All in!! Anfernee Simons 2.0

[Skybox]

Just to summarize....obtaining Simons does not mean...

abandoning the idea of defense

or taking the ball out of Franz and Paolo's hands

or budgeting to give Simons $40m per in 2 years

...IMO, it doesn't even mean starting Simons or losing a core member of our (healthy) rotation

[three3d]

Man... you can't look at Simons and bash him for that if you know anything about this current Blazers roster and coaching situation...

This Blazer roster is a hot mess of weird pieces, injuries and a disinterested bad lame-duck coach who tried to force his way out of town via the media last summer.

Simons is a good starter on a team where he's not the best player. The Magic truly are a great landing spot for them, he would take so much pressure off of Franz and Paolo. It's the role he should be in, 3rd best, and he's paid fairly for that when you consider a guy like KCP gets 22mil.

As for the "well no one has traded for him yet" argument that someone else made, that's also pretty silly and misinformed. The reality is the Blazers haven't seemed to even be looking to shop him. The Blazers GM loves Simons as a player and according to a recent article by Blazers beat writer Jason Quick (The Athletic), Cronin seems to only be interested in trading Simons if he asks to be moved.

Simons so far - on record in that article - has said he hasn't asked to be moved, he said he isn't there yet. So until Simons changes his tune, the reality is that I seriously question if the Blazers are considering moving him (even though I personally wish they would be proactive and do it for Scoot's benefit).

I do think it is an interesting question though, because here our team is winning games at a better rate than a lot of these no-defense combo guards win at when their full team is healthy. Not an apples to apples comparison, but there's a reason these non-defending volume shooters are considered one of the least valuable archetypes in the league. His contract is massive considering that.

And to take it a step further, Simons in advanced on/off stats and traditional plus/minus rates poorly the last two years. That is among his own teammates, who all play with the same terrible coach (totally agree with you here btw he's bad) and with the same terrible roster.

I actually am pro-Simons for the Magic at the right price, because I think he has potential to be a special shooter, although it hasn't led to great efficiency yet: career 56.6 TS% average for a 2 guard is 57.1. I just want to play devil's advocate and show that the other viewpoint is probably also a fair one.

That's a fair devil's advocate, however, to that I would say again to look at coaching and roster composition. 2 years ago was when they started the post-Dame era. Billups, being the god awful coach he is, has even to this day not changed how he coaches the offense given the new roster he has. He treats Simons like he's Dame, which Simons is not, never has been, never will be.

And again, I really think Simons' best role is as a 3rd option guy, not a first or even second offensive option. He can be that on nights for a team certainly, especially when he gets hot, but regularly I'm not so sure he can sustain being that level of option and have a team that wins at a high level.

I also think it's important to look at what doesn't show up on the stat sheet, the human component of it. The Blazers have been a losing franchise for almost 4 seasons straight now. More than half of Simons' career. The article I referenced also had very candid quotes from Simons about how difficult it's been to be on this Blazers roster over the last 3-4 years as they've been doing this weird ass mix of retooling and rebuilding. He openly admits in the article he has his good days and his "human" (bad) days where he's down about the situation - which does lead to bad/off games. I think he needs a fresh start somewhere and it would show up as better efficiency.

DusterBuster thanks for all the good info. For some reason people are fixated on a player having little to no value if he’s not elite defensively but I don’t buy into that. I think Simons fits seamlessly right next to Suggs and at any time Simons is on the court with an elite defensive guard like Suggs, KCP, and Anthony Black. And Coach Mosley is a great player developmental coach so I think he could unlock things in Simons he might not have been doing in Portland. And there also has to be extra motivation and joy in the fact he’d be coming back home to play basketball.

[DusterBuster]

I do think it is an interesting question though, because here our team is winning games at a better rate than a lot of these no-defense combo guards win at when their full team is healthy. Not an apples to apples comparison, but there's a reason these non-defending volume shooters are considered one of the least valuable archetypes in the league. His contract is massive considering that.

