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Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac

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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#221 » by Solid Snake » Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:45 pm

Get that shot right and that body right(do not skip leg day) and he'll be good.....This summer is going to be a big one for him
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#222 » by BadMofoPimp » Wed Mar 27, 2019 12:32 am

Player Slim most reminds me of is Tayshaun Prince.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#223 » by cb1115 » Wed Mar 27, 2019 3:43 pm

Rashard Lewis w/ All-NBA defensive level talent is the secret best player comp for JI at the moment
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#224 » by Solid Snake » Wed Mar 27, 2019 7:40 pm




just scratching the surface
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#225 » by Mule Tears » Wed Mar 27, 2019 8:23 pm

His ceiling is Tyrus Thomas -- if we're lucky.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#226 » by pepe1991 » Wed Mar 27, 2019 9:29 pm

Younger Ibaka seems to be right career projection. Their numbers tend to be similar across the board , and their strenght and weaknesses are similar as well.
Rashard comparison to me is pretty off. Rashard was way better shooter and scorer in general (at age of 21 guy averaged 15 ppg on 43% for 3 , on +120 made threes )
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#227 » by Solid Snake » Wed Mar 27, 2019 9:33 pm

Mule Tears wrote:His ceiling is Tyrus Thomas -- if we're lucky.

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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#228 » by BadMofoPimp » Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:58 pm

cb1115 wrote:Rashard Lewis w/ All-NBA defensive level talent is the secret best player comp for JI at the moment


I watched Tayshaun (4 time all NBA second team defense) since his first game and Slim plays eerily alot like him. Slim can aspire to be like Lewis, but his game doesn't resemble Lewis nearly as much as he plays like Prince did.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#229 » by Skin » Thu Mar 28, 2019 1:42 am

I am groot!
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#230 » by basketballRob » Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:20 am

Could end up being a Robert Horry which isn't bad. Horry was a very good defender who always hit big shots. He was also a glue guy that won 7 championships.


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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#231 » by BadHombre » Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:43 am

Since the all-star break, Isaac is shooting 40% from 3, on 4 attempts per game. 70 total over that span. Also averaged 11ppg on 9fgas. And he's only playing 28 minutes.

His per36 numbers have him only marginally behind Lewis at the same age.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#232 » by Shady Franchise » Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:20 pm

Could he be our Danny Manning without the knee injuries, and with a 3pt shot?



Season
▲ Age Tm Lg Pos G GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% eFG% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
1988-89 22 LAC NBA PF 26 18 36.5 6.8 13.8 .494 0.0 0.2 .200 6.8 13.6 .499 .496 3.0 4.0 .767 2.7 3.9 6.6 3.1 1.7 1.0 3.6 3.4 16.7
1989-90 23 LAC NBA PF 71 42 32.0 6.2 11.6 .533 0.0 0.1 .000 6.2 11.6 .536 .533 3.9 5.2 .741 2.0 3.9 5.9 2.6 1.3 0.5 2.6 3.7 16.3
1990-91 24 LAC NBA PF 73 47 30.1 6.4 12.4 .519 0.0 0.0 .000 6.4 12.4 .521 .519 3.0 4.2 .716 2.3 3.5 5.8 2.7 1.6 0.8 2.6 3.8 15.9


Minus the lack of 3 point shooting, I can see Isaac having a stat line like this in the next couple of seasons: 16pts/6reb/3assist/1.5stl/.8blk/.519fg/.716ft

He's already a better free throw shooter, 3 pt shooter, and defender.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#233 » by PrimeThyme » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:29 pm

BadMofoPimp wrote:
cb1115 wrote:Rashard Lewis w/ All-NBA defensive level talent is the secret best player comp for JI at the moment


I watched Tayshaun (4 time all NBA second team defense) since his first game and Slim plays eerily alot like him. Slim can aspire to be like Lewis, but his game doesn't resemble Lewis nearly as much as he plays like Prince did.

Just my take, but I think his ceiling offensively is higher than Tayshauns. I see Isaac in his prime as a 17-22 ppg scorer. He will be a better overall defender as well when you factor in his shot blocking capabilities.

