Official Speculation Thread '19-'20 V: Purgatory

[Skybox]

Honestly, I love Isaac but the Chuma/AG rotation isn't the worst thing I can imagine. Perhaps by the time Isaac returns, he will be a small 5, and we'll be running an outside-in offense that works.

[BadMofoPimp]

Honestly, I love Isaac but the Chuma/AG rotation isn't the worst thing I can imagine. Perhaps by the time Isaac returns, he will be a small 5, and we'll be running an outside-in offense that works.

I doubt his knees will have him banging opposing 5's. Maybe against small 5's in spurts at best.

[Bensational]

Honestly, I love Isaac but the Chuma/AG rotation isn't the worst thing I can imagine. Perhaps by the time Isaac returns, he will be a small 5, and we'll be running an outside-in offense that works.

I doubt his knees will have him banging opposing 5's. Maybe against small 5's in spurts at best.

Isaac's problem is he still tries to move like a guard, but his legs can't handle it. At least as a 5 he wouldn't be trying to make a play from the perimeter, and he'd still be able to anchor a defense. Get Vuc to teach him the finesse post moves instead of trying to have him emulate Durant, and it will probably do wonders for his durability.

Plus, as a 5 he will have more opportunity to be involved in the offense since PnR is such a staple.

[Bensational]

The Vuc/Gordon combo are our strongest points at the moment. I wouldn't be racing to trade either if we want to remain competitive and hope to have something to build off.

Gotta hope that Fultz emerges or we find a trade/draft a wing who can make an immediate impact to take that duo to the next level. Fultz, Okeke, Bamba 2020 FRP and Fournier's expiring contract will be the extent of the assets we'll have to work with, so the only studs we'll be getting from trading them will be diamond in the rough types.

NAW and Simons are top of that list for me. Josh Hart maybe. Norm Powell for someone a bit older.

Actually, I think Powell would surprise if placed in a lead role. But we don't have the value they'd want in return, I don't think. Maybe we could get him as a FA in a couple of seasons.

[bigdogdylan5]

The Vuc/Gordon combo are our strongest points at the moment. I wouldn't be racing to trade either if we want to remain competitive and hope to have something to build off.

Gotta hope that Fultz emerges or we find a trade/draft a wing who can make an immediate impact to take that duo to the next level. Fultz, Okeke, Bamba 2020 FRP and Fournier's expiring contract will be the extent of the assets we'll have to work with, so the only studs we'll be getting from trading them will be diamond in the rough types.

NAW and Simons are top of that list for me. Josh Hart maybe. Norm Powell for someone a bit older.

Actually, I think Powell would surprise if placed in a lead role. But we don't have the value they'd want in return, I don't think. Maybe we could get him as a FA in a couple of seasons.

I don’t really understand why people want to completely blow this up. I haven’t had this much fun watching the Magic between end of last year and this restart since Dwight. I want to emulate Toronto and Miami instead of doing the tanking again.

[yoyojw17]

The Vuc/Gordon combo are our strongest points at the moment. I wouldn't be racing to trade either if we want to remain competitive and hope to have something to build off.

Gotta hope that Fultz emerges or we find a trade/draft a wing who can make an immediate impact to take that duo to the next level. Fultz, Okeke, Bamba 2020 FRP and Fournier's expiring contract will be the extent of the assets we'll have to work with, so the only studs we'll be getting from trading them will be diamond in the rough types.

NAW and Simons are top of that list for me. Josh Hart maybe. Norm Powell for someone a bit older.

Actually, I think Powell would surprise if placed in a lead role. But we don't have the value they'd want in return, I don't think. Maybe we could get him as a FA in a couple of seasons.

I don’t really understand why people want to completely blow this up. I haven’t had this much fun watching the Magic between end of last year and this restart since Dwight. I want to emulate Toronto and Miami instead of doing the tanking again.

agreed. the team is getting it.... and the players are beginning to shine. we were the top scoring team in the nba since the all star break... and that is not just a fluke, that's a translation of players buying in and getting it. The style of play is beginning to change and things are being executed. Players are blooming. Tearing it down would totally undermine the mentality that has been cultivated for a possibility at"better talent". I'd rather make select changes/improvements that pulling down what was built through teaching, effort, growth, and continuity.

