Orlando Magic Free Agency Guide (Cap Info UPDATED page 37)

[Blue_and_Whte]

Butler putting up better numbers on a team with better record and has to split his role with other players.

Still think the vuc + ola for butler, 2 for 1 trade is too much. But to say a vic for butler straight up is a lateral move is ehhh?

Also, the fact that butler is a more attractive piece to land a big name FA than Ola is something worth considering, imo.

Vic will be as good as Butler by next season imo. As I've said before it wouldn't be the end of the world but it wouldn't move the needle much if at all imo, unless its a prerequisite to landing another elite player. Its similar to landing Blake Griffin. I'd be ok with that move but he isn't taking us anywhere. I'd rather just wait for AG. I feel like we have to move one or two of our core in order to improve significantly and I'm prepared for that.

Comments like these is what tells my that Jimmy Butler is one of the most underrated players in the league. I'm sorry but the boldness of this statement is out of the roof. Jimmy Butler is basically a perfected 6'7 version of Victor Oladipo. Reach his level by next year? It took Drose going down and making JB "the man" for him to showcase and become the all-star he is today. Vic has been "the man" in this team since rookie year and has been given the opportunity to shine since being drafted. We need to stop forcing this superstar role to Oladipo. We don't need him trying to drop 20+ every night. Not only is he not a good enough shooter to do that but he has yet to show this on a consistent basis. Every year its the same thing. He ends the season strong, we set an all-star expectation for the start of next year, next season comes and he struggles again. It would be great if he proves me wrong on all facets of this statement but I just don't see this happening. If we keep him long-term(which we be stupid not too unless a ridiculous offer comes up) then use him in a complementary role not force him to be Dwade.

Nobody underrates him. He is what he is, a second tier star. Vic will be as good as Butler by next year. Every single one of you can quote me and thank me later.

[OrlandoDream]

Vic will be as good as Butler by next season imo. As I've said before it wouldn't be the end of the world but it wouldn't move the needle much if at all imo, unless its a prerequisite to landing another elite player. Its similar to landing Blake Griffin. I'd be ok with that move but he isn't taking us anywhere. I'd rather just wait for AG. I feel like we have to move one or two of our core in order to improve significantly and I'm prepared for that.

Comments like these is what tells my that Jimmy Butler is one of the most underrated players in the league. I'm sorry but the boldness of this statement is out of the roof. Jimmy Butler is basically a perfected 6'7 version of Victor Oladipo. Reach his level by next year? It took Drose going down and making JB "the man" for him to showcase and become the all-star he is today. Vic has been "the man" in this team since rookie year and has been given the opportunity to shine since being drafted. We need to stop forcing this superstar role to Oladipo. We don't need him trying to drop 20+ every night. Not only is he not a good enough shooter to do that but he has yet to show this on a consistent basis. Every year its the same thing. He ends the season strong, we set an all-star expectation for the start of next year, next season comes and he struggles again. It would be great if he proves me wrong on all facets of this statement but I just don't see this happening. If we keep him long-term(which we be stupid not too unless a ridiculous offer comes up) then use him in a complementary role not force him to be Dwade.

Nobody underrates him. He is what he is, a second tier star. Vic will be as good as Butler by next year. Every single one of you can quote me and thank me later.

I never wanted a posters claim to prove me wrong as much as this. Ok so you heard it here first;

By April 27th 2017, Victor Oladipo will be at just as talented as the 2X NBA All-star and former NBA All-defense team Jimmy Butler.

Bets?

[Blue_and_Whte]

Comments like these is what tells my that Jimmy Butler is one of the most underrated players in the league. I'm sorry but the boldness of this statement is out of the roof. Jimmy Butler is basically a perfected 6'7 version of Victor Oladipo. Reach his level by next year? It took Drose going down and making JB "the man" for him to showcase and become the all-star he is today. Vic has been "the man" in this team since rookie year and has been given the opportunity to shine since being drafted. We need to stop forcing this superstar role to Oladipo. We don't need him trying to drop 20+ every night. Not only is he not a good enough shooter to do that but he has yet to show this on a consistent basis. Every year its the same thing. He ends the season strong, we set an all-star expectation for the start of next year, next season comes and he struggles again. It would be great if he proves me wrong on all facets of this statement but I just don't see this happening. If we keep him long-term(which we be stupid not too unless a ridiculous offer comes up) then use him in a complementary role not force him to be Dwade.