I don't think its a bad comparison. A better shooting version of Ak47 is still my favorite all time comp when I watch Isaac play though.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#234 » by pepe1991 » Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:30 pm

PrimeThyme wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
cb1115 wrote:Rashard Lewis w/ All-NBA defensive level talent is the secret best player comp for JI at the moment


I watched Tayshaun (4 time all NBA second team defense) since his first game and Slim plays eerily alot like him. Slim can aspire to be like Lewis, but his game doesn't resemble Lewis nearly as much as he plays like Prince did.

Just my take, but I think his ceiling offensively is higher than Tayshauns. I see Isaac in his prime as a 17-22 ppg scorer. He will be a better overall defender as well when you factor in his shot blocking capabilities.

I don't think its a bad comparison. A better shooting version of Ak47 is still my favorite all time comp when I watch Isaac play though.


wow

Prince played in times when defense was focus of every team, league average during his prime was well below 100 points. PPG total, per team saw around 15ppg boost from that early 2000s.

But even with overall stat inflatation, it's still hard to imagine player like Isaac going to 20 ppg because it requires a lot more than just shooting wide open jumpers ( and that's what he is doing now ) ,with occasional transition points.
RIght now 1/3 of all his points are wide open 3s ( closest defender not closer than 4 feet ).
It will require huge improvment in his game ( ballhandling, decision making, playing with ball ) to come anwhere near 20 points.
We saw with Gordon how that things simply don't come easy to players who don't have natural gift for offense.

To this day, after 2 full seasons, Isaac never averaged 14 ppg during long period of time (13,7 during 11 games is closest to that), let alone anything above that.

TIme will tell but i don't think you are having realistic expetations for somebody who's career tragjectory looks similar to Ibaka, and if Magic are lucky ,can end up looking like Siakam ( similar build, guy had offensive explosion this year )

Kirilenko thing is interesting , guy had odd career, peaked at age of 22. He is probably best example why fans shouldn't hold their breath about untapped potential and why it's impossible to project careers, but that's story and topic for another day.

If i want to guess, i assume Isaac in his 25-27 ( basically new prime for most players now) will average around 13-15 ppg, 7-8 rpg, 1,8 -2,0 bpg and be treat from outside. But i don't see transending star or allstar. Useful role player.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#235 » by PrimeThyme » Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:12 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
I watched Tayshaun (4 time all NBA second team defense) since his first game and Slim plays eerily alot like him. Slim can aspire to be like Lewis, but his game doesn't resemble Lewis nearly as much as he plays like Prince did.

Just my take, but I think his ceiling offensively is higher than Tayshauns. I see Isaac in his prime as a 17-22 ppg scorer. He will be a better overall defender as well when you factor in his shot blocking capabilities.

I don't think its a bad comparison. A better shooting version of Ak47 is still my favorite all time comp when I watch Isaac play though.


wow

Prince played in times when defense was focus of every team, league average during his prime was well below 100 points. PPG total, per team saw around 15ppg boost from that early 2000s.

But even with overall stat inflatation, it's still hard to imagine player like Isaac going to 20 ppg because it requires a lot more than just shooting wide open jumpers ( and that's what he is doing now ) ,with occasional transition points.
RIght now 1/3 of all his points are wide open 3s ( closest defender not closer than 4 feet ).
It will require huge improvment in his game ( ballhandling, decision making, playing with ball ) to come anwhere near 20 points.
We saw with Gordon how that things simply don't come easy to players who don't have natural gift for offense.

To this day, after 2 full seasons, Isaac never averaged 14 ppg during long period of time (13,7 during 11 games is closest to that), let alone anything above that.

TIme will tell but i don't think you are having realistic expetations for somebody who's career tragjectory looks similar to Ibaka, and if Magic are lucky ,can end up looking like Siakam ( similar build, guy had offensive explosion this year )

Kirilenko thing is interesting , guy had odd career, peaked at age of 22. He is probably best example why fans shouldn't hold their breath about untapped potential and why it's impossible to project careers, but that's story and topic for another day.

