Rookie Tracker: Aaron & Elf

[Bensational]

I just wanted to write and hear some thoughts on our rooks progress to date. I figure it could be worthwhile tracking them throughout the whole season, to see how they develops.

Anyone else been impressed with what AG has brought to the table offensively so far? I expected the kid to be much more raw, and limited to MoHarkless style offense, but he's really finding a way to get himself shots.

He seems quite comfortable down in the key, and he's been showing a really nice, soft touch down there. From memory, he's had a turn around fade away and a couple pull up floaters, all of which started from out near the perimeter and ended up inside after he used his handles to get inside with. It looks like he's really starting to put the package together.

On top of that, his individual defense is just insane. I can't wait to see him have a go at LeBron, or Durant when healthy. He just needs to be able to stay on top of defensive rotations a bit better, but that's not a big issue.

Yeah, he's had a few bad plays (bad passes, running too early and missing the ball), but he gives 100% effort, he and Tobias seem to be the primary targets for assists from KOQ because they move more than others, and he's already our best defender.

Anyone else got early season thoughts on the kid?



Elf on the other hand is legit and already capable of holding his own. He's had a few bad passes and plays which will all tidy up in time. They really don't concern me right now. Right now I want him pushing in and trying everything to learn his boundaries, before he tries to reign in areas. Some of his passes are so ridiculously on point!

I really want to see him take more shots. From outside and inside. Use Frye to his advantage.

I'd also like to see him develop a really strong rapport with the wings. It feels like every time he gets the ball down in the key, under the rim, he looks around for an easy short dump off but nobody has followed him in, and the defense has sealed off Vuc. Obviously, the kid needs outlets, but if Tobias/Aaron/Fournier just made a hard cut to the basket on those plays, they'd likely be at the rim before the defense knew what was going on.

Anyone got any thoughts on Elf?

[Nemesis21]

I just wanted to write and hear some thoughts on our rooks progress to date. I figure it could be worthwhile tracking them throughout the whole season, to see how they develops.

Anyone else been impressed with what AG has brought to the table offensively so far? I expected the kid to be much more raw, and limited to MoHarkless style offense, but he's really finding a way to get himself shots.

He seems quite comfortable down in the key, and he's been showing a really nice, soft touch down there. From memory, he's had a turn around fade away and a couple pull up floaters, all of which started from out near the perimeter and ended up inside after he used his handles to get inside with. It looks like he's really starting to put the package together.

On top of that, his individual defense is just insane. I can't wait to see him have a go at LeBron, or Durant when healthy. He just needs to be able to stay on top of defensive rotations a bit better, but that's not a big issue.

Yeah, he's had a few bad plays (bad passes, running too early and missing the ball), but he gives 100% effort, he and Tobias seem to be the primary targets for assists from KOQ because they move more than others, and he's already our best defender.

Anyone else got early season thoughts on the kid?



Elf on the other hand is legit and already capable of holding his own. He's had a few bad passes and plays which will all tidy up in time. They really don't concern me right now. Right now I want him pushing in and trying everything to learn his boundaries, before he tries to reign in areas. Some of his passes are so ridiculously on point!

I really want to see him take more shots. From outside and inside. Use Frye to his advantage.

I'd also like to see him develop a really strong rapport with the wings. It feels like every time he gets the ball down in the key, under the rim, he looks around for an easy short dump off but nobody has followed him in, and the defense has sealed off Vuc. Obviously, the kid needs outlets, but if Tobias/Aaron/Fournier just made a hard cut to the basket on those plays, they'd likely be at the rim before the defense knew what was going on.

Anyone got any thoughts on Elf?

I like what we are seeing from both of them! AG has even knocked down a 3 or two, IIRC. I just continue to hope he grows an inch or two,develops a consistent jumper so he can be our Blake Griffin with better defense.

[Orlwillbeback]

I just wanted to write and hear some thoughts on our rooks progress to date. I figure it could be worthwhile tracking them throughout the whole season, to see how they develops.

