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Keeping it going.

OrlandoNed wrote:

PennytoShaq wrote:

OrlandoNed wrote:Gordon is a really good defender at SF, but he's terrible offensively which kind of cancels out his overall effectiveness. If Gordon is going to succeed at SF he has to play next to DJ, Fournier and Ibaka as much as possible and most of all, stop taking so many pullup jumpers and attack. the. freaking. rim. Gordon absolutely has to master scoring in the paint before he expands his game outside of it.

He needs that jumper. You don't just get in the paint without a jumper, unless you are a super fast PG like Elf.

1. Players, especially athletic ones, absolutely can get into the paint without a jump shot. Proper floor spacing would allow Gordon to get into the paint much easier with the guards and other forward who can shoot on the perimeter and the center setting a proper screen to help him beat his man.

2. Payton is not super fast. Fast yes, super fast no.

I think you miss my point - defenses are sagging off Gordon and giving him that midrange shot right now. He needs to take it and make it.

threads can go over 100 pages, why do we need start a new thread?

SOUL locked the old one and asked for a new one.

PennytoShaq wrote:

OrlandoNed wrote:

PennytoShaq wrote:
He needs that jumper. You don't just get in the paint without a jumper, unless you are a super fast PG like Elf.

1. Players, especially athletic ones, absolutely can get into the paint without a jump shot. Proper floor spacing would allow Gordon to get into the paint much easier with the guards and other forward who can shoot on the perimeter and the center setting a proper screen to help him beat his man.

2. Payton is not super fast. Fast yes, super fast no.

I think you miss my point - defenses are sagging off Gordon and giving him that midrange shot right now. He needs to take it and make it.

Gordon has to learn to walk before he can run. The problem is that Gordon is settling for those shots way to easily and letting his guy off easy. Gordon is a good enough athlete to impose himself on the defense to get to the rim and score or draw a foul.

OrlandoNed wrote:

PennytoShaq wrote:

OrlandoNed wrote:1. Players, especially athletic ones, absolutely can get into the paint without a jump shot. Proper floor spacing would allow Gordon to get into the paint much easier with the guards and other forward who can shoot on the perimeter and the center setting a proper screen to help him beat his man.

2. Payton is not super fast. Fast yes, super fast no.

I think you miss my point - defenses are sagging off Gordon and giving him that midrange shot right now. He needs to take it and make it.

Gordon has to learn to walk before he can run. The problem is that Gordon is settling for those shots way to easily and letting his guy off easy. Gordon is a good enough athlete to impose himself on the defense to get to the rim and score or draw a foul.

He does that though. He attacks the rim. It's just kind of hard to do when the defender is sagged off of you.Teams are making him shoot right now and taking that drive away.

The next 10 days are pretty brutal schedule wise. Picking up a W tonight and hopefully tomorrow before it gets worse would be very good.

New thread, new ideas:

1) AG needs to Go Glass with that midrange shot like Pippen did. He can get the shot off at will, but his percentages are atrocious. Pippen said it opened everything up for him when he learned to use the backboard. And except for his investments, Scottie would be a good player for AG to emulate.

2) Bismack needs to try and tear the rim down when he gets the ball close to the basket. He should have to do push-ups if you attempts a lay-up.

3) Gordon also needs to attempt a direct drive to the basket with speed at least one time per game. He's trying to measure his man, which he's not good at. This just results in dribbling back and forth and then pulling up or passing out. So he should put his head down with no thought except getting to the basket at least once per game to see what his defender does about it. Just cup the ball and go! He has shown that he can lay it up from above the rim and he needs to use some of that athleticism to get there. This could help his confidence and ability to get to the line while he tries to develop that jumper.

4) The team should play some 3-on-3 scrimmages to 10 with some sort of consequences at the end of practice. Let the guys who aren't playing much handle the ball the most and only count their baskets (2 or 3) and assists (1). ANYTHING to keep Mario involved and give him shared playing time with the guys in the rotation. AG said last year that he absolutely loved playing with Mario and hoped that the two of them would have a lot of years together. Right now that's hard to imagine... Maybe Meeks, Wilcox, & Crobe need to actually play their way into some minutes with a regular competition of some kind that involves putting a basketball through the hoop and keeping someone else fro doing the same...

The Other Ankle wrote:New thread, new ideas:

1) AG needs to Go Glass with that midrange shot like Pippen did. He' can get the shot off at will, but his percentages are atrocious. Pippen said it opened everything up for him when he learned to use the backboard. And except for his investments, Scottie would be a good player for AG to emulate.