And to take it a step further, Simons in advanced on/off stats and traditional plus/minus rates poorly the last two years. That is among his own teammates, who all play with the same terrible coach (totally agree with you here btw he's bad) and with the same terrible roster.

I actually am pro-Simons for the Magic at the right price, because I think he has potential to be a special shooter, although it hasn't led to great efficiency yet: career 56.6 TS% average for a 2 guard is 57.1. I just want to play devil's advocate and show that the other viewpoint is probably also a fair one.

That's a fair devil's advocate, however, to that I would say again to look at coaching and roster composition. 2 years ago was when they started the post-Dame era. Billups, being the god awful coach he is, has even to this day not changed how he coaches the offense given the new roster he has. He treats Simons like he's Dame, which Simons is not, never has been, never will be.

And again, I really think Simons' best role is as a 3rd option guy, not a first or even second offensive option. He can be that on nights for a team certainly, especially when he gets hot, but regularly I'm not so sure he can sustain being that level of option and have a team that wins at a high level.

I also think it's important to look at what doesn't show up on the stat sheet, the human component of it. The Blazers have been a losing franchise for almost 4 seasons straight now. More than half of Simons' career. The article I referenced also had very candid quotes from Simons about how difficult it's been to be on this Blazers roster over the last 3-4 years as they've been doing this weird ass mix of retooling and rebuilding. He openly admits in the article he has his good days and his "human" (bad) days where he's down about the situation - which does lead to bad/off games. I think he needs a fresh start somewhere and it would show up as better efficiency.

DusterBuster thanks for all the good info. For some reason people are fixated on a player having little to no value if he’s not elite defensively but I don’t buy into that. I think Simons fits seamlessly right next to Suggs and at any time Simons is on the court with an elite defensive guard like Suggs, KCP, and Anthony Black. And Coach Mosley is a great player developmental coach so I think he could unlock things in Simons he might not have been doing in Portland. And there also has to be extra motivation and joy in the fact he’d be coming back home to play basketball.

The reality is defense for most guards is a team game. You can probably count on one hand the amount of guards in the league who are 2-way players + defensive stoppers. It's not super realistic to make that a total gauge of who's a good player or not.

I think you'd see Simons' defensive stats go up if he's on a roster with guards who are better defenders. The closest thing Simons has ever played alongside a good defender at the guard spot with is a very short cup-of-coffee with Malcom Brogdon.

Sometimes I just think people put too much stock into the advanced analytics on a single player, particularly on the defensive end of the floor, without looking at the big picture and how much other players or current situation can impact analytic numbers.

[Residual-Heat]

the guy that has been quietly killing it lately is Coby White. Also a better player and much better contract. Get him even if it means giving up a couple of picks.

[RichCollab]

We blow these games in the 5th quarter with our defense even missing our top 4 scoring players.

You guys get a 5th quarter?!

I was hoping you'd take that one...I'm lost

You know the “5 quarter”. A dollar 25…

[RichCollab]

Just to summarize....obtaining Simons does not mean...

abandoning the idea of defense

or taking the ball out of Franz and Paolo's hands

or budgeting to give Simons $40m per in 2 years

...IMO, it doesn't even mean starting Simons or losing a core member of our (healthy) rotation

It’s like going to Chick a fil for a burger.

[Skybox]

the guy that has been quietly killing it lately is Coby White. Also a better player and much better contract. Get him even if it means giving up a couple of picks.

He'd be good...but I think (might be wrong) he's got one of those dicey situations when it comes to re-signing him (just like Monk this summer where SAC could only pay up to a certain-potentially below market- amount) because of his very reasonable deal. I believe if you trade for him, you inherit that problem.

Kind of a deal breaker, imo.

[Skybox]

Just to summarize....obtaining Simons does not mean...

abandoning the idea of defense

or taking the ball out of Franz and Paolo's hands

or budgeting to give Simons $40m per in 2 years

...IMO, it doesn't even mean starting Simons or losing a core member of our (healthy) rotation

It’s like going to Chick a fil for a burger.

