Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0

[Skin]

There is NO WAY Bamba is re-signing with this team.
1. He is either going to be too good and get more than the Q offer from other teams or;
2. He isn't going to be good, and Magic are going to let him walk. Another bad year, time for scenery change.

Why would we not want him because he turns out to be TOO GOOD???

Magic won't let him walk because that would mean they messed up on the pick. They won't want to admit that. Letting Hezonja go was fine because he wasn't their pick.

If he has a very good season, a team offers him close to 20M, we aren't matching that. I think we all think he was offered something similar to WCJ, if that price goes up, we'll have 30M+ committed.
They didn't extend him, so they already are admitting the pick isn't holding it's value slot.

I also think the Cliff years have scarred Mo towards this franchise, IMO he wants to go somewhere else.

If he has a season that merits $20M per year, then we'll have a player that we NEED TO KEEP!

I know the fanbase is used to the Magic being a minor league factory for other teams to poach our stars when they've become shiny, but that needs to end.

The ENTIRE GOAL IS to make our young guys become worthy of being big money players.

In the end... having 2 Centers that combine to make $30-35M is better than having 1 $30-35M Center. We have redundancy to cover injury, we keep legs fresh, we have more versatility and have players with tradeable contracts.

[pepe1991]

Can we play like 15-20 actual games, against good, bad, elite and mediocre teams and players to proclaim who should be in play for $100M contracts ?

Jesus... Also, if you really want to (again) use cap space to sign center ( despite that being pivotal b***ing point about last team 2017-2020) there is Ayton as RFA. You know what he wants, max contract, you know he is top 10-12 center, you know he is durable and you have trackrecord all up to nba finals to figure he is indeed influencal player.

[Magic_Kingdom]

Why would we not want him because he turns out to be TOO GOOD???

Magic won't let him walk because that would mean they messed up on the pick. They won't want to admit that. Letting Hezonja go was fine because he wasn't their pick.

If he has a very good season, a team offers him close to 20M, we aren't matching that. I think we all think he was offered something similar to WCJ, if that price goes up, we'll have 30M+ committed.
They didn't extend him, so they already are admitting the pick isn't holding it's value slot.

I also think the Cliff years have scarred Mo towards this franchise, IMO he wants to go somewhere else.

If he has a season that merits $20M per year, then we'll have a player that we NEED TO KEEP!

I know the fanbase is used to the Magic being a minor league factory for other teams to poach our stars when they've become shiny, but that needs to end.

The ENTIRE GOAL IS to make our young guys become worthy of being big money players.

In the end... having 2 Centers that combine to make $30-35M is better than having 1 $30-35M Center. We have redundancy to cover injury, we keep legs fresh, we have more versatility and have players with tradeable contracts.

If he has "a season" that merits $20 million per year. See that's the trick. The entire body of work merits $6 million per year.

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

[YosemiteSam]

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

Marvin Bagley (drafted over Luka and Trey!!!) and now currently completely out of the rotation for the Kings is a MUCH bigger screw up in the same lottery. Also Kevin Knox and Jerome Robinson were also in the same lottery. Lotta misses every year, but it was a big one for us considering how many studs were also drafted after Mo.

[pepe1991]

Bagley isn't bad... guy is career 14 ppg, 7,5 rpg player at age of 22.
He has attitude and health issues and he will be much better off some team where vets will put him in his place.

Perfect spot for him would be Spurs or Heat, but he will probably end up on OKC because they have most assets they can remove without really losing much.

Seems like Raptors are internet's favorite to trade for Bagley.

My issue with him is positioning. He seems to be like much worst- Towns. He is not really a center, but he isn't really modern PF, so he is kind a like some very mobile PF who you can slide on C but who's defense at C isn't good. So it's messy.
if you can spike up his 3 ball volumen and in same time involve him pick& roll just enough, he has nice feeling to draw fouls... I don't know...

[YosemiteSam]

Bagley isn't bad... guy is career 14 ppg, 7,5 rpg player at age of 22.
He has attitude and health issues and he will be much better off some team where vets will put him in his place.

Perfect spot for him would be Spurs or Heat, but he will probably end up on OKC because they have most assets they can remove without really losing much.

Seems like Raptors are internet's favorite to trade for Bagley.

My issue with him is positioning. He seems to be like much worst- Towns. He is not really a center, but he isn't really modern PF, so he is kind a like some very mobile PF who you can slide on C but who's defense at C isn't good. So it's messy.
if you can spike up his 3 ball volumen and in same time involve him pick& roll just enough, he has nice feeling to draw fouls... I don't know...

His defense is some of the worst in the NBA. He is all offense so if that is the case then what he has provided even there despite being gifted stater minutes when healthy for 3 years is inadequate.

