Gamethread: Magic @ Bucks 01/10

[pepe1991]

Admittedly I called Mario a bust, and while he deserved that label, he’s totally shutting people up. A statement they could towards trying to get him to re sign here is trading Fournier if they feel he can keep this play up. Hand him the keys


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Well he isn't living up to 5# overall pick hype ,but when you look at his draft class half of players are underachiving.
I think it's safe to say now that he is better than Johnson and Winslow.
I watched Kings last night and WSC literally shoot his teammate with bullet pass, but bullet had literal meaning that time around. D'angelo got traded for Brook Lopez
Jah got traded for bag of chips,
Mudiay has shooting ability of 5 years old kid,
Kaminsky is usless on defense and overrated on offense
Turner looked like next great big man, now he is shotblocking Jason Smith (actually Sabonis looks like better prospect )
Lyles is backup on Nuggets
Booker has superstar potential if he ever learns how to do anything else but shoot.

He hasn't lived up to #5 ....YET! He was a project from the beginning... and people lost confidence in him after a regression in his 2nd year. Not every lottery pick bears fruit immediately. We all know that. But since so many were desperate for some signs of life from this team... he got thrown under the bus along with the rest of the woes of the team. I had stuck by my draft order of 1. KAT, 2a. Zingis and 2b. Hezonja. Obviously Porzingis is widening that gap.... but i still won't be surprised if Hezonja is the 3rd best player in that draft in a redraft in 2 years.

It would be interesting to ask what Nets want from Russell. I don't find him amazing but he is 21 years old and had nice start but got hurt and didn't play since.

[Nemesis21]

Admittedly I called Mario a bust, and while he deserved that label, he’s totally shutting people up. A statement they could towards trying to get him to re sign here is trading Fournier if they feel he can keep this play up. Hand him the keys


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Agreed. I think if we can ship some guys out here and give him an expanded role, then we have a chance to keep him. A long shot though for sure. Hopefully he can forgive us for giving up on him so early.

This, I still want Fournier and Vuc shipped out. Hopefully we can talk Mario back with a larger role.

Hopefully get another 1st rd pick in Fournier/Vuc trade, late lotto/20s range pick


Young/Payton
Simmons/Hezonja
Isaac/Iwundu
AG/Birch
Biz/McCoy? Williams? W Carter?

[Rainwater]

Admittedly I called Mario a bust, and while he deserved that label, he’s totally shutting people up. A statement they could towards trying to get him to re sign here is trading Fournier if they feel he can keep this play up. Hand him the keys


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Agreed. I think if we can ship some guys out here and give him an expanded role, then we have a chance to keep him. A long shot though for sure. Hopefully he can forgive us for giving up on him so early.

This, I still want Fournier and Vuc shipped out. Hopefully we can talk Mario back with a larger role.

Hopefully get another 1st rd pick in Fournier/Vuc trade, late lotto/20s range pick


Young/Payton
Simmons/Hezonja
Isaac/Iwundu
AG/Birch
Biz/McCoy? Williams? W Carter?

Def would not mind giving Hez a second shot.

[Jiwol]

That ship has already sailed, guys, c'mon.

[axl_c_cool]

Mario is balling. I feel like not hitting his option is going to end up being a HUGE mistake.

Admittedly I called Mario a bust, and while he deserved that label, he’s totally shutting people up. A statement they could towards trying to get him to re sign here is trading Fournier if they feel he can keep this play up. Hand him the keys


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

This, everything points to moving Fournier and Ross anyway. If we can do that and get a return, start Mario full time, continue to tank, hopefully we convince him to stay. Then either Young, Doncic, or Porter leaves us with a core of draft pick/Gordon/Isaac/Payton/Hezonja

[PennytoShaq]

Mario has to be a lesson to all of us as fans. I think we all give up on some guys a little fast. My personal rule is I give a guy until the last season of his rookie deal before I decide what I think he can be. Not that it matters, I don't work in a FO, but it's just how I form my opinion on guys. With Mario, I violated that rule a little early and totally gave up this preseason. It was hard to defend him last season as well. He played so, so bad.

IMO, Mario has to go somewhere that he can get big minutes. I am not sure how many teams will pay him over 5mm a year this season that can offer that. So we may still have a small chance of bringing the guy back.

I also think he may be tradable in a package if we need to throw something else in. His agent could talk to him about the target team and communicate to them if he'd be interested in resigning there.

[thelead]

That ship has already sailed, guys, c'mon.

Yup. We can’t offer him more than $5mil per. Someone can easily offer $6mil and a better opportunity. Hammond F up #2. #1 was trading away draft picks for crap.

[Shady Franchise]

Cant believe there are people still question giving AG a max. Only 22 having a career year and with a broke injured roster. Put him under a coach and Gm that knows how to surround their best players with others that complement their game, and AG will be an all star.