Anyone else been impressed with what AG has brought to the table offensively so far? I expected the kid to be much more raw, and limited to MoHarkless style offense, but he's really finding a way to get himself shots.

He seems quite comfortable down in the key, and he's been showing a really nice, soft touch down there. From memory, he's had a turn around fade away and a couple pull up floaters, all of which started from out near the perimeter and ended up inside after he used his handles to get inside with. It looks like he's really starting to put the package together.

On top of that, his individual defense is just insane. I can't wait to see him have a go at LeBron, or Durant when healthy. He just needs to be able to stay on top of defensive rotations a bit better, but that's not a big issue.

Yeah, he's had a few bad plays (bad passes, running too early and missing the ball), but he gives 100% effort, he and Tobias seem to be the primary targets for assists from KOQ because they move more than others, and he's already our best defender.

Anyone else got early season thoughts on the kid?



Elf on the other hand is legit and already capable of holding his own. He's had a few bad passes and plays which will all tidy up in time. They really don't concern me right now. Right now I want him pushing in and trying everything to learn his boundaries, before he tries to reign in areas. Some of his passes are so ridiculously on point!

I really want to see him take more shots. From outside and inside. Use Frye to his advantage.

I'd also like to see him develop a really strong rapport with the wings. It feels like every time he gets the ball down in the key, under the rim, he looks around for an easy short dump off but nobody has followed him in, and the defense has sealed off Vuc. Obviously, the kid needs outlets, but if Tobias/Aaron/Fournier just made a hard cut to the basket on those plays, they'd likely be at the rim before the defense knew what was going on.

Anyone got any thoughts on Elf?

I agree iam impressed with gordon so far, especially his ball handling and his ability to make shots. I have since changed my mind about who the better ball handler is between he and tobias as i now think gordon is the better ball handler.

Elfrid iam more worried about, he is very mistake prone as advertised but what is very concerning is his complete inability to score so far. He is so afraid to shoot these wide open jumpers that defenses are giving him and he only drives to pass right now. He has great vision and physical tools but he needs to start scoring to have a chance in this league.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using RealGM Forums mobile app

[Bensational]

Elfrid iam more worried about, he is very mistake prone as advertised but what is very concerning is his complete inability to score so far. He is so afraid to shoot these wide open jumpers that defenses are giving him and he only drives to pass right now. He has great vision and physical tools but he needs to start scoring to have a chance in this league.

i wouldn't be concerned. listen to his language in all his interviews, and he makes it pretty clear that he's here first and foremost to get the team involved. i think a lot of that has come from coaching, and that they know he's got the best chance of getting the ball to Vuc/Tobias/etc deep in the paint for a high % shot, and at this point they clearly trust their shooting over the rookie's. But I think Elf is such a great teammate that he prioritizes that, too. He wants to get his team going first, then find his, and that's commendable.

Elf will get his. He scored 20ppg for his college team, so he knows how to score. He gets inside and has so many open looks that one day he'll start taking those shots, and defenses won't know what to do. But, i reckon he's got real concerns with his 3-shot, which is why he never seems to take them. he needs to learn to get over that and to become more of a threat on that front.

[Orlwillbeback]

Elfrid iam more worried about, he is very mistake prone as advertised but what is very concerning is his complete inability to score so far. He is so afraid to shoot these wide open jumpers that defenses are giving him and he only drives to pass right now. He has great vision and physical tools but he needs to start scoring to have a chance in this league.

i wouldn't be concerned. listen to his language in all his interviews, and he makes it pretty clear that he's here first and foremost to get the team involved. i think a lot of that has come from coaching, and that they know he's got the best chance of getting the ball to Vuc/Tobias/etc deep in the paint for a high % shot, and at this point they clearly trust their shooting over the rookie's. But I think Elf is such a great teammate that he prioritizes that, too. He wants to get his team going first, then find his, and that's commendable.