But also when evaluating lottery picks you have to look at who the team passed on. So with Bamba we missed SGA, MPJ and both Bridges among other useful players like Huerter and DiVenzo but the Kings took Bagley over two superstars who were pretty obvious in their potential in Luka and Trey. That is much worse IMO

[JBSouthpaw]

If he has a very good season, a team offers him close to 20M, we aren't matching that. I think we all think he was offered something similar to WCJ, if that price goes up, we'll have 30M+ committed.
They didn't extend him, so they already are admitting the pick isn't holding it's value slot.

I also think the Cliff years have scarred Mo towards this franchise, IMO he wants to go somewhere else.

If he has a season that merits $20M per year, then we'll have a player that we NEED TO KEEP!

I know the fanbase is used to the Magic being a minor league factory for other teams to poach our stars when they've become shiny, but that needs to end.

The ENTIRE GOAL IS to make our young guys become worthy of being big money players.

In the end... having 2 Centers that combine to make $30-35M is better than having 1 $30-35M Center. We have redundancy to cover injury, we keep legs fresh, we have more versatility and have players with tradeable contracts.

If he has "a season" that merits $20 million per year. See that's the trick. The entire body of work merits $6 million per year.

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

agreed.

[JBSouthpaw]

Can we play like 15-20 actual games, against good, bad, elite and mediocre teams and players to proclaim who should be in play for $100M contracts ?

Jesus... Also, if you really want to (again) use cap space to sign center ( despite that being pivotal b***ing point about last team 2017-2020) there is Ayton as RFA. You know what he wants, max contract, you know he is top 10-12 center, you know he is durable and you have trackrecord all up to nba finals to figure he is indeed influencal player.

You do notice everyone is writing "If" in front of their statements right?
I think it's ok to speculate on a message board.

I do agree with your second statement.

[Skin]

If he has a very good season, a team offers him close to 20M, we aren't matching that. I think we all think he was offered something similar to WCJ, if that price goes up, we'll have 30M+ committed.
They didn't extend him, so they already are admitting the pick isn't holding it's value slot.

I also think the Cliff years have scarred Mo towards this franchise, IMO he wants to go somewhere else.

If he has a season that merits $20M per year, then we'll have a player that we NEED TO KEEP!

I know the fanbase is used to the Magic being a minor league factory for other teams to poach our stars when they've become shiny, but that needs to end.

The ENTIRE GOAL IS to make our young guys become worthy of being big money players.

In the end... having 2 Centers that combine to make $30-35M is better than having 1 $30-35M Center. We have redundancy to cover injury, we keep legs fresh, we have more versatility and have players with tradeable contracts.

If he has "a season" that merits $20 million per year. See that's the trick. The entire body of work merits $6 million per year.

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

IF Bamba becomes a player worth $20M/yr then there's no need to start over at that position.

If you want to trade him for an equal player then that's something, but the last thing to do is to let him walk without getting any compensation. You may want it, but WeHam can't be thinking that. That would be total misuse of an asset.

[Skybox]

If he has a season that merits $20M per year, then we'll have a player that we NEED TO KEEP!

I know the fanbase is used to the Magic being a minor league factory for other teams to poach our stars when they've become shiny, but that needs to end.

The ENTIRE GOAL IS to make our young guys become worthy of being big money players.

In the end... having 2 Centers that combine to make $30-35M is better than having 1 $30-35M Center. We have redundancy to cover injury, we keep legs fresh, we have more versatility and have players with tradeable contracts.

If he has "a season" that merits $20 million per year. See that's the trick. The entire body of work merits $6 million per year.

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

IF Bamba becomes a player worth $20M/yr then there's no need to start over at that position.

If you want to trade him for an equal player then that's something, but the last thing to do is to let him walk without getting any compensation. You may want it, but WeHam can't be thinking that. That would be total misuse of an asset.

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

[Knightro]

Read on Twitter

[JBSouthpaw]

If he has "a season" that merits $20 million per year. See that's the trick. The entire body of work merits $6 million per year.

I think WeltHam is past the point of hoping people don't think they missed on the Bamba pick. Everyone knows it, including them. He was really the only complete miss in the lottery that year. One of the reasons we are here is because that pick followed the Isaac pick, and you would need an electron microscope to chart their combined contributions to the team. So if we are starting over, then let's really start over and put those botched drafts behind us.

IF Bamba becomes a player worth $20M/yr then there's no need to start over at that position.

If you want to trade him for an equal player then that's something, but the last thing to do is to let him walk without getting any compensation. You may want it, but WeHam can't be thinking that. That would be total misuse of an asset.

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

[Optimus_Steel]

IF Bamba becomes a player worth $20M/yr then there's no need to start over at that position.

If you want to trade him for an equal player then that's something, but the last thing to do is to let him walk without getting any compensation. You may want it, but WeHam can't be thinking that. That would be total misuse of an asset.

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

That and we already tied up money in one big. How many teams really have multiple bigs like Bamba/WCJ/Rolo? We should invest in perimeters scorers and get multiples of that, not multiples of centers. We can sign stop gap centers for cheap. Some teams out there have like one 6'10 big and the rest wing and guards.