[PrimeThyme]

To do the Toronto/Miami thing you have to have an excellent basketball operations who have proven themselves in the draft. Ours simply haven’t. The only bright spots you could even argue outside of Fultz (who they didn’t draft) are still Hennys players.

People want to blow it up becuase we have a coach who has failed to elevate a roster past a 7th seed, a basketball operations who have proven to be the definition of mediocre, and a roster that has low ceiling written all over it.

I’m not even one of those that thinks you have to be competing for a championship every single year, but the least I ask is that you field a roster with the potential to be a 3-5 seed in the east.

I do not believe we have that, and I don’t have confidence that WeHam will get us there. So that leaves me feeling like we need another reset.

Even despite the games being more enjoyable being 4 games under .500 just doesn’t get me jumping up for joy.

[SOUL]

To do the Toronto/Miami thing you have to have an excellent basketball operations who have proven themselves in the draft. Ours simply haven’t. The only bright spots you could even argue outside of Fultz (who they didn’t draft) are still Hennys players.

People want to blow it up becuase we have a coach who has failed to elevate a roster past a 7th seed, a basketball operations who have proven to be the definition of mediocre, and a roster that has low ceiling written all over it.

I’m not even one of those that thinks you have to be competing for a championship every single year, but the least I ask is that you field a roster with the potential to be a 3-5 seed in the east.

I do not believe we have that, and I don’t have confidence that WeHam will get us there. So that leaves me feeling like we need another reset.

Even despite the games being more enjoyable being 4 games under .500 just doesn’t get me jumping up for joy.

Not to mention both teams made trades involving players that many liked and wanted to stay (DeMar/Josh Richardson) although others obviously didn't mind them leaving when you're bringing back higher ceiling players.

Keeping the status quo that many want here just isn't going to get the team anywhere.

[basketballRob]

Gordon turns 25 within a month and half, not big difference, but he has been in nba for full 6 years now.
He just isn't allstar level player.

51,7% TS on -0,2 BPM simply says all about his performance this year.
There was not a single season in this 6 years where his shots brought positive value to the offense apart from year 2.


If we talk about inner development and hope somebody can turn a table, it's Fultz recovering his jumpshot and 2020 pick being something extraordinary.

Oladipo didn't make an allstar team until he was 25. His career high in ppg was 17.9 and Gordon's is 17.6.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[bigdogdylan5]

The Vuc/Gordon combo are our strongest points at the moment. I wouldn't be racing to trade either if we want to remain competitive and hope to have something to build off.

Gotta hope that Fultz emerges or we find a trade/draft a wing who can make an immediate impact to take that duo to the next level. Fultz, Okeke, Bamba 2020 FRP and Fournier's expiring contract will be the extent of the assets we'll have to work with, so the only studs we'll be getting from trading them will be diamond in the rough types.

NAW and Simons are top of that list for me. Josh Hart maybe. Norm Powell for someone a bit older.

Actually, I think Powell would surprise if placed in a lead role. But we don't have the value they'd want in return, I don't think. Maybe we could get him as a FA in a couple of seasons.

Watching the Pelicans and grizzlies right now. Josh Hart looks really good and is playing well. It’s not possible to get equal value when trading Anthony Davis but gosh the Pelicans sure got close.

[jonbob17]

Seemed like the Magic were banking on JI becoming a top 15 player in the league and Fultz and Bamba getting much better, and then having Vucevic still close enough to his prime to be a big part or a trade chip.
This team is playing great right now, and I do think they can be even better next year, but you got Brooklyn probably being a top 4 team if everyone is healthy, you would think Washington would be somewhat better, I don't see any of the top teams getting much worse, possibly Indiana. The Hawks could get better, Trae, Reddish, Collins, and Capela, sound pretty good, if they could get a Marcus Smart, that would be a tough starting 5.

So while I think the Magic should still get into the playoffs, maybe. Then what, they get Isaac back, AG is in the last year of his contract, Vucevic will be entering his age 31 season. Hopefully Bamba will get back in the rotation at some point.

So that is why people want to blow it up. Yes, it is fun to watch this team, and yes they can beat anybody when they are on, but long term should we be happy with a peak of 5th seed in the east.