Elf will get his. He scored 20ppg for his college team, so he knows how to score. He gets inside and has so many open looks that one day he'll start taking those shots, and defenses won't know what to do. But, i reckon he's got real concerns with his 3-shot, which is why he never seems to take them. he needs to learn to get over that and to become more of a threat on that front.

Scoring in the nba is different than scoring in the sun belt. Elfrid scored pretty much all his points right at the rim in college and so far he either only looks to pass or has gotten blocked. He's got quite a bit of development to do.

[MagicStarwipe]

I really like Elfrid's shooting form here. Not talking about the ball going in as they aren't showing the misses, but his actual shooting form. Looks smooth,fluid and fundamentally sound to me.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBpUiO-bxz0[/youtube]

[Bensational]

Elfrid iam more worried about, he is very mistake prone as advertised but what is very concerning is his complete inability to score so far. He is so afraid to shoot these wide open jumpers that defenses are giving him and he only drives to pass right now. He has great vision and physical tools but he needs to start scoring to have a chance in this league.

i wouldn't be concerned. listen to his language in all his interviews, and he makes it pretty clear that he's here first and foremost to get the team involved. i think a lot of that has come from coaching, and that they know he's got the best chance of getting the ball to Vuc/Tobias/etc deep in the paint for a high % shot, and at this point they clearly trust their shooting over the rookie's. But I think Elf is such a great teammate that he prioritizes that, too. He wants to get his team going first, then find his, and that's commendable.

Elf will get his. He scored 20ppg for his college team, so he knows how to score. He gets inside and has so many open looks that one day he'll start taking those shots, and defenses won't know what to do. But, i reckon he's got real concerns with his 3-shot, which is why he never seems to take them. he needs to learn to get over that and to become more of a threat on that front.

Scoring in the nba is different than scoring in the sun belt. Elfrid scored pretty much all his points right at the rim in college and so far he either only looks to pass or has gotten blocked. He's got quite a bit of development to do.

the opportunities are there though. he gets down near the rim with good looks a lot, but he's looking to pass right now. if he were looking to shoot, he could put up plenty of uncontested shots. he's shown some amazing footwork in the paint, whilst dribbling, which makes me confident he could turn those opportunities into points.

i can only think of him being blocked once this season, and that was by Anthony Davis. i'm not gonna hold that against him.

[Orlwillbeback]

ut he's looking to pass right now. if he were looking to shoot, he could put up plenty of uncontested shots. he's shown some amazing footwork in the paint, whilst dribbling, which makes me confident he could turn those opportunities into points.

i can only think of him being blocked once this season, and that was by Anthony Davis. i'm not gonna hold that against him.

Let me clairfy I think the potential is there though for elfrid. He has the ball on a string and obviously great vision. He can knife into the paint whenever he wants and always has his head on a swivel looking for his teammates. I think having an offensive minded center like vuc will be great to his assist numbers throughout his career as vuc can finish ALOT of different kinds of plays.

I just think he needs to look for his own offense some more. He probably was just so much more talented than his peers in the sun belt that despite having the mentality of a distributor he still averages 20 ppg by default of his talent. Once he learn nba defenses and once vaughn uses frye more i expect elfrid to blossom. May not totally happen this season except for stretches but the potential is there.

[eyriq]

They are already playing average to above average defense, which is great to see. Aaron has been much better on offense compared to Payton, who has been a disaster IMO. I think Aaron Gordon is already a better player than Harris *troll face*

[ORLMagicGirl15]

I'm not very good at explaining the specifics, so I won't bother, but these are the little thing that I enjoy about each Rookie,