2) Bismack needs to try and tear the rim down when he gets the ball close. He should have to do push-ups if you attempts a lay-up.

3) Gordon also needs to attempt a direct drive to the basket with speed at least one time per game. He's trying to measure his man, which he's not good at, which results in dribbling back and forth and then pulling up or passing out. So he should put his head down with no thought except getting to the basket at least once per game to see what his defender does about it. Just cup the ball and go! He has shown that he can lay it up from above the rim and he needs to use some of that athleticism to get there. This could help his confidence and ability to get to the line while he tries to develop that jumper.

These are all great suggestions.

AG learning the use the bank shot could be good, because it's a lost art. It worked a treat for Duncan his entire career. But aren't backboard shots only really good when coming in from the side? It might give AG some confidence to actually dribble into those positions at times, rather than just down the lane, which might help him shake defenders more often.

But getting him to attack the rim at least once is a must. He can do it, but he's overthinking things and trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill with his approach to attacking from the perimeter.

And yeah, I'm not sure why Biyombo doesn't just go up hard for dunks off rebounds.

Actually, does anyone else feel like AG is playing below the rim a lot more this season than he was last season?

More bigs is not what we need, but the Baylor Bear in me has a soft spot for this kid...

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/18175535/former-baylor-bears-star-isaiah-austin-diagnosed-marfan-syndrome-2014-said-doctors-cleared-return-basketball

I met him a few times while I was teaching there. He was STICK thin. This was before we knew about his illness but he looked like a guy who would be plagued by injuries. People weren't meant to be that long and lanky.

I don't think this will work out but I hope some team at least calls him in for a workout.

MagicFan101 wrote:More bigs is not what we need, but the Baylor Bear in me has a soft spot for this kid...

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/18175535/former-baylor-bears-star-isaiah-austin-diagnosed-marfan-syndrome-2014-said-doctors-cleared-return-basketball

I met him a few times while I was teaching there. He was STICK thin. This was before we knew about his illness but he looked like a guy who would be plagued by injuries. People weren't meant to be that long and lanky.

I don't think this will work out but I hope some team at least calls him in for a workout.

I wouldn't mind us signing him. However, he probably is not in basketball shape, will take a long while to get back.

How do you guys like AG's cutting/positioning game? A lot of non-Magic posters liken him to Shawn Marion who made a living off of such actions. Do you think he should be working on this aspect or just improve on SF things like shooting or ball-handling? I haven't seen every game this season so I'm just gauging from what people know from him. From what I've seen he doesn't look comfortable yet taking guys off the dribble and even though he can improve it might not be where he can best focus his athletic gifts.

Bensational wrote:Actually, does anyone else feel like AG is playing below the rim a lot more this season than he was last season?

From the games I've seen he's taking more and more perimeter positions when he's off-ball and that means he's less available for dunks or putbacks. His OReb Rate has dropped as well as is percentage of shots around dunk range(0-3ft) and his dunk rate has dropped by 5%. His shot distance has increased by 3 feet and with the roster makeup we simply won't be able to put him in a position to play closer to the rim with the quality of big men we have.

OrlandoTill wrote:How do you guys like AG's cutting/positioning game? A lot of non-Magic posters liken him to Shawn Marion who made a living off of such actions. Do you think he should be working on this aspect or just improve on SF things like shooting or ball-handling? I haven't seen every game this season so I'm just gauging from what people know from him. From what I've seen he doesn't look comfortable yet taking guys off the dribble and even though he can improve it might not be where he can best focus his athletic gifts.

I think it's logical and what we all wanted to see more of from him last year. I think he needs he needs to find any offensive niche that he can rely on while he works on those things that are more conventional. He has to move a lot without the ball and make himself available as an option for playmakers and he needs to establish himself as a capable set 3-point shooter. He just isn't very good at finding his offense when he has possession.

I think Gordon suffers from an envy of guards that is fairly common among young bigs. Some guys spend their youths getting groomed as bigs and feel they are missing out on the fun of running around the perimeter chucking shots. His per 36 scoring is down this year despite his increase in usage because he is spending more time doing things that he isn't good at. He needs to appreciate and lean on the things that he is already good at, while developing other areas to incorporate when as he becomes more proficient. I think we'd all like it if he became a playmaker for us, but right now he is wasting some possessions on a team that is really struggling offensively.

Xatticus wrote:

OrlandoTill wrote:How do you guys like AG's cutting/positioning game? A lot of non-Magic posters liken him to Shawn Marion who made a living off of such actions. Do you think he should be working on this aspect or just improve on SF things like shooting or ball-handling? I haven't seen every game this season so I'm just gauging from what people know from him. From what I've seen he doesn't look comfortable yet taking guys off the dribble and even though he can improve it might not be where he can best focus his athletic gifts.