After all the bitching that is being done about not maxing Oladipo, you really want to see what AG will be in another 2-3 years in another team?

The Oladipo Syndrome is real

Per BR, he's already the 7th best PF in the game! Guys ahead of him like Millsap are dinosaurs and will be out of the league soon, so he'll move up rather quickly!

[Shady Franchise]

Yeah but this is what development is. It's letting him grow into the role.

What kind of numbers/performance do you expect from him?

attacking a rim instad of just bombing 3s when his shot is off. This is his 4th season in nba it's not like he is rookie who is trying to figure out what he can do. Yes he is young, yes he has potential but if you want to live up to max deal you have to be smart and learn how to make players around you better. Right now he is taking awful shots and plays super selfish . I mean look at his assist numbers it's 0-1-2 all the time . That simply can't continued with 20-22 FGA especiallyl if he is flat out cold and yet keeps forcing.

I hate double standards, i hated how Evan played tonight, forcing his shots, but by same standards i will judge Gordon who will force fadeaway 2 over passing to open man in 80% cases

AG's isn't a natural scorer, and has had a broken jumpshot until this year.
You don't think he's still trying to figure out what he can and can't do.
I mean look how long it took Dipo to figure it out, and he was much further along
offensively then Gordon was.
We have a selfish team. Whoever doesn't play selfish ends up being phased out of the offense.
I don't think Gordon or Simmons are naturally selfish players. I think it has more to do with the
me first environment.

Give the kid a couple more years and he'll get it down! Just about the same time Isaac comes around as well as our 2018 FRP!

[PennytoShaq]

That ship has already sailed, guys, c'mon.

Yup. We can’t offer him more than $5mil per. Someone can easily offer $6mil and a better opportunity. Hammond F up #2. #1 was trading away draft picks for crap.

The question though is who? Which team will invest that much playing time and money into him? I am thinking maybe the Bulls, maybe the Nets? I am not sure how many teams would.

[bobbeaver]

Admittedly I called Mario a bust, and while he deserved that label, he’s totally shutting people up. A statement they could towards trying to get him to re sign here is trading Fournier if they feel he can keep this play up. Hand him the keys


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Well he isn't living up to 5# overall pick hype ,but when you look at his draft class half of players are underachiving.
I think it's safe to say now that he is better than Johnson and Winslow.
I watched Kings last night and WSC literally shoot his teammate with bullet pass, but bullet had literal meaning that time around. D'angelo got traded for Brook Lopez
Jah got traded for bag of chips,
Mudiay has shooting ability of 5 years old kid,
Kaminsky is usless on defense and overrated on offense
Turner looked like next great big man, now he is shotblocking Jason Smith (actually Sabonis looks like better prospect )
Lyles is backup on Nuggets
Booker has superstar potential if he ever learns how to do anything else but shoot.

He hasn't lived up to #5 ....YET! He was a project from the beginning... and people lost confidence in him after a regression in his 2nd year. Not every lottery pick bears fruit immediately. We all know that. But since so many were desperate for some signs of life from this team... he got thrown under the bus along with the rest of the woes of the team. I had stuck by my draft order of 1. KAT, 2a. Zingis and 2b. Hezonja. Obviously Porzingis is widening that gap.... but i still won't be surprised if Hezonja is the 3rd best player in that draft in a redraft in 2 years.

I second that sentiment. Coming in he was a silky shooter with great tools and low understanding of the organized game of basketball. Somewhat of a shakey head. EVERYONE knew he was a project with a big hit high bust potential. Most normal fans thought he would show what he could do in 3-4 years. He d be more far along had he been trusted to make mistakes and figure things out last year. Including his 3pt pct. He blew up cause he got ride of the burden of being a team player primarily and felt like the first scoring option. You could see him relax and get fired up in that role and knowing he wount get yanked. You could see him take over games even now at beginning and the end of games cause he decides noone else will. He gets even more efficient than. And you could see Vogel wount let him take over completely.

[yoyojw17]

Well he isn't living up to 5# overall pick hype ,but when you look at his draft class half of players are underachiving.
I think it's safe to say now that he is better than Johnson and Winslow.
I watched Kings last night and WSC literally shoot his teammate with bullet pass, but bullet had literal meaning that time around. D'angelo got traded for Brook Lopez
Jah got traded for bag of chips,
Mudiay has shooting ability of 5 years old kid,
Kaminsky is usless on defense and overrated on offense
Turner looked like next great big man, now he is shotblocking Jason Smith (actually Sabonis looks like better prospect )
Lyles is backup on Nuggets
Booker has superstar potential if he ever learns how to do anything else but shoot.