If you're goal is just to confuse me with your last handful of posts - you win!

[DusterBuster]

Just to summarize....obtaining Simons does not mean...

abandoning the idea of defense

or taking the ball out of Franz and Paolo's hands

or budgeting to give Simons $40m per in 2 years

...IMO, it doesn't even mean starting Simons or losing a core member of our (healthy) rotation

It’s like going to Chick a fil for a burger.

Fwiw, if Chick Fil A did a burger, I would definitely try it.

[Skybox]

Just to summarize....obtaining Simons does not mean...

abandoning the idea of defense

or taking the ball out of Franz and Paolo's hands

or budgeting to give Simons $40m per in 2 years

...IMO, it doesn't even mean starting Simons or losing a core member of our (healthy) rotation

It’s like going to Chick a fil for a burger.

Fwiw, if Chick Fil A did a burger, I would definitely try it.

It apparently goes for $1.25 if I'm following

[DusterBuster]

It’s like going to Chick a fil for a burger.

Fwiw, if Chick Fil A did a burger, I would definitely try it.

It apparently goes for $1.25 if I'm following

I'm as lost as you are, but now I think I'm gonna have to make a run to the Chick Fil A and In-and-Out by me this evening.

[Residual-Heat]

the guy that has been quietly killing it lately is Coby White. Also a better player and much better contract. Get him even if it means giving up a couple of picks.

He'd be good...but I think (might be wrong) he's got one of those dicey situations when it comes to re-signing him (just like Monk this summer where SAC could only pay up to a certain-potentially below market- amount) because of his very reasonable deal. I believe if you trade for him, you inherit that problem.

Kind of a deal breaker, imo.

not sure about that TBH. All i remember with Monk is that the issue was the Kings signed him to a 2 year deal back in 2022 and thats why the Kings werent able to offer more than what he ended up signing for. Wouldve been different if they had signed him to 3 years... Bulls signed Coby for three years, so the Bulls or whoever team he is on can offer more than what the Kings were limited to when they signed Monk.

Dont quote me on that though, im not sure.

[eyriq]

He's not overpaid.

Simons is paid what a team pays their third highest paid player or what they pay an expensive 4th starter. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a 3rd option on a contender which is why I say he's overpaid. He's too good on offense to be a low usage 4th option. To me he's destined to be a 6th man and will take a massive pay cut (relative to salary as a % of the cap).

The only trade market for him is likely rebuilding teams like Orlando and Detroit with cap room to burn because their best players are on their rookie scale contracts, or desperate contenders that are trying for a hail mary attempt at adding to their core, like the Bucks or Lakers.

[DusterBuster]

He's not overpaid.

Simons is paid what a team pays their third highest paid player or what they pay an expensive 4th starter. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a 3rd option on a contender which is why I say he's overpaid. He's too good on offense to be a low usage 4th option. To me he's destined to be a 6th man and will take a massive pay cut (relative to salary as a % of the cap).

The only trade market for him is likely rebuilding teams like Orlando and Detroit with cap room to burn because their best players are on their rookie scale contracts, or desperate contenders that are trying for a hail mary attempt at adding to their core, like the Bucks or Lakers.

We're probably splitting hairs here, but I disagree. I think the best comp for what Simons would look like on a contender is Derrick White on the Celtics. He's obviously not as good of an individual defender, but he's a guy on a stacked roster who would give you 17/4/4 on good shooting as the 3rd/4th best starter.

At 25mil given the current NBA salary cap, that's pretty much on par with what you would expect. If you think that's overpaid, you might still be viewing NBA salaries through the lens of the previous CBA.

It's why I think he'd be so good on Orlando given the current roster makeup. He could really fit that role so well there and be an upgrade for what they need when the whole roster is healthy.

[eyriq]

He's not overpaid.

Simons is paid what a team pays their third highest paid player or what they pay an expensive 4th starter. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a 3rd option on a contender which is why I say he's overpaid. He's too good on offense to be a low usage 4th option. To me he's destined to be a 6th man and will take a massive pay cut (relative to salary as a % of the cap).