If i want to guess, i assume Isaac in his 25-27 ( basically new prime for most players now) will average around 13-15 ppg, 7-8 rpg, 1,8 -2,0 bpg and be treat from outside. But i don't see transending star or allstar. Useful role player.

With all due respect, your opinion on Isaac means nothing to me. You grilled me and called me a delusional homer for saying he could put up similar numbers to Grant if he played next to an elite playmaker like RW..lol

I'm really not sure how my expectations are unrealistic anyways. I did not say he would be a transcendent star. A better shooting version of AK47 should get him into a couple of All-star games but that doesn't make him Lebron James. I really don't see how he is on an Ibaka trajectory either. You have to consider that this is essentially his rookie year. Ibaka didnt even eclipse 10ppg until his 4th full season in the NBA. He is also an extremely overrated defender imo. Outside of a 3-4 year very good stretch he has been an average to below average defender for his career (just look at his dbpm numbers).

Isaac will be a more impactful player than Ibaka and Prince I feel. If that makes me a delusional homer in your eyes, thats fine but its not going to mean much coming from you.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#236 » by Shady Franchise » Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:23 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:
BadMofoPimp wrote:
I watched Tayshaun (4 time all NBA second team defense) since his first game and Slim plays eerily alot like him. Slim can aspire to be like Lewis, but his game doesn't resemble Lewis nearly as much as he plays like Prince did.

Just my take, but I think his ceiling offensively is higher than Tayshauns. I see Isaac in his prime as a 17-22 ppg scorer. He will be a better overall defender as well when you factor in his shot blocking capabilities.

I don't think its a bad comparison. A better shooting version of Ak47 is still my favorite all time comp when I watch Isaac play though.


wow

Prince played in times when defense was focus of every team, league average during his prime was well below 100 points. PPG total, per team saw around 15ppg boost from that early 2000s.

But even with overall stat inflatation, it's still hard to imagine player like Isaac going to 20 ppg because it requires a lot more than just shooting wide open jumpers ( and that's what he is doing now ) ,with occasional transition points.
RIght now 1/3 of all his points are wide open 3s ( closest defender not closer than 4 feet ).
It will require huge improvment in his game ( ballhandling, decision making, playing with ball ) to come anwhere near 20 points.
We saw with Gordon how that things simply don't come easy to players who don't have natural gift for offense.

To this day, after 2 full seasons, Isaac never averaged 14 ppg during long period of time (13,7 during 11 games is closest to that), let alone anything above that.

TIme will tell but i don't think you are having realistic expetations for somebody who's career tragjectory looks similar to Ibaka, and if Magic are lucky ,can end up looking like Siakam ( similar build, guy had offensive explosion this year )

Kirilenko thing is interesting , guy had odd career, peaked at age of 22. He is probably best example why fans shouldn't hold their breath about untapped potential and why it's impossible to project careers, but that's story and topic for another day.

If i want to guess, i assume Isaac in his 25-27 ( basically new prime for most players now) will average around 13-15 ppg, 7-8 rpg, 1,8 -2,0 bpg and be treat from outside. But i don't see transending star or allstar. Useful role player.

Looks very similar to the stats I posted earlier today comparing him to Manning. :wink: I believe Manning even had a couple of years in the 20 PPG scoring range, so this comp can please everyone. :D
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#237 » by NavalAviator94 » Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:42 pm

Mule Tears wrote:His ceiling is Tyrus Thomas -- if we're lucky.


Your ratio makes sense.

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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#238 » by BadMofoPimp » Fri Mar 29, 2019 9:54 am

Shady Franchise wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:Just my take, but I think his ceiling offensively is higher than Tayshauns. I see Isaac in his prime as a 17-22 ppg scorer. He will be a better overall defender as well when you factor in his shot blocking capabilities.

I don't think its a bad comparison. A better shooting version of Ak47 is still my favorite all time comp when I watch Isaac play though.


wow

Prince played in times when defense was focus of every team, league average during his prime was well below 100 points. PPG total, per team saw around 15ppg boost from that early 2000s.