He hasn't lived up to #5 ....YET! He was a project from the beginning... and people lost confidence in him after a regression in his 2nd year. Not every lottery pick bears fruit immediately. We all know that. But since so many were desperate for some signs of life from this team... he got thrown under the bus along with the rest of the woes of the team. I had stuck by my draft order of 1. KAT, 2a. Zingis and 2b. Hezonja. Obviously Porzingis is widening that gap.... but i still won't be surprised if Hezonja is the 3rd best player in that draft in a redraft in 2 years.

I second that sentiment. Coming in he was a silky shooter with great tools and low understanding of the organized game of basketball. Somewhat of a shakey head. EVERYONE knew he was a project with a big hit high bust potential. Most normal fans thought he would show what he could do in 3-4 years. He d be more far along had he been trusted to make mistakes and figure things out last year. Including his 3pt pct. He blew up cause he got ride of the burden of being a team player primarily and felt like the first scoring option. You could see him relax and get fired up in that role and knowing he wount get yanked. You could see him take over games even now at beginning and the end of games cause he decides noone else will. He gets even more efficient than. And you could see Vogel wount let him take over completely.

the guy has made a huge jump going from a disappointing year. I actually like seeing him drive to the basket now... and he is finishing at the rim. Last year he went to the rim (0-3ft) on 18% of his attempts and and now he is up to 25% of his attempts. And in that increase... his efficiency has risen from 52% finishing to...................72% which is absolutely ridiculous for a non bigman. The guy hit rock bottom and is on his way up. For all those that complain about black holes on the team... Mario actually likes passing the ball too. I'm sure biz loves playing with him... since he is one of the few people that tries to get him involved. So... if you'll think that losing dipo or even tobias is bad.... losing Mario for nothing.... will kill be even worse.

[basketballRob]

Weltman and Hammond look like a couple of idiots!

[prizm]

He hasn't lived up to #5 ....YET! He was a project from the beginning... and people lost confidence in him after a regression in his 2nd year. Not every lottery pick bears fruit immediately. We all know that. But since so many were desperate for some signs of life from this team... he got thrown under the bus along with the rest of the woes of the team. I had stuck by my draft order of 1. KAT, 2a. Zingis and 2b. Hezonja. Obviously Porzingis is widening that gap.... but i still won't be surprised if Hezonja is the 3rd best player in that draft in a redraft in 2 years.

I second that sentiment. Coming in he was a silky shooter with great tools and low understanding of the organized game of basketball. Somewhat of a shakey head. EVERYONE knew he was a project with a big hit high bust potential. Most normal fans thought he would show what he could do in 3-4 years. He d be more far along had he been trusted to make mistakes and figure things out last year. Including his 3pt pct. He blew up cause he got ride of the burden of being a team player primarily and felt like the first scoring option. You could see him relax and get fired up in that role and knowing he wount get yanked. You could see him take over games even now at beginning and the end of games cause he decides noone else will. He gets even more efficient than. And you could see Vogel wount let him take over completely.

the guy has made a huge jump going from a disappointing year. I actually like seeing him drive to the basket now... and he is finishing at the rim. Last year he went to the rim (0-3ft) on 18% of his attempts and and now he is up to 25% of his attempts. And in that increase... his efficiency has risen from 52% finishing to...................72% which is absolutely ridiculous for a non bigman. The guy hit rock bottom and is on his way up. For all those that complain about black holes on the team... Mario actually likes passing the ball too. I'm sure biz loves playing with him... since he is one of the few people that tries to get him involved. So... if you'll think that losing dipo or even tobias is bad.... losing Mario for nothing.... will kill be even worse.

Yea hezonja driving to the basket/slashing game have been really impressive... he gets touched up a lot too but refs aren't giving him the respect for him to get the and1 or free throws... most of the "star players" in the league get a foul call to the basket when they get breathed on

[bobbeaver]

He hasn't lived up to #5 ....YET! He was a project from the beginning... and people lost confidence in him after a regression in his 2nd year. Not every lottery pick bears fruit immediately. We all know that. But since so many were desperate for some signs of life from this team... he got thrown under the bus along with the rest of the woes of the team. I had stuck by my draft order of 1. KAT, 2a. Zingis and 2b. Hezonja. Obviously Porzingis is widening that gap.... but i still won't be surprised if Hezonja is the 3rd best player in that draft in a redraft in 2 years.

