A Wing Player from being a Contender

[MoMM]

If we had drafted Luka we would be a contender, but we hadn't, so let's not discuss about taking harder last season, game against Mavs, etc, however do you agree with this statement? We play very well when one of ours players plays like a star (Vucevic and Gordon), if we had a real star, we would be way better in the standings.

We could potentially have:
C: Vucevic (30) / Birch (18)
PF: Gordon (32) / Isaac (16)
SF: Luka (12) / Ross (8) / Isaac (8) / Simmons (20)
SG: Fournier (30) / Ross (18)
PG: DJ (28) / Luka (20)

Isn't it a Top 6, perhaps Top 4 team in Eastern Conference?

Unfortunately, we don't have him, but the point here is just to show that we are not that far from being a contender team again, we just need one more piece, a hard piece to get I agree, but it can be archievable by lucky (via Draft and its ping pong balls) or by trade (trading Bamba and Isaac who doesn't impact this lineup that much).

Currently we have the 7th best odds and more than 32% to get a Top 4 pick, we can't be that unlucky forever, right? So let's say we get a Top 4 pick and draft RJ, Morant, Rui or Zion. So, let's say we get DJ who I think better match our lineup.

C: Vucevic (30) / Bamba + Birch (18)
PF: Gordon (32) / Isaac (16)
SF: Fournier (30) / Ross (8) / Isaac (10)
SG: RJ (30) / Ross (18)
PG: DJ (28) / FA, 2nd round pick from Cavs or trade for Bamba

Simmons gets waived.

Also, there are some others paths during the draft, let's say we get #1 pick, we could make a trade ala Webber/Penny and get RJ + picks for Zion.

I think we would have a REALLY good team next season, what do you think?

[NotACat]

Luka isn't just a wing, he's a PG. We're a starting wing player AND a PG away from making noise in the playoffs. As long as Vuc is the best player on this team, I think the furthest we could go is the 2nd round in the playoffs.

I firmly believe in trading high on Vuc and Ross, and getting whatever we can for Fournier (I would package him with Simmons for Parsons, Dillion Brooks, and a protected 1st)

[jayrehme]

Lightning would have to strike for us to get a top 4 pick. Our best odds are through free agency, think a top player would want to come here to have ball in hands and be the man? Orlando would like even more enticing if we made the playoffs: https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2018/12/2019-nba-free-agent-power-rankings-2-0.html

[MagicStarwipe]

DJ and Fournier aren't legit starters. No.

[MoMM]

Lightning would have to strike for us to get a top 4 pick.

I won't say it's easy, but we have 32% of chances to get a Top 4 pick if we finish with the 7th worst record.

[tiderulz]

DJ and Fournier aren't legit starters. No.

Fournier is absolutely a legit starter in the NBA.

[MagicStarwipe]

DJ and Fournier aren't legit starters. No.

Fournier is absolutely a legit starter in the NBA.

I disagree. He's a liability everywhere on the court except 3 point shooting. And he's not even doing that that well this season.

[tiderulz]

DJ and Fournier aren't legit starters. No.

Fournier is absolutely a legit starter in the NBA.

I disagree. He's a liability everywhere on the court except 3 point shooting. And he's not even doing that that well this season.

you are allowed to disagree, I wont attack you for your opinion. I would point out that he is back playing SG after playing SF for the past 2 years which I believe takes a little adjusting to. He didnt start the year off too great, which I think was that adjustment back to SG and Clifford's offensive system, but his numbers coming around back to his career averages.

I agree if we have opportunity to improve the roster we should, at any position. no one on the roster imo is untouchable. that includes Isaac (and this view he is some unicorn) or Bamba. I just think Evan gets more hate than he deserves. I was also defending Tobias Harris when he was here. Now he is the player we all wish we had at SF. everyone gets mad when we have a player that doesnt turn into a superstar and they are instantly hated.

[MoMM]

Fournier is absolutely a legit starter in the NBA.

I disagree. He's a liability everywhere on the court except 3 point shooting. And he's not even doing that that well this season.

you are allowed to disagree, I wont attack you for your opinion. I would point out that he is back playing SG after playing SF for the past 2 years which I believe takes a little adjusting to. He didnt start the year off too great, which I think was that adjustment back to SG and Clifford's offensive system, but his numbers coming around back to his career averages.

I agree if we have opportunity to improve the roster we should, at any position. no one on the roster imo is untouchable. that includes Isaac (and this view he is some unicorn) or Bamba. I just think Evan gets more hate than he deserves. I was also defending Tobias Harris when he was here. Now he is the player we all wish we had at SF. everyone gets mad when we have a player that doesnt turn into a superstar and they are instantly hated.