[JBSouthpaw]

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

That and we already tied up money in one big. How many teams really have multiple bigs like Bamba/WCJ/Rolo? We should invest in perimeters scorers and get multiples of that, not multiples of centers. We can sign stop gap centers for cheap. Some teams out there have like one 6'10 big and the rest wing and guards.

I fully support this.
take our assets (mix of players and picks) and go get someone!

[Skybox]

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

That and we already tied up money in one big. How many teams really have multiple bigs like Bamba/WCJ/Rolo? We should invest in perimeters scorers and get multiples of that, not multiples of centers. We can sign stop gap centers for cheap. Some teams out there have like one 6'10 big and the rest wing and guards.

Nothing wrong with having multiple young bigs AS LONG AS THEIR DEALS DON'T MAKE THEM UN-MOVABLE...the WCJ deal is nice but not restrictive, IMO. I really wonder if there were any extension talks with Bamba? maybe NO as an incentive to produce, maybe YES but unable to get him nailed down to a team-friendly deal. Hard to guess what the inside dynamic is between Bamba/WeHam...I think they're rooting for him to win the job but don't want to bet $10m/yr on it when they can roll the dice on open market match. When a team clearly wants to retain a guy, teams are unlikely to bid too hard. I could see Bamba has a big year and gets re-signed first week of his RFA, without even getting other offers (like we did with AG). WCJ, traded (or possibly Isaac as mentioned above). RoLo is just a deep bench player/big man coach for our two legit Center prospects.

[Skin]

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

That and we already tied up money in one big. How many teams really have multiple bigs like Bamba/WCJ/Rolo? We should invest in perimeters scorers and get multiples of that, not multiples of centers. We can sign stop gap centers for cheap. Some teams out there have like one 6'10 big and the rest wing and guards.

Saying we tied up money in one big and can't do no more is like saying, we can't afford anymore SGs because we tied up money in T-Ross. WCj's contract is literally equivalent to a bench player. In 2025, he'll be making $10M year. That's like Aminu money. lol

Nowhere in the near future are we trying to save cap space for a big money player. Having his deal front loaded is a great benefit, but let's not deceive ourselves in thinking this is an annual cost.

As for the 3 spot, the most likely course of action is drafting one, so again... the cost of keeping a guy like Bamba does not interfere with the means for addressing a need like that.

[thelead]

Can we somehow trade Cole, RJ, and fillers for Buddy Hield? Yeah, he’ll be 29 this season but would bring stability to our backcourt rotation. It would be nice to get a solid backup pg like TJ McConnell as well. We need help lol.

[pepe1991]

Read on Twitter

That kid was drafted half of decade ago and his career to this point is made of 8 sec videos on twitter of him scoring against broomsticks

It's like Dante Exum pre draft, this just goes on and on forever.

Whole thing with Fultz is always very simplistic one:
a) can he play
b) can he shoot
c) how healthy he can be

I'm watching Mitchell, Tatum ,Adebayo, for start , it feels like they are in nba for ages now, second, nobody talks about "potential", they are what they are . Productive guys entering their mid 20s. Basically already entered their prime years. Finishing this season at age of 24-25. Get healthy, and start playing. SImple as that.

[89Magicfan]

Read on Twitter

That kid was drafted half of decade ago and his career to this point is made of 8 sec videos on twitter of him scoring against broomsticks

It's like Dante Exum pre draft, this just goes on and on forever.

Whole thing with Fultz is always very simplistic one:
a) can he play
b) can he shoot
c) how healthy he can be

I'm watching Mitchell, Tatum ,Adebayo, for start , it feels like they are in nba for ages now, second, nobody talks about "potential", they are what they are . Productive guys entering their mid 20s. Basically already entered their prime years. Finishing this season at age of 24-25. Get healthy, and start playing. SImple as that.

Same.

Don’t wanna see layups.

I want to see shots.

[BadMofoPimp]

IF Bamba becomes a player worth $20M/yr then there's no need to start over at that position.

If you want to trade him for an equal player then that's something, but the last thing to do is to let him walk without getting any compensation. You may want it, but WeHam can't be thinking that. That would be total misuse of an asset.

I still feel that our starting Center NEXT season will be one Mo Bamba. WCJ, on a very reasonable extension, will be traded as soon as we know Isaac is viable. WCJ may prove to be our PF of the future with Isaac possibly on the block (if Bamba/WCJ starts delivering a legit front court 2-2way upside). I'm saying Bamba's improved play is real and is more a function of opportunity and Coaching support than contract status...we'll see.

Now onto the 3 spot...

I think the issue for some of us, is only judging him on this contract year. We can't forget the past 3 years.
IF he puts up the numbers that look like a 20M year center, then goes back to partial participation, that really puts the org in a bind.

To me these are empty stats on a team losing by 30 points a game. Never pay a guy big bucks unless he is a difference maker. Bamba is not worth more than $12-15 mil per year until he becomes a difference maker that helps those around him win games.