The only trade market for him is likely rebuilding teams like Orlando and Detroit with cap room to burn because their best players are on their rookie scale contracts, or desperate contenders that are trying for a hail mary attempt at adding to their core, like the Bucks or Lakers.

We're probably splitting hairs here, but I disagree. I think the best comp for what Simons would look like on a contender is Derrick White on the Celtics. He's obviously not as good of an individual defender, but he's a guy on a stacked roster who would give you 17/4/4 on good shooting as the 3rd/4th best starter.

At 25mil given the current NBA salary cap, that's pretty much on par with what you would expect. If you think that's overpaid, you might still be viewing NBA salaries through the lens of the previous CBA.

I mean Derrick White is one of the best defenders in the NBA. Simons grades out as one of the worst.

[DusterBuster]

Simons is paid what a team pays their third highest paid player or what they pay an expensive 4th starter. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a 3rd option on a contender which is why I say he's overpaid. He's too good on offense to be a low usage 4th option. To me he's destined to be a 6th man and will take a massive pay cut (relative to salary as a % of the cap).

The only trade market for him is likely rebuilding teams like Orlando and Detroit with cap room to burn because their best players are on their rookie scale contracts, or desperate contenders that are trying for a hail mary attempt at adding to their core, like the Bucks or Lakers.

We're probably splitting hairs here, but I disagree. I think the best comp for what Simons would look like on a contender is Derrick White on the Celtics. He's obviously not as good of an individual defender, but he's a guy on a stacked roster who would give you 17/4/4 on good shooting as the 3rd/4th best starter.

At 25mil given the current NBA salary cap, that's pretty much on par with what you would expect. If you think that's overpaid, you might still be viewing NBA salaries through the lens of the previous CBA.

I mean Derrick White is one of the best defenders in the NBA. Simons grades out as one of the worst.

He's also on one of the best defensive squads on in the league and I clearly pointed that out. My ultimate point is, defense aside, the production he brings is similar to what you would expect for Simons on a good team as that 3/4th best player.

And for what it's worth, that's just my opinion, take it or leave it. If it were up to me as Blazers GM, I would be having the biggest firesale right now on all the vets. I hate the current non-direction of the team. I would sell off Simons, Grant, Ayton and Williams for anything that doesn't bring back salaries longer than those guys' respective current contracts. Any picks that can be brought back are would be secondary to just opening up roster spots for the guys on rookie scale deals.

[Idiosyncratic]

Man... you can't look at Simons and bash him for that if you know anything about this current Blazers roster and coaching situation...

This Blazer roster is a hot mess of weird pieces, injuries and a disinterested bad lame-duck coach who tried to force his way out of town via the media last summer.

Simons is a good starter on a team where he's not the best player. The Magic truly are a great landing spot for them, he would take so much pressure off of Franz and Paolo. It's the role he should be in, 3rd best, and he's paid fairly for that when you consider a guy like KCP gets 22mil.

As for the "well no one has traded for him yet" argument that someone else made, that's also pretty silly and misinformed. The reality is the Blazers haven't seemed to even be looking to shop him. The Blazers GM loves Simons as a player and according to a recent article by Blazers beat writer Jason Quick (The Athletic), Cronin seems to only be interested in trading Simons if he asks to be moved.

Simons so far - on record in that article - has said he hasn't asked to be moved, he said he isn't there yet. So until Simons changes his tune, the reality is that I seriously question if the Blazers are considering moving him (even though I personally wish they would be proactive and do it for Scoot's benefit).

I do think it is an interesting question though, because here our team is winning games at a better rate than a lot of these no-defense combo guards win at when their full team is healthy. Not an apples to apples comparison, but there's a reason these non-defending volume shooters are considered one of the least valuable archetypes in the league. His contract is massive considering that.

And to take it a step further, Simons in advanced on/off stats and traditional plus/minus rates poorly the last two years. That is among his own teammates, who all play with the same terrible coach (totally agree with you here btw he's bad) and with the same terrible roster.