Agreed, he is not a superstar or even a star, but he can be a 3rd or 4th option in a very good team or a 6th man of the year candidate. Since December he is shooting more than 40% for 3, he started the season in a very bad way, but he is improving gradually.

As for DJ not being a legit starter, I kind of agree with that and he should be a bench player (a very good one indeed), but not all of the contenders have great players in all 5 positions.

Playoff teams with winning records this year:
Lakers: Ball and McGee
Pacers: Young
76ers: Chandler
Spurs: Forbes
Rockets: Tucker and House
Blazers: Amino and Harkless
Thunder: Fergunson and Grant
Nuggets: Craig
Heat: Winslow, McGruder and Johnson

See, you don't need great players in all of the positions, you just need to assemble a team that matches well and we kind of have that, but we need a real go-to player to improve our scoring and even give more space to the others, the rest is OK, IMO.

Luka would have been perfect because he is a scorer, a playmaker (I mentioned him playing at 1 with DJ) and has a really high bball IQ, but we can't have him, so let's move on. RJ would be nice because he is a scorer and has some playmaking skills too.

Having Vuc all-around scoring ability, Fournier from outside, Gordon inside and RJ from everywhere and drawing fouls would be a very good (and young team) to have.

[pepe1991]

But imagine if we drafted TRAEE YOUNG... lol
Where are all posters who were talking about unlimited range, sharpshooting, instant new Curry, Curry with better range or whatever

[NotACat]

But imagine if we drafted TRAEE YOUNG... lol
Where are all posters who were talking about unlimited range, sharpshooting, instant new Curry, Curry with better range or whatever

His vision and passing is as advertised, teams are already treating him like Steph, his offense is starting to come along and he's demonstrating he can adjust to NBA level defenses at age 20. He's not Luka, but there's no reason to be pessimistic about his performance and his trajectory as a player

[OrlChamps2030]

I agree the Magic could be the 6 seed with Doncic.

But I don’t think that means anything. The Eastern Conference is bad. Adding an all star to any Eastern team causes them to be the 6 seed or a tier better than what they currently are. This is a star driven sport where over half the league makes the playoffs.

[pepe1991]

But imagine if we drafted TRAEE YOUNG... lol
Where are all posters who were talking about unlimited range, sharpshooting, instant new Curry, Curry with better range or whatever

His vision and passing is as advertised, teams are already treating him like Steph, his offense is starting to come along and he's demonstrating he can adjust to NBA level defenses at age 20. He's not Luka, but there's no reason to be pessimistic about his performance and his trajectory as a player

Teams just treat him as unathletic guard that he is, pressure him high so he can't make any separation.
As far as his impact on a game, his BPM is close to Hezonja's and his net rating (- 9,5) is second worst among starting PGs ( only Sexton is worst ) and overall he is 5th most "negative " rookie behind Bamba, Sexton, Spellman and Knox ,among ones who play at least 14 mpg.

Overall his vision has been overrated as well, he is averaging 4,0 TO a game , over last month his assists are getting lower, his turnovers are getting higher.

And finally i agree, no reason to be pessimisic about his trajectory . Ones who didn't bite into Lonzo vol 2 hype new that guy has Brandon Jennings written all over him.

[tiderulz]

But imagine if we drafted TRAEE YOUNG... lol
Where are all posters who were talking about unlimited range, sharpshooting, instant new Curry, Curry with better range or whatever

His vision and passing is as advertised, teams are already treating him like Steph, his offense is starting to come along and he's demonstrating he can adjust to NBA level defenses at age 20. He's not Luka, but there's no reason to be pessimistic about his performance and his trajectory as a player

Teams just treat him as unathletic guard that he is, pressure him high so he can't make any separation.
As far as his impact on a game, his BPM is close to Hezonja's and his net rating (- 9,5) is second worst among starting PGs ( only Sexton is worst ) and overall he is 5th most "negative " rookie behind Bamba, Sexton, Spellman and Knox ,among ones who play at least 14 mpg.

Overall his vision has been overrated as well, he is averaging 4,0 TO a game , over last month his assists are getting lower, his turnovers are getting higher.

And finally i agree, no reason to be pessimisic about his trajectory . Ones who didn't bite into Lonzo vol 2 hype new that guy has Brandon Jennings written all over him.

except Brandon could score but not really a passer. Trae can pass, his TO's are actually lower this month than the previous 2 months (granted only 6 games). his assists are down a little, but Atlanta also had some injuries to some of their actual players. you really seem to want to criticize this kid, some warranted some unwarranted imo.