I think it's logical and what we all wanted to see more of from him last year. I think he needs he needs to find any offensive niche that he can rely on while he works on those things that are more conventional. He has to move a lot without the ball and make himself available as an option for playmakers and he needs to establish himself as a capable set 3-point shooter. He just isn't very good at finding his offense when he has possession.

I think Gordon suffers from an envy of guards that is fairly common among young bigs. Some guys spend their youths getting groomed as bigs and feel they are missing out on the fun of running around the perimeter chucking shots. His per 36 scoring is down this year despite his increase in usage because he is spending more time doing things that he isn't good at. He needs to appreciate and lean on the things that he is already good at, while developing other areas to incorporate when as he becomes more proficient. I think we'd all like it if he became a playmaker for us, but right now he is wasting some possessions on a team that is really struggling offensively.

One thing that separates the talent of slashers in the NBA is the ability to get to the line. I never see AG do it consistently- maybe once or twice a game. Meanwhile a player like Harden will take about 14 free throws a game. AG avoids contact and tries to finesse around it. If he embraced contact maybe he could have some kind of offense in his game.

OrlandoTill wrote:How do you guys like AG's cutting/positioning game? A lot of non-Magic posters liken him to Shawn Marion who made a living off of such actions. Do you think he should be working on this aspect or just improve on SF things like shooting or ball-handling? I haven't seen every game this season so I'm just gauging from what people know from him. From what I've seen he doesn't look comfortable yet taking guys off the dribble and even though he can improve it might not be where he can best focus his athletic gifts.

He was really good at it last year, until the team decided to play him with the ball more often. haha

Even after we renounce the rights to release some of these cap holds is the team going to have enough cap space to sign anyone of significance? I'd obviously target Holiday and would love to add Haywood. (Very doubtful). Gallo and Teague will be out there as well.

MagicMatic wrote:

Xatticus wrote:

OrlandoTill wrote:How do you guys like AG's cutting/positioning game? A lot of non-Magic posters liken him to Shawn Marion who made a living off of such actions. Do you think he should be working on this aspect or just improve on SF things like shooting or ball-handling? I haven't seen every game this season so I'm just gauging from what people know from him. From what I've seen he doesn't look comfortable yet taking guys off the dribble and even though he can improve it might not be where he can best focus his athletic gifts.

I think it's logical and what we all wanted to see more of from him last year. I think he needs he needs to find any offensive niche that he can rely on while he works on those things that are more conventional. He has to move a lot without the ball and make himself available as an option for playmakers and he needs to establish himself as a capable set 3-point shooter. He just isn't very good at finding his offense when he has possession.

I think Gordon suffers from an envy of guards that is fairly common among young bigs. Some guys spend their youths getting groomed as bigs and feel they are missing out on the fun of running around the perimeter chucking shots. His per 36 scoring is down this year despite his increase in usage because he is spending more time doing things that he isn't good at. He needs to appreciate and lean on the things that he is already good at, while developing other areas to incorporate when as he becomes more proficient. I think we'd all like it if he became a playmaker for us, but right now he is wasting some possessions on a team that is really struggling offensively.

One thing that separates the talent of slashers in the NBA is the ability to get to the line. I never see AG do it consistently- maybe once or twice a game. Meanwhile a player like Harden will take about 14 free throws a game. AG avoids contact and tries to finesse around it. If he embraced contact maybe he could have some kind of offense in his game.

Yeah. I think he has been trying to play more physically around the basket lately when he gets there, but he has been stuffed a couple times. It's a work in progress. He has the physical tools to excel in getting into the paint, but he just doesn't have that skill at this point.

Blue_and_Whte wrote:Even after we renounce the rights to release some of these cap holds is the team going to have enough cap space to sign anyone of significance? I'd obviously target Holiday and would love to add Haywood. (Very doubtful). Gallo and Teague will be out there as well.

I think we can clear a little over $29 million.

OrlandO wrote:

Blue_and_Whte wrote:Even after we renounce the rights to release some of these cap holds is the team going to have enough cap space to sign anyone of significance? I'd obviously target Holiday and would love to add Haywood. (Very doubtful). Gallo and Teague will be out there as well.

I think we can clear a little over $29 million.

We need to clear more than that, this core doesn't work, a full blow up needs to take place, the team is fundamentally flawed and one player, unless it's a superstar won't change it