Nobody underrates him. He is what he is, a second tier star. Vic will be as good as Butler by next year. Every single one of you can quote me and thank me later.

I never wanted a posters claim to prove me wrong as much as this. Ok so you heard it here first;

By April 27th 2017, Victor Oladipo will be at just as talented as the 2X NBA All-star and former NBA All-defense team Jimmy Butler.

Bets?

Yes. I bet you're thanking me later.

[PennytoShaq]

Putting high hopes on guys like Oldaipo is why some Magic fans get irrationally angry and negative halfway through the season.

[axl_c_cool]

Nobody underrates him. He is what he is, a second tier star. Vic will be as good as Butler by next year. Every single one of you can quote me and thank me later.

I never wanted a posters claim to prove me wrong as much as this. Ok so you heard it here first;

By April 27th 2017, Victor Oladipo will be at just as talented as the 2X NBA All-star and former NBA All-defense team Jimmy Butler.

Bets?

Yes. I bet you're thanking me later.

I love Dipo and I'm a fan but as good as Butler at his peak powers in 12 months? Bro if he close to Butler or showing flashes of being that good then that would be great in 12 months. He could maybe reach Butler as his ceiling in 2-3 years




Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[Incognito76]

I would be happy if Oladipo is 1/3 of Butler next year.

[Def Swami]

Butler didn't hit his stride until age 25, his 4th season in. He made a huge leap from year 3 to year 4. Oladipo is already starting from a better baseline than Butler did. It's not unreasonable to think Oladipo makes a similar jump.
http://bkref.com/tiny/zfffZ

[PennytoShaq]

Butler didn't hit his stride until age 25, his 4th season in. He made a huge leap from year 3 to year 4. Oladipo is already starting from a better baseline than Butler did. It's not unreasonable to think Oladipo makes a similar jump.
http://bkref.com/tiny/zfffZ

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

[Def Swami]

Butler didn't hit his stride until age 25, his 4th season in. He made a huge leap from year 3 to year 4. Oladipo is already starting from a better baseline than Butler did. It's not unreasonable to think Oladipo makes a similar jump.
http://bkref.com/tiny/zfffZ

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

Those are 3rd year numbers for both players. Not first 3 seasons. He averaged 38 mpg that season. The guy literally couldn't shoot. I know Oladipo's isn't the most efficient guard in the league but he't not sub-40% from the field and sub-30% from 3. Those are Brandon Jennings numbers smh. It's not like all this talent was untapped by a Bulls team deprived of scoring during his first 3 years. Give Jimmy a ton of credit for putting in the work to make himself better.

[Xatticus]

Butler didn't hit his stride until age 25, his 4th season in. He made a huge leap from year 3 to year 4. Oladipo is already starting from a better baseline than Butler did. It's not unreasonable to think Oladipo makes a similar jump.
http://bkref.com/tiny/zfffZ

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

Those are 3rd year numbers for both players. Not first 3 seasons. He averaged 38 mpg that season. The guy literally couldn't shoot. I know Oladipo's isn't the most efficient guard in the league but he't not sub-40% from the field and sub-30% from 3. Those are Brandon Jennings numbers smh. It's not like all this talent was untapped by a Bulls team deprived of scoring during his first 3 years. Give Jimmy a ton of credit for putting in the work to make himself better.

There is an adjustment period for every player in the league. Before entering the NBA, nobody has experienced the length, speed, and skill of the game at its highest level. It takes players time to translate their skills to this new environment. Butler's role in Chicago has steadily increased, and his development has reflected this increased role. This correlation is quite obvious. For Oladipo, his role has remained essentially the same since he entered the league, regardless of whether or not he walks the ball up the court. He was immediately thrust into heavy minutes and a sizeable offensive role from the moment he first stepped onto the court for Orlando.

What separates Butler from Oladipo offensively is Butler's ability to get to the free throw line. As a jump shooter, Oladipo isn't a player you want taking a large share of your team's shots (Butler certainly isn't a great shooter either), but that seems to be the player he wants to be. As long as Oladipo continues to settle for lazy jumpers, he will never be an efficient high-volume scorer.

Is there a chance that Oladipo will develop into the player that Butler is now? Sure. But given the lack of evidence to support the idea that he is on track to do so, it's exceedingly unlikely that he will.