[pepe1991]

His vision and passing is as advertised, teams are already treating him like Steph, his offense is starting to come along and he's demonstrating he can adjust to NBA level defenses at age 20. He's not Luka, but there's no reason to be pessimistic about his performance and his trajectory as a player

Teams just treat him as unathletic guard that he is, pressure him high so he can't make any separation.
As far as his impact on a game, his BPM is close to Hezonja's and his net rating (- 9,5) is second worst among starting PGs ( only Sexton is worst ) and overall he is 5th most "negative " rookie behind Bamba, Sexton, Spellman and Knox ,among ones who play at least 14 mpg.

Overall his vision has been overrated as well, he is averaging 4,0 TO a game , over last month his assists are getting lower, his turnovers are getting higher.

And finally i agree, no reason to be pessimisic about his trajectory . Ones who didn't bite into Lonzo vol 2 hype new that guy has Brandon Jennings written all over him.

except Brandon could score but not really a passer. Trae can pass, his TO's are actually lower this month than the previous 2 months (granted only 6 games). his assists are down a little, but Atlanta also had some injuries to some of their actual players. you really seem to want to criticize this kid, some warranted some unwarranted imo.

Jennings was gifted passer, for example in first season when nba started to measure potential assists, he was 5th in whole league, behind Rubio , Lawson, Paul and Wall creating almost 16 potential assists a game.
Nowdays with more shooting/better spacing raw assists are getting kind a overrated as stat.

[drsd]

The Magic needs a massive upgrade at starting PG, and we are having a thread-discussion on the wing?

(no disrespect of course).

[IllMagic04]

But imagine if we drafted TRAEE YOUNG... lol
Where are all posters who were talking about unlimited range, sharpshooting, instant new Curry, Curry with better range or whatever

Id trade Bamba for Young right now without a doubt. All Im looking for is flashes with these rookies. Ive seen flashes with Young. Ive been surprised with how poorly he has shot the ball so far. His passing is a good as I thought it be. Funny thing is defenses aint backing off despite his poor shooting percentage. Do you believe his shooting will still be this bad by say year 3? Cause Id love to bet on that.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using RealGM mobile app

[yoyojw17]

As stated by some.... we are PG away from making some noise in my opinion. Echoing what has been said on this board.... loving DJ.... but he would be a much better back up for us than a starter. His capabilities on the court limits what we can probably really do as a team. He is a shooter that can make the correct and easy pass.... takes care of the ball and is not a strong defender by any stretch.

now... i just said this in another thread..... but if nothing happens because we are trying to keep the team together and upgrade the PG... I think (sad to say it this way) the Darius Garland injury could have been the best gift to us. Pretty much the top pg in the draft at the beginning of the season might slip and land directly in our laps due to injury.

What can he do.....

Watch on YouTube

...that's what he can do. Of course he comes with drawbacks like every player.... but he has that it factor that we would need at the PG position. Hope he's hitting the gym.... let's hit 185 buddy. But his capabilities would make more room and easier opportunities for the players we already have.

Clifford is beginning to get into these guys heads. As the philosophies continue to be practiced by and ingrained in these players we can only go up. That's why it might NOT be the best idea to just start selling low on players like Fournier, Vooch, AG... etc. Instead fill in the gap, introducing a missing piece to a well established culture.

[tiderulz]

As stated by some.... we are PG away from making some noise in my opinion. Echoing what has been said on this board.... loving DJ.... but he would be a much better back up for us than a starter. His capabilities on the court limits what we can probably really do as a team. He is a shooter that can make the correct and easy pass.... takes care of the ball and is not a strong defender by any stretch.

now... i just said this in another thread..... but if nothing happens because we are trying to keep the team together and upgrade the PG... I think (sad to say it this way) the Darius Garland injury could have been the best gift to us. Pretty much the top pg in the draft at the beginning of the season might slip and land directly in our laps due to injury.

What can he do.....

Watch on YouTube

...that's what he can do. Of course he comes with drawbacks like every player.... but he has that it factor that we would need at the PG position. Hope he's hitting the gym.... let's hit 185 buddy. But his capabilities would make more room and easier opportunities for the players we already have.

Clifford is beginning to get into these guys heads. As the philosophies continue to be practiced by and ingrained in these players we can only go up. That's why it might NOT be the best idea to just start selling low on players like Fournier, Vooch, AG... etc. Instead fill in the gap, introducing a missing piece to a well established culture.

I think calling him the top PG in the draft is a bit early.
15th on this list.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ranking-the-15-best-point-guards-in-college-basketball-entering-the-2018-19-season/

[EAS Law]

Lmao on what planet were we even two spots away from drafting Luka?

This is the insanity this board clings to in order to forward the ridiculous narratives.