AG:
-I'm excited that he inbounds the ball in pressure situations. It's interesting because last year we were a mess but he seems up for that. That was a source of anxiety for me every time I watched the team try to inbound that ball so I'm happy that he seems relaxed when in bounding.
-I love how excited he is. He is everywhere on that floor.
-When watching him defend, he is extremely focused on his man, a little too much, he tries to match them step for step but it is enjoyable to watch.
-He is a flyer. He reminds me of Dwight in that aspect.
-He handles the ball pretty well.
-I liked how he looked to crash the boards in game 2. I know he didn't have a lot of rebounds but compared to the first game he was more aggressive.
-Is it me or did he do a behind the back pass in the 2nd game and no one said anything? Maybe it was game 1 but I thought that's what I've seen.
- Over the summer there was a lot of talk in this board about AG, there was a post on the general board asking about studs, busts and sleepers and there was this overwhelming conclusion that AG will be a bust. And I have been rooting for this guy ever since we've picked him. I must admit, when we chose him at #4, I was confused and I don't know what Hennigan was thinking with other names on the board at #4, and even know I don't what will happen but I am thoroughly enjoy watching him grow. From Summer League to now his growth is incredible. He is very cerebral and I can't wait until his body catches up with his mind, baring injuried, it's going to be fun to watch him.

Elfrid Payton
-I want to say that it's great having a passing point guard, sadly we don't have shooters but it's defintely fun having him
-His aggressiveness in the first game was awesome but he seemed more timid in the 2nd game. Strange because he showed more anger but he seemed more flustered. And I was mad along with him when Wall pushed him, but it took me back to Wall's very first NBA game when Dwight layer him flat on the floor when he tried to score in the paint and I felt that Wall got his "revenge" somehow.
-Watching him go for steals is pretty awesome.
-He can't shoot and it's not okay but I'm hoping he'll improve that.
-He is so calm, a little too calm for my liking so I was happy to see a little emotion but I hope he can take that emotion and focus it in the game.
-His passing tho...

Marble
-I want to see more of him.
-He's a scorer, we have no shooters and therefore he needs to be in the game.

All in all, in two games, I'm excited about our rookies.

[tooler]

I'm not going to worry about defending Elfrid Payton right now. I'm confident he'll pick it up.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Aaron Gordon went through a short slump soon and we'll all be flip-flopping again.

[Skin]

Aaron Gordon is a Lebron James clone. We are VERY lucky to have had Henny draft him for us.

[cedric76]

Aaron Gordon is a Lebron James clone. We are VERY lucky to have had Henny draft him for us.

Gordon s defend is so good, I have never seen a rookie that good in D


Sent from my iPad using RealGM Forums

[j-ragg]

I'd be shocked if Aaron Gordon didn't have a season statistically like Wilt Chamberlains peak this year.

[pogiro]

I think we're a little too eager to point out what our rookies can't do. They have glaring weaknesses in their game, absolutely. But this year needs to be about establishing what they do well. Then they can work on adding facets to their game. I like what I see from Elfrid, because his good plays show things that you are unlikely going to be able to teach. His shot will be respectable at some point, but I highly doubt that'll happen this year.

Aaron's looked better than I expected, but I didn't expect much. I'm not so high on his offense as others may be. He hit a nice 3 in game 1, but he missed another 3 from that same spot horribly, airballing. And it's not like he was more contested on one shot than the other. He can play out of control at times, trying to do too much and be a little too fancy, but he's shown nice vision.

IMO, we need Payton for what he does well so there's going to be more pressure on him this year. Whatever Aaron does well is going to be icing on the cake.

[Bensational]

I think we're a little too eager to point out what our rookies can't do. They have glaring weaknesses in their game, absolutely. But this year needs to be about establishing what they do well. Then they can work on adding facets to their game. I like what I see from Elfrid, because his good plays show things that you are unlikely going to be able to teach. His shot will be respectable at some point, but I highly doubt that'll happen this year.

Aaron's looked better than I expected, but I didn't expect much. I'm not so high on his offense as others may be. He hit a nice 3 in game 1, but he missed another 3 from that same spot horribly, airballing. And it's not like he was more contested on one shot than the other. He can play out of control at times, trying to do too much and be a little too fancy, but he's shown nice vision.

IMO, we need Payton for what he does well so there's going to be more pressure on him this year. Whatever Aaron does well is going to be icing on the cake.

I love that Aaron isn't afraid to be a bit fancy. If he can find a way to actually use those moves to his benefit, then it's just going to make him all the more dangerous.