I second that sentiment. Coming in he was a silky shooter with great tools and low understanding of the organized game of basketball. Somewhat of a shakey head. EVERYONE knew he was a project with a big hit high bust potential. Most normal fans thought he would show what he could do in 3-4 years. He d be more far along had he been trusted to make mistakes and figure things out last year. Including his 3pt pct. He blew up cause he got ride of the burden of being a team player primarily and felt like the first scoring option. You could see him relax and get fired up in that role and knowing he wount get yanked. You could see him take over games even now at beginning and the end of games cause he decides noone else will. He gets even more efficient than. And you could see Vogel wount let him take over completely.

the guy has made a huge jump going from a disappointing year. I actually like seeing him drive to the basket now... and he is finishing at the rim. Last year he went to the rim (0-3ft) on 18% of his attempts and and now he is up to 25% of his attempts. And in that increase... his efficiency has risen from 52% finishing to...................72% which is absolutely ridiculous for a non bigman. The guy hit rock bottom and is on his way up. For all those that complain about black holes on the team... Mario actually likes passing the ball too. I'm sure biz loves playing with him... since he is one of the few people that tries to get him involved. So... if you'll think that losing dipo or even tobias is bad.... losing Mario for nothing.... will kill be even worse.

Which is weird that Biz likes to play with him more than Ep or AG. Ep i see virtualy never makes plays for him.. the few he tries to execute. Ill just say these Mario numbers are higher and better on a team that has no plays and a shooter is never open. And if they are they alot of the times dont get the pass. So its some achievement if we are honest here. Atleast with the efficiency he has.

[Furinkazan]

Weltman and Hammond look like a couple of idiots!

wait till they clear capspace

[bobbeaver]

I second that sentiment. Coming in he was a silky shooter with great tools and low understanding of the organized game of basketball. Somewhat of a shakey head. EVERYONE knew he was a project with a big hit high bust potential. Most normal fans thought he would show what he could do in 3-4 years. He d be more far along had he been trusted to make mistakes and figure things out last year. Including his 3pt pct. He blew up cause he got ride of the burden of being a team player primarily and felt like the first scoring option. You could see him relax and get fired up in that role and knowing he wount get yanked. You could see him take over games even now at beginning and the end of games cause he decides noone else will. He gets even more efficient than. And you could see Vogel wount let him take over completely.

the guy has made a huge jump going from a disappointing year. I actually like seeing him drive to the basket now... and he is finishing at the rim. Last year he went to the rim (0-3ft) on 18% of his attempts and and now he is up to 25% of his attempts. And in that increase... his efficiency has risen from 52% finishing to...................72% which is absolutely ridiculous for a non bigman. The guy hit rock bottom and is on his way up. For all those that complain about black holes on the team... Mario actually likes passing the ball too. I'm sure biz loves playing with him... since he is one of the few people that tries to get him involved. So... if you'll think that losing dipo or even tobias is bad.... losing Mario for nothing.... will kill be even worse.

Yea hezonja driving to the basket/slashing game have been really impressive... he gets touched up a lot too but refs aren't giving him the respect for him to get the and1 or free throws... most of the "star players" in the league get a foul call to the basket when they get breathed on

Interestingly he s supposed to still have bad handles lol think about it if he improves that segment further. He is succeeding with the current lvl of handles. Wonder how it will look in a year or two.

[prizm]

the guy has made a huge jump going from a disappointing year. I actually like seeing him drive to the basket now... and he is finishing at the rim. Last year he went to the rim (0-3ft) on 18% of his attempts and and now he is up to 25% of his attempts. And in that increase... his efficiency has risen from 52% finishing to...................72% which is absolutely ridiculous for a non bigman. The guy hit rock bottom and is on his way up. For all those that complain about black holes on the team... Mario actually likes passing the ball too. I'm sure biz loves playing with him... since he is one of the few people that tries to get him involved. So... if you'll think that losing dipo or even tobias is bad.... losing Mario for nothing.... will kill be even worse.

Yea hezonja driving to the basket/slashing game have been really impressive... he gets touched up a lot too but refs aren't giving him the respect for him to get the and1 or free throws... most of the "star players" in the league get a foul call to the basket when they get breathed on

Interestingly he s supposed to still have bad handles lol think about it if he improves that segment further. He is succeeding with the current lvl of handles. Wonder how it will look in a year or two.

Yea, it seems like that's the only weakness he has left in his game...like you said if in a year or two he can just tighten up those handles... I think he can really be dangerous in the league... I'm really hoping for some big trades to go down which will open up some space for him to get big minutes so he can consider staying in Orlando... but even if he still chooses to bounce... who can blame him...

[pepe1991]

I put all my prays on Weltman, i find Hammond trash/definition of medicority GM . He is perfect if your goal is to win 38 wins and dance around 8# spot . I will never forget that it was him who thought that Jennings is franchise player and that Jennings,Elise and JJ Redick can share the floor

[Skybox]

Mario will likely thrive in a new environment....my hope is that the Orlando Magic of next season is an ENTIRELY NEW environment. Part 2 is will his value stay under 5m while he shows out? Part 3 is will he stay with this organization at any price if he feels they wasted 3 years of his life and rep...I'd really like to see it work out for him and us.