his play either he needs to also work through his issues.....of course as long as he can actually get some consistent touches when he's with the bench...sometimes it seems franz is a bystander in that bench unit when in reality it should be focused around him.

It's just tough. It just sort of feels like a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario for Mosley.

The bench played really well in the first half of the 4th quarter and extended the lead to 10 with 6 minutes left.

If Mosley goes back to the starters, who for the most part did not play well, right then and there and they blow it - then he's catching heat for not riding the bench longer, ya know?

He gambled that the bench would continue to build/maintain the lead and got burned a bit when Miami went on a 5-0 run over the next two minutes.

But even with that 5-0 Heat run, once all the Magic's starters came back in with 3:20 to go, Orlando still scored the next two buckets to go back up 9.

It was the defense that really failed them as Miami scored on their next four possessions. Should they have had Suggs out there? Maybe, but he exhausted coming off 13 straight minutes to help build the lead in the first place.

And of all the things to be concerned about, for me personally Paolo's minutes aren't one of them. He's playing 34 MPG and even that has proven to be quite the strain on him recently. If anything they should be looking for ways to keep him more fresh versus grinding him straight into powder.

If starters are failing and bench units are so good that they play above starter into the crunch time, but they cant finish games becouse of exhaustion it means one thing. Lineups are bad.
I agree its a thin line with Banchero right now, but our guards make it really tough for him. Its not that Mosley wanted to limit Paolo minutes becouse he played 34, its the minutes allocation that sucks. Franz also magically remembers how to play when he is with the second unit and its not only becouse he plays against reserves.
Suggs should be ending games, if Mosley cant figure out how to do it its on him.

[drsd]

So we're in a weird spot. Are we taking the pure development path or are we taking the do everything to try and win path?

Banchero needs to get over his rookie wall. Threre is no winning without him getting to the line and scoring 20ppg.

But: glass half-full. The Magic's bench was again very good. Orlando can't tank because the team has too much depth.


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[drsd]

Magic are younger than Heat .
Heat survived OT in first night of back to backs before this game

Heat were down by 9 with 2:30 min to play.
Heat were down by 4 with 80 seconds on the clock.
Magic had full shot clock to kill game in last 20 sec before OT. Instad they they sent Heat to FT line below Heat's rim and stopped clock.
Magic also had game winning shot with 5 sec on the clock.
Magic should have had more energy in OT

Instad, Heat jumped them in OT and last 2 min it was brickfest for both teams-



It's bad loss but it is what it is.
I think that Paolo and Franz are being scouted better and that's one of reasons why their performances are so poor late. Paolo is kind a bad 3 point shooter who lives off baiting for fouls. Franz won't attemp shots that aren't layups and 3s.

Right now Magic depend way too much on bench to dig them up from slumps starters create

For me it is a "good" loss. It is a teachable moment. Orlando can clearly see what winning looks like. Now it is about delivering results.


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