Next year's draft is is rich and deep, the 7th pick next year probably gets you a pretty good starter, though very young. Maybe we get lucky and win the Cade sweepstakes, and we are automatically on an expedited path toward the top of the East.

[KillMonger]

Honestly, I love Isaac but the Chuma/AG rotation isn't the worst thing I can imagine. Perhaps by the time Isaac returns, he will be a small 5, and we'll be running an outside-in offense that works.

I doubt his knees will have him banging opposing 5's. Maybe against small 5's in spurts at best.

Isaac's problem is he still tries to move like a guard, but his legs can't handle it. At least as a 5 he wouldn't be trying to make a play from the perimeter, and he'd still be able to anchor a defense. Get Vuc to teach him the finesse post moves instead of trying to have him emulate Durant, and it will probably do wonders for his durability.

Plus, as a 5 he will have more opportunity to be involved in the offense since PnR is such a staple.

If Giannis doesn't play full time 5 i don't see why Issac would.....PF is perfect for JI, he can roam and block shots weakside and when he gets switch out on the perimeter he can lock up play passing lanes and instantly be a transition threat and JI is good in transition....At the center position the way Clifford's defense is set up JI would be planted in the paint, while that may be good for rim protection it kinda limits JI defensively since can't roam in clifford's defense at the 5....Center when we go small? yes but full time? i don't know about that money

[Bensational]

I doubt his knees will have him banging opposing 5's. Maybe against small 5's in spurts at best.

Isaac's problem is he still tries to move like a guard, but his legs can't handle it. At least as a 5 he wouldn't be trying to make a play from the perimeter, and he'd still be able to anchor a defense. Get Vuc to teach him the finesse post moves instead of trying to have him emulate Durant, and it will probably do wonders for his durability.

Plus, as a 5 he will have more opportunity to be involved in the offense since PnR is such a staple.

If Giannis doesn't play full time 5 i don't see why Issac would.....PF is perfect for JI, he can roam and block shots weakside and when he gets switch out on the perimeter he can lock up play passing lanes and instantly be a transition threat and JI is good in transition....At the center position the way Clifford's defense is set up JI would be planted in the paint, while that may be good for rim protection it kinda limits JI defensively since can't roam in clifford's defense at the 5....Center when we go small? yes but full time? i don't know about that money

You're probably right about the defensive side of things, since his movements on that side are very different to how he moves on offense. But offensively I don't think he's capable of playing how he wants to off the perimeter.

Giannis is healthy and strong AF, so I'm not sure I'd be using him as a model. Harry Giles is probably closer to what Isaac is - elite athleticism on dodgy knees/legs.

[KillMonger]

Isaac's problem is he still tries to move like a guard, but his legs can't handle it. At least as a 5 he wouldn't be trying to make a play from the perimeter, and he'd still be able to anchor a defense. Get Vuc to teach him the finesse post moves instead of trying to have him emulate Durant, and it will probably do wonders for his durability.

Plus, as a 5 he will have more opportunity to be involved in the offense since PnR is such a staple.

If Giannis doesn't play full time 5 i don't see why Issac would.....PF is perfect for JI, he can roam and block shots weakside and when he gets switch out on the perimeter he can lock up play passing lanes and instantly be a transition threat and JI is good in transition....At the center position the way Clifford's defense is set up JI would be planted in the paint, while that may be good for rim protection it kinda limits JI defensively since can't roam in clifford's defense at the 5....Center when we go small? yes but full time? i don't know about that money

You're probably right about the defensive side of things, since his movements on that side are very different to how he moves on offense. But offensively I don't think he's capable of playing how he wants to off the perimeter.

Giannis is healthy and strong AF, so I'm not sure I'd be using him as a model. Harry Giles is probably closer to what Isaac is - elite athleticism on dodgy knees/legs.