[PennytoShaq]

Butler didn't hit his stride until age 25, his 4th season in. He made a huge leap from year 3 to year 4. Oladipo is already starting from a better baseline than Butler did. It's not unreasonable to think Oladipo makes a similar jump.
http://bkref.com/tiny/zfffZ

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

Those are 3rd year numbers for both players. Not first 3 seasons. He averaged 38 mpg that season. The guy literally couldn't shoot. I know Oladipo's isn't the most efficient guard in the league but he't not sub-40% from the field and sub-30% from 3. Those are Brandon Jennings numbers smh. It's not like all this talent was untapped by a Bulls team deprived of scoring during his first 3 years. Give Jimmy a ton of credit for putting in the work to make himself better.

I guess you don't understand what I am saying. Jimmy Butler's 3rd year is more like Vic's second in terms of minutes. Butler did not get the minutes his first year at all. He barely played. To be clear, he averaged 8.5 mpg.

Victor has gotten around 30 MPG his entire 3 years here. The argument could easily be made that Butler blossomed into an All-Star after 2 seasons of heavy minutes, where Victor has yet to do that with the same volume.

[Blue_and_Whte]

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/25568957/there-are-four-teams-reportedly-in-the-running-to-sign-dwight-howard

According toESPN's Calvin Watkins, the Orlando Magic,Milwaukee Bucks, Portland Trail Blazersand Charlotte Hornets are the favorites to sign Howard in free agency.

The Rockets will have a comprehensive list of coaches to view whenever the season ends. Bickerstaff, who remains in good standing with management, will be part of that conversation. Alexander and Morey believe that Harden will play a role in helping to hire a coach and potentially sign free agents.

Howard is not expected to have a role. It's expected that he will become a free agent and seek a new team. Orlando, Milwaukee, Portland and Charlotte are the favorites.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Ezzzp posted great metrics awhile ago comparing Butler and Dipo so it's been discussed alot already. Well see.

[Def Swami]

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

Those are 3rd year numbers for both players. Not first 3 seasons. He averaged 38 mpg that season. The guy literally couldn't shoot. I know Oladipo's isn't the most efficient guard in the league but he't not sub-40% from the field and sub-30% from 3. Those are Brandon Jennings numbers smh. It's not like all this talent was untapped by a Bulls team deprived of scoring during his first 3 years. Give Jimmy a ton of credit for putting in the work to make himself better.

I guess you don't understand what I am saying. Jimmy Butler's 3rd year is more like Vic's second in terms of minutes. Butler did not get the minutes his first year at all. He barely played. To be clear, he averaged 8.5 mpg.

Victor has gotten around 30 MPG his entire 3 years here. The argument could easily be made that Butler blossomed into an All-Star after 2 seasons of heavy minutes, where Victor has yet to do that with the same volume.

That's undervaluing the experience Butler had as a rookie in the NBA that practices for 82 games and in the off-seasons with a team and undermines the fact that Oladipo came in a year younger than Butler, which is a year of development (regardless of if it encompasses NBA game time or practice time). There is more to development than simply playing players a lot of minutes in games. Essentially my point is you can't assume Oladipo's growth is going stagnate at age 23 when Butler made that jump at age 24. Unless you really believe there's no value to that extra year of experience that Butler had.

And this isn't my declaration that Oladipo is going to be Jimmy Butler. Players are malleable and unique and don't operate in a vacuum. So many factors go into players reaching their potential. But, if you would have taken a bet to say Jimmy Butler would be Paul George after Butler's 3rd season, folks would looked at you crazier than they do when taking a bet on Oladipo.

[Def Swami]

I keep typing this, but Butler was not getting the minutes Oladipo has gotten for 3 straight years. Butler came to a playoff team with a lot of talent and didn't get to log 30 MPG as a rookie like Victor.

Those are 3rd year numbers for both players. Not first 3 seasons. He averaged 38 mpg that season. The guy literally couldn't shoot. I know Oladipo's isn't the most efficient guard in the league but he't not sub-40% from the field and sub-30% from 3. Those are Brandon Jennings numbers smh. It's not like all this talent was untapped by a Bulls team deprived of scoring during his first 3 years. Give Jimmy a ton of credit for putting in the work to make himself better.

There is an adjustment period for every player in the league. Before entering the NBA, nobody has experienced the length, speed, and skill of the game at its highest level. It takes players time to translate their skills to this new environment. Butler's role in Chicago has steadily increased, and his development has reflected this increased role. This correlation is quite obvious. For Oladipo, his role has remained essentially the same since he entered the league, regardless of whether or not he walks the ball up the court. He was immediately thrust into heavy minutes and a sizeable offensive role from the moment he first stepped onto the court for Orlando.