His behind the back pass for his first move made me double take. Was not expecting that level of confidence from the guy.

His crossovers and hesitation dribbles look like they're starting to be used to get him into the paint. He's not blowing by defenders, but he's getting past them enough to get good looks in the key.

I think Aaron is sensible when it comes to 3's. He knows his spots, and he knows not to jack them. But the guy shot 50% (maybe more?) during preseason because he's sensible. I think we'll see 2 3pa's from him a game, and i wouldn't be surprised if he was a 40%+ shooter, simply because he limits them. I wouldn't care if he was a 30% shooter. I didn't expect him to go anywhere near the 3pt line, so it's all a bonus in my mind!

[pogiro]

I think we're a little too eager to point out what our rookies can't do. They have glaring weaknesses in their game, absolutely. But this year needs to be about establishing what they do well. Then they can work on adding facets to their game. I like what I see from Elfrid, because his good plays show things that you are unlikely going to be able to teach. His shot will be respectable at some point, but I highly doubt that'll happen this year.

Aaron's looked better than I expected, but I didn't expect much. I'm not so high on his offense as others may be. He hit a nice 3 in game 1, but he missed another 3 from that same spot horribly, airballing. And it's not like he was more contested on one shot than the other. He can play out of control at times, trying to do too much and be a little too fancy, but he's shown nice vision.

IMO, we need Payton for what he does well so there's going to be more pressure on him this year. Whatever Aaron does well is going to be icing on the cake.

I love that Aaron isn't afraid to be a bit fancy. If he can find a way to actually use those moves to his benefit, then it's just going to make him all the more dangerous.

His behind the back pass for his first move made me double take. Was not expecting that level of confidence from the guy.

His crossovers and hesitation dribbles look like they're starting to be used to get him into the paint. He's not blowing by defenders, but he's getting past them enough to get good looks in the key.

I think Aaron is sensible when it comes to 3's. He knows his spots, and he knows not to jack them. But the guy shot 50% (maybe more?) during preseason because he's sensible. I think we'll see 2 3pa's from him a game, and i wouldn't be surprised if he was a 40%+ shooter, simply because he limits them. I wouldn't care if he was a 30% shooter. I didn't expect him to go anywhere near the 3pt line, so it's all a bonus in my mind!

Naw he definitely has great potential when it comes to ball movement. But I think he'll need to learn to be a little more sensible with his skills at this level. He's got great vision and nice passing ability. I don't mind the confidence at all either with him starting off. But if he's still trying too hard and turning the ball over next year, I'll get annoyed. I think that's the case with his 3s. But being all over with his accuracy kinda shows me that it's not something you can count on being consistent anytime soon. Not saying he can't. But I'm not gonna say it's something he needs to do a lot of, yet. He needs to focus on moving without the ball, using his quickness and athleticism to get himself in good spots and easy baskets. I'm not sure I've seen that out of him yet.

[pogiro]

I'd be shocked if Aaron Gordon didn't have a season statistically like Wilt Chamberlains peak this year.

[tooler]

I'm not going to worry about defending Elfrid Payton right now. I'm confident he'll pick it up.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Aaron Gordon went through a short slump soon and we'll all be flip-flopping again.

Hi, how's everyone doing tonight?

Not trying to antagonize. I like them both. Just a gentle reminder how things will change from game to game.

[Rick Rolled]

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24780059/early-impressions-orlando-magic-rookie-elfrid-payton

It's too early to take away anything meaningful from the NBA season. Even a month worth of play isn't going to tell you anything you can take away as definitive. But you can at least get a sense of things like skillsets, mindset, playsets, teasets, really any kind of sets. Here's an early impression of Elfrid Payton.

The Magic rookie has impressed me the most of his classmates through these measely three games, but as opposed to last year, this isn't the case of simply "sucking the least."

Payton has shown both tangible skills that provide a lot of promise for him as a long-term option at guard, and intangible elements that impress in terms of his demeanor.