Well like you said Giannis is healthy and Strong AF and yet he STILL doesn't play center full time so the model works imo....offensively honestly it doesn't matter where JI is since Clifford won't involve him in anything any way.....until i see something different from how clifford uses JI then really it doesn't matter....you could have JI playing at the SG spot offensively and he will still end up just standing in the corner

[Bensational]

If Giannis doesn't play full time 5 i don't see why Issac would.....PF is perfect for JI, he can roam and block shots weakside and when he gets switch out on the perimeter he can lock up play passing lanes and instantly be a transition threat and JI is good in transition....At the center position the way Clifford's defense is set up JI would be planted in the paint, while that may be good for rim protection it kinda limits JI defensively since can't roam in clifford's defense at the 5....Center when we go small? yes but full time? i don't know about that money

You're probably right about the defensive side of things, since his movements on that side are very different to how he moves on offense. But offensively I don't think he's capable of playing how he wants to off the perimeter.

Giannis is healthy and strong AF, so I'm not sure I'd be using him as a model. Harry Giles is probably closer to what Isaac is - elite athleticism on dodgy knees/legs.

Well like you said Giannis is healthy and Strong AF and yet he STILL doesn't play center full time so the model works imo....offensively honestly it doesn't matter where JI is since Clifford won't involve him in anything any way.....until i see something different from how clifford uses JI then really it doesn't matter....you could have JI playing at the SG spot offensively and he will still end up just standing in the corner

It works for Giannis and AD who can both stay healthy. I just struggle to compare Isaac to either with his glass legs.

There would be advantages to Isaac playing C, too. His defense on the PnR could lock a lot of them down at the perimeter, and stick with them all the way into the paint, instead of dropping back and giving up the midrange as we have been doing.

But, we've got Bamba as our developing C for the future, so unless he's moved I can't see them developing Isaac into a 3rd C. So he probably does stay at PF like you're saying. We'll just have to wait a year and a half to see what kind of condition he returns in.

[KillMonger]

You're probably right about the defensive side of things, since his movements on that side are very different to how he moves on offense. But offensively I don't think he's capable of playing how he wants to off the perimeter.

Giannis is healthy and strong AF, so I'm not sure I'd be using him as a model. Harry Giles is probably closer to what Isaac is - elite athleticism on dodgy knees/legs.

Well like you said Giannis is healthy and Strong AF and yet he STILL doesn't play center full time so the model works imo....offensively honestly it doesn't matter where JI is since Clifford won't involve him in anything any way.....until i see something different from how clifford uses JI then really it doesn't matter....you could have JI playing at the SG spot offensively and he will still end up just standing in the corner

It works for Giannis and AD who can both stay healthy. I just struggle to compare Isaac to either with his glass legs.

There would be advantages to Isaac playing C, too. His defense on the PnR could lock a lot of them down at the perimeter, and stick with them all the way into the paint, instead of dropping back and giving up the midrange as we have been doing.

But, we've got Bamba as our developing C for the future, so unless he's moved I can't see them developing Isaac into a 3rd C. So he probably does stay at PF like you're saying. We'll just have to wait a year and a half to see what kind of condition he returns in.

i wouldn't say AD and healthy in the same sentence dude has been injured almost his whole career lol....other than that i get what you're trying to say i can see it....

[RookieStar]

I just wanna get thos off my head...

Coming into this season I was like WTF? We had trouble trying to put two(2) PFs in AG and JI then we sign Aminu AND drafted Chuma? PLlus if Im not.mistaken we still had Amile as well...

FAast forward to today and we have none of those PFs now lol.

[3ddman23]

Its so disheartening seeing the blazers vs nuggets game now . And they have players like bol bol, Michael porter Jr, pj dozier, gary Trent Jr, afernnnee simons all in the late and all contributing. But this organization just can't seem to find these type of players to contribute in the same manner.

Some of the moves and shoots these guys are making are things our younger guys could never do. I just don't get what this front office is doing in terms of talent evaluating and drafting. How do you let this type of players go by you in the draft and not select them?

I know hindsight is 20/20 but some times you can just tell when a guy has the it factor right of the bat. Its just so frustrating being a magic fan.

[KillMonger]

fultz better not be coming off the bench in todays game....i don't see anymore reason for it at this point....Fultz himself said it would only take him a week to get back into game shape....it's been a week, no reason he shouldn't be starting unless he lost the starting job to DJ Agustin

[Bensational]

I think Fultz is better off with the 2nd unit since he's more likely to be able to call his own shots with them. He's the 4th option with the starters and the 2nd option on the bench. I want to see Fultz looking for his own offense more, not necessarily setting up the others.