What separates Butler from Oladipo offensively is Butler's ability to get to the free throw line. As a jump shooter, Oladipo isn't a player you want taking a large share of your team's shots (Butler certainly isn't a great shooter either), but that seems to be the player he wants to be. As long as Oladipo continues to settle for lazy jumpers, he will never be an efficient high-volume scorer.

Is there a chance that Oladipo will develop into the player that Butler is now? Sure. But given the lack of evidence to support the idea that he is on track to do so, it's exceedingly unlikely that he will.

Again, this comes down to if you think players stop developing at age 23. Butler literally developed a jumpshot at age 24. I'm not writing off Oladipo's ability to improve as a scorer just as much as I wouldn't write off 23 year-old Jimmy Butler's ability to learn to shoot.

[Cosmic_Backlash]

This board criminally underrates Oladipo. Every year he's getting better offensively. He's improved 2 point shooting, 3 point shooting, and reduced turnovers literally every single year in the league.

Post all-star break he averaged 19/5/4 on great percentages. He's gotten significantly better playing off the ball.

His per 100 possession numbers are already very similar to Butler.

Do I think Butler is better? Yeah, but there is a real chance that Oladipo has the ability to reach a similar level as Butler.

Upgrading Oladipo doesn't improve the massive glaring weaknesses we had last year. We have no point guard that can be a consistent threat and no rim defender. I love Vuc and think he is a starting quality center, but he needs to have a much better cast around him to cover up his weakness. We were small at power and small forward positions last year so had no interior defensive presence. Regarding point guards - Elfrid was down right terrible last year. He has a ton of potential, but he needs to get his head in the game more consistently. If we can get Conley at a decent price I'd take him, but having an offensive threat that isn't a historically bad shooter (Jennings) come off the bench would be a tremendous help. Someone like Jeremy Lin would be a great change of pace sub.

If the magic want to improve via free agency/trades they need to upgrade their weaknesses. Striking out on Durant/Hassan/Horford is fine - there is good talent out there still. Getting some combination of Conley/Lin/Ezeli/Biyombo for PG/C duty would be great. If we get Ezeli start him and bring Vuc off the bench in the super sub role. If we get Biyombo bring him in as a backup to Vuc.

[T-Cat]

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/25568957/there-are-four-teams-reportedly-in-the-running-to-sign-dwight-howard

According toESPN's Calvin Watkins, the Orlando Magic,Milwaukee Bucks, Portland Trail Blazersand Charlotte Hornets are the favorites to sign Howard in free agency.

The Rockets will have a comprehensive list of coaches to view whenever the season ends. Bickerstaff, who remains in good standing with management, will be part of that conversation. Alexander and Morey believe that Harden will play a role in helping to hire a coach and potentially sign free agents.

Howard is not expected to have a role. It's expected that he will become a free agent and seek a new team. Orlando, Milwaukee, Portland and Charlotte are the favorites.

Interesting! I thought it was another rumor that Rob was not interested in Howard?

[SOUL]

Feels a bit like speculation on our part.

[OrlandoDream]

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/25568957/there-are-four-teams-reportedly-in-the-running-to-sign-dwight-howard

According toESPN's Calvin Watkins, the Orlando Magic,Milwaukee Bucks, Portland Trail Blazersand Charlotte Hornets are the favorites to sign Howard in free agency.

The Rockets will have a comprehensive list of coaches to view whenever the season ends. Bickerstaff, who remains in good standing with management, will be part of that conversation. Alexander and Morey believe that Harden will play a role in helping to hire a coach and potentially sign free agents.

Howard is not expected to have a role. It's expected that he will become a free agent and seek a new team. Orlando, Milwaukee, Portland and Charlotte are the favorites.

Been calling it since trade deadline. By the start of next season, Dwight will be a Charlotte Hornet. Steve Clifford is rebuilding the 09 Magic. I would watch a couple of hornets games, to see Dwight and Cournety Lee play together again. Bring back some old memories.

[The Real Dalic]

Putting high hopes on guys like Oldaipo is why some Magic fans get irrationally angry and negative halfway through the season.

I have high hopes for all of our players and you never see me negative, ask everyone on here. I believe in our players!