But even with overall stat inflatation, it's still hard to imagine player like Isaac going to 20 ppg because it requires a lot more than just shooting wide open jumpers ( and that's what he is doing now ) ,with occasional transition points.
RIght now 1/3 of all his points are wide open 3s ( closest defender not closer than 4 feet ).
It will require huge improvment in his game ( ballhandling, decision making, playing with ball ) to come anwhere near 20 points.
We saw with Gordon how that things simply don't come easy to players who don't have natural gift for offense.

To this day, after 2 full seasons, Isaac never averaged 14 ppg during long period of time (13,7 during 11 games is closest to that), let alone anything above that.

TIme will tell but i don't think you are having realistic expetations for somebody who's career tragjectory looks similar to Ibaka, and if Magic are lucky ,can end up looking like Siakam ( similar build, guy had offensive explosion this year )

Kirilenko thing is interesting , guy had odd career, peaked at age of 22. He is probably best example why fans shouldn't hold their breath about untapped potential and why it's impossible to project careers, but that's story and topic for another day.

If i want to guess, i assume Isaac in his 25-27 ( basically new prime for most players now) will average around 13-15 ppg, 7-8 rpg, 1,8 -2,0 bpg and be treat from outside. But i don't see transending star or allstar. Useful role player.

Looks very similar to the stats I posted earlier today comparing him to Manning. :wink: I believe Manning even had a couple of years in the 20 PPG scoring range, so this comp can please everyone. :D


I am more of the mind of a zero chance in hell Slim makes 20ppg. People make it seem easy for players to reach that 20ppg milestone. It took Vooch years to get there and he is a very good offensive talent. Slim isn't even close to Vooch talent offensively, does not have good handles and does not create his own shot. I say 16ppg tops. But, scoring won't be the determing factor if he is a great player or not. It will be his defense and team play which will make him great, not his scoring. Players like Slim are great role players on Championship teams like Tayshaun was, not the top scoring player on a team.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#239 » by pepe1991 » Fri Mar 29, 2019 11:55 am

It's important to see how he scores now to see where he can expend his game.
Right now he is always open for 3 as part of gameplan of other team. Almost 1/3 of all his points are 3s, and almost all his 3 FGM are open shots. ( 231/668 points are 3 pointers ) , 70 of 77 threes were not contested .

He draws some shooting fouls ,but we still talk about less than 3 FTA per game (1,8 to be more specific) .

How limied he is as player with ball can only be shown through facts:
He shoots 42% ( 41-97 ) in situations where he takes 2 dribbles.
That especially gets exposed when it comes to outside shooting, where he shoots 1-13 for 3 in situations he took 2 or more dribbles.

This also means that 203 of total 244 FGM are taken with one or zero dribbles.

Conclusion : in order to expend his game he has to work on playing with ball and off dribble. You can't be offensive weapon if you are glued to the floor in situation where you have ball and you didn't shoot.
That's why my comp was Ibaka, who,epspecially at younger age ,really couldn't do anything but dunk and shoot.
Prime Thyme said Ibaka was worst scorer at that age, and that's simply false, as Isaac is averaging 9,5 ppg at age of 22 ( second year ) where Ibaka, during second year ( age 21) averaged 9,9 ppg with similar usage and PT.

Now , if i can choose i would prefer that he turns into Siakam more than in Ibaka, but Siakam's skillset and ballhandling and passing seems to be way to advanced for him. Looking at Siakam, imo, he is everything that Gordon should have been but never ended up being. ( There is still some hope for Isaac, Siakam had breakout in 3rd year so it's still up in the air, but guy had some crazy explosion this year, almost like Dipo ).

We just have to wait and see what we have in him, but much like it was case with Gordon, i simply don't see star level player.
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Re: Eating Crow: VOL. Jonathan Isaac 

Post#240 » by NotACat » Fri Mar 29, 2019 12:37 pm

In games like last night, we have to use JI in the post. The Pistons had Reggie Jackson on him, have to punish that matchup to give us a chance.

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