I actually am pro-Simons for the Magic at the right price, because I think he has potential to be a special shooter, although it hasn't led to great efficiency yet: career 56.6 TS% average for a 2 guard is 57.1. I just want to play devil's advocate and show that the other viewpoint is probably also a fair one.

That's a fair devil's advocate, however, to that I would say again to look at coaching and roster composition. 2 years ago was when they started the post-Dame era. Billups, being the god awful coach he is, has even to this day not changed how he coaches the offense given the new roster he has. He treats Simons like he's Dame, which Simons is not, never has been, never will be.

And again, I really think Simons' best role is as a 3rd option guy, not a first or even second offensive option. He can be that on nights for a team certainly, especially when he gets hot, but regularly I'm not so sure he can sustain being that level of option and have a team that wins at a high level.

I also think it's important to look at what doesn't show up on the stat sheet, the human component of it. The Blazers have been a losing franchise for almost 4 seasons straight now. More than half of Simons' career. The article I referenced also had very candid quotes from Simons about how difficult it's been to be on this Blazers roster over the last 3-4 years as they've been doing this weird ass mix of retooling and rebuilding. He openly admits in the article he has his good days and his "human" (bad) days where he's down about the situation - which does lead to bad/off games. I think he needs a fresh start somewhere and it would show up as better efficiency.

Agree with you on many points. Like I said, I am for trading for Simons. The thing I like about him is that he is capable of shooting a lot of 3s at a good percentage. I think the spacing benefit our guys would recieve could be a big deal. Makes me prefer him to guys like Sexton who maybe score more efficiently, but don't have quite the same gravity a guy who can shoot 9 3s a game at 38% may have. As a role player with a better coach he should be able to improve his shot selection enough to be much more efficient overall.

I do watch Blazers games from time to time to see how Scoot and Shaedon are coming along and I always come off thinking your guys are just running around doing their own thing out there. Billups does seem pretty awful.

Thanks for the thoughtful posts. Wishing you guys some lottery luck this year.

[DusterBuster]

I do watch Blazers games from time to time to see how Scoot and Shaedon are coming along and I always come off thinking your guys are just running around doing their own thing out there. Billups does seem pretty awful.

Truly, it's what's happening, you nailed it 100%. The few games Billups missed for personal reasons and they had a fill-in HC were some of the only times we've seen a structured offense. It's really brutal, he's basically a worst Doc Rivers.

I haven't watched a full Blazer game in years during the Billups era, it's just been too brutal to sit through a game he coaches. I'm just counting down the days til he's gone.

[RichCollab]

Simons is like the shake with our 12 count nugget meal? The cherry on top.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

He's not overpaid.

Simons is paid what a team pays their third highest paid player or what they pay an expensive 4th starter. I don't think he's anywhere close to being a 3rd option on a contender which is why I say he's overpaid. He's too good on offense to be a low usage 4th option. To me he's destined to be a 6th man and will take a massive pay cut (relative to salary as a % of the cap).

The only trade market for him is likely rebuilding teams like Orlando and Detroit with cap room to burn because their best players are on their rookie scale contracts, or desperate contenders that are trying for a hail mary attempt at adding to their core, like the Bucks or Lakers.

We're probably splitting hairs here, but I disagree. I think the best comp for what Simons would look like on a contender is Derrick White on the Celtics. He's obviously not as good of an individual defender, but he's a guy on a stacked roster who would give you 17/4/4 on good shooting as the 3rd/4th best starter.

At 25mil given the current NBA salary cap, that's pretty much on par with what you would expect. If you think that's overpaid, you might still be viewing NBA salaries through the lens of the previous CBA.

It's why I think he'd be so good on Orlando given the current roster makeup. He could really fit that role so well there and be an upgrade for what they need when the whole roster is healthy.

we’re paying Jon Isaac to play 52 games for 15M and Gary Harris 7.5M for minimal production.

It’s laughable that this dude is even trying to critique what Simons makes while we’ve got those dead weights.